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Anyone flying BoPs in STFs???
jaguarskx
Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
I'm just wondering why am I not seeing any fellow BoP captains doing STFs? I am flying the Hegh'ta Heavy BoP.
I mostly play STFs with my Fed toon, but I still do a decent number of STFs with my KDF toon currently working on completing Omega Tier 4 and collecting BNPs. Also working on Romulan Tier 2. I got plenty of Nukara marks, but not really interested in doing that rep system.
The thing is I hardly see anyone flying BoPs. I think the last time I saw a fellow "BoP'er" was around 3 week ago... can't remember if it was a B'rel Retrofit in whatever STF I was playing at the time. I can't even recall seeing a fellow BoP'er beyond that one instance.
I mostly play STFs with my Fed toon, but I still do a decent number of STFs with my KDF toon currently working on completing Omega Tier 4 and collecting BNPs. Also working on Romulan Tier 2. I got plenty of Nukara marks, but not really interested in doing that rep system.
The thing is I hardly see anyone flying BoPs. I think the last time I saw a fellow "BoP'er" was around 3 week ago... can't remember if it was a B'rel Retrofit in whatever STF I was playing at the time. I can't even recall seeing a fellow BoP'er beyond that one instance.
Post edited by jaguarskx on
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Ships that can take a lot of pounding and pretty much spew out mass quantities of sustained damage without ever breaking off are preferrable.
Which is why I use ships like the Fleet Tor'kaht or Bortasqu for that purpose, as they give as well as they take.
I took my Fleet Norgh into Crystalline Catastrophe once, but it didn't work too well... although I think I still ended up in 3rd place on that one. I will have to switch to more of a drain build if I do it again.
I use my Fleet BoPs in ISE. I can solo a side in Khitomer (Elite) with my B'rel. I don't do the one with the Kang because people suck, but I have done it back in the day with a Hegh'ta.
I use my Fleet Hoh'sus & Fleet Norgh in the Undine space all the time. although that's not really STF & it's not Elite mode.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Because of the very low staying power of the BOP, they're not efficient. Escorts can trade shots to a degree and have enough to take them and move away safely to recover. Cruisers, Carriers can take the pounding. Science Vessels will have ridiculous Aux Power, so their heals are very potent. But the BOP? Too frail. If you're trying to compete in rankings to get No.1 in CEE, it's very hard to do it in a BOP because you're constantly being driven off by the smallest of attacks.
The only way to play a BOP is Hit & Run. Anything else will get you killed, esp. in PVP. Even then, there's other Escorts and Warbirds that do the job better with increased survival.
The Flanking Bonus doesn't mean **** if you're spending at the very least half the time in the match running away or repairing your catastrophic damage. This has traditionally been the reason why you stopped seeing BOPs in PVP team matches. The Hit & Run style tends to leave the rest of the team in a bind with 1 less player in the fight, because the BOP greatly suffered from someone farting in their general direction. Instead of a 5 vs 5 match, if you have a BOP in your team, it's really a 5 vs 4 match.
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
I have actually made it through ISE and Vortex elite many times w/o going "BOOM", but that mean running away to heal up before fighting again.
Everyone was very squishy.
I lasted a couple seconds less than the Escorts when it was my turn to be targeted until I decided to slip just out of range of the Tac Cube... then I turned back in when it swapped targets. (Just keep an eye on what the Tac Cube is shooting at, and get away if you're the one... you can lead the dog by its nose for a while, and then dive back in when it isn't chasing you. We really should have a general BoP discussion, I think.)
Managed to get the Optional, but it was close.
You just can't handle a BoP like a Cruiser. It's just not possible to do what a Cruiser does, even if Cruiser DPS is possibly the best in the game right now due to FAW & A2B.
If I had been in my B'rel, it wouldn't have been an issue to be in an all-Escort group.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
For stf not very effective, but hey who cares? right?
