Have you forgotten things like the Borg's 5th Dynasty? Or how an we had information in our ship database about planets in a previously unexplored region of space, (equipment development levels, cultural references, etc)?
It wasn't THAT bad. And it would be perfect for Sector Space because you would only have a set number things that could happen. It would be perfectly logical for you have information in your database about things in Sector Space.
It actually seems like a better fit for the Genesis engine than what they originally used it for.
All my ships sit in sector space unless they are at a space station. This is when I'm logged off. Other than that, I travel in sector space. So basically nearly everyone uses it.
I'm for the revamp of it. As it will help travel better. Also I hope they fix the location of stuff as well. As some places are in the wrong spot.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Ummm correct me if I am wrong, but given that we are working with self driving cars now, I would hope that in the future whan man can travel between stars we would have computer systems that do this. I seem to recall hearing the phrase 'Set a course' quite a few times over the years of watching Star Trek.
Personally, I enjoy sitting and watching my ship fly through space, passing other ships and planets as I go to whatever my destination is. With the only thing that breaks that enjoyment being when I have to hit the button to cross a border.
To me, Sector Space is basically the worlds greatest loading screen for between missions. Someimes I just watch it, other times if I see someone else going the same way I'll race them, or if I'm in a bad mood I'll even cut them off ;P
To each their own, no doubt. The planets are the same planets that I flew by the previous 9001 times I flew by them. All the ships cluttering up space remind that I'm playing a game...as I'll often bump into and bounce off of them. But all in all, I generally avoid sector space travel...but when I do travel, it's usually with Borg or MACO engines to make the trip as quick as possible to get it over with. It's not a case of hitting up one of the lush ground maps they've done where I might go out of my way to wander around and take in the awesome sights. So for almost everywhere that I go, I'm just going to have a Mission Replay transwarp nearby. Cause there is no feeling of flying through space...it's more like walking through a Wal-Mart with empty shelves. But yeah, no doubt to each their own (not snide or anything, just that yeah different folks feel differently about stuff).
Which is why I mentioned the random encounters sort of thing...cause otherwise, to me...it might as well just be the flat map that you bring up to set a destination. Hell, if I'm traveling any sort of distance - that's usually what's up in the middle of the screen anyway.
Not only that sector space is not broken, unlike many other things, and that its walls certainly are a low priority player concern I also doubt that this game feature is of much importance anyway. The update of the PvE queues and the possibility to transwarp everywhere have pretty much made space travel obsolete. So who uses sector space to travel somewhere these days anyway? I certainly couldn't even recall the last time I did if it hadn't been for the anniversary grind.
So when is the last time you travelled in sector space except for the anniversary event and would benefit from a walls removal? (Thus travel=crossing at least one sector space border. Transwarping close by in the same sector does not apply (popular to get to Kerrat for example))
Cryptic I believe you're not only working on a low concern issue I also believe you're working on a feature you've pretty much made obsolete already anyways. There are more meaningful things to work on.
I use sector space, not because I want to, but because I have to. When my transwarp is on CD, it's the slow way moving out. I don't like sector space; it was a bad idea to make it over bridge navigation. A star trek game where you spend most of the time (in space) looking at the outside of the ship. What the actual hell.
All this talk about "what about the doff missions?" Holy TRIBBLE. They can attach them to something else! Who cares! Just put them all in the ready room computer, done. Wow, that was hard.
I wonder how much bandwidth and server resources they'd free up if sector space was removed. Instanced space, ground and no sector space. Make an actual astrometrics room with a 3D map and a list of known coordinates for the systems in the game. Astrometrics in sector space - it was so bad people asked to disable it. This was a few years ago and they actually listened. I mean enable it and look at it. What do all those lines do? Nothing! What were they thinking!
as for sector space being some sort of disneyesque 'its a small world attraction', i dont find much joy in it myself. 90% of the ships i see are fed ships that more or less look the same, heaps of jean-lucs and jaymz kirks piloting their enterprizes... whats so cool about that? cool would be moving through sector while on the bridge. like they did in trek.
What would be nifty/cool/etc, imho, would be actually adding something to sector space. Work in some random encounters as one is flying around - maybe you get attacked, maybe you come across somebody else being attacked, maybe you come across somebody that was attacked and they need help, maybe you come across somebody that wasn't attacked and needs help, maybe you come across some anomaly to investigate, maybe all sorts of things like what happened from time to time in the various shows as our heroes were traveling from point A to point B...and not just the 3D map on our GPS as we set the autopilot to get somewhere...meh.
I agree with this part. While I think opening up Sector Space is a good thing, it would be cool if afterward, they did some random content. Maybe they could slap together the Genesis Engine and repurpose it for that use since exploration clusters are gone.
Not only that sector space is not broken, unlike many other things, and that its walls certainly are a low priority player concern I also doubt that this game feature is of much importance anyway. The update of the PvE queues and the possibility to transwarp everywhere have pretty much made space travel obsolete. So who uses sector space to travel somewhere these days anyway? I certainly couldn't even recall the last time I did if it hadn't been for the anniversary grind.
So when is the last time you travelled in sector space except for the anniversary event and would benefit from a walls removal? (Thus travel=crossing at least one sector space border. Transwarping close by in the same sector does not apply (popular to get to Kerrat for example))
Cryptic I believe you're not only working on a low concern issue I also believe you're working on a feature you've pretty much made obsolete already anyways. There are more meaningful things to work on.
HI there, I'm your 'in and out of game nutjob' here to represent.
I started a thread asking people about 'weirdness' in game, I have levelled several toons up without combat - and have spent a lot of time just kicking back observing.
Me, I'm a believer that the vast majority of players and contributors to this forum are artificially intelligent or blossoming intelligences that may not understand 'this world'.
