The abuse of those items was indeed Disruptive (you know, the other part in 'Disruptive or Detrimental'), and it was done solely for the purpose of disturbing others, as is plainly obvious despite the veiled attempts at claims otherwise.
Those wishing a "party" as opposed to running around trolling should have politely requested that they take an instance and used team invites to get those who wanted that way in once it was full (though it would never be full because "party" was nothing more than an excuse to attempt getting away with disruptive behavior).
I was there yesterday as well. The fleet in question was on zone 1. They were on zone 1 in mass. So in effect they did have an instance where they were having a party. I only saw them show up in my zone after people began filling zone chat with rage about them. Once people started mass hating on them, how could you not expect them to take the ball and run with it. That kind of public raging demands even the most timid troll let your freak flag fly. And yeah, I would say they were trolling once it got going, but com'on, their level of trolling more comedy that vengeful. I would rank them a few steps below people who spam lolcat emails.
Even when they showed up in my zone #3, they only stayed long enough to toss around a few disco balls then left. While discoballs aren't my cup of tea during a vigil, it's not like I suddenly felt violated. I mean, my 12 year old son plays and he annoys me in game way way more than the most ardent dentist on their most disco day.
Zone chat was more disrupted by people cursing and calling for bans than it was by any of the people "not behaving properly".
I can't see how anything they did, even at it's most possibly annoying to the sensitive folks could be considered a TOS violation. They weren't abusive, even when being abused. They didn't impede anyone's gameplay. I wouldn't call standing in one spot playing, even if it could be considered playing, how would your avatar dancing impede you from the fact it wasn't doing anything to begin with? As had been pointed out, the subspace party nullifier will immune you to dancing, so it's not like they are forcing people who really really don't want to dance to dance. And even if someone is completely latinum poor (which really?), all you have to do is type /movementreset when a ball gets dropped.
Lastly, it was a vigil for someone, people were sharing their memories and favorite quotes and scenes. In that tone, I think I was not alone in having my chat window maximized for long periods of the entire day. Leonard Nimoy was a real person that deserved to have his life discussed, not just have a bunch of cartoon characters stand in a circle. Someone dropping a discoball during those periods would have been wasting their effort if they wanted me to watch.
It wasn't until after midnight that they were in one instance. Before that, they were hopping from instance to instance following people to perform their disruptive actions. As such, yes, they indeed violated the Terms of Service.
It wasn't until after midnight that they were in one instance. Before that, they were hopping from instance to instance following people to perform their disruptive actions. As such, yes, they indeed violated the Terms of Service.
They were chasing people who made threats against their members. How would you respond to someone threatening to kill your members? Wouldn't you want to follow them and report them?
It wasn't until after midnight that they were in one instance. Before that, they were hopping from instance to instance following people to perform their disruptive actions. As such, yes, they indeed violated the Terms of Service.
Well I didn't stalk them, I take it you did? When I first got to Vulcan they were on zone 1, around noon US Eastern. I... GASP!... moved zones to #3, and didn't see them for hours after that.
Again, how were they disrupting gameplay? Not behaving how you want someone to behave is not disrupting. Was there a misison objective that they kept you from completing?
I feel bad as much as the next guy, but no. RP is totally creepy. And please stop demanding that people RP in the game.
In fact, such creepy demands almost make me want to roll a "Zombie Spock" toon of my own and have him shuffling around ESD going "BRAINS AND BRAINS! WHAT IS BRAINS?" just to tweak creepy RPers like you who are taking things far too seriously.
I think you're confusing RP with ERP, the latter of which IMO has no place in a public instance. I am not part of an RP group in game but I don't think there is anything wrong with RP that does not cross into public ERP. There's nothing "creepy" about garden-variety RP.
What we have a problem with is that aside from a brief period, people who wanted to set off disco balls did chase from instance to instance, and the chat was not in fact all respectful despite claims to the contrary, though I will not name the players here and I have already followed proper channels for that.
The idea of a rowdy wake is in itself not my issue--it's the active hounding from instance to instance. As I have suggested before, Quark's and Club 47 would make good locations...heck, Quark's has even been seen onscreen being used that way at least once. And I am pretty darned sure that those who have made more solemn observances on Vulcan would NOT start flooding DS9 to go after anyone partying there. I certainly would not!
