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What PWE is telling us by less words and more actions
qrtrmstr
Member Posts: 139 Arc User
Again, it's simple math:
Perfect World has figured out a way (in the Asian market) to get players hooked on buying stuff and making it seem like you're making progress on materials to buy/upgrade stuff, all to get us to spend real money. The grinding is an additional tool to that end.
PWE lost the Russian market with all the politics relating to Chrimea (as did Apple, Google and so on)
PWE announces to share holders, annual profits tanked for net loss of over 50% for all of 2014.
PW is has to stop the losses so they cut staff 32% dev teams on Neverwinter and STO (STO's team was at 5 and now sits at 4) which is so pathetically small, they don't have the resources to "pay attention to the details" meaning we'll continue seeing bugs, most of which will never be fixed, this will most likely continue to keep players out.
PW gets pressure from shareholders for a turnaround or face a sell off (bankruptcy) so tells Cryptic to monetize everything, raise the cap on everything, give players a way to reach that cap, but increase the NPC difficulty so if they want to continue being effective and earning marks they MUST upgrade their gear (why're we're seeing the STF queues a ghost town, average players don't have the time or resources to upgrade gear to a level to compete effectively against the hardened AI) this also contributes to player withdrawal and profit loss.
STO is in big trouble...that's what all this says...the previous team went off track so badly that they lost too many players (aka profits) and they are in damage control mode now. Frankly I think they are going about this bass akwards from a business stand point, you don't jack up prices (create new sinks) and hope that brings in cutomers...you have sales, at least that's what you do in the states. You add a ton of new stuff for FREE, take the short term loss to get the players back...THEN you start TRIBBLE around with price, after you have people back playing and hooked in.
The problem is, this is way beyond too late now.
So, what we're gonna see is one of two things.
1) STO goes into a maintenance mode like Champions and they hope enough players log on and spend enough to keep the lights on....basically they whether the storm for a while and see if the community returns in the future.
2) We see another round of massive sinks thrust upon the remaining players base. In essence admitting things have gone too far wrong that they are no longer interested in salvaging it and are going to milk and squeeze every last dime they can before shutting down (this may even include going back to a 'cheaper than launch' sub model for a short time.
All we can do now is sit and watch and see which way they go.
I would suggest that if even more sinks pop up, and I don't mean like 1 or 2, I mean the amount introduced at DR or more, I wouldn't spend anymore in game (I certainly won't be) because if the latter happens, STO's days are numbered and I mean it's a low number, in the hundreds if we're lucky.
You also have to consider, Branflakes admitted before leaving that the license for STO is up in 2015+1 is the agreement. If they don't turn this around soon, and/or don't feel it will turn around fast enough, they won't renew the license. And I don't care what dev hops in here and says otherwise, it will be more "war propaganda" like "DR is the best expansion EVER and the players LOVE it!" nonsense, I hate to say it but STO is on life support right now and it's not looking good. I have been around since day 1, would be considered one of the whales and I can see this, the facts I put up are FACTS, Google them if you don't believe me. I will be honest that we all can really only speculate at actual numbers because Cryptic won't reveal login info but the empty map instances at DS9, ESD, and empty queues and empty everything doesn't lie...once upon a time we saw queues filled, 10-15 ESD instances full, DS9 the same...so unless tens of thousands of people have suddenly decided to run around doing player made content (Foundry missions) which I doubt, STO is in trouble. And we whales won't keep this going...most whales want the new shinies to show off (I'm the exception where I am not as concerned about showing off as I I just wanting to have my main have everything in game (worth having)!, but when nobody is around to show off too, whales find new things to play to show off there.
Perfect World has figured out a way (in the Asian market) to get players hooked on buying stuff and making it seem like you're making progress on materials to buy/upgrade stuff, all to get us to spend real money. The grinding is an additional tool to that end.
PWE lost the Russian market with all the politics relating to Chrimea (as did Apple, Google and so on)
PWE announces to share holders, annual profits tanked for net loss of over 50% for all of 2014.
PW is has to stop the losses so they cut staff 32% dev teams on Neverwinter and STO (STO's team was at 5 and now sits at 4) which is so pathetically small, they don't have the resources to "pay attention to the details" meaning we'll continue seeing bugs, most of which will never be fixed, this will most likely continue to keep players out.
PW gets pressure from shareholders for a turnaround or face a sell off (bankruptcy) so tells Cryptic to monetize everything, raise the cap on everything, give players a way to reach that cap, but increase the NPC difficulty so if they want to continue being effective and earning marks they MUST upgrade their gear (why're we're seeing the STF queues a ghost town, average players don't have the time or resources to upgrade gear to a level to compete effectively against the hardened AI) this also contributes to player withdrawal and profit loss.
