"All Hands on Deck" Not affecting Intelligence Team

cerealplayer

Reproduction steps:

1. I logged into my Federation tactical character, Kaz
2. Go into any space combat area. Make sure AHOD is slotted.
3. Use Intelligence Fleet, and any other captain abilities
4. Trigger AHOD by using any tactical or command abilities.
5. Watch the cooldown on all other captain abilities be reduced, but Intelligence Team stay the same


EDIT: Sorry, wrong title. Meant to say "Intelligence Fleet", and not "Intelligence Team".

fatman592

Just for clarification: Are you taking about Intelligence Team the boff power, or Intelligence Fleet power gained through the Intel specialization?

AHOD shouldn't effect Intel Team. And I'm not really sure if it's supposed to work on Intel Fleet. Seems like it should though.

jarvisandalfred

Specialization abilities (including Intel Fleet) are all unaffected, including Rock and Roll; this appears to be by design, as their source is not your career, but your specialization.

cerealplayer

fatman592 wrote: »

Just for clarification: Are you taking about Intelligence Team the boff power, or Intelligence Fleet power gained through the Intel specialization?

AHOD shouldn't effect Intel Team. And I'm not really sure if it's supposed to work on Intel Fleet. Seems like it should though.

Intelligence Fleet. Thanks for the question.

cerealplayer

jarvisandalfred wrote: »

Specialization abilities (including Intel Fleet) are all unaffected, including Rock and Roll; this appears to be by design, as their source is not your career, but your specialization.

Interesting. If it is by design (which I hope it isn't), then it should be stated. As in, right now, AHOD states it works on all captain powers.

jarvisandalfred

cerealplayer wrote: »

Interesting. If it is by design (which I hope it isn't), then it should be stated. As in, right now, AHOD states it works on all captain powers.

Right. And, like I said, Intel Fleet, whatever the Command equivalent is, and Rock and Roll are specialization powers, not captain powers.

cerealplayer

jarvisandalfred wrote: »

Right. And, like I said, Intel Fleet, whatever the Command equivalent is, and Rock and Roll are specialization powers, not captain powers.

No. What you said is that their source is your specialisation , and not your career:

jarvisandalfred wrote: »

as their source is not your career, but your specialization.

Which is clearly true. But let me ask you: if they're not captain powers, then what are they? They're clearly not BOFF powers, nor console powers, nor even ship powers.

I think we can all agree that there are two types of captain powers: those that come from your career, and those that come from your specialisation. Where we seem to disagree is whether these later also count as "captain powers". I argue that they are.

Now, whether this means that AHOD was meant to affect these or not; well that's a different matter. I obviously don't know what the intent of the game designers was on this.

As a side note: the "Opportunistic" ability in the third tier of Intel spec does reduce the cooldown of Intel fleet (and I assume rock and roll).

jarvisandalfred

cerealplayer wrote: »

No. What you said is that their source is your specialisation , and not your career:




Which is clearly true. But let me ask you: if they're not captain powers, then what are they? They're clearly not BOFF powers, nor console powers, nor even ship powers.

I think we can all agree that there are two types of captain powers: those that come from your career, and those that come from your specialisation. Where we seem to disagree is whether these later also count as "captain powers". I argue that they are.

Now, whether this means that AHOD was meant to affect these or not; well that's a different matter. I obviously don't know what the intent of the game designers was on this.

As a side note: the "Opportunistic" ability in the third tier of Intel spec does reduce the cooldown of Intel fleet (and I assume rock and roll).

You're right. They didn't jump out and clarify "this is exactly what we mean".

So, let's look at the abilities that we do see affected:

Tactical Initiative, Go Down Fighting, Attack Pattern Alpha, Fire on My Mark, Tactical Fleet (the 5 abilities specific to tactical captains)

Nadian Inversaion, Miracle Worker, Rotate Shield Frequency, Engineering Fleet (4 of the 5 abilities specific to engineering captains, the fifth, EPS Power Transfer was acknowledged as being buged in this patch after this thread.)

Subnucleonic Beam, Scattering Field, Photonic Fleet, Sensor Scan, Science Fleet (the 5 abilities specific to science captains)

And the ones that are part of your captain (e.g. not from consoles, bridge officers, reputation, or specific ships):

Transwarps, Fleet Support, Brace for Impact, Ramming Speed, and Abandon ship (all abilities granted to every captain)

Rock and Roll, Intel Fleet, Boost Morale (all abilities granted via specialization).