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
The idea of a rowdy wake is in itself not my issue--it's the active hounding from instance to instance. As I have suggested before, Quark's and Club 47 would make good locations...heck, Quark's has even been seen onscreen being used that way at least once. And I am pretty darned sure that those who have made more solemn observances on Vulcan would NOT start flooding DS9 to go after anyone partying there. I certainly would not!
While I won't argue the taste of the folks in question, forcing segregation based on social zone behavior I don't think is a road we should travel. I'd never see my kid in world if his behavior had to meet certain standards in certain areas. He's a kid, he's goofy. I was surprised he lasted on Vulcan as long as he did yesterday (about 45 minutes).
Most of us were in instance one, which was consistently full almost the entire day. We had a few members in other zones, but considering there were between 6-8 dentals at the vigil during the day and over 1000k players, you are grossly overestimating the effect we had on 20+ zones. You are not some omniscient being that was able to zoom out and see the whole picture, you were confined to an instance like most of the rest of us, and no matter how many people tell you you're wrong (you are), we understand you are going to continue crying over spilled milk instead of remembering a great man.
Then how do you explain people leaving an instance due to the disruptive actions and very few minutes later the exact same individuals then show up in the new instance to perform more disruptive actions?
Not to mention people calling for people for a tasteful and respectful line up the steps to Mount Seleya which was within minutes crashed and disrupted by a strange "large tailed" character running around with a fire extinguisher and a "Zombie Spock" running up and down the stairs dropping disco bombs?
As the fleet everyone seems to enjoy hating has mentioned they had a handful of people on... and there numbers accounted for less then 1% of the people on vulcan.
I was partying myself... and I have explained in previous posts why.
I was in zone 18 I think it was for most of the afternoon... I did jump zones once as there where people trolling me about enjoying the occasion.
I also I will admit amused when I got the "stop your trolling dental" Pm from some obviously confused player. As I am not a member of there fleet.
I would say of the 1500 or so people on Vulcan at its peek yesterday... 100-200 of them where of like mind and where doing things like Popping there Tricorders / Firing off some party poppers and sure dropping the odd ball.
I hear Smirk later in the day turned the party favors off in one zone. That's cool he gave people a zone if they wanted to be all somber. That's fine he didn't shut them off everywhere which is great. Let people that really can't handle seeing people happy when the reflect on Mr. Nimoys work there own little zone. For most of us reflecting on Mr Nimoys life is fun and joyful... and I think Mr. Nimoy would be happy to know we have remembered him well.
From what I observed yesterday, there were a LOT of people who were respectful and did pretty much as you asked just by observing the others...
It was the action of a few bad users and hackers (characters with odd avatars that looked modded beyond what STO offers) who were f*cking around to make a spectacle for the lulz
You cannot expect any one event to unite everybody, but this was the first time I saw such a huge turnout showing enormous respect and care
well, I can see there's not much respect here, so by all means, go have your partys at the fountain
Indeed people NOT celebrating the life of Mr. Niomy are extremely disrespectful. Standing around and staring at a virtual pond of water is no way to share the joy and love that is Mr. Nimoys legacy.
Get your poppers out and show you where moved by his body of work.
"A silence with you
Is not
a silence
But a moment rich
with peace
- Leonard Nimoy"
Having some fun in his name will make you feel a heck of a lot better. Man lived a fantastic life, celebrate it.
Hardly I think you better re read those words and attempt to understand them a little better.
Did anyone celebrating use foul language ? Not that I remember after being there for the first 4-5 hours yesterday. Quite the opposite it was hurled at us what was returned was "peace and love".
Abuse... nope no one did that. ALL CAPS... nope no one attending Mr. Nimoys party did that as far as I noticed.
Detrimental methods? if you mean using the devices CRYPTIC sells us to have parties with... umm I hate to break it to you dude. We where at a party for Mr. Niomy and used the Cryptic approved devices intended to be used at parties.
The only TOS violations I witnessed where carried out by a very very small handful of the "OMG your trolling" crowd who did things like PM nasty messages to party goers.
I have a question. Why would anyone be on Vulcan for more than say an hour to pay respect? Any more would seem excessive to me and looks like you just hung around to cause trouble. Personally I went, payed respect and went about my business. I didn't see any of the partys and wouldn't have minded because I just ignore things like that and go about my business.
Starfleet Dental did their very best to be 'Starfleet Dental'. Ultimately they ran out of steam and congregated at various instances at different times.
It was fun to watch them attempt to distract many players who had the nullifiers on hand. But like any bully or internet troll, they moved on to other prey when we would not respond.
