The following queues are being retired:
Mine Trap
The Breach
WHAT!? Why was this decision made? Mine Trap is one of my favourite queues, and with the help of the '20player' chat channel it's been popping a lot this last few weeks. Really can't understand why you would remove a queue which isn't broken. I haven't played a lot on The Breach, but I know a lot of people who do play it. This just seems crazy that you're retiring them with no warning at all.
Part of 20player as well, sad to see this happening know a lot of players that enjoy minetrap, can't see the logic in this.
When mine trap gets played it's usually not a PUG, and if it's not a PUG it doesn't show in those numbers.
Thanks for letting me know. And therein lies the difference. Those of us in small fleets, or more "casual" players, would never know that. I like Mine Trap - use to run it quite often back when we had more than 3 fleet members on at a time.
"Move to a bigger/more active fleet!!" you say? Well, that would be a bit hard after being in my current fleet for the better part of 4 years. Lots of time, effort, and camaraderie to just throw away. Plus, that whole "new guy" thing is a real non-starter for me.
I should have also put in my earlier post:
I agree there are several other queues that could have been taken out, and no one (probably) would have noticed. Big Dig, anyone?
Fleet Battle Cruiser Presto
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
So, they took out 2 queues that barely anyone ever plays, replacing them with 2 brand new ones. And people STILL complain.
Does no one else understand that content is not being removed, it's being replaced?
People, who complain, play those STFs. It's not a matter of numbers to be even, but of content to not be enjoyed any more.
Go back through this thread and read the whines of "Why are they removing content from the game, it's already light in content!"
Extra special bonus for counting the "Why are they removing this?" with "I rarely played it, but..." posts.
I can go back and find plenty of posts of people who do play it. Heck, I played it with them.
Whether people complain that "content is removed" or "I played it, don't take it away from me", the bottom line is the same: they are not happy about it. It seems to me that the people who don't care are people of the "I don't do it, so nobody else does" mindset. If it stayed, nothing would change for them. But taking it away changes a lot for us.
Whether people complain that "content is removed" or "I played it, don't take it away from me", the bottom line is the same: they are not happy about it. It seems to me that the people who don't care are people of the "I don't do it, so nobody else does" mindset. If it stayed, nothing would change for them. But taking it away changes a lot for us.
What's better for the game- a queue hardly anyone plays, or a brand new queue likely to be played by most? It ain't rocket surgery.
Whether people complain that "content is removed" or "I played it, don't take it away from me", the bottom line is the same: they are not happy about it. It seems to me that the people who don't care are people of the "I don't do it, so nobody else does" mindset. If it stayed, nothing would change for them. But taking it away changes a lot for us.
What's better for the game- a queue hardly anyone plays, or a brand new queue likely to be played by most? It ain't rocket surgery.
I get your point. But my point is that the game for me is for my entertainment and removing parts I find entertaining is not good for me. I'm not a Vulcan, sorry.
The following queues are being retired:
Mine Trap
The Breach
WHAT!? Why was this decision made? Mine Trap is one of my favourite queues, and with the help of the '20player' chat channel it's been popping a lot this last few weeks. Really can't understand why you would remove a queue which isn't broken. I haven't played a lot on The Breach, but I know a lot of people who do play it. This just seems crazy that you're retiring them with no warning at all.
Wow - on a content starved MMO (which STO still is) - the Dev Team decides to retire more content. What, with the average speed of most internet connections these days are they going to trot out the old "It makes the initial download smaller" excuse out again? Sorry I don't see how this content could be considered 'substandard' given some of the other PvE queue being left in the game. I really don't understand Cryptic's constant removal of content from an MMO that is still light on content.
STO hasn't been content starved since Delta Rising. There are plenty of new story missions and lots of queues.
Lots of people complain that the queues are empty and queues don't pop often or fast enough - getting rid of some of them can at least make the people concentrate more on the remaining ones.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
I get your point. But my point is that the game for me is for my entertainment and removing parts I find entertaining is not good for me. I'm not a Vulcan, sorry.
So, instead of having a queue that is regularly dead, you get one that isn't. You still come out ahead, right? It honestly needed changing, or else it wouldn't be empty 90% of the time (or more). If they end up not changing it, you still get a queue that isn't stagnant in return.