Thus, via analysis, the reasoning behind what is affected, and what isn't (outside of EPS Power Transfer), I can conclude that this is likely not a bug.

Not that it matters that trait is already op as all hell already.

cerealplayer

jarvisandalfred wrote: »

You're right. They didn't jump out and clarify "this is exactly what we mean".

Thank you. And that's all I was saying in my second post. The tooltip does not reflect the actual workings of the ability. This means either the tooltip is wrong, and needs to be updated to state that it affects "all non-specialisation captain abilities", or the the ability itself needs to be fixed to affect all captain abilities (regardless of their origin), as the tooltip suggests the ability should do. Either way, there's a bug in the game, which I have now reported.

As an aside, your conclusion that, because a certain ability acts a certain way (specially shortly after it was first introduced) means that it was designed to work that way, betrays a certain trust in Cryptic's development and Q&A teams that is, on the face of all evidence, misplaced.

cerealplayer

Just to add that All Hands on Deck is not affecting Fleet Support either.

So to recap, AHOD does not affect:

Fleet Support 3
Rock And Roll
Intelligence Fleet
Boost Morale

While the latter three could be attributed to AHOD designed to work with only career abilities, this does not explain the lack of support for Fleet Support.

Furthermore, all of these abilities are affected by Opportunistic. Both Opportunistic and AHOD tooltips read that they affect "captain abilities" (Opportunistic does further say that it affects all captain abilities, both space and ground).

At this point, I'm convinced this is a bug. Can we get a confirmation?

jarvisandalfred

cerealplayer wrote: »

Just to add that All Hands on Deck is not affecting Fleet Support either.

So to recap, AHOD does not affect:

Fleet Support 3
Rock And Roll
Intelligence Fleet
Boost Morale

While the latter three could be attributed to AHOD designed to work with only career abilities, this does not explain the lack of support for Fleet Support.

Furthermore, all of these abilities are affected by Opportunistic. Both Opportunistic and AHOD tooltips read that they affect "captain abilities" (Opportunistic does further say that it affects all captain abilities, both space and ground).

At this point, I'm convinced this is a bug. Can we get a confirmation?

jarvisandalfred wrote: »

You're right. They didn't jump out and clarify "this is exactly what we mean".

So, let's look at the abilities that we do see affected:

Tactical Initiative, Go Down Fighting, Attack Pattern Alpha, Fire on My Mark, Tactical Fleet (the 5 abilities specific to tactical captains)

Nadian Inversaion, Miracle Worker, Rotate Shield Frequency, Engineering Fleet, EPS Power Transfer (the 5 abilities specific to engineering captains)

Subnucleonic Beam, Scattering Field, Photonic Fleet, Sensor Scan, Science Fleet (the 5 abilities specific to science captains)

And the ones that are part of your captain (e.g. not from consoles, bridge officers, reputation, or specific ships):

Transwarps, Fleet Support, Brace for Impact, Ramming Speed, and Abandon ship (all abilities granted to every captain)

Rock and Roll, Intel Fleet, Boost Morale (all abilities granted via specialization).

Thus, via analysis, the reasoning behind what is affected, and what isn't (outside of EPS Power Transfer), I can conclude that this is likely not a bug.

Not that it matters that trait is already op as all hell already.

read above you next time.

suaveks

The trait does not affect Photonic Officer science skill, but I believe this one was a design decission.

psych2l

It doesn't affect brace for impact either

nh3rd

Clearly it is career specific abilities that it effects, however I am inclined to agree that the abilitiy should reduce all cooldowns associated with your captain. But that would only compound the claim of an OP trait and bring about the nerfbat. I wouldn't mind seeing it changed to work with all but not at any expense of what is currently gained. How often are you going to use abandon ship or ramming speed? The spec trees however, yes these SHOULD have been included but I'm sure there is a reason they weren't.

I wouldn't mind hearing a response on the subject as to the intention of the trait.

cerealplayer

psych2l wrote: »

It doesn't affect brace for impact either

It does affect brace for impact. At least, it does so for me. I just checked it right now.

So yeah, there goes the theory that it's "career-specific abilities only".

toiva

While I believe I have seen it reduce the CD of Brace for Impact, I haven't seen the trait 'All hands on deck' affect Evasive maneuvers.

cerealplayer

toiva wrote: »

While I believe I have seen it reduce the CD of Brace for Impact, I haven't seen the trait 'All hands on deck' affect Evasive maneuvers.

I can confirm this. Again, seeing as these two abilities are in the exact same category (captain abilities that are learned regardless of career), it seems to me that it is a clear bug.