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Why is the Federation not at war with the Romulan Empire?

newplayerguy7newplayerguy7 Member Posts: 593 Arc User
edited February 2015 in Star Trek Online General Discussion
**SPOILERS BELOW***






As per the title, after the events in the new 'Empress Sela' episode in the Romulan Mystery arc, why are the Federation and Romulan Star Empire not at war? I mean seriously. The fully recognized LEADER of the Empire takes a full on battle fleet across the Neutral Zone, flies deep into Federation space, enters orbit to a Federation home world (Vulcan) and attempts to obliterate it. How is that not an open act of war in any sense of the term??

That would be like the Japanese attacking Pearl Harbor in WWII and the United States just shrugging their shoulders (do nothing in response) and saying, 'Eh, what are you gonna do? That's just the way they are".

Seriously!?!?

Oh and for heavens sake, please, PLEASE, change the Sela toon back to the one we originally had, the new one looks HORRIBLE.
Post edited by newplayerguy7 on

Comments

  • thutmosis85thutmosis85 Member Posts: 2,358 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Isn't the Federation "at war" with pretty much everyone ?
    Aren't we murdering Hakeev some Missions later & trying to kill Sela ?
    What else do you need ?
    Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member, Star Trek Online Moderator Posts: 58,596 Community Moderator
    edited February 2015
    Actually... only a Romulan player actually kills Hakeev. Fed and KDF just let Obisek do it.
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    Yang Xiao Long wrote:
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited February 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • thutmosis85thutmosis85 Member Posts: 2,358 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    rattler2 wrote: »
    Actually... only a Romulan player actually kills Hakeev. Fed and KDF just let Obisek do it.

    Yeah I know ... but still ... complicity in murder ...
    Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
  • zellkarrathzellkarrath Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    I guess its because The Federation doesn't want to officially open up another front in the current state of war the galaxy is in. During this time, they are already dealing with the Klingons, Borg attacks, potential Undine infiltrations, and terrorism from The True Way.

    Really though, the entire Empress Sela mission is really, really bad. Sela invites a prominent captain along with several delegates to the same location where she is loading all of her weapons up to attack Vulcan. Ummmmmm why? Why is she drawing attention to herself in this episode? Why even bother with a conference? Just launch a cloaked fleet at Vulcan without any warning. Done. Or if you want to lull the Federation into a false sense of security, have the fleet launch from a separate location entirely and have no evidence or proof of an incoming attack be located at the conference site.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member, Star Trek Online Moderator Posts: 58,596 Community Moderator
    edited February 2015
    The conference was to distract the Federation. Too bad someone already suspected that something was off. And to help distract the Federation, Sela was there in person to "Participate". My guess is she planned to make nice, excuse herself, disable the Fed ships, then lead the fleet to Vulcan personally.
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    Yang Xiao Long wrote:
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • zellkarrathzellkarrath Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    rattler2 wrote: »
    The conference was to distract the Federation. Too bad someone already suspected that something was off. And to help distract the Federation, Sela was there in person to "Participate". My guess is she planned to make nice, excuse herself, disable the Fed ships, then lead the fleet to Vulcan personally.

    Except She left evidence of a potential attack everywhere at the conference site. Sure, you weren't even supposed to be in those sections of the base, but she should have assumed that Starfleet or elements within The Federation would do some snooping around. The idea of staging a conference to launch a surprise attack isn't what I think is wrong wrong with this mission, it's the fact that Sela would have a great deal of evidence just sitting around for any would be spies to stumble upon. The Romulans are supposed to be renown for their cunning, yet I see none of that here in this mission.

    Although to be fair, maybe things would have ended differently if Hakeev did his part. You could argue that Sela's contingency plan was to have enough forces set aside to succeed even if their cover was blown. Unfortunately, Hakeev didn't seem too interested in helping.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member, Star Trek Online Moderator Posts: 58,596 Community Moderator
    edited February 2015
    There's also the fact that Sela is blinded by hate and a thirst for revenge. She doesn't care what happens as long as she gets what she wants.
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    Yang Xiao Long wrote:
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • baelogventurebaelogventure Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Did no one actually watch the TNG episodes that had Sela?

    She's not exactly the best at subterfuge or tactical planning.

    Look at Unification I and Unification II

    She leaves Spock, Picard, and Data alone, unguarded, in her office where she has already shown them that it has holographic technology in the form of Holo-Spock.

    I mean, really?

    Spock. Picard. And Data. Left in a room, alone and unguarded, with holographic technology.