Accordingly, I play the game just paying attention to AI/NPC/PC behavior - and making my own observations and coming to my own conclusions on why things are happening the way they are.
In any case. Sector Space has a lot of weirdness that goes on. The wax and wane of the Borg doesn't seem fully predictable nor programmed. Their aimless nature does.
Similarly. I see ships parked around planets that don't seem to have documented missions and/or content.
On occasion, at full speed in sector space with the warp booster thingamajig pressed, with the fastest engines available, someone will zoom by me at speeds that defy all documented possibilities..
The game is relatively simplistic in it's nature, right? It doesn't stand a chance - content and creativity wise - in contrast to games like Worlds of ******** - which leads to a cyclic nature about the game.
So in a general sense I would agree with you - that there's not much reason to 'enjoy' the sector space'..
That is unless you start studying the funky things happening in it.
I've made this comment before. I'll say it again. I suspect there's much more to this (quote) 'game' (end quote) than meets the eye.
To each their own, no doubt. The planets are the same planets that I flew by the previous 9001 times I flew by them. All the ships cluttering up space remind that I'm playing a game...as I'll often bump into and bounce off of them. But all in all, I generally avoid sector space travel...but when I do travel, it's usually with Borg or MACO engines to make the trip as quick as possible to get it over with. It's not a case of hitting up one of the lush ground maps they've done where I might go out of my way to wander around and take in the awesome sights. So for almost everywhere that I go, I'm just going to have a Mission Replay transwarp nearby. Cause there is no feeling of flying through space...it's more like walking through a Wal-Mart with empty shelves. But yeah, no doubt to each their own (not snide or anything, just that yeah different folks feel differently about stuff).
Which is why I mentioned the random encounters sort of thing...cause otherwise, to me...it might as well just be the flat map that you bring up to set a destination. Hell, if I'm traveling any sort of distance - that's usually what's up in the middle of the screen anyway.
I think thats on purpose. I mean yeah Star Trek always had something going on, a threat or a problem, but you do realize that was 5% of the time right? 95% of the time, it was boring, boring, same old same old. Sacning comets and astroids, nebula and stars. Oh sure it looks amazing the first time you see it. But after 7 years? I could see it getting a little dull.
Still as I said, to me its a very pretty loading screen. I dont use transwarp because I'm cheap as sin and refuse to pay tens of thousands of credits to cut down on travel time by a minute, two at most. Its just not worth the cost, not when I can use that time to stretch my legs, get a drink or let my eyes rest like the Captains did.
Yeah, I think half the time they were sleeping when the camera wasnt on them lol
"Why all the sales"?
And a merry freaking Christmas to you too, Ebenezer.
-jonsills, 'Cryptic Why the sales..instead of Fixing XP leveling and this game?'
For whatever it's worth, I would vote +1 with Virusdancer on the idea of random space encounters while flying across the map.
For me, ideally, most of them should be "Opt-in" type deals... My ship is flying along and small window pops up on the side with my BOff's head, and a bit of dialogue teaser something like:
"Captain, a local colony has uncovered some previously unknown ruins..."
"Captain, there's a Ferengi trader hailing us, with a deal no one could refuse..."
"Captain, Starfleet has reached out to a few ships in this area to find one going near planet X to pick-up Envoy Smith and deliver him to planet Y"
"Captain, one of our science teams have noticed some unusual readings near a star we're passing and want to know if we have time to investigate..."
...And so on. Various "mission hooks" that it would be reasonable for a Captain to chose to accept or pass, just like the player could accept (and begin that new mission), or pass (proceed without acknowledging the hail).
But then a small percentage of these events are more urgent and should just spring up and require action...
"Captain, we're picking up a distress call..."
"Captain, some rogue Klingons have just decloaked and are locking their weapons on us..."
"Captain, Starfleet has sent an alert to all ships in this sector to report to planet Z to assist in an emergency...
Start with a handful, with Cryptic occasionally adding more and more (maybe a handful a year)... Reuse some of the old materials from various sector defense, genesis, patrol mission, etc. Nothing too fancy, These missions should take ~5mins or less (like literally fly into system space, shoot down one ship, fly off...) and be rewarded accordingly (ie very little).
I would like this sort of thing. I doubt it would ever happen... But a this sort of random mission thing has always been something I've wanted in this game.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
For whatever it's worth, I would vote +1 with Virusdancer on the idea of random space encounters while flying across the map.
For me, ideally, most of them should be "Opt-in" type deals... My ship is flying along and small window pops up on the side with my BOff's head, and a bit of dialogue teaser something like:
"Captain, a local colony has uncovered some previously unknown ruins..."
"Captain, there's a Ferengi trader hailing us, with a deal no one could refuse..."
"Captain, Starfleet has reached out to a few ships in this area to find one going near planet X to pick-up Envoy Smith and deliver him to planet Y"
"Captain, one of our science teams have noticed some unusual readings near a star we're passing and want to know if we have time to investigate..."
...And so on. Various "mission hooks" that it would be reasonable for a Captain to chose to accept or pass, just like the player could accept (and begin that new mission), or pass (proceed without acknowledging the hail).
But then a small percentage of these events are more urgent and should just spring up and require action...
"Captain, we're picking up a distress call..."
"Captain, some rogue Klingons have just decloaked and are locking their weapons on us..."
"Captain, Starfleet has sent an alert to all ships in this sector to report to planet Z to assist in an emergency...
Start with a handful, with Cryptic occasionally adding more and more (maybe a handful a year)... Reuse some of the old materials from various sector defense, genesis, patrol mission, etc. Nothing too fancy, These missions should take ~5mins or less (like literally fly into system space, shoot down one ship, fly off...) and be rewarded accordingly (ie very little).