Really can't understand why you would remove a queue which isn't broken. I haven't played a lot on The Breach, but I know a lot of people who do play it. This just seems crazy that you're retiring them with no warning at all.[/color]
These queues are being reviewed for potential improvements. I can't really say more than that at the moment, as we're not ready to commit to anything publicly, just yet.
Ultimately, we don't intend for their retirement to be permanent (but, of course, I can't even really promise that much at the moment...)
Not that updating either of those queues is a bad thing... but why not just leave them in... and then when you update them... just update them. Surely they dont need to be inactive for you guys to update them and improve them...
True...it's more likely they will make them special/recurring 'events' like they do with the Elachi Gateway mission...
I get your point. But my point is that the game for me is for my entertainment and removing parts I find entertaining is not good for me. I'm not a Vulcan, sorry.
So, instead of having a queue that is regularly dead, you get one that isn't. You still come out ahead, right? It honestly needed changing, or else it wouldn't be empty 90% of the time (or more). If they end up not changing it, you still get a queue that isn't stagnant in return.
The thing is that I played this queue quite a few times recently thanks to 20player channel. It's not dead in my eyes. Sure, it doesn't pop up every 5 minutes, but it's not dead. Nor was the Breach. The Breach was even "less dead", in fact.
Yeah, I get a new queue. Will I like it? Will I enjoy it as much as Mine Trap? They're taking away my favourite toy. A new toy may not be enough to dry my tears. Try that with a 3 year old, and you'll see
I get your point. But my point is that the game for me is for my entertainment and removing parts I find entertaining is not good for me. I'm not a Vulcan, sorry.
So, instead of having a queue that is regularly dead, you get one that isn't. You still come out ahead, right? It honestly needed changing, or else it wouldn't be empty 90% of the time (or more). If they end up not changing it, you still get a queue that isn't stagnant in return.
I wouldn't get too comfortable with the idea of Cryptic taking things away. Next time it might be something that you really like.
Personally, I don't really care about the queues; but since I was a fan of the exploration clusters, this kind of hits a nerve.
When mine trap gets played it's usually not a PUG, and if it's not a PUG it doesn't show in those numbers.
Thanks for letting me know. And therein lies the difference. Those of us in small fleets, or more "casual" players, would never know that. I like Mine Trap - use to run it quite often back when we had more than 3 fleet members on at a time.
"Move to a bigger/more active fleet!!" you say? Well, that would be a bit hard after being in my current fleet for the better part of 4 years. Lots of time, effort, and camaraderie to just throw away. Plus, that whole "new guy" thing is a real non-starter for me.
I should have also put in my earlier post:
I agree there are several other queues that could have been taken out, and no one (probably) would have noticed. Big Dig, anyone?
I am also part of a small fleet, 44 toons in total and 13 of them are me. I think we have a total of 15 actual members in the fleet and 99% of the time it's only me online these days. We founded our fleet during early access though and it's a fleet I would never leave. However I use the '20player' chat channel which was setup to help get the older and larger queues to pop again. I happened upon a message from the channel founder in ESD zone chat one day and I've never been so glad to have had zone chat open for a change. We've ran a tonne of Mine Trap, Starbase Fleet Defence, Klingon Scout Force, The Big Dig etc this last few weeks and it's been a lot of fun. I'd highly recommend the channel to anybody who loves these older/larger queues and would like the chance to play them again.
To join it, just type this in chat.
/channel_join 20player
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
I wouldn't get too comfortable with the idea of Cryptic taking things away. Next time it might be something that you really like.
Personally, I don't really care about the queues; but since I was a fan of the exploration clusters, this kind of hits a nerve.
Let's look at it this way:
There are so many complaints about how "teh queues are dead ffs" and "they need to take out the bloated queues no one plays." If you were a new player, and saw all of those empty queues, you would think no one was playing the game. Replacing them with populated ones is an improvement for everyone...it's just that many just focus on losing instead of gaining.
They don't take queues away without adding a brand new queue to replace it. They don't take out anything popular (not counting NWS).
The few people who play the queues (that are generally empty) complain that they get replaced with new queues they won't have to wait forever to get into. And, there's the off chance (as stated) that they get brought back with improvements (although that seems unlikely, considering track record).
I think they replace instead of remove just because of the exploration clusters. The very vocal minority of those who liked them caused enough of a fuss, that they now don't just delete things without a replacement.
Drats, I missed the shortened notice of the patch & it interfered with the giveaway & my timing, darn schedule, to acquire it so no upgrade token for me. Bummer.