    Not to mention her plan in those episodes was to somehow invade Vulcan with 2000 Romulan ground troops. An entire planet with 2,000 men.

    She's not exactly that great at this whole "Military conquest" thing in the first place.
  • zellkarrathzellkarrath Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    baelogventure wrote: »
    Did no one actually watch the TNG episodes that had Sela?

    She's not exactly the best at subterfuge or tactical planning.

    Look at Unification I and Unification II

    Heh, I was about to say that then again, Sela's character was never particularly well written to begin with. She also made the assumption that she could dupe an Android captain to slip through the Federations detection net during the end of the Klingon civil war.
  • mhirtescmhirtesc Member Posts: 581 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Probably because there isn't much of a Romulan "Empire" left. Sela has pretty much a few worlds in her grasp, but the main Romulan presence is the Republic.

    Sela is pretty much the Alpha Quadrant version of Kin Jung Un; a dangerous but containable jerk.

    But there is some hope that she may have a role to play in the imminent conflict with the Iconians, since she's had a good idea of what kind of threat they are (and how trying to ally with them like Hakeev tried to do was a fool's errand).
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Yeah, I'm was about to say; people expect Sela to think her plans through all the way? :P I like the way Denise played her, but her character was arrogant to the point of stupidity, the peak of which was leaving Picard, Data and Spock alone in a room

    And anyway, we pretty much are at war with the Romulan Star Empire, all except for a formal declaration - Starfleet's spread thin enough as it is. If they formally declared war, the fleet would have to send forces to give the appearance of a fighting war... when really it's mostly isolated skirmishes
    Was named Trek17.

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  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    baelogventure wrote: »
    Did no one actually watch the TNG episodes that had Sela?

    She's not exactly the best at subterfuge or tactical planning.

    Look at Unification I and Unification II

    She leaves Spock, Picard, and Data alone, unguarded, in her office where she has already shown them that it has holographic technology in the form of Holo-Spock.

    I mean, really?

    Spock. Picard. And Data. Left in a room, alone and unguarded, with holographic technology.

    Not to mention her plan in those episodes was to somehow invade Vulcan with 2000 Romulan ground troops. An entire planet with 2,000 men.

    She's not exactly that great at this whole "Military conquest" thing in the first place.

    Pretty much this. Sela's Empire isn't worth the Federation's time. If the RR PC hadn't taken care of things, even odds they would have eventually taken themselves out.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Hmmmm yeah pretty much


    That's how it's always been In Trek, the Romulans attack the Federation and the feds are like meh nice try maybe next time.
    GwaoHAD.png
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Hell, I've got a strong suspicion that the only reason Sela even made commander in the first place is because her daddy's a general.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • zellkarrathzellkarrath Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Well, Sela had a better run in STO than she did in the Star Trek Novel timeline.......I guess.......

    *somewhat major novel spoilers*







    Sela is arrested shortly after becoming the head of the Tal Shiar in 2384, and chooses to commit suicide instead of being Extradited to The Federation. So she's dead in the novel universe last I checked, unless some crazed author has tried to revive her since then.
  • rogueaegianrogueaegian Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Don't give the authors bad ideas


    Massive spoilers ahead


    They already killed Janeway then lost their minds and decided to sacrifice Q jr to bring her back, do we really want them even considering reviving Sela?
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    the federations resources are not as stretched as it appears, with the help of task force omega, all the federation really has to be concerned about is having some ships along the klingon border incase the ceasefire lands on their feet, along the imperial romulan border because sela is not to be trusted. a few ships along the cardassian border and some of the fleets in the task force omega. i doubt the federation doesnt have any more fight left in it, they may still have reserves that have not been seen. its a rarity to see the USS San Jose out in the field and any other Jupiter class ship and the Typhoon class isnt exactly been seen recently either.
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
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  • lordinsanelordinsane Member Posts: 274 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    I'm inclined to think that the main problem is that Empress Sela comes first in the arc (not counting Heading Out), rather than just before the featured episode series. Put it first, and you have the question of why the Starfleet character still bothers with diplomatic niceties when meeting Sela in Taris and to a lesser degree the courtesy given to the I.R.W. Rea in Shadow Play.
    Put it after, and the tension over Taris gives Sela an excellent excuse for why she'd want to hold the conference, the possible time-frame between the attack and when events supersede the issue is shorter (an actual invasion of the RSE is something Starfleet would probably want to bring up to the Federation Council before doing it, so it makes sense it wouldn't come directly), the events of the FE series serves as a decent explanation for why you aren't involved with any preliminary response, and by the time the FE series over it's pretty much a moot issue, what with Sela being gone and the RSE disintegrating again. The only issue is the lead-up to Desperate Measures, but given the connection to the Romulan Republic storyline it doesn't really need that lead-up.
  • mrspidey2mrspidey2 Member Posts: 959 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    zellkarrath wrote: »
    Really though, the entire Empress Sela mission is really, really bad. Sela invites a prominent captain along with several delegates to the same location where she is loading all of her weapons up to attack Vulcan. Ummmmmm why? Why is she drawing attention to herself in this episode? Why even bother with a conference? Just launch a cloaked fleet at Vulcan without any warning. Done. Or if you want to lull the Federation into a false sense of security, have the fleet launch from a separate location entirely and have no evidence or proof of an incoming attack be located at the conference site.