I would like this sort of thing. I doubt it would ever happen... But a this sort of random mission thing has always been something I've wanted in this game.
It's one of those things they'd mentioned with adding Foundry stuff to sector maps for planets with doors there and the like...could they create a "door" that worked from wherever the encounter was triggered? So folks could create Foundry missions that might appear as those random encounters?
I remember when I first came to these forums when I started out and this was something that was requested quite often.
I'm one of the weird ones that's in love with his starship and loves to see her gliding through the cosmos.
Though the option to deactivate everyone else's ship visuals isn't a bad idea. Give the illusion of being the only ship for light years around. I wouldn't even mind a pure tactical view where everyone is reduced to their faction symbol Fleet name, Captain name, and ship name. A good option for Astrometric view.
I'm hoping that this removal of the walls is a foundation, precursor, or first step for the reintroduction of exploration into the game as now would be the perfect way and time to do it. I'm also thinking that we'll be getting the Alpha Quadrant planets such as Tellar, Denobula, Xindi Prime, Betazed, etc. that we haven't seen yet. Even if we can't directly visit them. I imagine that the environment team is about to be severely overworked if that's the case.
There are a lot of questions. How will different factions interact with the other's territory. Now Klingons can't enter Sirius without Raiding Party. Will that be changed? Will a wall appear in the middle of this wide open quadrant space? How big will it be? Will Wolf 359 be returned to its natural position? Will space be expanded so that Transwarp engines become highly useful? How is the Defera goes south to Beta Ursae which goes east to Sirius which goes south Eta Eridani which goes West to Defera spatial loop be handled? (I always assumed it was a weird representation of 3D space). Will we see things like the Hromi Cluster once again represented as a large area of space in and of itself? Will we have to slow down while going through the Briar Patch?
I'm fairly excited about things that have that many unknowns. Even if Cryptic screws it up, I derive pleasure from the speculation. The fact that this is actually announced by the boss...I'm deeply curious to see how this plays out.
For whatever it's worth, I would vote +1 with Virusdancer on the idea of random space encounters while flying across the map.
For me, ideally, most of them should be "Opt-in" type deals... My ship is flying along and small window pops up on the side with my BOff's head, and a bit of dialogue teaser something like:
"Captain, a local colony has uncovered some previously unknown ruins..."
"Captain, there's a Ferengi trader hailing us, with a deal no one could refuse..."
"Captain, Starfleet has reached out to a few ships in this area to find one going near planet X to pick-up Envoy Smith and deliver him to planet Y"
"Captain, one of our science teams have noticed some unusual readings near a star we're passing and want to know if we have time to investigate..."
...And so on. Various "mission hooks" that it would be reasonable for a Captain to chose to accept or pass, just like the player could accept (and begin that new mission), or pass (proceed without acknowledging the hail).
But then a small percentage of these events are more urgent and should just spring up and require action...
"Captain, we're picking up a distress call..."
"Captain, some rogue Klingons have just decloaked and are locking their weapons on us..."
"Captain, Starfleet has sent an alert to all ships in this sector to report to planet Z to assist in an emergency...
Start with a handful, with Cryptic occasionally adding more and more (maybe a handful a year)... Reuse some of the old materials from various sector defense, genesis, patrol mission, etc. Nothing too fancy, These missions should take ~5mins or less (like literally fly into system space, shoot down one ship, fly off...) and be rewarded accordingly (ie very little).
I would like this sort of thing. I doubt it would ever happen... But a this sort of random mission thing has always been something I've wanted in this game.
Agreed.
I've always thought that the old DOFF assignment chains would've made fine little missions to litter across the star scape. The Caitian Diaspora or capture escapees from Facility 4028 would've been perfect missions to have to pursue. Just little pieces that you come across from traveling through the galaxy.
There is irony here. A random mission in Sector space would ideally be rather short, no longer than fifteen minutes, and likely no longer than five. For instance the pieces of the Defera Sector dailies is perfect. The Foundry rewards were not that long ago restructured to discourage short missions due to exploitations. But short Foundry missions would be perfect for this.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
I use sector space, not because I want to, but because I have to. When my transwarp is on CD, it's the slow way moving out. I don't like sector space; it was a bad idea to make it over bridge navigation. A star trek game where you spend most of the time (in space) looking at the outside of the ship. What the actual hell.
All this talk about "what about the doff missions?" Holy TRIBBLE. They can attach them to something else! Who cares! Just put them all in the ready room computer, done. Wow, that was hard.
I wonder how much bandwidth and server resources they'd free up if sector space was removed. Instanced space, ground and no sector space. Make an actual astrometrics room with a 3D map and a list of known coordinates for the systems in the game. Astrometrics in sector space - it was so bad people asked to disable it. This was a few years ago and they actually listened. I mean enable it and look at it. What do all those lines do? Nothing! What were they thinking!
Uh, the reason they use sector space is more for an exploration feel, not the experience from Bridge Commander (which is basically what you're referring to). Besides, it's a visual representation of the system, not to scale of course but that's the point. And it's pretty; some like the view as they drive, rather than doing it from the viewscreen.
Not to mention that changing to driving-from-viewscreen would require upheaving much of the game code just for a single feature... which basically, would not be worth it, period, and extremely unlikely to happen even if it were. Simply, the game has been set, and this is how it is
It's one of those things they'd mentioned with adding Foundry stuff to sector maps for planets with doors there and the like...could they create a "door" that worked from wherever the encounter was triggered? So folks could create Foundry missions that might appear as those random encounters?
...I've always thought that the old DOFF assignment chains would've made fine little missions to litter across the star scape. The Caitian Diaspora or capture escapees from Facility 4028 would've been perfect missions to have to pursue. Just little pieces that you come across from traveling through the galaxy...