STO is in big trouble...that's what all this says...the previous team went off track so badly that they lost too many players (aka profits) and they are in damage control mode now. Frankly I think they are going about this bass akwards from a business stand point, you don't jack up prices (create new sinks) and hope that brings in cutomers...you have sales, at least that's what you do in the states. You add a ton of new stuff for FREE, take the short term loss to get the players back...THEN you start TRIBBLE around with price, after you have people back playing and hooked in.
The problem is, this is way beyond too late now.
So, what we're gonna see is one of two things.
1) STO goes into a maintenance mode like Champions and they hope enough players log on and spend enough to keep the lights on....basically they whether the storm for a while and see if the community returns in the future.
2) We see another round of massive sinks thrust upon the remaining players base. In essence admitting things have gone too far wrong that they are no longer interested in salvaging it and are going to milk and squeeze every last dime they can before shutting down (this may even include going back to a 'cheaper than launch' sub model for a short time.
All we can do now is sit and watch and see which way they go.
I would suggest that if even more sinks pop up, and I don't mean like 1 or 2, I mean the amount introduced at DR or more, I wouldn't spend anymore in game (I certainly won't be) because if the latter happens, STO's days are numbered and I mean it's a low number, in the hundreds if we're lucky.
You also have to consider, Branflakes admitted before leaving that the license for STO is up in 2015+1 is the agreement. If they don't turn this around soon, and/or don't feel it will turn around fast enough, they won't renew the license. And I don't care what dev hops in here and says otherwise, it will be more "war propaganda" like "DR is the best expansion EVER and the players LOVE it!" nonsense, I hate to say it but STO is on life support right now and it's not looking good. I have been around since day 1, would be considered one of the whales and I can see this, the facts I put up are FACTS, Google them if you don't believe me. I will be honest that we all can really only speculate at actual numbers because Cryptic won't reveal login info but the empty map instances at DS9, ESD, and empty queues and empty everything doesn't lie...once upon a time we saw queues filled, 10-15 ESD instances full, DS9 the same...so unless tens of thousands of people have suddenly decided to run around doing player made content (Foundry missions) which I doubt, STO is in trouble. And we whales won't keep this going...most whales want the new shinies to show off (I'm the exception where I am not as concerned about showing off as I I just wanting to have my main have everything in game (worth having)!, but when nobody is around to show off too, whales find new things to play to show off there.
Post edited by qrtrmstr on
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I'll admit, I haven't liked the direction this game has been taking in quite some time, though I continue to log in every other day and do the odd mission (or just fly around doffing). I hate to say it, but if the game were to shut down tomorrow, as it stands, it would be of no great loss to me.
When I first started playing I really enjoyed it cause it was fresh and new. Nearly everything that has come to us lately is too similar to what has preceded it; another rep grind, another cross-faction mission, another new skill-tree. The spark has been lost.
I think PWE have a lot to answer for in that regard, but then, without PWE, we wouldn't have this game to complain about (Atari went bust, and STO needed a buyer). If another corporation came along and purchased the title, then maybe we'd be laughing and some wonderful things could be done to improve the game, but that ain't all too likely to happen.
End of the day, it is what it is, and we should enjoy what we have whilst it lasts. No point in fretting about what we can't change.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Is it a doom thread or fiction? Does it get locked or moved to Ten Forward?
It's a big deal to me...I love this game...it kills me what's happened. I am glad PWE breathed life into it and I am holding out hope that another publisher sees the name, the potential just the name alone carries, and will buy it and secure a new deal with CBS and turn things around.
Blue posted something similar a few days ago...he's not happy with everything that's happened either.
And this is less about DOOM and more about the facts, what's been happening behind the scenes and what the most likely 2 scenarios are that play out...I am not wanting STO to die, you don't drop over 10 grand in 5 years in something you want to see die...but you do see patterns and trends and dead instances and queues are a trend that Delta Recruiting sorts put a short term bandaid on.
The underlying issues remain and until they're fixed, or at this point IF they're fixed, we will either see a maintenance mode like Champions, or they opt not to renew the license.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
I'm curious , where did you get that STO number from ?
... 'cuz last we heard, the STO team was around 60 ppl ...
Did you read it though? It's more fiction than doom. I vote to move it to Ten Forward.
From meeting the actual team at the convention lol the dev team at its peak was 6 I think...
Fiction?
