In what world would mobile deathstars be a perfect addition to canon? Starfleet ships are designed to operate alone and fully support themselves. If you form them together in a fleet, every ship is according to it's own dimension capable of fully supporting themselves and allies around it. A Galaxy Class Starship, not talking of the Oddyssey in STO, is already close to a flying starbase. It is able to support colonization efforts significantly on it's own. And no, Starbases don't fly all the way to their destination, they are most likely assembled at their destiation point by a fleet of ships until it is able to support itself. After reaching that point it only requires protection and a steady resource supply.
Your idea may hold merit in terms of gameplay, if you are into battlefield games. But not for a Star Trek game, let alone Star Trek Online which has no content that would even remotely require basic team support aside from throwing a heal here and there.
Mobile deathstars? You certainly have a flair for the dramatic, as if every single slow moving vehicle with heavy defenses must be a war machine. Having strong defenses has nothing to do with making war, and more about preventing it. In fact it is a Luddite view of technology that only things have "seen" before do everything including assemble mammoth stations that the largest flag ships of the fleet are dwarfed by.
Also, it is incorrect that starships are fully autonomous, as the need to be built, and assembled at a shipyard first, and they just are not built out in space, second they do need to come in for repairs and upgrades, third, the carrier would build stations, not ships, it would just act as a repair center for ships. Note that the majority of Star Trek ships had X year missions.
How do you imagine the fleet of ships would assemble the large pylons? Would they go to the nearest Space Depot, and have giant domes replicated on the spot, or do they rent a Space-haul trailer and tow each piece behind the ship? Do they keep the supplies in the shuttle bay? Is it something you add water to and it grows 1000x its size?
Frankly, you have not given a good enough reason for why a large ship like this couldn't exist, and you and others would be better met not wasting your time with Starwars insults to my idea, its very disrespectful.
(...)
How do you imagine the fleet of ships would assemble the large pylons? Would they go to the nearest Space Depot, and have giant domes replicated on the spot, or do they rent a Space-haul trailer and tow each piece behind the ship? Do they keep the supplies in the shuttle bay? Is it something you add water to and it grows 1000x its size?
(...)
It's really not that complicated. You'd need ships with industrial grade replicators. Those would replicate parts at the construction site which are then moved and assembled by worker bees and personnel. At some point the station will be able to house those replicators and will only need a steady resource supply. I do not know in which form replicators store the resources that are required to replicate the parts, but once replicated they are assembled rather traditionally. I think that makes more sense than "carrying" space stations around in a giant ship.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
It's really not that complicated. You'd need ships with industrial grade replicators. Those would replicate parts at the construction site which are then moved and assembled by worker bees and personnel. At some point the station will be able to house those replicators and will only need a steady resource supply. I do not know in which form replicators store the resources that are required to replicate the parts, but once replicated they are assembled rather traditionally. I think that makes more sense than "carrying" space stations around in a giant ship.
What you are proposing to me, sounds more psuedo-science verging on pure fantasy, as there is nothing on any ship that we have seen thus far that can create something in a timely basis that even looks remotely like ESD or other deep space stations that can come from a starship. Additionally, it seems to me you have completely skipped the prospect of the kind of power required to convert such a structure with all the complex internals etc. It sounds like trying to use a 3D printer to create the Taj Mahal, if this were the case Voyager should have been able to build several craft in the Delta quadrant, but they were only able to build one, and even during the design process were forced to scale down the design specs to save resources. However it is not, because starships do not house infinite energy, and they certainly do not have the ability to construct large mechanical pylons that require a fleet of engineers.
Also, how would the worker bees be transferred? Answer : The carrier. Why? When is the last time you saw an episode where a star fleet vessel was towing around worker bees for a station construction project? Never. Additionally, given the mass of the carrier makes it far more logical in constructing such a station, as it would be able to hold the power, and maintain the heavy machinery to put something that large together in a far shorter time then 100 ships replicating Trillions^ of pieces of a starbase and trying to assemble it in any sort of rational amount of time.