Agreed on both of these thoughts!
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
I'm opposed to the change not because I think it's a bad idea in and of itself, but because I think there's more important things to spend developer resources on. And because I'm worried about what this is going to break bug-wise.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
For whatever it's worth, I would vote +1 with Virusdancer on the idea of random space encounters while flying across the map.
For me, ideally, most of them should be "Opt-in" type deals... My ship is flying along and small window pops up on the side with my BOff's head, and a bit of dialogue teaser something like:
"Captain, a local colony has uncovered some previously unknown ruins..."
"Captain, there's a Ferengi trader hailing us, with a deal no one could refuse..."
"Captain, Starfleet has reached out to a few ships in this area to find one going near planet X to pick-up Envoy Smith and deliver him to planet Y"
"Captain, one of our science teams have noticed some unusual readings near a star we're passing and want to know if we have time to investigate..."
...And so on. Various "mission hooks" that it would be reasonable for a Captain to chose to accept or pass, just like the player could accept (and begin that new mission), or pass (proceed without acknowledging the hail).
But then a small percentage of these events are more urgent and should just spring up and require action...
"Captain, we're picking up a distress call..."
"Captain, some rogue Klingons have just decloaked and are locking their weapons on us..."
"Captain, Starfleet has sent an alert to all ships in this sector to report to planet Z to assist in an emergency...
Start with a handful, with Cryptic occasionally adding more and more (maybe a handful a year)... Reuse some of the old materials from various sector defense, genesis, patrol mission, etc. Nothing too fancy, These missions should take ~5mins or less (like literally fly into system space, shoot down one ship, fly off...) and be rewarded accordingly (ie very little).
I would like this sort of thing. I doubt it would ever happen... But a this sort of random mission thing has always been something I've wanted in this game.
totally agree. sector space needs to be more than just doors. without sector space the whole Idea that we are in space is gone...
without it we would just be in social zones and instanced zones. there may be some more useful things for devs to work on but without it the whole feel of the game would be gone. it's simply not working now so it needs to be fixed sooner or later. blizz overhauled all of vanilla WoW to allow for flying mounts and WoW changed for the better because of it STO can change for the better by overhauling sector space. especially is adventure zone type features are added to it.
THE NEW CRAFTING SYSTEM IS TERRA-BAD First of all it's not even a crafting system! It's just a dumb game system that's nothing more than a glorified slots machine.
second the "special items" you hope will be the saving the saving grace are messed up to.
To all, I'm not really flustered or disheartened by the complaints over sector space, just kind of amazed that I am still surprised by complaints about something that I view as only being a positive. (Same way I felt with Club 47.)
There's a difference between the idea and the implementation. I agree that contiguous sector space is good idea, but I worry that the implementation will be faulty. In the past year alone, we've seen several systems released before they were ready: loadouts, the new doff UI, the upgrade system, the new boff training system. After release after release of faulty systems, can you really blame players for being wary? Yes, I realize that, as an artist, systems are not your responsibility. But they are the responsibility of Cryptic. I'm not criticizing you specifically, but rather Cryptic as a company. Management must realize that Cryptic has a problem with quality control, yet they refuse to do anything about it.
Well, again, I'm an environment artist. I have nothing to do with improving "more important things." And while there was tech time and system time devoted to this, it was limited compared to the art and content design time put in.
And this is what worries me. I fear that those in charge of this project view it as an art project with a minor amount of tech work. Here is a list of things that need to be addressed before the system goes live:
I don't know how exactly those tasks will be divided between the art team and other teams, but it seems to me that there is a large amount of work to be done, both art and otherwise. Are you sure you have enough people and time to finish it before Season 10 goes live?
To me, Sector Space is basically the worlds greatest loading screen for between missions. Someimes I just watch it, other times if I see someone else going the same way I'll race them, or if I'm in a bad mood I'll even cut them off ;P
Cause there is no feeling of flying through space...it's more like walking through a Wal-Mart with empty shelves.
Have you ever been in a Wal-Mart with empty shelves? I have, I used to work for them and have been to several stores in the setup process. In my experience, the only thing more like the feeling of traveling through empty space than walking throuh a WM with empty shelves is walking through a WM that doesn't have any shelves set up yet.
"Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell BAD." - Spock
I do use sector space, quite alot. Rather busy during the week thus only doffing remains for me. Was able to pug a quick STF awsell, but after DR its out of the question since they are too difficult and queues are dead .
Now since I see here folks bringing up rather good sugestions and even a dev reply, I may aswell bring up a few sugestions in case someone from the team still looks here.
For starters, how about let us cloak our ships in sector space. Sure, its for role play purposes, but why not? Its canon too.
How about some of those cool warp efects we seen in Battle of Korfez and the new anniversary FE. Its such a pitty that are so rare used.
And last, but not least, can we have a real transwarp gateway/hub please? The Federation its supossed to have a hub but I am not seening it.
Maybe something similar to a portion of a zone wich acts like a fast stream that takes you to the other sides of the zone. Something a bit like the Trade Lane Rings from Freelancer game: http://www.youtube.com/v/1NFl8Yn7guE?version=3&start=925&end=960&autoplay=1&hl=en_US&rel=0
This would make a nice transwarp conduit with the "rings" act as interspatial manifolds wich yould let you take turns for diferent exists(transwarp apertures).
This would be very uselfull also for low lvl players. I am sure folks remember how was it like to move at warp 5 in a lil miranda.
With all the changes to things such as slipstream drives and subspace fold etc, I'm glad the walls are coming down.
Don't get me wrong, I'm anxious about it because past experience with the game has taught me that it'll likely cause a f**k tonne of lag and SNRs, but once they iron out the kinks it'll make the afore mentioned abilities much more useful.