Here's your layoff article on Massively in March of this year
http://massivelyop.com/2015/03/17/cryptic-layoffs-alone-totaled-18-people/
And for good measure, here's your article about losing the Russian market and that entire team getting axed.
http://massivelyop.com/2015/03/31/perfect-world-suffers-more-layoffs-this-time-in-the-eu/
So like I said in the opening, STO is on life support, anyone playing can see it, feel it, and we're heading towards the Campions deal, or the pulling the plug, that will all come down to whether they make enough to let it run or not.
He would certainly care enough to do it justice and he has a lot of money so he wouldn't be so greedy.
I have upgraded every piece of gear to mk14 on 6 ships and am in the process of doing the same on another 3 plus I have upgraded some ground gear to mk14 and it hasn't cost me a penny.
just play the game get dil upgrade.
given enough time I`m sure I could upgrade every piece of kit I have if I wanted to with the same end cost of nothing.
at the moment theres a lot of dil floating around and it only makes sense to give up plenty of ways to spend it, now that many fleets are tapped out you`ve got to spend it somewhere.
how you equate this with doom I will never know.
cryptic are doing ok or they wouldn't be able to afford to keep hiring the trek actors for voiceovers, I'm pretty sure the cost of the licence for the game is no problem in comparison to what they have spent on this overall.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
I have some toast. The toast is not fictional. Saying that I use that toast to fight intergalactic threats to the planet would be fiction. So yes, your opening post there is fiction.
And Smirk was PWE not Cryptic at that...
...it's like the OP was in hibernation for a couple of months, it's like this is a necro. Hell, he originally posted his OP in a 3+ month necro as is.
When the team was tiny to begin with, to lose any accounted for 18% of the team...this is why we see so many more bugs and less attention to detail now.
I'm not saying I wont miss it, of course I will, but I'll have accepted that it's been a long-time coming.
qrtrmstrAre you sure you didn't just meet six of the team? I find it hard to believe that a game of this magnitude has only six people behind it.
You didn't even read your own linked article... /facepalm
18 people (though it included PWE as well as Cryptic folks) was listed as 14% of the Cryptic staff...
...so that would mean 128+ Cryptic staff existed.
You can stop posting at any time now...it's going to go from funny to tedious pretty fast.
Erm ... , I don't think 6 ppl have put out DR or the content that followed .
I mean I can imagine Champions maintenance crew to be that, but not STO, not at this time .
Having said that, I definitely think that they had some reshuffling of staff as priorities have changed .
And let's face it, priorities have changed !
The ship team got Thomas as a boost (perhaps even others) , as the #1 priority has become "sell more power" (in ship skins) .
In order to sell that power, you have to have ship model makers & programmers to create / modify / copy-paste those powers .
New powers = new FX ... , and the garish out of proportions FX we're getting since DR definitely point toward either a new VFX guy, or from orders from PW to make STO as Hello Kitty bling-bling as possible .
(when you have FX that come close to the size of the CE, you know you're dealing with a man on a mission ...)
And last but not least, there is always a cost to reshuffling & new priorities .
My tip there, wait 'til December , and then count the number of FE's & missions we got in 2015 , and see if it is above or below 2014 & 2013 .
Then ask yourself if the voice acting has been worth it .
... you also might want to notice that the last few FE's have employed a suggestion I made a while back (not that I'm taking credit here) to reuse existing scenery from the game in FE's, and thus make FE's cheaper & quicker to produce ...
a sheeple is starting to wake up and actually see the situation from what it is. the rest of us doom mongers who stated things were going to change and not for the better are right to this point, at least with fairly accurate predictions or right thoughts on motivations just different objectives that were instead met.
whatever the case though, you should of known the honeymoon was going to end at some point.
also DOOOOOOOMMMMMMM!!1!!!!11!!!!111!!!1!!!!
its the former for sure, the whole concept of the thread is built around the survival of PWE and what happens to STO even if there are a few questionable points like the one quoted below. but because its based on what someone thinks is the end of everything in a few years, its a doom thread.
like these silly podcasts, if you got nothing then you got no proof. it wouldnt even matter if obama himself said it on the podcast, unless there is proof these things are going to happen, how do i know the voice over isnt an electronic fake? and its the same for this. :P
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
We're career players man, we play probably a lot more than 2 hours a week. They are NOT friendly to the two hour a week casual crowd and if you didn't notice the mass exodus from DR because if the lack of staying friendly to alts and that player group, it happened, it's why our instances are the way they are, why the queues are the way they are...the two hour a week silver guys never put money in here no, but they did give us teams to get stuff done...when they OP'd the NPC's they drove those guys off...those guys that for whatever reason couldn't sit around and grind out better gear to be able to handle the OP'd NPC's in ISA or IGA or CSA or whatever...