But you can still pull 4x dps out of them then a random pug player, so how can anybody tell they are not effective, it is all about the good fun :rolleyes:
The problem is BFAW/A2B being the king of output, and the solution is to get more people to run BFAW cruisers due to enemy spam?
Maybe I'll go back to Photons on my B'rel. Part of my issue is positioning with my Transphasics. To land the Breen Cluster, I don't like to be too far away due to BFAW from the enemy... but that means I'm more open to one-shotting, whereas the OP Enhanced Biometric doesn't need to be very close (even in THY mode).
CCE is still easy in the B'rel, though.
EDIT: Okay, Photons tore up ISE. The thing is, others will strip the shields, and then the mega-photon setup has amazing spike damage due to the big critical bonuses to Photons on the Dyson set... then you throw in the OP Enhanced Biomolecular Torp.
And I WANT to like Transphasic, too.
EDIT2: KSE was easy in Photon mode. No one-shots. I think I was out of practice. And the Enhanced Biomolecular torp is OP.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
1. Grand total of one C-Store BoP that receives a really ****ty fleet "upgrade".
2. Flying a paper plane in an environment full of hull burn isn't terribly healthy.
The combination of the fact that there aren't really any good ones available at reasonable prices combined with the fact that they aren't a good chassis for the job means you don't see 'em much. Even the flanking bonus added isn't really too helpful, as you tend to lose more damage repositioning to use the bonus than you gain by capitalizing on it. It does not help that Borg don't really have distinguishable rear sides, so you are left with significant guesswork to determine which side is the rear side.
good burst damage when people need the spike I can spew but not really good in sustained.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
The target selector window shows quite clearly which shield facing you are hitting. The only thing on which that doesn't work is the structures, as the target selector always shows you hitting the front of it, even if you are moving around.
Doenst work very well on borg ship too.
I did a lot of STFs in my hegh'ta and I have to say its a pain. Haven't done much since the revamp though.
It has nothing to offer that in of real use in that missions but pays for that nothing with its fragility. Still think that there should have been a more extensive revamp to that ships then "10% hull and flanking"
Especially since the heghta still doesnt have a fleet version.
One uses the B'rel Retrofit and the other one the Hegh'ta Heavy BoP. It's not impossible nor very difficult to use them, just takes some time to get adjusted if you spent a lot of time using more studry ships in STFs. If you like a chanllenge and to be engaged during the entire STF instead of flying circles and FAW-ing everything, pick up a BoP.
I mean, c'mon, using a raider in a STF is not something difficult. Players have been doing STFs in T3 ships. I just saw a video the other day where a player filmed another player in a STF flying the T1 Connie from TOS, who didn't die even once! :eek:
Raiders work just fine in STF's, indeed. I've been using my B'rel since the Dominion missions went live. And this was before all the scary power creep.
Also, you're right on the more engaging part. STF's are mostly a snooze-fest with FaW boats anyway. Hit your head on the spacebar while watching TV and you'll finish it with lots of time left on the optional. I find it more fun flying a raider, where I have to position myself. Surely, it's not the most effective way - you'll lose some dps - but really, STF's are so easy already, it's not much of a problem. One minute more or less doesn't matter much to me.
Although, for the Vicious Cycle mission, I do rather whip out the Galor. That map lags a lot for me, and I get eaten alive by all the yellow undine gravity well bullpoopoo in my B'rel. But that's just me lagging. I'm sure it's easily doable on a better computer.
Now, which side is the front? Is it the side to your right, or the side to your left? If the indicator wasn't so rigidly locked to the center, you could perhaps tell which side it was talking about. Unfortunately, from where you are, facing the corner of it, it's pretty much impossible to tell at a glance which way to go from here, since the cube lacks all distinguishing features and has no visible rear. Thanks, Obama!
The PUG was:
So, one Battlecruiser plus 4 squishies.
Pretty darn easy run, I think. I didn't die once.
Someone ran a DPS parser. Elapsed time was 7:56 (which was adequate, I think, since there were no Scimitars). I was 2nd in total damage (therefore, also 2nd in the sustained DPS). I think 1st was one of the T'varos.