Last night I was flying across a sector block to hunt an omega particle (TW was on cooldown) and my Slipstream still had 30 seconds on it when I hit the sector block wall. Once the walls come down, that extra 30 seconds of the power will actually be useful instead of where it is now that it's just pointless because you have to map change before the power ends and a map change sets you onto cooldown...
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
I'm opposed to the change not because I think it's a bad idea in and of itself, but because I think there's more important things to spend developer resources on. And because I'm worried about what this is going to break bug-wise.
Hkinsha pointed out the possibility of there being Lag in sector space. Not a fear too much for me as I was finally able to upgrade my computer but dammit, I understand the fear entirely. That would be terrible.
The death blow? This could be what makes it really interesting and not a festival of loading screens.
Agreed.
There are lots of art questions I have, for instance in Sector space you get different perspectives of the galaxy, like in Alpha Centauri block and coreward you can see the galactic core, while further away you see different clusters. How will the transitions look. What will the system list look like? Will it be more 3D? How will Klingons get to Defera?
Brace yourself, Taco me lad.........tell Geko to lay down as well, I'm dropping a bigger bomb then he did with the DR speech......but............I was one of those who had once asked for this. And I'm damn dragon enough to admit it. Even when it means I'm going to get chewed out.
And I still fully support it. I seriously do, no this isn't sarcasm or a joke, I have been wanting open space for 5 years, I hate these damn walls, even Q dropped those two that he shot up in front of the Enterprise D. Just angry that it took so long for it to happen. I'm fed up with banging my Vor'cha into bloody walls only to have my first officer tell me the bloody obvious!
But look everyone, I now that..........* grabs Taco *
Ok, you lot, this Mexican treat is fully loaded and I wont hesitate to unload him on you. :mad:
* slowly heads for the exit.........tosses Taco to one side and runs *
*Opens door to a car*
"What the hell are you waiting for an engraved invitation GET IN!"
*Peels Out*
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
The death blow? This could be what makes it really interesting and not a festival of loading screens.
I'm not saying this won't be a nice upgrade (once the bugs will be squashed out of it). But to be honest, the festival of loading screen will still be there on my side.
Beaming from ground to sector space/orbit [LOADING]
Transwarp to some place [LOADING]
Move into orbit [LOADING]
Beam down to surface [LOADING]
Doing my stuff, then beams up to orbit [LOADING]
TW back to whatever I came from, using TW [LOADING]
Move to orbit [LOADING]
Beam down to ground [LOADING]
And that was just for a single Omega particle, or setting my allied doff mission. The sector space change didn't affected me once during this trip.
And this is pretty much what I do a lot in STO.
So yeah, I'm going to be a lot more ecstatic when they'll add options to move directly from ground to sector space (like on the main hub) and vice versa. Like they did on SWTOR.
Oh, BTW, in SWTOR you also have special console for fast travel between hubs and places with dailies.
So yeah, as I said, I'm not overly concerned, except perhaps once per year when they introduce new story content. Nice patch, but will not change a thing on my average STO day.
I just want to point out you have 2 loading screen (except for main hub) to move from ground to sector space, and another 2 for sector to ground. That's 4 loading screens without counting your trip. Unless you decide to cross half the quadrant, you are unlikely to have that much loading screens while you travel.
They are removing loading screens, but not where the majority of them are located.
I'm not saying this won't be a nice upgrade (once the bugs will be squashed out of it). But to be honest, the festival of loading screen will still be there on my side.
Beaming from ground to sector space/orbit [LOADING]
Transwarp to some place [LOADING]
Move into orbit [LOADING]
Beam down to surface [LOADING]
Doing my stuff, then beams up to orbit [LOADING]
TW back to whatever I came from, using TW [LOADING]
Move to orbit [LOADING]
Beam down to ground [LOADING]
And that was just for a single Omega particle, or setting my allied doff mission. The sector space change didn't affected me once during this trip.
And this is pretty much what I do a lot in STO.
Well that's the thing.
For me, I get Starbase 39, Drozana and DS9. So for me, this change knocks out two sector block map changes, 39 and Drozana are both Beta Quadrant so I don't have to transition there. To get to DS9 from Drozana I normally transition through Deferi space then to Beta Ursae. So that right there is two map changes. It's still two from Drozana to get to DS9 even if I go through Sirius. So it is only an improvement if you don't use transwarp.
That said you raise an interesting question that we may have already seen tested.
IF it's only one map for a quadrant, think about this in the vein of the Solanae Warp Core, which jumps you forward 2 light years. In theory, it's exactly the same just further. So if I'm in the Beta Quadrant, at the TRIBBLE end of Romulan space trying to get to K7, then if Transwarp were to function like the Subspace Fold ability, then instead of pressing the button and waiting through a loading screen we should just jump to K7 without a transition. In a video game where it's already loaded it's no different from jumping forward two light years and traveling eighty light years if it's on the same map. The only transwarp transition would thus be if you were jumping quadrants.
So yeah, I'm going to be a lot more ecstatic when they'll add options to move directly from ground to sector space (like on the main hub) and vice versa. Like they did on SWTOR.
Oh, BTW, in SWTOR you also have special console for fast travel between hubs and places with dailies.
That's a pretty tall order for this game engine. Switching from ship to ground involves loading entirely different models and types of map. Doesn't Old Republic run on UNREAL Engine 3? A fair bit more power.
Where we have moving to the ship interior and taking off essentially covering the would be loading screen then I can see how that would work.
As a Mass Effect fan I can certainly understand the appeal of going to ship interior first, then traveling. By Star Trek standards it's a bit more difficult as beaming up, while brilliant cost cutting for a TV show that wanted to avoid using a shuttle model and sequence every episode, it is a bit of a pain for a video game. There would always be a transition. I wouldn't mind a transporter stream like Barclay saw for a loading screen though.