Also, it would not carry the station there as a whole, much like a real modern building they would have the pieces held internally, and thus fabricated on site. Unlike a small ship however, the carrier could assemble the main pylons, with no need to expend the massive amount of energy and supplies that tapping a replicator for a job that size would entail. It would be a monumental waste of resources, personnel, equipment, and time. Without a doubt, specialized equipment was used to construct the stations, and in the entire time watching startrek, we never saw it. Startrek Armada however made a far more appealing case of how the stations were built, which detailed the process and design of the stations on site far more credibly then parlaying a massive group of military exploration vessels as a means to construct a station.
Not even defending a terradome containing good Undine from "Voyagers (in the Flesh) " against rogue zealot Klingon or Federation hell bent on complete genocide?
"good" Undine? It doesn't take much to fool Janeway does it? Sign me up for some good old fashioned Undine Genocide! because the thousands we kill every day just by ourselves is just not enough!
@originalspock: I don't get your point. Of course something like that takes a ridiculous amount of energy and resources, but Star Trek is set in an universe where a hand-help device the size of a car key can indefinitely fire energy beams able to desintegrate stuff. I don't think they run into problems when attempting to build a space station or starbase. Industrial replicators were mentioned on screen and they were used to build factories, power plants and entire colonies, and twelve of them fit on a transport vessel. It's not a too big leap to imagine Starships housing some of them and replicate parts which are then assembled at the site.
I don't understand your worker bee argument as well. A Galaxy Class ship has like 20 of them on board, even more if you dedicate the vessel to support the contruction efforts. I don't understand why they should build humongous ships we never saw or heard of in order to build stuff. Sure, a starbase is a huge project and probably takes years to finish but they last the same time as well.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
@originalspock: I don't get your point. Of course something like that takes a ridiculous amount of energy and resources, but Star Trek is set in an universe where a hand-help device the size of a car key can indefinitely fire energy beams able to desintegrate stuff. I don't think they run into problems when attempting to build a space station or starbase. Industrial replicators were mentioned on screen and they were used to build factories, power plants and entire colonies, and twelve of them fit on a transport vessel. It's not a too big leap to imagine Starships housing some of them and replicate parts which are then assembled at the site.
I don't understand your worker bee argument as well. A Galaxy Class ship has like 20 of them on board, even more if you dedicate the vessel to support the contruction efforts. I don't understand why they should build humongous ships we never saw or heard of in order to build stuff. Sure, a starbase is a huge project and probably takes years to finish but they last the same time as well.
Yes things will take a massive amount of energy, more then a single ship could generate thousands of miles of Tritanium by itself, and the fact that you don't understand something like that would need to be in a single piece as opposed to differing specs of quality replication says a lot regarding knowledge of densities, and metal treatments.
Um you are wrong sir, phasers, and phaser rifles run out of power, (See Siege of AR-558) during a prolonged combat scenario they run dry. I don't think you are as familiar with trek-nology as you think you are, let alone real world scenarios regarding functional/feasible/rational design measures.
As for Industrial Replicators, you never saw one inside of a ship, the only ones we ever saw made food, and small arms, and one Delta flyer.
As for Galaxy Class Starships having 20 worker bees, now you are clearly just making stuff up. Go ahead and prove they are anywhere in any schematics or even on this page http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Galaxy_class
They had no reason to show or talk about the ships because the carrier had nothing to do with the storyline, now there is a real possibility they can be talked about, and it hasn't ever truly been known how the stations themselves were constructed, they were just some how always there.
Yes things will take a massive amount of energy, more then a single ship could generate thousands of miles of Tritanium by itself, and the fact that you don't understand something like that would need to be in a single piece as opposed to differing specs of quality replication says a lot regarding knowledge of densities, and metal treatments.
Um you are wrong sir, phasers, and phaser rifles run out of power, (See Siege of AR-558) during a prolonged combat scenario they run dry. I don't think you are as familiar with trek-nology as you think you are, let alone real world scenarios regarding functional/feasible/rational design measures.
