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The forums: The gutter of STO?
vocmcp
Member Posts: 1,134 Arc User
The forum: The forsaken gutter of STO?
Judging by Cryptics attitude lately this is indeed how it is being seen. Well guys, you may not like the bashing, the trolling or whatever else it is that itches you, but simply leaving the forum is not very professional. While I understand that Dev's may not frequent some places that much anymore I have absolutely no understanding for your communication team not doing what they're being paid by us to do: Communicate with us! Not posting news into the Galactic News network anymore is just the latest example of how forsaken this place is. At least have the guts to COMMUNICATE a change in communication style. And on that note, remember that it is not possible not to communicate. But you may choose how you do it.
So man up, get your act together, and face us*. This will earn you much more respect than just lying low. Besides:
*rofl.....as if writing news would even qualify as such......ridiculous attitude
Judging by Cryptics attitude lately this is indeed how it is being seen. Well guys, you may not like the bashing, the trolling or whatever else it is that itches you, but simply leaving the forum is not very professional. While I understand that Dev's may not frequent some places that much anymore I have absolutely no understanding for your communication team not doing what they're being paid by us to do: Communicate with us! Not posting news into the Galactic News network anymore is just the latest example of how forsaken this place is. At least have the guts to COMMUNICATE a change in communication style. And on that note, remember that it is not possible not to communicate. But you may choose how you do it.
So man up, get your act together, and face us*. This will earn you much more respect than just lying low. Besides:
*rofl.....as if writing news would even qualify as such......ridiculous attitude
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Comments
Imagine talking to anyone the way people here talk to cryptic.
And I mean anyone.
That's their own fault. If they do not follow our wishes (as we finance this game), it is our right to critizise their behavior and if they dont listen, things get even worse.
Some of the anger is deserved but I wouldn't want it to be my job. This coming from someone who has worked retail for 20 years.
This idea that they are somehow required to listen or reply is misguided. If anyone came into my place of employment and talked to me the way people often do here? They would be escorted out by security.
To be honest I don't see much flaming here. The criticism may be harsh at some times I know, but it's mostly civil and a lot is very constructive. Well, they don't have to reply to it and they don't. Fair enough. But not even communicating news any more is just childish. The situation here hasn't gotten that bad to completely pull out of it.
What else should we do to improve the game. It's like talking to a wall (Cryptic).
It's aggressive, antagonistic and uncivil. Would you speak like that to someone in the street? Or in a shop? I very much doubt it. And if you did, you'd be arrested for harassment.
Cryptic has a right to not communicate with the player base if they're being jerks to the devs... that's why you don't see the majority of the dev team in the forums, they neither have the time nor the patience to sit through and sift through all the whining that people do on this forum... and some players wonder why a certain developer called people whiny.
It's troll bait.
Congratulations for throwing one more fish bone into the pile of rotted, mutilated horse corpses, friend!
Again, the main problem is the missing communication. It won't help if they abandon us.
It isn't just flaming that can be painful to endure. Sometimes even critic I would not call "flaming" in the strict sense is not something I'd want to expose myself on a regular basis - especially not if I can't afford to tell people my real opinion of their attitude.
Today I saw even some people comparing STO to cancer.
But there are even more harmless accusations. Like calling the devs "lazy". Or "greedy". Or claiming they are incompetent. That they are lying. People starting threads about how Cryptic will "ruin/monetize" the game next. People want to see individuals getting fired (Man, how would you react to that if someone came to you and your colleagues and asked for you to be fired? Would you ever want to be in that position? Regardless if the game is a crazy lunatic or has a good point...)
And then you present a new idea like the new BO training system that seems to contain a lot of cool features that will make life a lot easier for players, and all people talk about is that it will add more dilithium grind - without even having a solid basis for that claim.
There are probably ways to stay active on the forums as a developer and counter such claims. But - that is time intensive, and the forums aren't their job. And they would often just end up repeating themselve.s Look at how often tacofangs has to answer the same questions...
The only ones of Cryptic that have a job dealing with the forums are the Community Team. I tend to think they could be more active, too. But hey - as long as they condense the feedback they find on the forums, they're still doing the critical part. Whether the 3 % forum users are happy with the response times on the forums is not as important as whether the game gets the features and changes that are meaningful to the game.
I'll be honest they know their game is way way behind the standard for mmorpgs these days so they are milking what they can out of it before one of two things happen. They will be asked to do a sequel from the ground up or to pass the buck to another company who can handle the workload. When I say handle it I mean like this... I can say yeah I understand Star Trek is about the federation exploring and peacekeeping and such which was mostly limited to an enterprise, ds9, and then voyager. The thing though is that a limited exploration of earth and esd is about the sum of what you can visit or do anything with the core world of the federation much less the alpha quadrant.
So in retrospect the forums are not the gutter of sto when sto has been a gutter itself. Its just taken this long for new and old players to see the game isn't going to evolve any further than what we get which is grindfests with little to no work done by cryptic on the game itself. So its like an insult and disrespect to the franchise and to star trek fans everywhere when they try to defend what the status quo for what they consider running this game lol.
