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New and more powerful ships .... but what about the Borg?

shomrimshomrim Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Surely the Borg are not just sitting still while the Federation, Romulans, Klingons and all other races are upgrading their ships. They have taken a beating from the Undine so maybe we will get to fight an even nastier Borg vessel in the future. Wouldn't it be great to run into a new prototype Borg warship in the Delta Quadrant? Think about that STO.
Post edited by shomrim on
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Comments

  • razar2380razar2380 Member Posts: 1,187 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Yeah, but the only thing is will they make them hard, or challenging? The difference is that they can make the Borg we now fight harder to beat. This can be done by giving them more hit points, and have them hit harder.

    However, if they are more challenging, then it means the AI is smarter, and will coordinate with other ships, try to split the team, or even just cycle through more powers. This will be challenging because they will force players to come up with tactics, and strategies to beat them.

    I would be all for an upgraded Borg, since the Borg we now face seem like they were from back when Pickard first met them. They haven't really upgraded much over time, and they were suppose to be assimilating races the whole time. Lol.
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  • amosov78amosov78 Member Posts: 1,495 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    They could give Borg drones and ships the ability to adapt to weapons fire in the same manner that the Aegis shield gives a hull damage resistance buff, and the Fleet ship shields give an energy damage resistance buff to the shields themselves. In space they wouldn't have the complete adaptation that their ground counterparts do, but it would make them tougher.

    In addition to that, Borg were capable of reviving fallen drones after death, so they could add that feature to the ground forces, but also to the ships in space too. Imagine a Borg ship thought destroyed/crippled regenerates back into action.
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  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Adaption Proc is a no brainer, if anyone has adaptive shields it should be them, Heck the feds adaptive shields should have been gained by studying borg tech


    Also more intelligent and varied AI would be good, not sure how it could be acomplished, but I for one would appreciate more challenging eneimes

    My input would be to try and make enemy behavior in general more variable, forcing players to pay attention, analyse the enemy then respond to its current behavior
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  • lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,882 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    amosov78 wrote: »
    They could give Borg drones and ships the ability to adapt to weapons fire in the same manner that the Aegis shield gives a hull damage resistance buff, and the Fleet ship shields give an energy damage resistance buff to the shields themselves. In space they wouldn't have the complete adaptation that their ground counterparts do, but it would make them tougher.

    In addition to that, Borg were capable of reviving fallen drones after death, so they could add that feature to the ground forces, but also to the ships in space too. Imagine a Borg ship thought destroyed/crippled regenerates back into action.

    No thanks...if they're to make the Borg harder they need to do more than just make the Borg do more damage and more resistant to damage. Not the greatest comparison but at least they're heading in the right direction with the Voth and Undine...they actually use some powers.
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  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I have to agree that just buffing damage output or resilience isn't much use to make a fight against the Borg interesting.

    They need to use some powers and tactics that you need to anticipate and counter.

    If a Borg vessel would subnuke my escort's buff away as I am about to open an alpha strike, they would probably get some new respect.

    I also think there is a visual thing they could do to make the Borg more menacing without actually altering any statistics. Just use smaller ship types for the current ship roles in the Collective.

    Instead of a Cube, you fight a Sphere. Sure, it still blows up within 10 seconds or less to an Escort alpha strike, but - it's only a sphere. The current Cube would replace the Tactical Cube, and the Tactical Cube would replace whatever is next in the Borg food chain (Diamond? B'Gers?)
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  • ltdata96ltdata96 Member Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    How to make Borg STFs harder? Assimilated Aceton Assimilators :cool:
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  • svindal777svindal777 Member Posts: 856 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    ltdata96 wrote: »
    How to make Borg STFs harder?

    Make every shot a 1 shot kill.
    Well excuse me for having enormous flaws that I don't work on.
  • amosov78amosov78 Member Posts: 1,495 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    lianthelia wrote: »
    No thanks...if they're to make the Borg harder they need to do more than just make the Borg do more damage and more resistant to damage. Not the greatest comparison but at least they're heading in the right direction with the Voth and Undine...they actually use some powers.

    How about making the Borg adapt to your ship and personal shields. Essentially making all of their weapons fire bypass them? Also, their shield draining missile should disable engines, and cause a speed and engine power debuff after they are repaired by the targeted ship.
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  • architect13architect13 Member Posts: 1,076 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    The Borg are unhappy that they now have to pay for tier 6 ships and are protesting
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  • coolheadalcoolheadal Member Posts: 1,253 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Frankly Tactical Cube is tough one! Weak spot under the cube though.. Fire all your weapons in circle pattern under the cube. Max Shields, Max Firing on these cubes already. You all want to go to the extreme to make it tougher. Doesn't the Elite PVE for Borg already tougher without a team if you go in there on your own. But it won't let you do that.
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  • ufpdewolfeufpdewolfe Member Posts: 95 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Why not make the borg have something to be feared and next to impossible to beat. Something that you need to avoid at all costs but can be delayed with some smart tactics. Like the intial borg episodes in the Next Gen. Move away from the voyager super torpedoes blowing up cubes left and right.
  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    It should be a combination of higher hit points, more weapon damage and more ability powers as well. This could basically be upgrade of the current ships like a Mk II "Vanilla" Cube and Mk II Tactical Cube.

    Since the Borg STFs are very popular I suggest that Cryptic make these STFs for 10 players instead of 5; similar to Crystalline Catastrophe. I feel the Cryptic has truly nerfed Borg ships just so that they can be destroyed in a 5 player STF.