As for Industrial Replicators, you never saw one inside of a ship, the only ones we ever saw made food, and small arms, and one Delta flyer.
As for Galaxy Class Starships having 20 worker bees, now you are clearly just making stuff up. Go ahead and prove they are anywhere in any schematics or even on this page http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Galaxy_class
They had no reason to show or talk about the ships because the carrier had nothing to do with the storyline, now there is a real possibility they can be talked about, and it hasn't ever truly been known how the stations themselves were constructed, they were just some how always there.
I am aware that things can run out of energy, yet they do so at random. The type 1 phaser can desintegrate probably all day before something happens while other phasers deplete as soon as the situation looks grim I just wanted to illustrate that power use is probably not the most important factor in constructing space stations in Star Trek, although I will correct myself later on as I did read up some stuff.
We never saw industrial replicators, but they were mentioned in dialogue. Two replicators were enough to significantly help Bajor being reconstructed after the occupation, four replicators were used to construct structures like factories and powerplants and twelve of them were transportet via one vulcan transport vessel (all of this is cited on memory alpha in the article related to CFIs).
I don't make the numbers up but I was mistaken. The USS Enterprise was equipped with a dozen work pods which were called industrial manipulators which admittedly I suspect working in a similar manner as workbees do. This is stated in the TNG Technical Manual, page 158ff. The Galaxy just served as an example as to how many construction equipment and parts could fit in there if you tried, although I'm sure Starfleet Materiel Supply has ships better suited for that task.
Now regarding construction of starbases, to my knowledge the only records on starbase construction we have are about Terok Nor and found in the DS9 Technical Manual, page 20ff. According to it, the entire ops module was prefabricated at cardassia prime and then towed into Bajor's orbit by freighter where it was finished by welding parts which were produced at Bajor's ground facilities to it. Once a habitable atmosphere on board was available, more and more of the workforce were transfered to the station and with external support it grew from that point onward.
It is indeed not stated that industrial replicators were used while being in orbit but rather suggested that freighter brought parts that were fabricated/replicated in ground facilities which were then assembled in orbit by personnel.
I suspect Starfleet operates in a similiar manner. You get parts towed from all over the galaxy by convoys and weld them together at the contruction site. Nobody drags the whole spacedock part for a starbase around, it grows in time. I never stated that a single spaceship replicates the starbase, that was your interpretation.
Given the above information, we can assume that there is no such thing as a "base carrier". You might not accept Technical Manuals as canon, which they aren't since they were not "on-screen", yet they are based on the writer's bible and as far as I am concerned as long as on-screen doesn't directly contradict what is in those manuals, they are a viable secondary source.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I am aware that things can run out of energy, yet they do so at random. The type 1 phaser can desintegrate probably all day before something happens while other phasers deplete as soon as the situation looks grim I just wanted to illustrate that power use is probably not the most important factor in constructing space stations in Star Trek, although I will correct myself later on as I did read up some stuff.
We never saw industrial replicators, but they were mentioned in dialogue. Two replicators were enough to significantly help Bajor being reconstructed after the occupation, four replicators were used to construct structures like factories and powerplants and twelve of them were transportet via one vulcan transport vessel (all of this is cited on memory alpha in the article related to CFIs).
I don't make the numbers up but I was mistaken. The USS Enterprise was equipped with a dozen work pods which were called industrial manipulators which admittedly I suspect working in a similar manner as workbees do. This is stated in the TNG Technical Manual, page 158ff. The Galaxy just served as an example as to how many construction equipment and parts could fit in there if you tried, although I'm sure Starfleet Materiel Supply has ships better suited for that task.
Now regarding construction of starbases, to my knowledge the only records on starbase construction we have are about Terok Nor and found in the DS9 Technical Manual, page 20ff. According to it, the entire ops module was prefabricated at cardassia prime and then towed into Bajor's orbit by freighter where it was finished by welding parts which were produced at Bajor's ground facilities to it. Once a habitable atmosphere on board was available, more and more of the workforce were transfered to the station and with external support it grew from that point onward.
