Hey let's continue to poke a stick at the Dev that has worked many hours to bring us a much needed update to ESD. That sounds like a fantastic idea and I think we should keep doing it after said Dev has expressed his frustrations honestly and openly.
His job is to provide us with content, if some of us dont like certain content and prefer other content regardless of what it is (100% of the player base) then that's each individuals opinion. I am sorry my opinion does not agree with others, but hey it is my opinion and it would seem a fair few others here. I am not going to feel bad because a dev is upset that some players prefer his crappy work over his masterpiece !
Maybe instead of being told what we SHOULD like, we could have a choice of what we actually like, or am I asking too much here ?
ESD certainly did need an update and it got it. Just because its all shiny and new does not mean we all have to like it, on the contrary all of us agree that the update is good. We just disagree on which parts are better and I do not see how that is a problem and why should we have to feel guilty in any way for that opinion.
His work, his rules. If he is annoyed by all this fuss even when he expressed he didn't want to talk about it, he might just put a giant wall over there, without windows.
You entirely have the choice of what you like. But annoying someone that told you he doesn't want to be bothered is rude at best.
I think people are talking about the shuttlebay because they can't go there. Pretty much like the kids when you say "don't touch it", they feel the urge to touch it.
If we could access to the shuttlebay, people would say how empty it is, and lacking. But since we aren't supposed to go there, it's suddenly the best place in the world.
In all fairness, this is a theme park game. In a sandbox game, players are encouraged to get up close and personal with as many aspects of the gameworld as possible as they go about doing whatever they want to do at any given time. In theme park games, not only are players directed from A to B to C along a pre-scripted path, but there's often more stuff they can't even get close to, let alone interact with. Which is why I have little desire to pay for theme park MMOs, but would be perfectly happy to shell out $15 for a good sandbox MMO.
I'm sorry, but I've never understood the necessity of shoving a game into one of these pigeonholes.
An MMO doesn't have to be all one type or the other, and many games reside happily between the two.
Hell, there are enough Easter Eggs in STO if you look hard enough (Harry Kim managing a minor starbase that you only see once, IIRC; granted, it's been a while) that it resides happily in that space too.
"Theme park vs. sandbox" is an arbitrary and fairly meaningless designation for a game (unless you're talking about the extremes: original Guild Wars as a theme park, and Second Life as a sandbox), and it honestly has nothing to do with whether the shuttlebay is accessible or not.
In all honesty, if someone went through the game counting the beautiful places that we can't get to, there would be quite a few. But ESD is high-profile, and shuttlebay is a work of art, so it gets whammed on in threads like this one.
Content doesn't have to be touchable or danceable to be content.
The shuttlebay is part of ESD, and that is content.
As I said to the Almighty Taco in another post, we like to explore, and most of us mourn being able to get in the shuttlebay because we want to see what's on the other side. And, as such, it's a love letter to his (and his team's) creation that we want to see all of it.
But it's sounding to me like there's a bit of entitlement in your argument. Might be time to hang it up and let the thread rest, unless you're TRYING to irritate one or more devs. Or unless you just feel that somehow playing the game entitles you to order the devs around and have them rearrange a map for your amusement.
We got content. We can't touch this part of it, as it's for looking only. Deal with it and move on.
I was going to post a lengthy comment, but I need to get back to playing this game full of disco balls, dinosaurs, snowmen and over 1000 USS EnterpriZes flown by numerous Kirks and Picards.
If we could access to the shuttlebay, people would say how empty it is, and lacking. But since we aren't supposed to go there, it's suddenly the best place in the world.
that's where you are wrong, as you would see if you read my previous posts, I have already been around the shuttlebay on tribble, apart from a couple of forcefields on the rear space doors and an access ramp the shuttlebay is complete.
now im not saying that its the best place in the world on the contrary I think they did a great job with the rest of earth spacedock but theres loads to see in the shuttlebay that you just cant see from the existing vantage point.
now I can understand when they say we were not supposed to go there but we were not supposed to jump over the railing on the upper level walkway in the main area either or paddle in the stream from the water feature but there is nothing stopping us from doing these things, there are loads of places throughout the entire gaming areas of sto that we were likely never ment to go but they don't stop us going to all these other places.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
. . . we were not supposed to jump over the railing on the upper level walkway in the main area either or paddle in the stream from the water feature but there is nothing stopping us from doing these things, there are loads of places throughout the entire gaming areas of sto that we were likely never ment to go but they don't stop us going to all these other places.
You are mistaken.
Yes, there are places in the game that you were not intended to get into, but you all find ways. But, if the area is not walled off, we expect you'll get there.
Some devs thought we should have invisiwalled off the upper walkways, the fountains, the roof over the Exchange/Infirmary, the glass over the Shipyard, the Support Stuts, even tables/desks. Long discussions have been had on each of those. In New Romulus, I specifically built up piles of rocks, knowing you guys would climb them.
