I have said this in private and on the forums before....the community is the one responsible for the improvement or the destruction of ground pvp. The mechanics of the game change season to season, but there is a reoccurring theme here....every season seems to lead back to tacs online.
Dot duffs
spam inheriting owners buffs
cloaking period
Running virus while cloaked
omega cloaking
The other classes have had issues as well. The traits are not working correctly. Some traits you don't even have to have slotted to be active.
I was in a shanty the other day....I watched how one tac would uncloak and one shot lunge someone.....then on the other team...a tac uncloaked on the first one and did the same thing. Then the logging in/out started. This is not pvp...its a joke. Having multiple copies of any ability stack on a team level isn't needed.
If you want ground pvp fixed or better...we as a community have to learn to play the game and stop with the agendas. The same toons do the same thing consistently. As far as im concerned...sit in those qs alone then.
I welcome anyone that wishes to discuss more about this to come on our mumble server...send me a mail/tell for info.
Most of those tac issues aren't really issues anymore. I did prefer when cloak was more a defensive power and sitting at 0m on someone wasn't possible. Still lame if you happen to be on a toon not in possession of one of the hard counters. I was never one for cloaking myself.
I seem to recall making a post prior to S9 launching on tribble bug reports about the trait thing. I actually hate that my engineer is stuck with the chasing beam. Picked that up to test and never slotted it again. That's really a part of the reason why I hardly touch my engineer. The other reason being my sci is still too fun right now.
Really, things like rally cry should work like STF set bonus' do now; the best version gets applied and doesn't stack. Shouldn't be a hard change really, tac initiative doesn't apply twice even though it stacks on the buff bar.
Yea lunge is just lol. Aside from the fact the animation is totally broke and can ignore walls and obstacles, launch players into the air ( they nerfed that in the battle zone, wonder why? Lol ) it's just a dumb "ability" IMO. If I can't just set phaser to kill and vaporize a target without shooting them more then once, why can I just kick someone for 1/3 - 1/2 the hit points of a shuttle?
"But wait Nulonu! I've seen your exothermic induction field hit north of 2000 damage and you complain lunge is stupid?!! Hypocrite!"
Maybe. Really though, which makes more sense, dying from being set on fire or dying because you got kicked sorta hard? No brainer for me and I have yet to see anyone land fire hit north of 3k which has been pretty common for lunge lately.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Exothermic induction can hit hard. It helps with debuffs and teams buffs like strike team and rally cry. Remember rally cry is buffing the entire team. So engineers and science toons get the buffs. The worst thing about exothermic induction is with three geologist and tac int. you can fire it three times in about five seconds. With the stacking buffs and hardly no cool down it becomes dangerous.
Exothermic is basically a fire grenade that can't be dodged and has a shorter CD. Buff it the same way Scis fire 1k sniper shots- debuff the heck out of the enemy.
Exothermic induction can hit hard. It helps with debuffs and teams buffs like strike team and rally cry. Remember rally cry is buffing the entire team. So engineers and science toons get the buffs. The worst thing about exothermic induction is with three geologist and tac int. you can fire it three times in about five seconds. With the stacking buffs and hardly no cool down it becomes dangerous.
The DoT shouldn't stack and I believe Bort said he was going to look at that. Personally, I don't run 3x cool down geologists on mine. If they do make it so there's no benefit to running 3 because of a minimum CD then they really need to just make it so you can't stack a certain type of doff anyway. That's so unintuitive, you have no way of knowing what ones you can and what ones you can't and the stacking of certain types (crit doffs anyone) are what really causes problems with certain abilities.
The DoT shouldn't stack and I believe Bort said he was going to look at that. Personally, I don't run 3x cool down geologists on mine. If they do make it so there's no benefit to running 3 because of a minimum CD then they really need to just make it so you can't stack a certain type of doff anyway. That's so unintuitive, you have no way of knowing what ones you can and what ones you can't and the stacking of certain types (crit doffs anyone) are what really causes problems with certain abilities.
Stacking doffs is part of the problem. But so many doffs are out here. Most doffs hat you can stack are only chance doffs. I believe the security melee doffs are an exception. I think their doff buffing ability is always on.