I'm not really trying for DPS... but with my gear (especially the OP Enhanced Biomolecular torp), it's not difficult to do a lot of damage.
As for flanking a Cube... I'm just used to the little arrow, now. I just know in my head which way to go when the arrow is pointing a certain direction.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Relatively close to my alternative A2B build. Still not feeling op.
Transphasics just don't do the job anymore if you do not put anything and everything dedicated into it. What I have tried in an aborted experiment is a Transphasic Spamming Boat.
Transphasic Torpedoes
Projectile Weapons Officers
Breen Cluster
Transphasic Mines
Breen Space Set (not the Adapted MACO/KHG 2 piece... that buffs Torpedoes only and not Mines, which the Breen Clusters count as)
Transphasic Mines
Lead off an attack run with your favored TAC buffs, firing Transphasic Torps, firing the Breen Cluster, then when close to the target, releasing a DPB of Transphasic Mines. Get some space, wheel around, then keep spamming the Transphasic Torps to reduce the Breen Cluster CD.
Do it right, then you're hitting the target with alot of different transphasic sources. It gets very nice when you load in something like APO+APA and the Breen Cluster's mines and your DPB of Transphasic Mines hit at the same time, all while your regular Transphasics are still shooting.
Still... spamming Torpedo Fire is not healthy for a BOP, even a B'Rel. You need to keep weapons on target because you need to spam the torps to get the Cluster off cooldown. This seriously impacts your flying behavior as a BOP pilot because of that time on target requirement. This means that you're constantly in weapons range of the enemy. Torp Spamming in EBC of a B'Rel will get you killed very quickly even in PVE. So you're left trying to do this out of cloaks.
And I'm not even talking about PVP. I would not dare do this in PVP, except maybe for a single alpha strike and get the hell out of town. And even then, the current PVP environment is not friendly for destructible projectiles.
What I'm doing these days is playing the "Flanking" game when I play my other characters who are flying Escorts & Warbirds. All to keep up the drill and habit for proper Flanking play, even when the ship I'm using is not using such a benefit.
What is up with all the 'scorts? Did the cruisers just lose out in FOTM? I don't think they nerfed BFAW & A2B...
I think the PUG was:
The Plesh Brek spent most of the game waiting to respawn. I think I got popped 5 or 6 times, myself. It was ugly, although we got the bonus.
The Intrepid landed a couple Grav Wells... except that instead of hitting the Nanites, one Grav Well hit a Generator during the fight on the Left side... and the other Grav Well hit the Transformer instead of the Nanites while fighting on the Right side. LOL.
After getting beat up a lot, it was nice to see this at the end...
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II gives 2055 (10667) to Tactical Cube's Shields.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II deals 1185 (8058) Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.
Your Omega Graviton Amplifier deals 751 Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II gives 300 (1556) to Tactical Cube's Shields.
Your Omega Graviton Amplifier deals 751 Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II deals 9699 (7651) Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II deals 12316 (8372) Kinetic Damage to Tactical Cube.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II deals 20078 (13646) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Tactical Cube.
Your Enhanced Bio-Molecular Photon Torpedo - Spread II deals 19623 (13336) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Tactical Cube.
Flanking criticals are fun
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Funny observation about the Breen Raider. Another confirmation in my belief that most people out there don't know how to play a "Raider" class at all. They see all the benefits, esp. for the BOP, but they can't survive in one.
PUG was...
The Chel Grett was getting aggro & vaped almost instantly by the Tac Cube. I think I died 3 times... once due to Nanite spam, and then to the Tac Cube.
I just go to Flank & fire everything. If I get aggro from being too aggressive, then I either get out of range or die. Even with every toolbar devoted to defensive skills, it wouldn't be enough.
I died once trying to be tricky & using battle cloak to try to rebuff myself with my elite Rom ambush bonus... but that led to a one-shotting by the Tac Cube. I think the Chel Grett died, and then aggro switched to me as I cloaked.