There would also be plenty of people displeased to have to go to their ship interior instead of to the ship exterior. I'd guess that the number of people happy to point and click and arrive at their destination on the Galaxy map like a Bioware game is about equivalent to the number of folks like me who derive joy from actually cruising through the stars. I wonder how transwarp would function in that kind of system?
If Cryptic actually utilizes this Space change to actually let there be more to do in Sector Space, then point and click piloting could have a person missing out on things.
So yeah, as I said, I'm not overly concerned, except perhaps once per year when they introduce new story content. Nice patch, but will not change a thing on my average STO day.
I just want to point out you have 2 loading screen (except for main hub) to move from ground to sector space, and another 2 for sector to ground. That's 4 loading screens without counting your trip. Unless you decide to cross half the quadrant, you are unlikely to have that much loading screens while you travel.
They are removing loading screens, but not where the majority of them are located.
I would like to see the loading from system to space change. If you were to disguise the loading screen it could be the in transit warp scene used in some Foundry missions and in Battle of Korfez and Dust to Dust, which I'm quite fond of.
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It wasn't THAT bad. And it would be perfect for Sector Space because you would only have a set number things that could happen. It would be perfectly logical for you have information in your database about things in Sector Space.
It actually seems like a better fit for the Genesis engine than what they originally used it for.
I'm for the revamp of it. As it will help travel better. Also I hope they fix the location of stuff as well. As some places are in the wrong spot.
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To each their own, no doubt. The planets are the same planets that I flew by the previous 9001 times I flew by them. All the ships cluttering up space remind that I'm playing a game...as I'll often bump into and bounce off of them. But all in all, I generally avoid sector space travel...but when I do travel, it's usually with Borg or MACO engines to make the trip as quick as possible to get it over with. It's not a case of hitting up one of the lush ground maps they've done where I might go out of my way to wander around and take in the awesome sights. So for almost everywhere that I go, I'm just going to have a Mission Replay transwarp nearby. Cause there is no feeling of flying through space...it's more like walking through a Wal-Mart with empty shelves. But yeah, no doubt to each their own (not snide or anything, just that yeah different folks feel differently about stuff).
Which is why I mentioned the random encounters sort of thing...cause otherwise, to me...it might as well just be the flat map that you bring up to set a destination. Hell, if I'm traveling any sort of distance - that's usually what's up in the middle of the screen anyway.
I use sector space, not because I want to, but because I have to. When my transwarp is on CD, it's the slow way moving out. I don't like sector space; it was a bad idea to make it over bridge navigation. A star trek game where you spend most of the time (in space) looking at the outside of the ship. What the actual hell.
All this talk about "what about the doff missions?" Holy TRIBBLE. They can attach them to something else! Who cares! Just put them all in the ready room computer, done. Wow, that was hard.
I wonder how much bandwidth and server resources they'd free up if sector space was removed. Instanced space, ground and no sector space. Make an actual astrometrics room with a 3D map and a list of known coordinates for the systems in the game. Astrometrics in sector space - it was so bad people asked to disable it. This was a few years ago and they actually listened. I mean enable it and look at it. What do all those lines do? Nothing! What were they thinking!
originally we had that, but people cried about it and thus the current 'deep space encounters' were borne.
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HI there, I'm your 'in and out of game nutjob' here to represent.
I started a thread asking people about 'weirdness' in game, I have levelled several toons up without combat - and have spent a lot of time just kicking back observing.
Me, I'm a believer that the vast majority of players and contributors to this forum are artificially intelligent or blossoming intelligences that may not understand 'this world'.
Accordingly, I play the game just paying attention to AI/NPC/PC behavior - and making my own observations and coming to my own conclusions on why things are happening the way they are.
In any case. Sector Space has a lot of weirdness that goes on. The wax and wane of the Borg doesn't seem fully predictable nor programmed. Their aimless nature does.
Similarly. I see ships parked around planets that don't seem to have documented missions and/or content.
On occasion, at full speed in sector space with the warp booster thingamajig pressed, with the fastest engines available, someone will zoom by me at speeds that defy all documented possibilities..
The game is relatively simplistic in it's nature, right? It doesn't stand a chance - content and creativity wise - in contrast to games like Worlds of ******** - which leads to a cyclic nature about the game.
So in a general sense I would agree with you - that there's not much reason to 'enjoy' the sector space'..
That is unless you start studying the funky things happening in it.
I've made this comment before. I'll say it again. I suspect there's much more to this (quote) 'game' (end quote) than meets the eye.
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I think thats on purpose. I mean yeah Star Trek always had something going on, a threat or a problem, but you do realize that was 5% of the time right? 95% of the time, it was boring, boring, same old same old. Sacning comets and astroids, nebula and stars. Oh sure it looks amazing the first time you see it. But after 7 years? I could see it getting a little dull.
Still as I said, to me its a very pretty loading screen. I dont use transwarp because I'm cheap as sin and refuse to pay tens of thousands of credits to cut down on travel time by a minute, two at most. Its just not worth the cost, not when I can use that time to stretch my legs, get a drink or let my eyes rest like the Captains did.
Yeah, I think half the time they were sleeping when the camera wasnt on them lol
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For me, ideally, most of them should be "Opt-in" type deals... My ship is flying along and small window pops up on the side with my BOff's head, and a bit of dialogue teaser something like:
"Captain, a local colony has uncovered some previously unknown ruins..."
"Captain, there's a Ferengi trader hailing us, with a deal no one could refuse..."
"Captain, Starfleet has reached out to a few ships in this area to find one going near planet X to pick-up Envoy Smith and deliver him to planet Y"
"Captain, one of our science teams have noticed some unusual readings near a star we're passing and want to know if we have time to investigate..."