Thanks for letting me know. And therein lies the difference. Those of us in small fleets, or more "casual" players, would never know that. I like Mine Trap - use to run it quite often back when we had more than 3 fleet members on at a time.
"Move to a bigger/more active fleet!!" you say? Well, that would be a bit hard after being in my current fleet for the better part of 4 years. Lots of time, effort, and camaraderie to just throw away. Plus, that whole "new guy" thing is a real non-starter for me.
Same situation for me: my armada is an alliance of fleets not just for STO but across several games including SWTOR, MechWarrior, and even a few in WoW. I don't play anything else but STO and even though the STO side is not as active (but NOT dead!), I am not going to give up hanging out with the friends I've been chatting with since not long after F2P.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
I'm really disappointed to hear that Minetrap is being removed.
I organized matches every so often, and it was a nice multiplayer ground counterpoint to space dominant missions. The game need more large scale (20 player) ground missions and Mindtrap was a step in the right direction. The only unfixed issue was the mis-awarded crafting materials boxes. The inability to fix the crafting materials reward problem helped keep many people, who I spoke to, away from the match. They did not want to play a match that claimed to reward an elite crafting box but awarded an advanced one. Despite this I still organized matches, and still got people to participate.
I'm disappointed in the decision to retire the map with no explanation or possibility to provide input into any issues with the map. Thank you for reading this, and designing ground missions like Minetrap.
When mine trap gets played it's usually not a PUG, and if it's not a PUG it doesn't show in those numbers.
(snip)
I am also part of a small fleet, 44 toons in total and 13 of them are me. I think we have a total of 15 actual members in the fleet and 99% of the time it's only me online these days. We founded our fleet during early access though and it's a fleet I would never leave. However I use the '20player' chat channel which was setup to help get the older and larger queues to pop again. I happened upon a message from the channel founder in ESD zone chat one day and I've never been so glad to have had zone chat open for a change. We've ran a tonne of Mine Trap, Starbase Fleet Defence, Klingon Scout Force, The Big Dig etc this last few weeks and it's been a lot of fun. I'd highly recommend the channel to anybody who loves these older/larger queues and would like the chance to play them again.
To join it, just type this in chat.
/channel_join 20player
[/color]
I will most certainly add that channel after work today thank you for the invite
I think we have maybe 10 actual members in fleet .... and about 70 alts LOL
Fleet Battle Cruiser Presto
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Same situation for me: my armada is an alliance of fleets not just for STO but across several games including SWTOR, MechWarrior, and even a few in WoW. I don't play anything else but STO and even though the STO side is not as active (but NOT dead!), I am not going to give up hanging out with the friends I've been chatting with since not long after F2P.[/quote]
Our fleet is mutli-spectrum, as well. STO, BSGO, SW:TOR, WoW, etc. Most moved from BSGO to STO, then on to SW:TOR .... others just burned out on STO. Heck, I had a 5 month forced absence due to not being able to log in after an April patch. Finally found a workaround 2 weeks ago - still trying to finish my Delta toon run for the extra goodies. I forgot how "lengthy" the Cardassian episodes are.
I do not look forward to "Of Bajor".
Fleet Battle Cruiser Presto
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Heh..."Of Bajor" for me is actually a lot more tolerable than "Operation: Gamma." THAT is the mission from that arc that I can't stand. Heck, I even collaborated with @starswordc on a story that came out of "Of Bajor."
Then again, it really helps with "Of Bajor" when one plays a Cardassian toon--just imagining the sheer degree of AWKWARD on some of the assignments is a delight from an RP perspective. It got especially so when Admiral Berat had to go to the Bajoran Temple, and MORE so when the solution he agreed on with the prylar was to go out and start lighting incense according to a Bajoran ritual. It was so easy to imagine how uncomfortable and nervous poor Berat felt (and how the Bajorans felt about having HIM around), that it doesn't feel like a mindless grind when I take him through that mission.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Heh..."Of Bajor" for me is actually a lot more tolerable than "Operation: Gamma." THAT is the mission from that arc that I can't stand. Heck, I even collaborated with @starswordc on a story that came out of "Of Bajor."
Then again, it really helps with "Of Bajor" when one plays a Cardassian toon--just imagining the sheer degree of AWKWARD on some of the assignments is a delight from an RP perspective. It got especially so when Admiral Berat had to go to the Bajoran Temple, and MORE so when the solution he agreed on with the prylar was to go out and start lighting incense according to a Bajoran ritual. It was so easy to imagine how uncomfortable and nervous poor Berat felt (and how the Bajorans felt about having HIM around), that it doesn't feel like a mindless grind when I take him through that mission.