The B'rel is much better at this stuff. I'm sure my Fed Eng's Excelsior would survive longer, but then it can't drop a Grav Well.
As far as BoPs go, I think I like my Fleet Hoh'sus more than my Fleet Norgh as well. The difference is an extra Attack Pattern (I use both APB & APO on my Norgh now).
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
I haven't had a lot of time to play the last few weeks, so I hop on to get daily marks, run a couple missions with some fleet mates, and then take off until the next day sometime. When have some more time to play, you might see my B'Rel's when pugging STFs.
I die much more often in my Fleet Norgh and Hoh'sus. Even in a bad PUG, i find that i can salvage more situations in my B'rel than my Norgh.
I do STFs in my Norgh and Hoh'sus to get better at the standard BoP setup.
Last run through ISE in my Fleet Norgh... easy, uneventful. Going to flank the first cube was a problem because although the Gate isnt active during the first fight, it is active immediately after, so it can oneshot you if you are too close.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
I used to run a transphasic setup with dual mines in the back, 2 cluster-mine torps and 2 rapid-reload torps up front.
What I did, was get in real close, dop a mine, then fire a clustermine torpedo and 1-2 rapid reload torps, turn about and get out of range in a hurry. Since both of the back slots had mines, this helped to force cloaking which helped to keep me alive and prepare a decloak damage bonus after I turned around. The tricks I found was that I had to consistently keep my attacks very short, trying to only get 1 RR torp to fire as I turned the ship to get distance and cloak. I had to escape to about 6km with good groups so I could cloak and someone else could take aggro. It also helps to try to get the timing of every other attack round in synch with mines and cluster mines when using 2 mine PWOs. You feel like a yo-yo after the constant run in, launch a bunch of stuf, turn, run out to 6-7km, then turn back and repeat again and again. If you only fire for 1-2 seconds and run away to quickly return, when a tac cube tries to put the tractor beam on you, you'll often get out of range before it can take hold and you'll be still cloaked and returning to dish out the hurt again.
Personally, using a grav well to capture the speheres in ISE and try to blow them all up is a real challenge since the gateway and the tac cube will join in the attack on you. That's 6-8 plasma torpedoes that could potentially be coming your way in a very short time frame. Your defense will probably be able to support healing up from 2 torpedo hits, maybe 3, so staying exposed for any time is risking a lot of damage coming your way which you may not be able to survive, hence the challenge.
Transphasic Cluster is actually still pretty decent is some PvP scenarios, like Cap and Hold. People tend to fly less organized and you wont have to deal with 2-3-4 man Fire at Will spam.
It's kinda cheesy, but what I do with my Sci B'rel is wait for people to burn their movement buffs like ApO, subnuke them, hit them with the Black Poo console, Scan, Gravity Well, and drop the Cluster point black, followed by a set of Nukara mines. Tends to one-pass a lot.
Other option is using Tractor Beam + Jam Sensors, drop Aceton and the Mines, wait for them to grab them and swing around with another point blank Cluster.
I guess I am probably one of the few who exclusively flies BoPs for everything. Got a Mirror Qin on the sideline that I am trying to kit out with Romulan Plasma DBB weapons, but getting them is completely random.
I like the challenge of flying around in an un-optimized Hegh'ta for the moment (I only do PvE). That basically means no slotted Doffs, all Boff are at best Lt Cmdr rank, and very basic equipment that generally should not cost more than 200k EC on the exchange. The only things I have that cannot be bought off the exchange are the Plasma-Disruptor hybrid DHC, Hargh'peng torps and 2 pieces from the Solanae set. I'll probably wait until I hit Tier 5 before adding any equipment from the Omega rep.
If you know how to fly you will never die
you will do about 10k dps as welll perhaps more
depends on build/skill/boffs/doffs
The bop is so fast and nimble if you fly it right you will take very few hit in the first place
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse