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Hating the whole Fleet KDF thing
royalsovereign
Member Posts: 1,344 Arc User
So someone explain to me why there is a Norgh, and a "Norgh refit" (a.k.a. the Ning'tao), and a Fleet Norgh which can use the Ning'tao skin, but there's no Norgh retrofit, so there's no discount available for the fleet Norgh. :P
And yeah, I know, devs hate KDF, etc, etc. Not really what I'm after.
And yeah, I know, devs hate KDF, etc, etc. Not really what I'm after.
"You Iconians just hung a vacancy sign on your asses and my foot's looking for a room!"
--Red Annorax
--Red Annorax
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That is a long-standing issue with the way ship offerings are done in STO, and it's not confined to the Fleet Norgh.
Partly it's that they simply don't make as many ships for the KDF, meaning they left gaps in the lineup. Partly it's that they stuffed the T5-9 versions of many ships into the Fleets for 200K Fleet Marks (Maybe because they couldn't think of or implement a console to put in them? Maybe because they were trying to give more free ship options to the KDF and didn't consider the consequences? Maybe because... Iconians?). Partly it's that they created a large portion of the Fleet ships out of lower tier (T1-4) ships because of the previous problems (or for no apparent reason, as in the case of the T5-9 Marauder FDC matched by a T5-10 Fleet Corsair FDC). The bottom line is that for many ships you will pay more because you won't have a Fleet Ship Module discount available.
They may or may not hate the KDF, but the imbalanced ship offerings do have an effect. Which is worse at T6 since Starship Traits are single-character unlocks... and the Federation has 3x the number of T6 ships available in the C-Store. Just wait until T6-11 Fleet ships come around. :mad::rolleyes::P
You did already answer yourself, though...
And yes, I deleted the smileys from you quote so I could use more of my own.
I had seen those here and there. Unfortunately there is not a Norgh to my knowledge. If there were, I have enough fleet credits to buy one (if that'd even help anyway).
Not a problem, just griping anyways. :P
--Red Annorax
If you're a raptor fan, or even if you're not - get the Mat'Ha. Trust me, unless you're totally in love with the Qin's design the difference in quality and performance is the size of a solar system. The Mat'Ha is probably one of the best ships in the game currently, I can't see myself leving mine - the ship is pure epic Klingon awesomness.
The t5U for it finally gave it enough "stuff" to change it from a "generic, jack of all" to a "dps focused" ship that actually performs well --- except now it is outdated so that is only useful to people who already owned one.
So the ship finally comes into its own as it becomes obsolete. GG cryptic, again.
It is not the only ship that was poorly thought out, but it was one of the worst. While it is pretty strong now, I highly advise you save your money. If you want a dps BOP wait for a t6.
And pre DR I ran the norgh & mirror side by side and the mirror produced more DPS consistently. I do not have the Hoh'sus or fleet b'rel (do have the c-store b'rel). Of those the mirror won consistently. And its not just the tac console, they gave the norgh a full DPS passives unlock on upgrade too. The combined effect was very significant --- but now it is pitted against the maha raptor... and it can't keep up with that. The maha wins. IFF my norgh could flank 100% of the time, it would be *close* on that, but that is not realistic, at best I flank maybe 25% of the time on trash and 75% or more on a cube etc.
Guns on target is pretty consistent across all these -- I can keep a fairly slow ship on NPC targets and none of these are slow.
And it was not crippled -- I flew it a lot as well and did OK. But it was also, for the cost, not even in the neighborhood of many other fleet ships. The extra officer skill does not make up for the missing console. Compare it to a scimitar**... in price and performance. Or a maha. Get back to me on the price to value ratio. Its a $27.50 price tag for the upgraded ship. Maha is 30, scim upgraded is 32.50.
** not technically a fleet ship but with fleet ship stats direct from store.
Ya, have that same problem. Bought the Mat'ha and the fsm/upgrade chit. The Mat'ha hits harder than the Qin and isn't as soft but it's got less crew and is almost unarmed from the rear.
Save yourself the headaches- get a mirror qin off the exchange and if you're still wanting to upgrade get the Mat'ha.
To the rest- I still have my Norgh, it's one of the best looking raptors we have but I wouldn't expect anything from cryptic to make it an endgame ship- they already discounted any argument from the KDF playerbase regarding discount fleet upgrades as 'it ain't gonna happen, the playerbase is too small'.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
you do know that less crew is a positive thing, right?
the mirror BOP is fine too if that style is preferred. But you can't upgrade them... useless after about level 55 (which seems to be when the mobs grow up to the current difficulty).
Since when is less crew good ?
the less crew you have the less repairs get done, the less the weapons fire, the less sustained damage you can take.