Now that right there, is HILARIOUS!!!
I've done "Of Bajor" so many times ...... as a team and individual ..... trying to get ALL the accos. *sigh*
That's really the only episode in that arc that bugs me. Although, I still have to find the Delta tech in "Temporal Ambassador" ... where is it AT? LMAO
Fleet Battle Cruiser Presto
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Yeah, Berat trying to talk down the Bajoran protesters (Yes, I am a Cardassian, no, I am NOT an occupier or war criminal!) is another supremely awkward one. But the awkwardness makes it WORK.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Heh..."Of Bajor" for me is actually a lot more tolerable than "Operation: Gamma." THAT is the mission from that arc that I can't stand. Heck, I even collaborated with @starswordc on a story that came out of "Of Bajor."
Then again, it really helps with "Of Bajor" when one plays a Cardassian toon--just imagining the sheer degree of AWKWARD on some of the assignments is a delight from an RP perspective. It got especially so when Admiral Berat had to go to the Bajoran Temple, and MORE so when the solution he agreed on with the prylar was to go out and start lighting incense according to a Bajoran ritual. It was so easy to imagine how uncomfortable and nervous poor Berat felt (and how the Bajorans felt about having HIM around), that it doesn't feel like a mindless grind when I take him through that mission.
Now that right there, is HILARIOUS!!!
I've done "Of Bajor" so many times ...... as a team and individual ..... trying to get ALL the accos. *sigh*
That's really the only episode in that arc that bugs me. Although, I still have to find the Delta tech in "Temporal Ambassador" ... where is it AT? LMAO
Its in the control room after you get from jefry tubes.
Comments
My character Tsin'xing
Part of 20player as well, sad to see this happening know a lot of players that enjoy minetrap, can't see the logic in this.
Thanks for letting me know. And therein lies the difference. Those of us in small fleets, or more "casual" players, would never know that. I like Mine Trap - use to run it quite often back when we had more than 3 fleet members on at a time.
"Move to a bigger/more active fleet!!" you say? Well, that would be a bit hard after being in my current fleet for the better part of 4 years. Lots of time, effort, and camaraderie to just throw away. Plus, that whole "new guy" thing is a real non-starter for me.
I should have also put in my earlier post:
I agree there are several other queues that could have been taken out, and no one (probably) would have noticed. Big Dig, anyone?
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
David
*** Aktiv since 03.06.10 ***
Go back through this thread and read the whines of "Why are they removing content from the game, it's already light in content!"
Extra special bonus for counting the "Why are they removing this?" with "I rarely played it, but..." posts.
I can go back and find plenty of posts of people who do play it. Heck, I played it with them.
Whether people complain that "content is removed" or "I played it, don't take it away from me", the bottom line is the same: they are not happy about it. It seems to me that the people who don't care are people of the "I don't do it, so nobody else does" mindset. If it stayed, nothing would change for them. But taking it away changes a lot for us.
What's better for the game- a queue hardly anyone plays, or a brand new queue likely to be played by most? It ain't rocket surgery.
I get your point. But my point is that the game for me is for my entertainment and removing parts I find entertaining is not good for me. I'm not a Vulcan, sorry.
STO hasn't been content starved since Delta Rising. There are plenty of new story missions and lots of queues.
Lots of people complain that the queues are empty and queues don't pop often or fast enough - getting rid of some of them can at least make the people concentrate more on the remaining ones.
So, instead of having a queue that is regularly dead, you get one that isn't. You still come out ahead, right? It honestly needed changing, or else it wouldn't be empty 90% of the time (or more). If they end up not changing it, you still get a queue that isn't stagnant in return.
True...it's more likely they will make them special/recurring 'events' like they do with the Elachi Gateway mission...
The thing is that I played this queue quite a few times recently thanks to 20player channel. It's not dead in my eyes. Sure, it doesn't pop up every 5 minutes, but it's not dead. Nor was the Breach. The Breach was even "less dead", in fact.
Yeah, I get a new queue. Will I like it? Will I enjoy it as much as Mine Trap? They're taking away my favourite toy. A new toy may not be enough to dry my tears. Try that with a 3 year old, and you'll see
I wouldn't get too comfortable with the idea of Cryptic taking things away. Next time it might be something that you really like.
