Extreme (Option A) - You can grind a level in one hour or less, if you know the right places with a team of 5.
Extreme (Option - 10,000 Specialization Points in 15 mins or less.
Normal - You can grind a level in one day or less (roughly 3 hours or less) alone.
Cryptic - Grind Forever!
The solution to the XP grind problem would be simple.
Just imagine how cool things would be if we had lets say two dozen good and different endgame queues which could successfully by run by every STO player and reward accordingly. Of course the reward would vary a bit depending on the player/team skill but basically fun for everybody while doing so and learning to become better would be guaranteed. Could also be used to make gear upgrades at the same time you know.
Wait A SEC!!!!!!
We had that already a moth ago and some toons of mine had enough XP and Dil at their disposal to build starbases without even knowing what the word grind means.
The reason why Cryptic patched that out with Delta Rising is beyond my understanding and resulted in a lot of unhappy customers on the one hand and lost ones on the other.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
As it stands right now, PWE and Cryptic are losing money on myself and the entirety of my fleet who have all essentially stopped playing. We used to spend money on alts. With the grind factor turned up to 11 and the greed factor in orbit with the new R&D system, they'll likely never see a dime from us again.
There are a wide variety of different starships which need different builds to play them right. The difference between a defiant and a prometheus are vast, if you want to do it right, e.g. maximize/bring out the full potential of both of them.
Well they are loosing money right now because i don't create new toons and don't buy ships and stuff for them. I've got everything i need on my main: ship, boffs, doffs, gear, you name it. At the moment i literally have zero reasons to buy zen.
THIS
I dont paly my other toons I DONT create more
and stuff I need for this oen toon is less compared to if Id play all/more of em
well more DIL gain?
also I got a different ship on each
since ship switching loudouts was buggy since ever I just create a new toon for every ship I wanna fly
Extreme (Option A) - You can grind a level in one hour or less, if you know the right places with
WOW THAT is your extreme?
thats what Im talking about! it takes MUCH too loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong
13 toons * 120lvl = 1560 hours of ENDLESS exp grind
DUUUDE thats 65 days without sleeping or doign soemth else!
I have a life! this is supposed to be FUN not WORK
There must be a solution here that would make everyone somewhat happy and lead to more money for the developers too. Something like the rep system where you have to work through it the long way on your first character but then be able to get tokens to cut the grind in half for alts. It makes too much sense to not happen at some point.
Yeah they need to re-evaluate the game and try to correct the imbalances they have introduced whether they were before or after DR. Currently the Time/Reward ratio is so off that even putting in the Dil via Zen just gives you a feeling of throwing your cash into a black hole. There's little to no wow factor in the upgraded items either.
As for the challenge of completing the Elite STF's awesome I love a challenge. However I'll have to wait until 2017 to play them due to upgrading sh**. The other problem is that Health Sponges AREN'T difficult, they are tedious. Difficult is making the enemies have good gear and balanced items which up at Elite would mean that a straight DPS build may not be the best to win, having healers and tanks would be needed while the DPS guys do their thing. Currently NONE of that happens the way it's supposed to be intended...
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
above lvl 50 unplayed missions provide not enoughf exp to...got nerved remember?
And will still give you a reasonable amount IMHO. More exp than sector patrols, more exp than queue missions, usually more exp than DOFFing(though DOFFing is a supplement anyway)
log in, WAIT 3 MINUTES untill you canb collect em all
do the math its much time for nothing
we need soemth NEW to lvl up faster on multiple toons!
You're talking to a player who has 45 characters. DOFFing is fine, excluding the 'feature' they added that makes you wait 5sec in between assignment completions in an attempt to "make you wait less time for them to finish"...
Trust me though when I say that I understand all the perils of having a few characters to manage.
They're already losing paying players left and right. Nothing they do right now will stop that.
The question is: How many more will they continue to lose?
The XP grind is pretty bad right now. It's one of the more MINOR problems right now, but it's there. I don't have any motivation to play my other characters anymore. The DR missions aren't worth it, and the PvE is locked behind lvl60, which is really impossible to get to in a timely manner now. I only have one character at lvl60, one at 59, the rest all far below that.
With no rewards in normal, with no XP gains anywhere, with no incentives or even OPTIONS to play other areas of the game, there's not much for me to do. If I didn't log in, accept my doff missions, run a MIN game for each of my 5 characters, I probably wouldn't log in at all. It certainly isn't worth my time to craft, since crafting mats are locked behind ELITE content which is missing, broken, fubar, or just impossible. Not to mention I can't ge gear to COMPLETE an elite PvE because the upgrade/crafting system requires... you guessed it.. the mats and rewards locked behind the Elite PvE queues. That's the circular logic behind DR right now.
I agree with all these points.Pretty much how i feel. Mind you i got 33 toons. leveling them all is a nightmare as i also got all the T6 ships.