It is indeed not stated that industrial replicators were used while being in orbit but rather suggested that freighter brought parts that were fabricated/replicated in ground facilities which were then assembled in orbit by personnel.
I suspect Starfleet operates in a similiar manner. You get parts towed from all over the galaxy by convoys and weld them together at the contruction site. Nobody drags the whole spacedock part for a starbase around, it grows in time. I never stated that a single spaceship replicates the starbase, that was your interpretation.
Given the above information, we can assume that there is no such thing as a "base carrier". You might not accept Technical Manuals as canon, which they aren't since they were not "on-screen", yet they are based on the writer's bible and as far as I am concerned as long as on-screen doesn't directly contradict what is in those manuals, they are a viable secondary source.
The point isn't the fact that the power runs out for dramatic effect, its that it does, and essentially, to build the station you are saying it can be just done by any ship, well if they could just build a station by any ship with a replicator on board, why would they need shipyards at all? Why wouldn't they just fabricate on the fly? Why are there several major shipyards located around the alpha quadrant? Why even require a space dock at all if they are completely self sustainable. Your evidence does not pass the smell test. Yes this stuff is fictional, but when you jump the shark on practicality with science fiction, it just starts to look silly and unrealistic. The fact that a station like ESD needs a warp core that dwarfs any ship building it. Taking for account of the exotic elements and specialized custom synthetic parts of that station that would need to be assembled. When I think about replicators I think about their inability to replicate Latinum. Which means their replication ability has limits, how far is yet to be seen, but the inability to create a base metallic element says something about the limitations of a sophisticated machinery unable to copy an inert piece of matter.
Considering Tritanium is a highly priced commodity, not to mention Dilithium, I doubt the raw material could be summoned on site, as well as plasma coolant, and perhaps other specialist chemically treated pieces of machinery the replicator is incapable of building.
Also you are ommiting key words used on the website regarding the replicators "The Federation Council approved the request, and gave the Cardassians twelve Class 4 replicators so that the Cardassians could at least start building new power plants and factories. " You also mistaken the Class 4 replicators for the number of replicators to be used. Nothing entails that they actually built complete power plants or factories with them, just that they were given the start to build them.
Also, they never even actually got to build them as "Unfortunately, all twelve CFI replicators, which were transported to Deep Space 9 via a Vulcan freighter were hijacked by the Maquis, under the direction of former Starfleet Security officer Michael Eddington. (DS9: "For the Cause") "
Given that replicators provide an almost infinite source of food, and clothing, they would prove invaluable. The ironic thing is you mention how it helped the Bajorans as if it built things like ESD while omitting the second generation technology that Bajor obviously still had post occupation.
Also regarding "Industrial Manipulators" there is no schematic I know of that shows where 20 of those are kept, nor have they ever been seen in operation in any show or movie.
As for the Galaxies design, its not a construction ship, and it was never meant to be. You do not build a Gigantic saucer section to house thousands of engineers and family with little to no industrial equipment. On top of that, there are few things the Enterprise itself could do as far as manipulating objects in space, tow, push, and shoot at it, that's it. The Enterprise and other starfleet ships are extremely poor in managing objects in space with engineering precision. Towing a comet or a space ship is one thing, but holding together large tritanium columns so that engineers could focus working on installing shield generators and other circuitry long term seems unlikely.
As for how much material fits in the Enterprises cargo bays... not much as seen in many many emergency decompressions on TNG
Regarding DS9, your example of what Cardassia did pretty much supports my assertions on starbase construction, designing the most complex and larger pieces at industrial facilities, and then transporting the pieces to the area for assembly, you could also argue that Cardassia's proximity to Bajor allows for the entire platform to be towed instead of assembled primarily because it would not take nearly the amount of time that it would take in deep space.