You gotta be trolling me.
:P
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
At the risk of being tarred and feathered (does anything with feathers live on Qo'nos?) I'll admit that my KDF is not my main character. I'm not in it for endgame superiority or PvP notoriety. I just want a BoP with the alternative style of the Ning'tao (or the Hegh'ta, which I also like) that I can use without being outclassed, and I hate the thought of forking out 4 FSMs and an upgrade for that privilege.
Didn't expect a full-blown debate over the relative merits of the Norgh vs. the B'rel or the Mat'ha.
Yeah, I don't pay real money for ships. I'm not oozing EC and 36mil is ... more than a cheap old Scot like me wants to spend, hey, it's virtual money. I'm just griping.
Well, PvP is not a consideration for me - if I want to be verbally abused (win, lose, or draw), I can find lots of ways to make that happen without logging into a video game. Going to a Philadelphia Eagles game wearing a Cowboys jacket, Redskins jersey, and Giants socks and hat would be more fun and less painful than PvP here (or anywhere).
--Red Annorax
less crew regenerates like 100x faster than a 3000 crew does...each torp hit kills a % of crew so large crews take huge hits while a 50 man crew take 1 hit
I don't even worry about crew in my scorts..an usually im tanking the map
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Fair enough question - I've played Romulans online dating way back to the old MUSH days in the early 90's, so I guess it is habit. The Devs 'abuse' is a different matter entirely and far less personal.
--Red Annorax
Heh I also hate the scim to be honest. I use it now and then, but I didn't even upgrade mine. All my roms are in box ships now.
I love the norgh. Don't mistake me on that. I am just not recommending buying one right now, today, at 30 bucks when as like as not we *may* have a t6 BOP soonish. Its just a lot of $$ to gamble on. Having already had mine a while, yea, its pretty strong. I only have the maha because I earned enough dil in the MU event to buy one, and it seemed more interesting than squandering it all on upgrades. I upgraded a set of tradeable weapons and some of my key gear and put that mess aside for now.
Lets all just keep our fingers crossed for a t6 BOP sooner rather than later...
In the meantime, the mirror bop is the cheap solution. If you are impatient and rolling in funds, norgh is fine... but its a risk of being wasted in 2, 3 months if a t6 rolls out.
And the other guy beat me to it on the crew size. But in a few words or less... big crew ships in combat sit at 75% dead crew and they *never come back*. So on paper big crew looks good, but in practice, they are more of a liability.
I agree with most of what you said but I have to point something out. I recently broke down and bought the Qib. I was really surprised. SS and OSS are almost too good and with it's trait it has an amazing turn rate. Even with just 3 tac consoles I'm punching through people's shields with brute force. Add in it's battle cloak and I personally think its one of the best KDF battle cruisers. The fleet version will only make it better.
I strongly feel it's the intel powers that push it over the top. If it had just standard powers and the same setup and stats, yeah, it would totally be mediocre, but with it's intel powers, it truly is a great ship.
also the trait is pretty darn good on my t5u fleet b'rel and any other ship that uses cannons. It gets a stack per shot fired so you can get all 10 with just one volley and it persists as long as you keep shooting. Just 1 turret will give you all 10 stacks. I tried it on a beam boat with the heavy turret and was able to keep all 10 stacks the whole time.
Incidentally, I went ahead and bought the fleet Norgh last night and moved all my Hegh'ta's equipment over. Then I went to bed.
--Red Annorax
Also, the Upgrade Skin on a B'Rel is wonderful.
if those are the BoPs i am thinking of, they arent even that new. they were the original ships available back before we were forced into feds the first 20-odd levels, reintroduced as 'new' when kdf got the early levels back.
is the brel upgrade skin usable on the fleet brel? i have been falling out of touch with sto
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To be fair, re-packaging the B'Rel seems to a very acceptable and often used Klingon method of operation and tactic.
(UFP) Ragnar
Yeah, give the B'rel the Voyager Treatment, best Idea I've seen in this thread.
Just 1 hybrid carear/intel slot for a bit of intel flair, but yes this, quick and easy.
LOL the day they give the b'rel any positive treatment is the day I die from a massive heart attack. Reason I say this is out of every possible thing they have screwed the KDF over the years the b'rel is the absolute winner. If you can think of any torpedo or mine combination that seems like it was nerfed really bad odds are that the brel could use it in a combination and because of what it does when its cloaked it basically got the devs to let that certain crowd dictate how the kdf is treated.
To be honest though I highly doubt they will ever give us what we want though on the terms of the bird of prey topic. Its bad enough we don't get their semi useless science ships and then feds cry bloody murder if we get anything anyways so yeah especially with how much of a fail DR was on top of that we are only going to see fed ships this year.