I dunno how much time you have spoend to get your 45 toons lvled up to 120
but I dont have the time
reading through this threat I sense a lot of othjer ppl agree
As far as lvling alts, the fix is simple and already in game. Do the same thing as reps, once you max your specialization, have a project available in the event section of rep called "specialization accelerator" or something that reduced the exp requirement on alts by... say... 75%. This would allow you to lvl the specialization on 4 characters in the time it took you to lvl your first and would be completely fair. They had no problems doing this for reps so I don't see them having an issue with this plan.
For 50-60, well it's been said before, there needs to be a consistent progression without stopping to grind the same patrol. I don't mind the grind at 60, but they really should make the story arc smooth without stoppage.
Perhaps it's time for a new 3 episode arc and exp reshuffle to bridge the gap in epx/lvls?
And will still give you a reasonable amount IMHO. More exp than sector patrols, more exp than queue missions, usually more exp than DOFFing(though DOFFing is a supplement anyway)
You're talking to a player who has 45 characters. DOFFing is fine, excluding the 'feature' they added that makes you wait 5sec in between assignment completions in an attempt to "make you wait less time for them to finish"...
Trust me though when I say that I understand all the perils of having a few characters to manage.
The DR content simply does not give enougth experience or specialization. It sad I can level a 60 character with a addotional 10k in less the 10 minutes if I want to without going into the Delta Quadrant or episodes basically DR content.
I can level up my other charcters dirt fast similiarly but Ive stopped grinding or playing them. Because of the post DR monetized spec-time-gate system with aggressive censoring.
As far as lvling alts, the fix is simple and already in game. Do the same thing as reps, once you max your specialization, have a project available in the event section of rep called "specialization accelerator" or something that reduced the exp requirement on alts by... say... 75%. This would allow you to lvl the specialization on 4 characters in the time it took you to lvl your first and would be completely fair. They had no problems doing this for reps so I don't see them having an issue with this plan.
For 50-60, well it's been said before, there needs to be a consistent progression without stopping to grind the same patrol. I don't mind the grind at 60, but they really should make the story arc smooth without stoppage.
Perhaps it's time for a new 3 episode arc and exp reshuffle to bridge the gap in epx/lvls?
I have a life! this is supposed to be FUN not WORK
I should be done with the specislization tree, delta rep, and full ship upgrade in a week and half. Possibly all Doff tiers, most assaignment chains, and all school at 15.
I cut down playing 4 characters to 1 with a primary ship and a backup. I can power grind in small burst it but not for 5 toons if I add the Foundry characters. I dont use loadouts and change traits very rarely.
Back at launch this game was very pvp/alt and casual friendly, leveling a new toon to max was a matter of 1-2 days, equipping it with the best gear was a matter of visiting the exchange and a hour. When reputations and lockboxes came getting a toon pvp ready was behind a time-gate and a paywall but it was still all possible.
Now with delta raising and my 16 pvp toons (many with lockbox ships) i kinda came to the conclusion i'd be busy for half a year with totally boring pve-grind just to get my toons "pvp-ready" again.
"Pvp-ready" would mean max level and maxed out in specialization, because pvp is all about build vs build, playing skill vs playing skill, playing on a toon thats not maxed out is kinda pointless.
So its like looking at cutting down to one toon and grinding a bit or grinding em all for half a year+ with a low chance of pvp happening (queues are all dead now anyway) vs just migrating to some other game thats offering pvp right from the get-go without any grind.
So yea i kinda hope some smart dev notices how horrible wrong the DR system is. Spec points should be account bound and should be spendable on all toons, punishing people for having alts is a bad concept and im sure they will notice a decrease in sales too caused by all the people that wont buy lockbox stuff for their left behind alts anymore... but by the time they notice how terrible wrong their new xp design is its probably to late anyway.
In the Before Time, the level-gating and grind didn't feel as bad because going to Exploration Zones was kind of random and fun and felt like content. Fly around doing Explorations, then before you know it BOOM new rank and on to the next story mission.
What we have now are pointless, repetitive patrols that we aren't even told in-game are meant to be grinded for XP to hit the next level gate. I had to go to the forums to find that out.
We need something like the old Exploration Zones, and we need the game to tell us that it's what were supposed to be doing until we level and can participate in the next story mission. Until then, STO feels like an MMO circa 1998. Grind grind grindy grind...
The OP's "solution" is him/herself! There is a somewhat of a divide between the "lifers" and the rest of us when it comes to what we're willing to accept as a "fair" return on our time investment. I have no issue with players who are into exploring the maximum variety of playable races, ships, and gear. Variety is the spice of life, so to speak. Many of those players have also accepted that their passion requires a greater commitment over time to realize that diversity in its fullness.