    In the series a single Borg Cube can withstand attacks from several dozen starships. Yeah, sure everyone's favorite psychopath and mass murder Captain Janeway developed weapons to defeat the Borg (bad writing to quickly end the series which had poor ratings due to ummm.... bad writing) easily. But a decent amount of time have past which would have allowed the Borg to develop more powerful ships and abilities.
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  • binebanebinebane Member Posts: 557 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    borg are gone. they dont have any more species to assimilat, no new technology so everyone in galaxy now beats borgs TRIBBLE.
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  • coupaholiccoupaholic Member Posts: 2,188 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    binebane wrote: »
    borg are gone. they dont have any more species to assimilat, no new technology so everyone in galaxy now beats borgs TRIBBLE.

    The universe is infinite, there is always someone to assimilate.

    And how cool would that be. The Borg coming back into the arms race with assimilated species of aliens no-one has ever seen before. Borg ships that are totally new, using adapted technology unknown to the rest of the universe.

    Then proceeds to beat the living daylights out of us. Just like first contact with them in TNG.
  • feiqafeiqa Member Posts: 2,410 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    How to make the borg more challenging/nastier. Make them legion. A borg cube flies around as one object but it is actually 2, 4, or 6 ships. Each one has a fraction of the overall hitpoint. They all sit under the same unified shield. But each part targets and fires separately.
    No tougher to kill (Unless you add the rotating adaptive shields.) but way more aggressive and able to put players more on the defensive.

    Advantage: More challenge, tac boats can't ignore the fire power and handle it alone easily. so Cruiser/tanks, and sci/debuff have specific uses in handling such an encounter.

    Really want to make them powerful? Have the parts able to toss hazard emitters on each other.

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  • feiqafeiqa Member Posts: 2,410 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    dark4blood wrote: »
    ^To me more ships isn't the solution, true adaptation is the solution, having them recognize the ridiculous resistance certain species have put up and then adapting and conquering those upgrades. The Borg should remain a constant threat, a predator they never goes away, a predator that adapts constantly.

    See you miss my point. It is one cube. Working as 2 or more vessels. Thus it can act like more than one and support itself. Emulating the adaption, regeneration, and multi tasking abilities of the borg.

    Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
    Network engineers are not ship designers.
    Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
  • hyplhypl Member Posts: 3,719 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    The Borg Cube should not be treated as a ship, but more like a moving platform with many hardpoints to destroy. Those hardpoints could be weapons nodes, tractor beam nodes, or armor nodes. As you chip away at the ship, it becomes more vulnerable. The nodes will also regenerate. Make enough of a dent in the cube and its softer areas will become exposed. The tractor beam should be much more powerful and practically shut down a player's ship. Others would have to destroy the tractor beam node holding that player, or that player's ship will be sliced to pieces with the cutting beam.

    You could make it more difficult for the cube to counter your team's attacks by hitting multiple sides at once. It would take longer to destroy, but it would be safer. Or you could tackle one side to destroy the cube faster, however this method is dangerous because the cube will divert everything to this one facing, increasing defense, firepower, and effectiveness from other abilities like tractor beam, shield neutralizer, and assimilate ship.

    Boy oh boy, won't targeting be a nightmare though... :rolleyes:
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  • abystander0abystander0 Member Posts: 649 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Bear in mind that for every person that wants x to be buffed, there will be 5 that will cry about it when it is. Remember the last time the borg were given new abilities and made a little more difficult? Yeah...people complained, screamed, and cried, until they were nerfed back into petting zoo critters. I am all for smarter and tougher NPC's, especially borg, but the reality is that there are a very large number of players who would rather have easy mode with the illusion of difficulty.

    Difficulty is fine and all, but at the same time how do you balance that against the desires of a player base who's idea of difficulty varies so greatly?

    One other thing to keep in mind when asking for buffs to NPCs is that generally speaking NPCs get buffed across the board. So asking for the borg in stfs to get buffed will also more than likely get your mission and Red Alert borg buffed too. The Federation leveling track has borg appear in various missions. Think about what would happen to that hapless low level captain when the come across these newly buffed borg. It wouldn't be pretty, and would probably be quite frustrating.

    Another thing to remember is that for many players, the game is about satisfying their immersion in the Star trek universe. Having their ship go boom is detrimental to that experience.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I agree with the guys who're saying hit points and damage are not the right way to buff borg, better AI is the right way to go, along with more abilities, the main reason this game is so darn boring (for me) is that none of the encounters require thought, I just switch on my macros, pilot and use additional damage buffs when there are more/bigger enemies. If the AI actually thought back I would have to rethink what I cycle permanently and what I activate when needed which would be much less boring.
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  • kestrelliuskestrellius Member Posts: 462 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    No, no, no, no, no. The Borg are obsolete. They're supposed to be. They're not sitting still while everyone else advances? That's precisely what they're doing. That's what they've always done and you know what, I'm not going to do my whole spiel about how the Borg are not the enormous threat they were for all of a year again, because I've explained this countless times. So, no. Have the Undine, Voth, Elachi, and Iconians be hard. But the Borg shouldn't be any harder than they are now.
  • heckgoblinheckgoblin Member Posts: 685
    edited August 2014
    Maybe the Borg in the new expansion will figure out that time travel should be used to go into the future, instead of the past, like the last time they tried it. Go kidnap some 29th-century Borg, bring them back, figure out what makes them tick. BAM, FUTURE-BORG!
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  • sunfranckssunfrancks Member Posts: 3,925 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    The best fight I have had with the Borg, was with the Diamond. Now that was interesting, more like the Voth for using more powers and tactics..
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  • phoeniciusphoenicius Member Posts: 762 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    i for one, like that the borg aren't the ridiculous overpowered enemy they were during TNG, which make sense since the alpha quadrant managed to close the technological gap.

    never liked them as concept(hurr space cyborg zombies).
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