The difference between those, and the Shuttlebay (or the Reman Area of NR), is a wall. Visible, or not, there is a wall that is intended to keep you out of those areas. There happens to be a glitch in our movement code that players can exploit to get beyond those walls.
That is a very different beast than some fountains that are inside the playable space.
Yes, there are places in the game that you were not intended to get into, but you all find ways. But, if the area is not walled off, we expect you'll get there.
Some devs thought we should have invisiwalled off the upper walkways, the fountains, the roof over the Exchange/Infirmary, the glass over the Shipyard, the Support Stuts, even tables/desks. Long discussions have been had on each of those. In New Romulus, I specifically built up piles of rocks, knowing you guys would climb them.
The difference between those, and the Shuttlebay (or the Reman Area of NR), is a wall. Visible, or not, there is a wall that is intended to keep you out of those areas. There happens to be a glitch in our movement code that players can exploit to get beyond those walls.
That is a very different beast than some fountains that are inside the playable space.
Could I at least convince you to add the ability to get in the shuttle-bay to the foundry? Say... as a map?
Support 90 degree arc limitation on BFaW! Save our ships from looking like flying disco balls of dumb!
Could I at least convince you to add the ability to get in the shuttle-bay to the foundry? Say... as a map?
That would require them to finish the shuttlebay, and if they finish the shuttlebay, they may as well remove the invisible walls.
I'm one of the naughty folks who got in there and climbed around. When you view it from the balcony, it looks like something you can move around in, but it's not. It's like a Western movie set. Go around a corner, and the facade is revealed to be just that.
As artists, they want you to see their work in its intended form. Looking at the back side of something that isn't meant to be seen runs counter to that. Plus there are people in this game's community who would have the gall to the complain about stuff like that.
I think it would be wonderful if the art team were able to finish up the shuttlebay to the point where we could be allowed to roam around in it. Since they're updating ESD in the near future anyway- to add in the club- maybe that's still a possibility. I won't hold my breath.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
I realize that this fountain is already clogged with all manner of currency, but I'm throwing my two cents in all the same...
One of the most beautiful scenes in STO (for me, anyway) is the boarding ramp connecting the Tholian base to the Enterprise-C. I think it is so incredibly unbelievably cool that you guys built a full sized Enterprise-C that I want you to do that with all of your ships. I'd love a sequence where a captain who gets a new ship is able to walk out to it at least once. (This is my praise of the quality of the artwork, for those of you wondering why this statement is here, instead of another thread.)
And that leads me to the ESD... The new ESD is gorgeous, but it feels like a mall. That shuttlebay feels like Star Trek. I often tell people that while I absolutely love STO, it shouldn't be called "Star Trek Online." It should be called "Space Combat in the Star Trek Universe Online" because over time, you guys are phasing out the science, exploration, and discovery in favor of "Fight, kill, fight, kill, fight, kill!
SIDEBAR: The adventure "Divide et Impara" is a perfect example of this. No Star Trek captain from any series or movie (main or supporting character) would follow an order to kill everyone and leave no survivors/witnesses. But the player has no option to declare the order illegal. (I played the adventure as written, then rewrote the adventure as a story in captain's log supplements.)
Instead of giving us more ways to fight, kill, fight, kill, fight, kill, you should be giving us more Star Trek. The shuttlebay is more of what we need.
Here's a suggestion that would meet us halfway: Finish the shuttlebay. Continue the mezzanine out into the shuttlebay with large floor-to-ceiling observation windows. That would give us more access to this masterpiece, while still keeping it a "painting on the wall."
I'd love to also suggest a ring-shaped gallery around the main hangar (above or below the main doors) with observation windows into the hangar, and seating areas that are either public, or can be bought/assigned/reserved for player fleets. (I would prefer this over the fleet starbase, but that's just me.) I'd love to suggest it, but I can imagine the developers' responses.
Comments
His work, his rules. If he is annoyed by all this fuss even when he expressed he didn't want to talk about it, he might just put a giant wall over there, without windows.
You entirely have the choice of what you like. But annoying someone that told you he doesn't want to be bothered is rude at best.
I think people are talking about the shuttlebay because they can't go there. Pretty much like the kids when you say "don't touch it", they feel the urge to touch it.
If we could access to the shuttlebay, people would say how empty it is, and lacking. But since we aren't supposed to go there, it's suddenly the best place in the world.
An MMO doesn't have to be all one type or the other, and many games reside happily between the two.
Hell, there are enough Easter Eggs in STO if you look hard enough (Harry Kim managing a minor starbase that you only see once, IIRC; granted, it's been a while) that it resides happily in that space too.
"Theme park vs. sandbox" is an arbitrary and fairly meaningless designation for a game (unless you're talking about the extremes: original Guild Wars as a theme park, and Second Life as a sandbox), and it honestly has nothing to do with whether the shuttlebay is accessible or not.