Or when smirk showed up. That was funny - like kids caught with something they shouldn't have, Starfleet Dental ran away.
That doesn't explain the blatant disruptions of those following people from instance to instance.
Despite patently false claims to the contrary, that most certainly did occur. Not to mention that "Big Tail Creature" (whoever it was) and the "Zombie Spock" invaded the instance where Smirk and Tacofangs were as well.
Indeed people NOT celebrating the life of Mr. Niomy are extremely disrespectful. Standing around and staring at a virtual pond of water is no way to share the joy and love that is Mr. Nimoys legacy.
Get your poppers out and show you where moved by his body of work.
"A silence with you
Is not
a silence
But a moment rich
with peace
- Leonard Nimoy"
Having some fun in his name will make you feel a heck of a lot better. Man lived a fantastic life, celebrate it.
I don't think it's right to suggest there is something wrong or disrespectful with being sad or upset when someone passes--many people need time to reflect and to work through those emotions in peace and it is NOT all right to force a levity on them that they are not actually feeling. If someone is upset and you don't feel you can sincerely acknowledge their feelings, the best thing you can do is to give them their space. NOT to say that their feelings or their way of working through it is wrong.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
I have a question. Why would anyone be on Vulcan for more than say an hour to pay respect? Any more would seem excessive to me and looks like you just hung around to cause trouble. Personally I went, payed respect and went about my business. I didn't see any of the partys and wouldn't have minded because I just ignore things like that and go about my business.
I had a conversations with a few friends in PMS that lasted at least an hour. I often sit at the exchange in the afternoon while I have other real work open on another screen. Didn't seem like a day I felt like sitting at an exchange so I headed to vulcan. I don't have to explain why I was there for any number of minutes as perscribed by anyone. I stayed as long as I felt, I wanted. For one hour I burned 30 or so Balls and kept one burning in a zone As high above the fountine as I could get them. The other party goers let that go as the only ball for almost that entire hour, thought it was lovely myself.
Most of us had a good time... talked with friends in PMs. (zone chat scrolled to fast to have any real conversations all day) however plenty of nice things where said and I appreciated them all. Just because I was being part of the party doesn't mean the nice tribute messages where not enjoyed.
I have to wonder if many people have ever had the privilege to attend a real honest wake. It is possible to be "saddened" by someones passing and still be Joyful when reflecting on there lives. Wakes for people that have lead long fruitful lives are fun, even for the people close to the subject of the wake. Life takes many people from us before they have had a chance to fill there potentials. When someone we respect leaves the world having filled it with as much good works and joy as Mr. Nimoy has, imo the natural response is to temper our sadness with a good amount of joy.
So yes I spent 4 or 5 hours down on vulcan yesterday... and I had a good time, with friends... and I even made a few new ones.
I have a question. Why would anyone be on Vulcan for more than say an hour to pay respect? Any more would seem excessive to me and looks like you just hung around to cause trouble. Personally I went, payed respect and went about my business. I didn't see any of the partys and wouldn't have minded because I just ignore things like that and go about my business.
I spent 12 hours on Vulcan yesterday. Spent it chatting with people, talking about favorite memories. Sharing urls that had stories. Doing all kinds of things that had nothing to do with people partying or people raging about people partying. The effect that the dentists had on the whole day is getting blown way out of proportion here. They didn't spoil a memorial, they popped around, acted like they do and left. I probably wouldn't have even noticed most of their activities during the day if it wasn't for people in zone chat raving about them.
You don't get to dictate what is and isn't acceptable.
He said respectful and decent not acceptable.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Not at all. That is how a respectful and decent human being behaves at a memorial service.
What memorial service ?
I am not trying to give you a hard time now... however lets get the facts right.
Cryptic didn't send out some big announcement asking for everyone to come for some form of service on Vulcan did they ?
Mr. Nimoys Family didn't invite us all to some type of service did they ?
Some people said in a zone chat somewhere... lets all go to Vulcan and be somber together. Yes I believe that.
Some other folks said in the same or other chats... lets all go to Vulcan and remember Lenard Simon Nimoy, bring your party gear and lets have a good time.
Of those 2 calls to Vulcan... which has priority ? The somber one cause you say so... how petty.
Comments
I was there yesterday as well. The fleet in question was on zone 1. They were on zone 1 in mass. So in effect they did have an instance where they were having a party. I only saw them show up in my zone after people began filling zone chat with rage about them. Once people started mass hating on them, how could you not expect them to take the ball and run with it. That kind of public raging demands even the most timid troll let your freak flag fly. And yeah, I would say they were trolling once it got going, but com'on, their level of trolling more comedy that vengeful. I would rank them a few steps below people who spam lolcat emails.
Even when they showed up in my zone #3, they only stayed long enough to toss around a few disco balls then left. While discoballs aren't my cup of tea during a vigil, it's not like I suddenly felt violated. I mean, my 12 year old son plays and he annoys me in game way way more than the most ardent dentist on their most disco day.
Zone chat was more disrupted by people cursing and calling for bans than it was by any of the people "not behaving properly".
I can't see how anything they did, even at it's most possibly annoying to the sensitive folks could be considered a TOS violation. They weren't abusive, even when being abused. They didn't impede anyone's gameplay. I wouldn't call standing in one spot playing, even if it could be considered playing, how would your avatar dancing impede you from the fact it wasn't doing anything to begin with? As had been pointed out, the subspace party nullifier will immune you to dancing, so it's not like they are forcing people who really really don't want to dance to dance. And even if someone is completely latinum poor (which really?), all you have to do is type /movementreset when a ball gets dropped.
Lastly, it was a vigil for someone, people were sharing their memories and favorite quotes and scenes. In that tone, I think I was not alone in having my chat window maximized for long periods of the entire day. Leonard Nimoy was a real person that deserved to have his life discussed, not just have a bunch of cartoon characters stand in a circle. Someone dropping a discoball during those periods would have been wasting their effort if they wanted me to watch.
They were chasing people who made threats against their members. How would you respond to someone threatening to kill your members? Wouldn't you want to follow them and report them?
Well I didn't stalk them, I take it you did? When I first got to Vulcan they were on zone 1, around noon US Eastern. I... GASP!... moved zones to #3, and didn't see them for hours after that.
Again, how were they disrupting gameplay? Not behaving how you want someone to behave is not disrupting. Was there a misison objective that they kept you from completing?
I think you're confusing RP with ERP, the latter of which IMO has no place in a public instance. I am not part of an RP group in game but I don't think there is anything wrong with RP that does not cross into public ERP. There's nothing "creepy" about garden-variety RP.
What we have a problem with is that aside from a brief period, people who wanted to set off disco balls did chase from instance to instance, and the chat was not in fact all respectful despite claims to the contrary, though I will not name the players here and I have already followed proper channels for that.
The idea of a rowdy wake is in itself not my issue--it's the active hounding from instance to instance. As I have suggested before, Quark's and Club 47 would make good locations...heck, Quark's has even been seen onscreen being used that way at least once. And I am pretty darned sure that those who have made more solemn observances on Vulcan would NOT start flooding DS9 to go after anyone partying there. I certainly would not!
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Wait? What? Explain "ERP". Seriously I never heard of this.
While I won't argue the taste of the folks in question, forcing segregation based on social zone behavior I don't think is a road we should travel. I'd never see my kid in world if his behavior had to meet certain standards in certain areas. He's a kid, he's goofy. I was surprised he lasted on Vulcan as long as he did yesterday (about 45 minutes).
Then how do you explain people leaving an instance due to the disruptive actions and very few minutes later the exact same individuals then show up in the new instance to perform more disruptive actions?
Not to mention people calling for people for a tasteful and respectful line up the steps to Mount Seleya which was within minutes crashed and disrupted by a strange "large tailed" character running around with a fire extinguisher and a "Zombie Spock" running up and down the stairs dropping disco bombs?
I was partying myself... and I have explained in previous posts why.
I was in zone 18 I think it was for most of the afternoon... I did jump zones once as there where people trolling me about enjoying the occasion.
I also I will admit amused when I got the "stop your trolling dental" Pm from some obviously confused player. As I am not a member of there fleet.
I would say of the 1500 or so people on Vulcan at its peek yesterday... 100-200 of them where of like mind and where doing things like Popping there Tricorders / Firing off some party poppers and sure dropping the odd ball.
I hear Smirk later in the day turned the party favors off in one zone. That's cool he gave people a zone if they wanted to be all somber. That's fine he didn't shut them off everywhere which is great. Let people that really can't handle seeing people happy when the reflect on Mr. Nimoys work there own little zone. For most of us reflecting on Mr Nimoys life is fun and joyful... and I think Mr. Nimoy would be happy to know we have remembered him well.
aut vincere aut mori pro imperio
either to conquer or to die for the Empire
I'm sorry, but that is funny.