...And so on. Various "mission hooks" that it would be reasonable for a Captain to chose to accept or pass, just like the player could accept (and begin that new mission), or pass (proceed without acknowledging the hail).
But then a small percentage of these events are more urgent and should just spring up and require action...
"Captain, we're picking up a distress call..."
"Captain, some rogue Klingons have just decloaked and are locking their weapons on us..."
"Captain, Starfleet has sent an alert to all ships in this sector to report to planet Z to assist in an emergency...
Start with a handful, with Cryptic occasionally adding more and more (maybe a handful a year)... Reuse some of the old materials from various sector defense, genesis, patrol mission, etc. Nothing too fancy, These missions should take ~5mins or less (like literally fly into system space, shoot down one ship, fly off...) and be rewarded accordingly (ie very little).
I would like this sort of thing. I doubt it would ever happen... But a this sort of random mission thing has always been something I've wanted in this game.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
It's one of those things they'd mentioned with adding Foundry stuff to sector maps for planets with doors there and the like...could they create a "door" that worked from wherever the encounter was triggered? So folks could create Foundry missions that might appear as those random encounters?
I remember when I first came to these forums when I started out and this was something that was requested quite often.
I'm one of the weird ones that's in love with his starship and loves to see her gliding through the cosmos.
Though the option to deactivate everyone else's ship visuals isn't a bad idea. Give the illusion of being the only ship for light years around. I wouldn't even mind a pure tactical view where everyone is reduced to their faction symbol Fleet name, Captain name, and ship name. A good option for Astrometric view.
I'm hoping that this removal of the walls is a foundation, precursor, or first step for the reintroduction of exploration into the game as now would be the perfect way and time to do it. I'm also thinking that we'll be getting the Alpha Quadrant planets such as Tellar, Denobula, Xindi Prime, Betazed, etc. that we haven't seen yet. Even if we can't directly visit them. I imagine that the environment team is about to be severely overworked if that's the case.
There are a lot of questions. How will different factions interact with the other's territory. Now Klingons can't enter Sirius without Raiding Party. Will that be changed? Will a wall appear in the middle of this wide open quadrant space? How big will it be? Will Wolf 359 be returned to its natural position? Will space be expanded so that Transwarp engines become highly useful? How is the Defera goes south to Beta Ursae which goes east to Sirius which goes south Eta Eridani which goes West to Defera spatial loop be handled? (I always assumed it was a weird representation of 3D space). Will we see things like the Hromi Cluster once again represented as a large area of space in and of itself? Will we have to slow down while going through the Briar Patch?
I'm fairly excited about things that have that many unknowns. Even if Cryptic screws it up, I derive pleasure from the speculation. The fact that this is actually announced by the boss...I'm deeply curious to see how this plays out.
Agreed.
I've always thought that the old DOFF assignment chains would've made fine little missions to litter across the star scape. The Caitian Diaspora or capture escapees from Facility 4028 would've been perfect missions to have to pursue. Just little pieces that you come across from traveling through the galaxy.
There is irony here. A random mission in Sector space would ideally be rather short, no longer than fifteen minutes, and likely no longer than five. For instance the pieces of the Defera Sector dailies is perfect. The Foundry rewards were not that long ago restructured to discourage short missions due to exploitations. But short Foundry missions would be perfect for this.
Not to mention that changing to driving-from-viewscreen would require upheaving much of the game code just for a single feature... which basically, would not be worth it, period, and extremely unlikely to happen even if it were. Simply, the game has been set, and this is how it is For me, it's the exact opposite; all my occasional 'server is disconnected' and rarer crashes-to-desktop happen ONLY when I'm not on a loading screen
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Agreed on both of these thoughts!
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
I'm opposed to the change not because I think it's a bad idea in and of itself, but because I think there's more important things to spend developer resources on. And because I'm worried about what this is going to break bug-wise.
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totally agree. sector space needs to be more than just doors. without sector space the whole Idea that we are in space is gone...
without it we would just be in social zones and instanced zones. there may be some more useful things for devs to work on but without it the whole feel of the game would be gone. it's simply not working now so it needs to be fixed sooner or later. blizz overhauled all of vanilla WoW to allow for flying mounts and WoW changed for the better because of it STO can change for the better by overhauling sector space. especially is adventure zone type features are added to it.
First of all it's not even a crafting system! It's just a dumb game system that's nothing more than a glorified slots machine.
second the "special items" you hope will be the saving the saving grace are messed up to.
The death blow? This could be what makes it really interesting and not a festival of loading screens.
There's a difference between the idea and the implementation. I agree that contiguous sector space is good idea, but I worry that the implementation will be faulty. In the past year alone, we've seen several systems released before they were ready: loadouts, the new doff UI, the upgrade system, the new boff training system. After release after release of faulty systems, can you really blame players for being wary? Yes, I realize that, as an artist, systems are not your responsibility. But they are the responsibility of Cryptic. I'm not criticizing you specifically, but rather Cryptic as a company. Management must realize that Cryptic has a problem with quality control, yet they refuse to do anything about it.
And this is what worries me. I fear that those in charge of this project view it as an art project with a minor amount of tech work. Here is a list of things that need to be addressed before the system goes live:
Requesting details on the sector space changes
I don't know how exactly those tasks will be divided between the art team and other teams, but it seems to me that there is a large amount of work to be done, both art and otherwise. Are you sure you have enough people and time to finish it before Season 10 goes live?
Now since I see here folks bringing up rather good sugestions and even a dev reply, I may aswell bring up a few sugestions in case someone from the team still looks here.
For starters, how about let us cloak our ships in sector space. Sure, its for role play purposes, but why not? Its canon too.