The rest of us have chosen to attempt a balance of recreation vs. real-life commitments, and many are not happy with the "rut" they feel they have found themselves in. I am quite content to play 4 alts, providing me with the majority of the available gameplay options, while not requiring an overwhelming commitment of time to maintain/advance them. My preferred play style is to spend 2-3 hours on one character, and call it a day, switching to the next alt from day to day. Events like MU press my stamina a bit, but 4 alts is still manageable.
The more pertinent question is not "where can we gain XP faster?", but "why am I still here?". At some point, the hard-core players will inevitably run out of new content, so they have to decide that the game is enough fun on its own merits, or not. Mind you, I'm not a Craptic apologist, but this is really the core issue for all players.
In my personal case, I've reached lvl 55 on all my 'toons just by completing unplayed episodes, dailies, and weekend events, and all my toons were lvl 50 before DR. Some of the later missions are not so much fun after the 3rd or 4th time through, but that will always be the case. By the time I start the DR story arc, I expect that my alts will be at lvl 56, with most of their T5-U ships more than halfway through their XP upgrades.
BTW, I'm completing several rep sets, and preparing to eventually do some crafting, but no more cash for PWE until real bugs have been fixed. It makes no sense that lock box ships are not upgradeable, since we had to buy keys to unlock them in the first place, and I have no intention of buying any T6 ships until the fleet versions are available. I have absolutely no need to buy anything else for my account.
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STO player since November 2013
So yea i kinda hope some smart dev notices how horrible wrong the DR system is. Spec points should be account bound and should be spendable on all toons, punishing people for having alts is a bad concept and im sure they will notice a decrease in sales too caused by all the people that wont buy lockbox stuff for their left behind alts anymore... but by the time they notice how terrible wrong their new xp design is its probably to late anyway.
We need something like the old Exploration Zones, and we need the game to tell us that it's what were supposed to be doing until we level and can participate in the next story mission. Until then, STO feels like an MMO circa 1998. Grind grind grindy grind...
agreed!
not buyn anyth 4 my alts cuz im not palyn em....
cuz I cant affort the time it takes to lvl em
doffing is boring sicne you need to wait minutes till you can collect them
Comments
The level requirements for story missions is an easy answer.
This is my scale.
Extreme (Option A) - You can grind a level in one hour or less, if you know the right places with a team of 5.
Extreme (Option
Normal - You can grind a level in one day or less (roughly 3 hours or less) alone.
Cryptic - Grind Forever!
Aw, come on. You just want that so that you can complain that you already have maxed everything and nothing else to do.
Just imagine how cool things would be if we had lets say two dozen good and different endgame queues which could successfully by run by every STO player and reward accordingly. Of course the reward would vary a bit depending on the player/team skill but basically fun for everybody while doing so and learning to become better would be guaranteed. Could also be used to make gear upgrades at the same time you know.
Wait A SEC!!!!!!
We had that already a moth ago and some toons of mine had enough XP and Dil at their disposal to build starbases without even knowing what the word grind means.
The reason why Cryptic patched that out with Delta Rising is beyond my understanding and resulted in a lot of unhappy customers on the one hand and lost ones on the other.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Just like a friend of mine
This game is big enough that there's always something fun to do , something to aim for, unless you play 24/7 .
There are a wide variety of different starships which need different builds to play them right. The difference between a defiant and a prometheus are vast, if you want to do it right, e.g. maximize/bring out the full potential of both of them.
THIS
I dont paly my other toons I DONT create more
and stuff I need for this oen toon is less compared to if Id play all/more of em
well more DIL gain?
also I got a different ship on each
since ship switching loudouts was buggy since ever I just create a new toon for every ship I wanna fly
above lvl 50 unplayed missions provide not enoughf exp to...got nerved remember?
also doffing?? on 13 toons? its like:
log in, WAIT 3 MINUTES untill you canb collect em all
do the math its much time for nothing
we need soemth NEW to lvl up faster on multiple toons!
WOW THAT is your extreme?
thats what Im talking about! it takes MUCH too loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong
13 toons * 120lvl = 1560 hours of ENDLESS exp grind
DUUUDE thats 65 days without sleeping or doign soemth else!
I have a life! this is supposed to be FUN not WORK
Yeah they need to re-evaluate the game and try to correct the imbalances they have introduced whether they were before or after DR. Currently the Time/Reward ratio is so off that even putting in the Dil via Zen just gives you a feeling of throwing your cash into a black hole. There's little to no wow factor in the upgraded items either.
As for the challenge of completing the Elite STF's awesome I love a challenge. However I'll have to wait until 2017 to play them due to upgrading sh**. The other problem is that Health Sponges AREN'T difficult, they are tedious. Difficult is making the enemies have good gear and balanced items which up at Elite would mean that a straight DPS build may not be the best to win, having healers and tanks would be needed while the DPS guys do their thing. Currently NONE of that happens the way it's supposed to be intended...