Exothermic is basically a fire grenade that can't be dodged and has a shorter CD.
Making Exothermic Induction Field a grenade would actually balance the very high damage the ability is capable of dealing to players. Now if only Hyperonic Radiation could be fixed so that Vascular Regenerator and other DoT cleansers can clear it. Right now a Science officer can stack up 4-5 copies of Hyperonic Radiation and there is nothing the player can do to remove them regardless of class.
Stacking doffs is part of the problem. But so many doffs are out here. Most doffs hat you can stack are only chance doffs. I believe the security melee doffs are an exception. I think their doff buffing ability is always on.
The problem is some of the duty officers made after Season 5 received powers balanced for stacking three times (Melee Security Officers). +8% Critical Chance and +25% Critical Severity seems nice as a standalone, but it pushes melee damage to absurd levels. There are 1,200 damage/second (single target) sweeping strikes users running around with melee doffs and a handful of melee buffing abilities. It would be a massive imbalance in PvP if it weren't for the fact that Sweeping Strikes is so easy to sidestep by players. A single kick should not be dealing the same (if not more) damage as a pulsewave archwave setting all while obtaining 80% shield bypass.
The problem is some of the duty officers made after Season 5 received powers balanced for stacking three times (Melee Security Officers). +8% Critical Chance and +25% Critical Severity seems nice as a standalone, but it pushes melee damage to absurd levels. There are 1,200 damage/second (single target) sweeping strikes users running around with melee doffs and a handful of melee buffing abilities. It would be a massive imbalance in PvP if it weren't for the fact that Sweeping Strikes is so easy to sidestep by players. A single kick should not be dealing the same (if not more) damage as a pulsewave archwave setting all while obtaining 80% shield bypass.
RL comparision take as you will....
A skilled martial artist would be quite capable of rendering you unconscious or even dead with a well placed strike to the head which is what i believe sweeping strikes emulates. Gamewise dead via pulsewave or dead via a caved in skull is still dead, but where as SS is very easy to sidestep the Pulsewave just requires target lock and a good buff.
Most of the complaints in these threads are about team buffs reducing cooldowns or buffing a power to crazy levels due to stacking/team abilities, its seems almost as if it is designed to discourage team play.
Would it be better if team buffs could not effect other players but only your away team boffs?
Most of the complaints in these threads are about team buffs reducing cooldowns or buffing a power to crazy levels due to stacking/team abilities, its seems almost as if it is designed to discourage team play.
Would it be better if team buffs could not effect other players but only your away team boffs?
Or they could just balance the godforsaken game so that players aren't doing four times the damage in season 9 as they were in season 6 with no changes to NPCs and only about a 50% increase to player survivability.
You know, like a competent de... develop... :eek::D ahahahaha sorry can't keep a straight face through that sentence, oh god, I'm dying of laughter, send help.
A skilled martial artist would be quite capable of rendering you unconscious or even dead with a well placed strike to the head which is what i believe sweeping strikes emulates. Gamewise dead via pulsewave or dead via a caved in skull is still dead, but where as SS is very easy to sidestep the Pulsewave just requires target lock and a good buff.
I don't care how skilled you are at martial arts. A single sweeping kick isn't going to kill everyone in a 360 degree sphere within two meters of your person. Yet that is precisely what sweeping strikes does currently ingame. If the ability has the capability to one hit kill, then it should have a cooldown. Right now sweeping strikes doesn't have a cooldown at all.
Or they could just balance the godforsaken game so that players aren't doing four times the damage in season 9 as they were in season 6 with no changes to NPCs and only about a 50% increase to player survivability.
Survivability has increased with damage, but damage has reached a point where a max buffed single attack far exceeds a player's maximum hit points in some cases. This is the main problem at the heart of the issue.
You know, like a competent de... develop... :eek::D ahahahaha sorry can't keep a straight face through that sentence, oh god, I'm dying of laughter, send help.
Hey now, they have done a fine job keeping the majority of the mechanics balanced for PvP.
Or they could just balance the godforsaken game so that players aren't doing four times the damage in season 9 as they were in season 6 with no changes to NPCs and only about a 50% increase to player survivability.