Haha the solid basis for that is the experience since the game went F2P.
While I really prefer having something in the Dev Tracker for every blog, let's be honest - the news site is one click away from any page on the forum. That's often even less clicks than the Dev Tracker would be away.
But, yeah, clicking on "Back to Game News" is something not yet in my muscle memory.
Well yeah... I get your point... I'd be pissed and disappointed too. Nevertheless not even posting a news link anymore is just being a little too touchy. After all this is the interwebz and not a fluffy pony farm.
yeah. that is what I tell my kids "if you don't listen to me, i am going to yell and whine and flame you".
I think some of the angst here is the fact that people just want this game to be great. Granted everyone has there own model of what that is but if the game high ups are posting here and your putting a lot of $$ and time into the game of course you are going to use this as an outlet to vent if you feel they could do a better job.
And yes people could tone it down a bit.
This is a symptom of poor upper management. I have full confidence in Cryptic's team doing the things we all wish they did, if an incompetent manager up top in Cryptic/PWE was fired or removed from their position, and replaced with someone who recognizes the importance of happy players. Quality, not quantity.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
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I was brought up to respect people and treat people how I would want to be treated so it shocks me how they just take it... So not shocked they stay clear of the forums like they do tbh.
I made a comment elsewhere about game developers tending to be INTJ, which rings true for management here.
Here's a good description:
INTJ: The Mastermind
http://www.16personalities.com/intj-personality
I have recently learned that INTJs are about 8x as prevalent among game designers as they are in the general population and as a social consequence, many game studios end up filtering out all their non-INTJ employees by supporting an INTJ way of doing business.
Now... What I have said for awhile now. Nobody needs to be fired. The Cryptic platform is designed to continuously develop new games.
Your INTJ style managers should be put to good use on games that are still being designed.
Live games should not be managed by INTJs unless they are extremely self-aware and self-correct for their innate tendencies. A live game is an entertainment service built on good will, not a systems project. A good idea is insufficient. Spin and damage control are not coats of paint to be applied on at the end or tertiary products but should be integral to product design from the moment beta ends, even if it interferes with efficiency or technical excellence in systems design.
Ideal candidates for leadership on a live game?
ESTP: The Promoter
ENTP: The Inventor
Same here. It's not flaming it's absolutely deserved disappointment. If they can't be professionals about it then they are in the wrong business and need to respectfully do what GhostCrawler did in Blizzard and resign preferably sooner than later so that we can get some better management in here asap.
We here on the forums - those invested enough to read, and even more those who bother to post, let alone post a lot - are a tiny, tiny minority of those who play. And because of that strong investment, we're also, as a group, extremely prone to melodrama and irrational behavior.
There's a few lines that apply to all game forums, but especially this one, given the franchise's long-established fondness for Shakespeare: "It is a tale told by an idiot; full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."
Of course they're going to ignore what we say. I mean, Cryptic might listen - if they're not busy with something more important, which is pretty much all the time - but they're not in charge. Perfect World is. And Perfect World is never going to listen to us. They're going to look at their numbers and metrics - logins per day, length of logins, and most of all, the money. And as long as we're being outspent, by orders of magnitude - that means "hundreds or thousands" for the non-math types - by that vast non-reading, non-posting majority, that is who they are going to listen to. It makes no logical sense, no business sense, to do otherwise.
The sad fact is that our emotional investment, bright though it burns here, is a flickering spark next to the financial investment of everyone else. Even those who speak of having spent hundreds of dollars on this game over the years - that might run the servers and pay the salaries and license fees for a whole day, or make up a notable fraction (not the majority) of how much PWE makes off all those players per hour. Maybe. I don't have the actual numbers in front of me. But you'd better believe Cryptic and PWE do.
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bad analogy,
better one going into burgerking and ordering a cheeseburger and getting a raw fishpatty. then BK refusing to do anything about it beyond telling you to suck it up and eat it. that's pwe/cryptic.
end reply.
@stoleviathan99
who ever runs the show is NOT FRAKKING INTJ. completely missing the J part in every decision. there is no thinking decisions through, there is no thinking mechanics changes through, something any intj WOULD DO. i do it ffs and i don't even develop this game. there is no acceptance of responsibility, there is no possibility that they are ever wrong, the censor the forums ffs...how is any of that intj?
end reply.
if you want to know about cryptics/pwe state of mind look no further than some of the gdc talk topics concerning milking whales among hundreds of others. talks by people who aren't gamers ABOUT gamers and what they think we are, what we want as a herd, etc. you can find the entire GDC talk lists including for 2015 at their site.
it's an eye opening read about just how deluded developers and game companies really are concerning gamers. they totally avoid the most accurate and logical approach to finding out what gamers want...by listening to the gamers. they prefer we be statistics, an homogeneous mass easily categorized.
and people here wonder how cryptic/pwe can continue with foot in the mouth syndrome time and time again...how they seem so out of touch.
now you know if you didn't before.
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