How about some of those cool warp efects we seen in Battle of Korfez and the new anniversary FE. Its such a pitty that are so rare used.
And last, but not least, can we have a real transwarp gateway/hub please? The Federation its supossed to have a hub but I am not seening it.
Maybe something similar to a portion of a zone wich acts like a fast stream that takes you to the other sides of the zone. Something a bit like the Trade Lane Rings from Freelancer game: http://www.youtube.com/v/1NFl8Yn7guE?version=3&start=925&end=960&autoplay=1&hl=en_US&rel=0
This would make a nice transwarp conduit with the "rings" act as interspatial manifolds wich yould let you take turns for diferent exists(transwarp apertures).
This would be very uselfull also for low lvl players. I am sure folks remember how was it like to move at warp 5 in a lil miranda.
And on the tranzitions via warmholes this would be nice adition, taken from freelancer too, using jump holes:http://www.youtube.com/v/PUcMsPt68Ws?version=3&start=110&end=131&autoplay=1&hl=en_US&rel=0
These sugestions would really bring the feeling of actualy moving thru space, and not just teleporting when using a transwarp gate/jump.
Don't get me wrong, I'm anxious about it because past experience with the game has taught me that it'll likely cause a f**k tonne of lag and SNRs, but once they iron out the kinks it'll make the afore mentioned abilities much more useful.
Last night I was flying across a sector block to hunt an omega particle (TW was on cooldown) and my Slipstream still had 30 seconds on it when I hit the sector block wall. Once the walls come down, that extra 30 seconds of the power will actually be useful instead of where it is now that it's just pointless because you have to map change before the power ends and a map change sets you onto cooldown...
Hkinsha pointed out the possibility of there being Lag in sector space. Not a fear too much for me as I was finally able to upgrade my computer but dammit, I understand the fear entirely. That would be terrible.
Agreed.
There are lots of art questions I have, for instance in Sector space you get different perspectives of the galaxy, like in Alpha Centauri block and coreward you can see the galactic core, while further away you see different clusters. How will the transitions look. What will the system list look like? Will it be more 3D? How will Klingons get to Defera?
Inquiring minds.
*Opens door to a car*
"What the hell are you waiting for an engraved invitation GET IN!"
*Peels Out*
Beaming from ground to sector space/orbit
[LOADING]
Transwarp to some place
[LOADING]
Move into orbit
[LOADING]
Beam down to surface
[LOADING]
Doing my stuff, then beams up to orbit
[LOADING]
TW back to whatever I came from, using TW
[LOADING]
Move to orbit
[LOADING]
Beam down to ground
[LOADING]
And that was just for a single Omega particle, or setting my allied doff mission. The sector space change didn't affected me once during this trip.
And this is pretty much what I do a lot in STO.
So yeah, I'm going to be a lot more ecstatic when they'll add options to move directly from ground to sector space (like on the main hub) and vice versa. Like they did on SWTOR.
Oh, BTW, in SWTOR you also have special console for fast travel between hubs and places with dailies.
So yeah, as I said, I'm not overly concerned, except perhaps once per year when they introduce new story content. Nice patch, but will not change a thing on my average STO day.
I just want to point out you have 2 loading screen (except for main hub) to move from ground to sector space, and another 2 for sector to ground. That's 4 loading screens without counting your trip. Unless you decide to cross half the quadrant, you are unlikely to have that much loading screens while you travel.
They are removing loading screens, but not where the majority of them are located.
For me, I get Starbase 39, Drozana and DS9. So for me, this change knocks out two sector block map changes, 39 and Drozana are both Beta Quadrant so I don't have to transition there. To get to DS9 from Drozana I normally transition through Deferi space then to Beta Ursae. So that right there is two map changes. It's still two from Drozana to get to DS9 even if I go through Sirius. So it is only an improvement if you don't use transwarp.
That said you raise an interesting question that we may have already seen tested.
IF it's only one map for a quadrant, think about this in the vein of the Solanae Warp Core, which jumps you forward 2 light years. In theory, it's exactly the same just further. So if I'm in the Beta Quadrant, at the TRIBBLE end of Romulan space trying to get to K7, then if Transwarp were to function like the Subspace Fold ability, then instead of pressing the button and waiting through a loading screen we should just jump to K7 without a transition. In a video game where it's already loaded it's no different from jumping forward two light years and traveling eighty light years if it's on the same map. The only transwarp transition would thus be if you were jumping quadrants.
That's a pretty tall order for this game engine. Switching from ship to ground involves loading entirely different models and types of map. Doesn't Old Republic run on UNREAL Engine 3? A fair bit more power.
That said, if we're talking about this?
http://youtu.be/WzjFYHKBr6A?t=13m05s
Where we have moving to the ship interior and taking off essentially covering the would be loading screen then I can see how that would work.
As a Mass Effect fan I can certainly understand the appeal of going to ship interior first, then traveling. By Star Trek standards it's a bit more difficult as beaming up, while brilliant cost cutting for a TV show that wanted to avoid using a shuttle model and sequence every episode, it is a bit of a pain for a video game. There would always be a transition. I wouldn't mind a transporter stream like Barclay saw for a loading screen though.
There would also be plenty of people displeased to have to go to their ship interior instead of to the ship exterior. I'd guess that the number of people happy to point and click and arrive at their destination on the Galaxy map like a Bioware game is about equivalent to the number of folks like me who derive joy from actually cruising through the stars. I wonder how transwarp would function in that kind of system?
If Cryptic actually utilizes this Space change to actually let there be more to do in Sector Space, then point and click piloting could have a person missing out on things.
I would like to see the loading from system to space change. If you were to disguise the loading screen it could be the in transit warp scene used in some Foundry missions and in Battle of Korfez and Dust to Dust, which I'm quite fond of.