You know, like a competent de... develop... :eek::D ahahahaha sorry can't keep a straight face through that sentence, oh god, I'm dying of laughter, send help.
Sigh, I remember when crafted armor/shields on memory alpha were top of the line. No STF sets, no doffs at all. Npcs were balanced around that. They were of course still having dumb AI but it wasn't so lol like it is now.
The problem is some of the duty officers made after Season 5 received powers balanced for stacking three times (Melee Security Officers). +8% Critical Chance and +25% Critical Severity seems nice as a standalone, but it pushes melee damage to absurd levels. There are 1,200 damage/second (single target) sweeping strikes users running around with melee doffs and a handful of melee buffing abilities. It would be a massive imbalance in PvP if it weren't for the fact that Sweeping Strikes is so easy to sidestep by players. A single kick should not be dealing the same (if not more) damage as a pulsewave archwave setting all while obtaining 80% shield bypass.
I don't care how skilled you are at martial arts. A single sweeping kick isn't going to kill everyone in a 360 degree sphere within two meters of your person. Yet that is precisely what sweeping strikes does currently ingame. If the ability has the capability to one hit kill, then it should have a cooldown. Right now sweeping strikes doesn't have a cooldown at all.
Survivability has increased with damage, but damage has reached a point where a max buffed single attack far exceeds a player's maximum hit points in some cases. This is the main problem at the heart of the issue.
Hey now, they have done a fine job keeping the majority of the mechanics balanced for PvP.
What?
Sweeping strikes has a 180 degee arc and a 2.44meter range thus why you can sidestep it.
Sweeping strikes has a 180 degee arc and a 2.44meter range thus why you can sidestep it.
It is 360 degrees, I've hit targets in front and behind me at the same time with the ability in the past. The reasons players can sidestep is because the ability uses the player as the focal point and prevents any form of movement. This gives players the chance to sidestep out of range.
(sigh), the 360 degree attack is probably a combo. I'm not ingame at the moment, but I'll check later to see what triggers the 360 degree strike. I know the ability does have a 360 degree strike because I've initiated it in the past. The character drops to one knee, does a 360 degree swipe against anything within range, and typically knocks down everything in range.
(sigh), the 360 degree attack is probably a combo. I'm not ingame at the moment, but I'll check later to see what triggers the 360 degree strike. I know the ability does have a 360 degree strike because I've initiated it in the past. The character drops to one knee, does a 360 degree swipe against anything within range, and typically knocks down everything in range.
That animation is a half circle (180) out in front of the character. It doesn't swing out behind the character. If it's causing damage behind then it's bugged somehow.
the 3rd seems to have a slight variation if crouched but the order they will play is random when using the skill.
If you have the Target Next key set-up to rapidly switch targets then......... Hypothetically you could target someone in front then immediately switch to a target behind you giving the appearance of a 360 degree strike but its still only 180.
Motion Accelerator ultimately isn't much of a problem. Use of the ability spreading to the team requires standing within four meters of the activating teamate. The ability is most effective when staggered rather than stacked due to a three minute cooldown before Tactical Initiative. It may be for the best to tone down the speed bonus a bit, but removing the stackability of the ability wouldn't accomplish much. Lunge is one hit killing without the aid of Motion Accelerator.
Lunge is just as much a problem in PvE when players are capable of instant killing an Elite Tactical Drone through shields on the elite difficulty.
I have to argue that motion accelerator is an issue. I believe they it was never added to the operative kit is to keep the run speed debuff from stealth module in check. Now with the new kits the debuff in a team setting is null and void. All it takes is a team mate to activate MA while a player is cloaked and save theirs for the escape. I think MA should be cancelled out by stealth module and should not be a reci we of the power when in stealth. But it is my opinion that this would give more game balan e.
I have to argue that motion accelerator is an issue. I believe they it was never added to the operative kit is to keep the run speed debuff from stealth module in check.
I wouldn't know about that idea. Frosted Boots have existed since Season 5 and players have always been capable of using them while in stealth. The only problem I see with Motion Accelerator is the magnitude of the speed buff provided. Personally I believe the ability scales too aggressively when skill points are applied. Prior to Season 9, Squad Command would improve Motion Accelerator III by +0.2% Physical/Run Speed per skill point. Putting 9 ranks in Squad Command increased the ability from a base of +20% Physical/Run Speed to +39.8% Physical/Run Speed.