In all honesty, if someone went through the game counting the beautiful places that we can't get to, there would be quite a few. But ESD is high-profile, and shuttlebay is a work of art, so it gets whammed on in threads like this one.
No.
His job, as you said, is to provide content.
Content doesn't have to be touchable or danceable to be content.
The shuttlebay is part of ESD, and that is content.
As I said to the Almighty Taco in another post, we like to explore, and most of us mourn being able to get in the shuttlebay because we want to see what's on the other side. And, as such, it's a love letter to his (and his team's) creation that we want to see all of it.
But it's sounding to me like there's a bit of entitlement in your argument. Might be time to hang it up and let the thread rest, unless you're TRYING to irritate one or more devs. Or unless you just feel that somehow playing the game entitles you to order the devs around and have them rearrange a map for your amusement.
We got content. We can't touch this part of it, as it's for looking only. Deal with it and move on.
that's where you are wrong, as you would see if you read my previous posts, I have already been around the shuttlebay on tribble, apart from a couple of forcefields on the rear space doors and an access ramp the shuttlebay is complete.
now im not saying that its the best place in the world on the contrary I think they did a great job with the rest of earth spacedock but theres loads to see in the shuttlebay that you just cant see from the existing vantage point.
now I can understand when they say we were not supposed to go there but we were not supposed to jump over the railing on the upper level walkway in the main area either or paddle in the stream from the water feature but there is nothing stopping us from doing these things, there are loads of places throughout the entire gaming areas of sto that we were likely never ment to go but they don't stop us going to all these other places.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
You are mistaken.
Yes, there are places in the game that you were not intended to get into, but you all find ways. But, if the area is not walled off, we expect you'll get there.
Some devs thought we should have invisiwalled off the upper walkways, the fountains, the roof over the Exchange/Infirmary, the glass over the Shipyard, the Support Stuts, even tables/desks. Long discussions have been had on each of those. In New Romulus, I specifically built up piles of rocks, knowing you guys would climb them.
The difference between those, and the Shuttlebay (or the Reman Area of NR), is a wall. Visible, or not, there is a wall that is intended to keep you out of those areas. There happens to be a glitch in our movement code that players can exploit to get beyond those walls.
That is a very different beast than some fountains that are inside the playable space.
Could I at least convince you to add the ability to get in the shuttle-bay to the foundry? Say... as a map?
Support 90 degree arc limitation on BFaW! Save our ships from looking like flying disco balls of dumb!
That would require them to finish the shuttlebay, and if they finish the shuttlebay, they may as well remove the invisible walls.
I'm one of the naughty folks who got in there and climbed around. When you view it from the balcony, it looks like something you can move around in, but it's not. It's like a Western movie set. Go around a corner, and the facade is revealed to be just that.
As artists, they want you to see their work in its intended form. Looking at the back side of something that isn't meant to be seen runs counter to that. Plus there are people in this game's community who would have the gall to the complain about stuff like that.
I think it would be wonderful if the art team were able to finish up the shuttlebay to the point where we could be allowed to roam around in it. Since they're updating ESD in the near future anyway- to add in the club- maybe that's still a possibility. I won't hold my breath.
Joined January 2009
One of the most beautiful scenes in STO (for me, anyway) is the boarding ramp connecting the Tholian base to the Enterprise-C. I think it is so incredibly unbelievably cool that you guys built a full sized Enterprise-C that I want you to do that with all of your ships. I'd love a sequence where a captain who gets a new ship is able to walk out to it at least once. (This is my praise of the quality of the artwork, for those of you wondering why this statement is here, instead of another thread.)
And that leads me to the ESD... The new ESD is gorgeous, but it feels like a mall. That shuttlebay feels like Star Trek. I often tell people that while I absolutely love STO, it shouldn't be called "Star Trek Online." It should be called "Space Combat in the Star Trek Universe Online" because over time, you guys are phasing out the science, exploration, and discovery in favor of "Fight, kill, fight, kill, fight, kill!
SIDEBAR: The adventure "Divide et Impara" is a perfect example of this. No Star Trek captain from any series or movie (main or supporting character) would follow an order to kill everyone and leave no survivors/witnesses. But the player has no option to declare the order illegal. (I played the adventure as written, then rewrote the adventure as a story in captain's log supplements.)
Instead of giving us more ways to fight, kill, fight, kill, fight, kill, you should be giving us more Star Trek. The shuttlebay is more of what we need.
Here's a suggestion that would meet us halfway: Finish the shuttlebay. Continue the mezzanine out into the shuttlebay with large floor-to-ceiling observation windows. That would give us more access to this masterpiece, while still keeping it a "painting on the wall."
I'd love to also suggest a ring-shaped gallery around the main hangar (above or below the main doors) with observation windows into the hangar, and seating areas that are either public, or can be bought/assigned/reserved for player fleets. (I would prefer this over the fleet starbase, but that's just me.) I'd love to suggest it, but I can imagine the developers' responses.