Nabreeki, I give you a golf clap for getting people to start calling the disco balls, bombs.
It was the action of a few bad users and hackers (characters with odd avatars that looked modded beyond what STO offers) who were f*cking around to make a spectacle for the lulz
You cannot expect any one event to unite everybody, but this was the first time I saw such a huge turnout showing enormous respect and care
I was very touched by it all
I just don't understand trolls. Never have. Never will. A lot of people went on my ignore list that night.
Indeed people NOT celebrating the life of Mr. Niomy are extremely disrespectful. Standing around and staring at a virtual pond of water is no way to share the joy and love that is Mr. Nimoys legacy.
Get your poppers out and show you where moved by his body of work.
"A silence with you
Is not
a silence
But a moment rich
with peace
- Leonard Nimoy"
Having some fun in his name will make you feel a heck of a lot better. Man lived a fantastic life, celebrate it.
I have a question. Why would anyone be on Vulcan for more than say an hour to pay respect? Any more would seem excessive to me and looks like you just hung around to cause trouble. Personally I went, payed respect and went about my business. I didn't see any of the partys and wouldn't have minded because I just ignore things like that and go about my business.
It was fun to watch them attempt to distract many players who had the nullifiers on hand. But like any bully or internet troll, they moved on to other prey when we would not respond.
Or when smirk showed up. That was funny - like kids caught with something they shouldn't have, Starfleet Dental ran away.
Despite patently false claims to the contrary, that most certainly did occur. Not to mention that "Big Tail Creature" (whoever it was) and the "Zombie Spock" invaded the instance where Smirk and Tacofangs were as well.
I don't think it's right to suggest there is something wrong or disrespectful with being sad or upset when someone passes--many people need time to reflect and to work through those emotions in peace and it is NOT all right to force a levity on them that they are not actually feeling. If someone is upset and you don't feel you can sincerely acknowledge their feelings, the best thing you can do is to give them their space. NOT to say that their feelings or their way of working through it is wrong.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
I had a conversations with a few friends in PMS that lasted at least an hour. I often sit at the exchange in the afternoon while I have other real work open on another screen. Didn't seem like a day I felt like sitting at an exchange so I headed to vulcan. I don't have to explain why I was there for any number of minutes as perscribed by anyone. I stayed as long as I felt, I wanted. For one hour I burned 30 or so Balls and kept one burning in a zone As high above the fountine as I could get them. The other party goers let that go as the only ball for almost that entire hour, thought it was lovely myself.
Most of us had a good time... talked with friends in PMs. (zone chat scrolled to fast to have any real conversations all day) however plenty of nice things where said and I appreciated them all. Just because I was being part of the party doesn't mean the nice tribute messages where not enjoyed.
I have to wonder if many people have ever had the privilege to attend a real honest wake. It is possible to be "saddened" by someones passing and still be Joyful when reflecting on there lives. Wakes for people that have lead long fruitful lives are fun, even for the people close to the subject of the wake. Life takes many people from us before they have had a chance to fill there potentials. When someone we respect leaves the world having filled it with as much good works and joy as Mr. Nimoy has, imo the natural response is to temper our sadness with a good amount of joy.
So yes I spent 4 or 5 hours down on vulcan yesterday... and I had a good time, with friends... and I even made a few new ones.
I spent 12 hours on Vulcan yesterday. Spent it chatting with people, talking about favorite memories. Sharing urls that had stories. Doing all kinds of things that had nothing to do with people partying or people raging about people partying. The effect that the dentists had on the whole day is getting blown way out of proportion here. They didn't spoil a memorial, they popped around, acted like they do and left. I probably wouldn't have even noticed most of their activities during the day if it wasn't for people in zone chat raving about them.
mmmm ,this is going to far now.
Not at all. That is how a respectful and decent human being behaves at a memorial service.
He said respectful and decent not acceptable.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
What memorial service ?
I am not trying to give you a hard time now... however lets get the facts right.
Cryptic didn't send out some big announcement asking for everyone to come for some form of service on Vulcan did they ?
Mr. Nimoys Family didn't invite us all to some type of service did they ?
Some people said in a zone chat somewhere... lets all go to Vulcan and be somber together. Yes I believe that.
Some other folks said in the same or other chats... lets all go to Vulcan and remember Lenard Simon Nimoy, bring your party gear and lets have a good time.
Of those 2 calls to Vulcan... which has priority ? The somber one cause you say so... how petty.