The skill is one of those abilities that gains +99% effectiveness through max speccing in the skill tree. Honestly the ability wouldn't be half bad if the skill point bonus were cut in half to +50% with max skill spec. It may also be prudent to change Motion Accelerator to the point where only the best speed buff is applied (akin to Tactical Initiative).
I did play ground pvp a few days ago and I must say there is more balance between the careers now and engineers are still potent as ever. Maybe the devs should look more to the space careers balance now, improve engineers :cool:
The rally cry does a great boost and motion accelerator is great for offense/defense, but you cant call it op it doesn't last forever and it has a long cd after that so its pretty balanced.
I wouldn't know about that idea. Frosted Boots have existed since Season 5 and players have always been capable of using them while in stealth. The only problem I see with Motion Accelerator is the magnitude of the speed buff provided. Personally I believe the ability scales too aggressively when skill points are applied. Prior to Season 9, Squad Command would improve Motion Accelerator III by +0.2% Physical/Run Speed per skill point. Putting 9 ranks in Squad Command increased the ability from a base of +20% Physical/Run Speed to +39.8% Physical/Run Speed.
The skill is one of those abilities that gains +99% effectiveness through max speccing in the skill tree. Honestly the ability wouldn't be half bad if the skill point bonus were cut in half to +50% with max skill spec. It may also be prudent to change Motion Accelerator to the point where only the best speed buff is applied (akin to Tactical Initiative).
You can't compare frosted boots to MA because once in red alert you can't use frosted boots.
Comments
Most of those tac issues aren't really issues anymore. I did prefer when cloak was more a defensive power and sitting at 0m on someone wasn't possible. Still lame if you happen to be on a toon not in possession of one of the hard counters. I was never one for cloaking myself.
I seem to recall making a post prior to S9 launching on tribble bug reports about the trait thing. I actually hate that my engineer is stuck with the chasing beam. Picked that up to test and never slotted it again. That's really a part of the reason why I hardly touch my engineer. The other reason being my sci is still too fun right now.
Really, things like rally cry should work like STF set bonus' do now; the best version gets applied and doesn't stack. Shouldn't be a hard change really, tac initiative doesn't apply twice even though it stacks on the buff bar.
Yea lunge is just lol. Aside from the fact the animation is totally broke and can ignore walls and obstacles, launch players into the air ( they nerfed that in the battle zone, wonder why? Lol ) it's just a dumb "ability" IMO. If I can't just set phaser to kill and vaporize a target without shooting them more then once, why can I just kick someone for 1/3 - 1/2 the hit points of a shuttle?
"But wait Nulonu! I've seen your exothermic induction field hit north of 2000 damage and you complain lunge is stupid?!! Hypocrite!"
Maybe. Really though, which makes more sense, dying from being set on fire or dying because you got kicked sorta hard? No brainer for me and I have yet to see anyone land fire hit north of 3k which has been pretty common for lunge lately.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
How in the world do you accomplish that?
The DoT shouldn't stack and I believe Bort said he was going to look at that. Personally, I don't run 3x cool down geologists on mine. If they do make it so there's no benefit to running 3 because of a minimum CD then they really need to just make it so you can't stack a certain type of doff anyway. That's so unintuitive, you have no way of knowing what ones you can and what ones you can't and the stacking of certain types (crit doffs anyone) are what really causes problems with certain abilities.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
Stacking doffs is part of the problem. But so many doffs are out here. Most doffs hat you can stack are only chance doffs. I believe the security melee doffs are an exception. I think their doff buffing ability is always on.
Making Exothermic Induction Field a grenade would actually balance the very high damage the ability is capable of dealing to players. Now if only Hyperonic Radiation could be fixed so that Vascular Regenerator and other DoT cleansers can clear it. Right now a Science officer can stack up 4-5 copies of Hyperonic Radiation and there is nothing the player can do to remove them regardless of class.