This isn't about doom, it's about informing what is happening, what's happened, and the fact that I still believe they COULD turn this around but not buy adding sinks and ships, there aren't enough people buying ships to turn this around; we need our community back and that's not gonna happen in the current model
But, but, but...I was hoping there was going to be a follow up post where the guys boarded a shuttle, flew to the incoming asteroid, and saved Cryptic! Without any of the deaths or anything like that...maybe some bruises and a sprained ankle.
Patch notes which finally tend to lag issues, a community moderator informing about plans of SP adjustments way in advanced. A featured episode on hold to tend to quality issues. The whole Delta Recruitment thingy. This is quiet differently from the non communication period we had not to mention the nerf hammers.
Im optimistic with STO atm and very much at that. I wasnt 4 month ago but more and more the game feels to be back on the right road again.
My ISA lag issues have almost disappeared out of sudden. We have new queues that run like buttah. Yea 3000 Zen for this cool new Sci Pilot ship for my Delta Recruit and my Main was worth it then and only then because Im having fun in the game choose to play.
Its either happy customers or a handful of rice I guess.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Can I haz yer stuffs before you go?
People tend to predict doom for games and game platforms everytime something happens they don't like. People predicted doom for Second Life so many times I can't count them all. I've had characters there for going on 10 years and I'm not even the oldest, I know characters in SL older than me.
I've been playing STO going on 2 years now and while that may be a brief blink compared to some people, overall, I find the game very enjoyable and very playable. Maybe that's because I view it as what it is, a game, for entertainment.
Like my characters in Second Life, I play, I enjoy, I don't try to make it a lifestyle.
"There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard
As usual, things are complicated.
The people at Perfect World that are working on STO - they are not the people at cryptic working on STO. AFAIK, the PWE people are mostly stuff like the community team. Whatever they do exactly, the majority of the work - design, programming, art, server adminstration - is done by Cryptic. And I think even there it's not always as simple as saying "X is working for STO", since there other Cryptic games and part of the infrastructure of the games is shared, and thus also the people working on it.
Just wanted to note that I agree 100% with the above .
That ain't Doom .
That be reality .
... I mean look at what they did to the supposed Delta Recruits newcomers to the game: first thing they got was getting told that the Summer Event ships that we could access for 2 years won't be available to them ...
I don't go off what the article calls the STO team, I never met the Neverwinter team, sure they're a good group of guys but I have no desire to play that game, if I did I'd go back to WoW, but I have met the team for STO, well the old team, and there were...6 if I remember right back in 2013, but when this went down is was 5 I think, 5 to 4 is about 18% if you include Bran cause I don't know who they were counting and when that article was published versus when it was written...so I have no idea who they are counting and when but I give Bran if he's being counted 2% because he isn't a dev. The actual dev team, the people who sit and code, is so small now, it's laughable..so when everyone is raging about all these bugs, they don't realize there are NOT 100 guys sitting around working on STO...maybe there were when Cryptic FIRST started redoing what the old company left off, when they changed this from and exploration to a space combat game...but there were 6 in 2013...SIX assigned to STO everyone else is doing Neverwinter, Torchlight, the new space game, and everything else.
Are you telling me you are leaving the planet undefended from intergalactic threats?
You have the toast but you're doing NOTHING?
WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE!
I think your problem is that you have a false image of what someone that plays 2 hours a week actually expects from the game.
If you play 2 hours a week, you're not in a rush for anything, and you're not doing a lot of stuff that needs endgame gear. Chances are, you are not even yet at endgame in the first place!
why would anyone who only plays 2 hours a week spend any money in the game? I`m pretty sure if they left and never returned cryptic would not even notice their passing in a financial sense.
sure some of the ques have been quiet but that's more to do with the changes in difficulty and rewards then lack of players, thank goodness they are trying to rectify this.
I have been playing ques all week and have not waited more then a few seconds for a game.
there are also a lot more things to do in the game other then ques and many players are doing them.
I see plenty of players in the game sure some left but also new players joined but then players leave and join all the time and some that leave even return once they have tried a few other games and they realise that sto`s not so bad in comparison to other mmo`s out there.
also apart from a lot of waffle your entire thread boiled down to crafting is about getting us to spend money so the game must be dying, yet I proved in my previous reply it does not and I am living proof of the fact, you have failed to show otherwise.
but then of course the devs want us to spend money, its their bread and butter and what keeps the game alive but it doesn't mean the game is ending anytime soon.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.