    Still a better story than Divide et Empera...
    At least here, Sela is the idiot, not the player captain.
    2bnb7apx.jpg
  • shevetshevet Member Posts: 1,667 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Nothing short of active stupidity on Sela's part puts that stack of weapons at the conference, where you can conveniently find and destroy them. OK, maybe it's not Tuesday, yet, so they haven't been installed on the ships that will carry them... but why bring them to the "peace conference"?

    No explanation short of active stupidity. And that leaves me with the question of how Sela got to be Empress, given that "active stupidity" is not a valuable survival trait in Romulan politics.
    8b6YIel.png?1
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    shevet wrote: »
    Nothing short of active stupidity on Sela's part puts that stack of weapons at the conference, where you can conveniently find and destroy them. OK, maybe it's not Tuesday, yet, so they haven't been installed on the ships that will carry them... but why bring them to the "peace conference"?

    No explanation short of active stupidity. And that leaves me with the question of how Sela got to be Empress, given that "active stupidity" is not a valuable survival trait in Romulan politics.

    Politics. Taris was doing a bunch of really stupid things (e.g. quarantining plague-ridden worlds when the Federation would've provided the cure if she'd bothered to ask) and the military thought Sela would be the lesser of two evils so they teamed up with her and the Hirogen and staged a coup. I'd wager General Velal has been kicking himself ever since.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • captainhunter1captainhunter1 Member Posts: 1,630 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Just crossing the Neutral Zone with an armed force technically starts a war. The Feds went to war with the Klingons for less. So, um, yeah...:rolleyes:
    My consolidated list of game improvements for STO:
    arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
  • zellkarrathzellkarrath Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    rogueaegian wrote: »
    Don't give the authors bad ideas

    I was worried they would do that with the way that Before Dishonor concluded, which is a shame.
    mirrorchaos wrote: »
    i doubt the federation doesnt have any more fight left in it, they may still have reserves that have not been seen. its a rarity to see the USS San Jose out in the field and any other Jupiter class ship and the Typhoon class isnt exactly been seen recently either.

    I generally think of the excuse that was given during The 2800 missions regarding this. It's not that Starfleet is at its limit, more so that it would take some doing to do put together a sizable force to go on the offensive against The Romulans. I think the Federation border is well defended against the Romulans, but they aren't interested in actually going on the offensive against them, at least not a large scale offensive that is.

    It could also be that The Romulan Star Empire simply doesn't have the numbers for a large scale war any more anyway. After all, we are allowed to fly very deep into their space without too many issues. So maybe Starfleet doesn't even need to divert many ships to harass The Star Empire to begin with.
    lordinsane wrote: »
    I'm inclined to think that the main problem is that Empress Sela comes first in the arc (not counting Heading Out), rather than just before the featured episode series. Put it first, and you have the question of why the Starfleet character still bothers with diplomatic niceties when meeting Sela in Taris and to a lesser degree the courtesy given to the I.R.W. Rea in Shadow Play.

    Pretty much agree. While the mission itself would still have some issues, it would fit far better into the story than it did before.
    mrspidey2 wrote: »
    Still a better story than Divide et Empera...
    At least here, Sela is the idiot, not the player captain.

    A fair point. :D
  • quevvenquevven Member Posts: 2
    edited February 2015
    rogueaegian wrote: »
    Don't give the authors bad ideas


    Massive spoilers ahead


    They already killed Janeway then lost their minds and decided to sacrifice Q jr to bring her back, do we really want them even considering reviving Sela?

    If I remember that novel correctly... The Borg also ate Pluto. And part of the Sun...
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