The problem is some of the duty officers made after Season 5 received powers balanced for stacking three times (Melee Security Officers). +8% Critical Chance and +25% Critical Severity seems nice as a standalone, but it pushes melee damage to absurd levels. There are 1,200 damage/second (single target) sweeping strikes users running around with melee doffs and a handful of melee buffing abilities. It would be a massive imbalance in PvP if it weren't for the fact that Sweeping Strikes is so easy to sidestep by players. A single kick should not be dealing the same (if not more) damage as a pulsewave archwave setting all while obtaining 80% shield bypass.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
RL comparision take as you will....
A skilled martial artist would be quite capable of rendering you unconscious or even dead with a well placed strike to the head which is what i believe sweeping strikes emulates. Gamewise dead via pulsewave or dead via a caved in skull is still dead, but where as SS is very easy to sidestep the Pulsewave just requires target lock and a good buff.
Most of the complaints in these threads are about team buffs reducing cooldowns or buffing a power to crazy levels due to stacking/team abilities, its seems almost as if it is designed to discourage team play.
Would it be better if team buffs could not effect other players but only your away team boffs?
Or they could just balance the godforsaken game so that players aren't doing four times the damage in season 9 as they were in season 6 with no changes to NPCs and only about a 50% increase to player survivability.
You know, like a competent de... develop...
I don't care how skilled you are at martial arts. A single sweeping kick isn't going to kill everyone in a 360 degree sphere within two meters of your person. Yet that is precisely what sweeping strikes does currently ingame. If the ability has the capability to one hit kill, then it should have a cooldown. Right now sweeping strikes doesn't have a cooldown at all.
Survivability has increased with damage, but damage has reached a point where a max buffed single attack far exceeds a player's maximum hit points in some cases. This is the main problem at the heart of the issue.
Hey now, they have done a fine job keeping the majority of the mechanics balanced for PvP.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Sigh, I remember when crafted armor/shields on memory alpha were top of the line. No STF sets, no doffs at all. Npcs were balanced around that. They were of course still having dumb AI but it wasn't so lol like it is now.
BACK IN MY DAY........never mind I better stop.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
What?
Sweeping strikes has a 180 degee arc and a 2.44meter range thus why you can sidestep it.
:rolleyes:
It is 360 degrees, I've hit targets in front and behind me at the same time with the ability in the past. The reasons players can sidestep is because the ability uses the player as the focal point and prevents any form of movement. This gives players the chance to sidestep out of range.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
No its 180 degree
(sigh), the 360 degree attack is probably a combo. I'm not ingame at the moment, but I'll check later to see what triggers the 360 degree strike. I know the ability does have a 360 degree strike because I've initiated it in the past. The character drops to one knee, does a 360 degree swipe against anything within range, and typically knocks down everything in range.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
That animation is a half circle (180) out in front of the character. It doesn't swing out behind the character. If it's causing damage behind then it's bugged somehow.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
1. Crescent Roundhouse kick
2. Double arm swing strike
3. Sweeping Leg strike
the 3rd seems to have a slight variation if crouched but the order they will play is random when using the skill.
If you have the Target Next key set-up to rapidly switch targets then......... Hypothetically you could target someone in front then immediately switch to a target behind you giving the appearance of a 360 degree strike but its still only 180.
I have to argue that motion accelerator is an issue. I believe they it was never added to the operative kit is to keep the run speed debuff from stealth module in check. Now with the new kits the debuff in a team setting is null and void. All it takes is a team mate to activate MA while a player is cloaked and save theirs for the escape. I think MA should be cancelled out by stealth module and should not be a reci we of the power when in stealth. But it is my opinion that this would give more game balan e.
The skill is one of those abilities that gains +99% effectiveness through max speccing in the skill tree. Honestly the ability wouldn't be half bad if the skill point bonus were cut in half to +50% with max skill spec. It may also be prudent to change Motion Accelerator to the point where only the best speed buff is applied (akin to Tactical Initiative).
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
The rally cry does a great boost and motion accelerator is great for offense/defense, but you cant call it op it doesn't last forever and it has a long cd after that so its pretty balanced.
You can't compare frosted boots to MA because once in red alert you can't use frosted boots.