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
You're talking to a player who has 45 characters. DOFFing is fine, excluding the 'feature' they added that makes you wait 5sec in between assignment completions in an attempt to "make you wait less time for them to finish"...
Trust me though when I say that I understand all the perils of having a few characters to manage.
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I agree with all these points.Pretty much how i feel. Mind you i got 33 toons. leveling them all is a nightmare as i also got all the T6 ships.
you DONT get enoughf EXP
I dunno how much time you have spoend to get your 45 toons lvled up to 120
but I dont have the time
reading through this threat I sense a lot of othjer ppl agree
WE REQUIRE A SOLUTION
its NOT fien as it is for MOST of the ppl
For 50-60, well it's been said before, there needs to be a consistent progression without stopping to grind the same patrol. I don't mind the grind at 60, but they really should make the story arc smooth without stoppage.
Perhaps it's time for a new 3 episode arc and exp reshuffle to bridge the gap in epx/lvls?
The DR content simply does not give enougth experience or specialization. It sad I can level a 60 character with a addotional 10k in less the 10 minutes if I want to without going into the Delta Quadrant or episodes basically DR content.
I can level up my other charcters dirt fast similiarly but Ive stopped grinding or playing them. Because of the post DR monetized spec-time-gate system with aggressive censoring.
sounds like an idea
I should be done with the specislization tree, delta rep, and full ship upgrade in a week and half. Possibly all Doff tiers, most assaignment chains, and all school at 15.
I cut down playing 4 characters to 1 with a primary ship and a backup. I can power grind in small burst it but not for 5 toons if I add the Foundry characters. I dont use loadouts and change traits very rarely.
Now with delta raising and my 16 pvp toons (many with lockbox ships) i kinda came to the conclusion i'd be busy for half a year with totally boring pve-grind just to get my toons "pvp-ready" again.
"Pvp-ready" would mean max level and maxed out in specialization, because pvp is all about build vs build, playing skill vs playing skill, playing on a toon thats not maxed out is kinda pointless.
So its like looking at cutting down to one toon and grinding a bit or grinding em all for half a year+ with a low chance of pvp happening (queues are all dead now anyway) vs just migrating to some other game thats offering pvp right from the get-go without any grind.
So yea i kinda hope some smart dev notices how horrible wrong the DR system is. Spec points should be account bound and should be spendable on all toons, punishing people for having alts is a bad concept and im sure they will notice a decrease in sales too caused by all the people that wont buy lockbox stuff for their left behind alts anymore... but by the time they notice how terrible wrong their new xp design is its probably to late anyway.
What we have now are pointless, repetitive patrols that we aren't even told in-game are meant to be grinded for XP to hit the next level gate. I had to go to the forums to find that out.
We need something like the old Exploration Zones, and we need the game to tell us that it's what were supposed to be doing until we level and can participate in the next story mission. Until then, STO feels like an MMO circa 1998. Grind grind grindy grind...
The rest of us have chosen to attempt a balance of recreation vs. real-life commitments, and many are not happy with the "rut" they feel they have found themselves in. I am quite content to play 4 alts, providing me with the majority of the available gameplay options, while not requiring an overwhelming commitment of time to maintain/advance them. My preferred play style is to spend 2-3 hours on one character, and call it a day, switching to the next alt from day to day. Events like MU press my stamina a bit, but 4 alts is still manageable.
The more pertinent question is not "where can we gain XP faster?", but "why am I still here?". At some point, the hard-core players will inevitably run out of new content, so they have to decide that the game is enough fun on its own merits, or not. Mind you, I'm not a Craptic apologist, but this is really the core issue for all players.
In my personal case, I've reached lvl 55 on all my 'toons just by completing unplayed episodes, dailies, and weekend events, and all my toons were lvl 50 before DR. Some of the later missions are not so much fun after the 3rd or 4th time through, but that will always be the case. By the time I start the DR story arc, I expect that my alts will be at lvl 56, with most of their T5-U ships more than halfway through their XP upgrades.
BTW, I'm completing several rep sets, and preparing to eventually do some crafting, but no more cash for PWE until real bugs have been fixed. It makes no sense that lock box ships are not upgradeable, since we had to buy keys to unlock them in the first place, and I have no intention of buying any T6 ships until the fleet versions are available. I have absolutely no need to buy anything else for my account.
Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci
Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac
Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
agreed!
not buyn anyth 4 my alts cuz im not palyn em....
cuz I cant affort the time it takes to lvl em
doffing is boring sicne you need to wait minutes till you can collect them
But, think of them as "bonus points", not levels.
It could be slightly faster, they have a point.
-or-
more varied content, rotate pve ques out of "featured", more variety