Personally, I don't really care about the queues; but since I was a fan of the exploration clusters, this kind of hits a nerve.
I am also part of a small fleet, 44 toons in total and 13 of them are me. I think we have a total of 15 actual members in the fleet and 99% of the time it's only me online these days. We founded our fleet during early access though and it's a fleet I would never leave. However I use the '20player' chat channel which was setup to help get the older and larger queues to pop again. I happened upon a message from the channel founder in ESD zone chat one day and I've never been so glad to have had zone chat open for a change. We've ran a tonne of Mine Trap, Starbase Fleet Defence, Klingon Scout Force, The Big Dig etc this last few weeks and it's been a lot of fun. I'd highly recommend the channel to anybody who loves these older/larger queues and would like the chance to play them again.
To join it, just type this in chat.
Let's look at it this way:
There are so many complaints about how "teh queues are dead ffs" and "they need to take out the bloated queues no one plays." If you were a new player, and saw all of those empty queues, you would think no one was playing the game. Replacing them with populated ones is an improvement for everyone...it's just that many just focus on losing instead of gaining.
They don't take queues away without adding a brand new queue to replace it. They don't take out anything popular (not counting NWS).
The few people who play the queues (that are generally empty) complain that they get replaced with new queues they won't have to wait forever to get into. And, there's the off chance (as stated) that they get brought back with improvements (although that seems unlikely, considering track record).
I think they replace instead of remove just because of the exploration clusters. The very vocal minority of those who liked them caused enough of a fuss, that they now don't just delete things without a replacement.
Same situation for me: my armada is an alliance of fleets not just for STO but across several games including SWTOR, MechWarrior, and even a few in WoW. I don't play anything else but STO and even though the STO side is not as active (but NOT dead!), I am not going to give up hanging out with the friends I've been chatting with since not long after F2P.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
I'm really disappointed to hear that Minetrap is being removed.
I organized matches every so often, and it was a nice multiplayer ground counterpoint to space dominant missions. The game need more large scale (20 player) ground missions and Mindtrap was a step in the right direction. The only unfixed issue was the mis-awarded crafting materials boxes. The inability to fix the crafting materials reward problem helped keep many people, who I spoke to, away from the match. They did not want to play a match that claimed to reward an elite crafting box but awarded an advanced one. Despite this I still organized matches, and still got people to participate.
I'm disappointed in the decision to retire the map with no explanation or possibility to provide input into any issues with the map. Thank you for reading this, and designing ground missions like Minetrap.
I'd like to see the queue fixed and un-retired.
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Same situation for me: my armada is an alliance of fleets not just for STO but across several games including SWTOR, MechWarrior, and even a few in WoW. I don't play anything else but STO and even though the STO side is not as active (but NOT dead!), I am not going to give up hanging out with the friends I've been chatting with since not long after F2P.[/quote]
Our fleet is mutli-spectrum, as well. STO, BSGO, SW:TOR, WoW, etc. Most moved from BSGO to STO, then on to SW:TOR .... others just burned out on STO. Heck, I had a 5 month forced absence due to not being able to log in after an April patch. Finally found a workaround 2 weeks ago - still trying to finish my Delta toon run for the extra goodies. I forgot how "lengthy" the Cardassian episodes are.
I do not look forward to "Of Bajor".
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Then again, it really helps with "Of Bajor" when one plays a Cardassian toon--just imagining the sheer degree of AWKWARD on some of the assignments is a delight from an RP perspective. It got especially so when Admiral Berat had to go to the Bajoran Temple, and MORE so when the solution he agreed on with the prylar was to go out and start lighting incense according to a Bajoran ritual. It was so easy to imagine how uncomfortable and nervous poor Berat felt (and how the Bajorans felt about having HIM around), that it doesn't feel like a mindless grind when I take him through that mission.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Now that right there, is HILARIOUS!!!
I've done "Of Bajor" so many times ...... as a team and individual ..... trying to get ALL the accos. *sigh*
That's really the only episode in that arc that bugs me. Although, I still have to find the Delta tech in "Temporal Ambassador" ... where is it AT? LMAO
T6 Tac Command Battlecruiser Roll The Bones
Xindi Aquatic Narcine Dreadnaught Carrier Different Stages
IVXX Senior Officer
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Its in the control room after you get from jefry tubes.