Frankly I don't know how many ships you think would work on a station, but it would more then likely encounter too many cooks in the kitchen regarding assembly. Too many people working in such a tight proximity they would all be bumping into each other trying to get work done. Its simply not logical. Just as getting 1,000 men to lift a girder is less practical then using a single industrial crane. You seem to be arguing that the men should solely be responsible for building a building and that no new types of technologies would ever possibly be present.
Question : How many oil drilling platforms have you seen on the ocean or tv? Plenty right? How often have you seen the ships that place them? A handful to none, right? I would be willing to bet this is the same situation with Trek. There are probably very few of these giant behemoths, and those that do exist, are being sent out all the time on deep space assignments to setup outposts. As it is unlikely such a vehicle would ever have a true shore leave vs rotating crew of engineers/scientist/technicians.
The point isn't the fact that the power runs out for dramatic effect, its that it does, and essentially, to build the station you are saying it can be just done by any ship, well if they could just build a station by any ship with a replicator on board, why would they need shipyards at all? Why wouldn't they just fabricate on the fly? Why are there several major shipyards located around the alpha quadrant? Why even require a space dock at all if they are completely self sustainable. Your evidence does not pass the smell test. Yes this stuff is fictional, but when you jump the shark on practicality with science fiction, it just starts to look silly and unrealistic. The fact that a station like ESD needs a warp core that dwarfs any ship building it. Taking for account of the exotic elements and specialized custom synthetic parts of that station that would need to be assembled. When I think about replicators I think about their inability to replicate Latinum. Which means their replication ability has limits, how far is yet to be seen, but the inability to create a base metallic element says something about the limitations of a sophisticated machinery unable to copy an inert piece of matter. (...)
Either you don't read or you don't understand what I write. I explicitly said that a station is not built by a single ship. I also said that there is indeed no evidence that replicators were used in space for construction purposes, only to replicate spare parts for on-the-fly ship maintenance (TNG manual). Yes, this is controversial to what I said earlier but I corrected that sentiment once I read up on it, sorry if it wasn't clear.
A shipyard is needed to, well, construct ships in space. It's in principle similiar to a drydock. However, Starfleet vessels ARE able to fully support themselves according to their size, the Galaxy (for example) was designed to do that for years. Of course it is not flying drydock and major repairs and refits need a dock.
And I'm pretty sure it's rather fact that a station like ESD doesn't have a warp core. Because it's a station. No warp drive and all. No moving, in fact.
(...)
Also you are ommiting key words used on the website regarding the replicators "The Federation Council approved the request, and gave the Cardassians twelve Class 4 replicators so that the Cardassians could at least start building new power plants and factories. " You also mistaken the Class 4 replicators for the number of replicators to be used. Nothing entails that they actually built complete power plants or factories with them, just that they were given the start to build them.
(...)
A replicator doesn't create a buil
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Can I ask one silly question? With most ships now having trans warp capability, is there really a need for it?
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
Comments
Mobile deathstars? You certainly have a flair for the dramatic, as if every single slow moving vehicle with heavy defenses must be a war machine. Having strong defenses has nothing to do with making war, and more about preventing it. In fact it is a Luddite view of technology that only things have "seen" before do everything including assemble mammoth stations that the largest flag ships of the fleet are dwarfed by.
Also, it is incorrect that starships are fully autonomous, as the need to be built, and assembled at a shipyard first, and they just are not built out in space, second they do need to come in for repairs and upgrades, third, the carrier would build stations, not ships, it would just act as a repair center for ships. Note that the majority of Star Trek ships had X year missions.
How do you imagine the fleet of ships would assemble the large pylons? Would they go to the nearest Space Depot, and have giant domes replicated on the spot, or do they rent a Space-haul trailer and tow each piece behind the ship? Do they keep the supplies in the shuttle bay? Is it something you add water to and it grows 1000x its size?
Frankly, you have not given a good enough reason for why a large ship like this couldn't exist, and you and others would be better met not wasting your time with Starwars insults to my idea, its very disrespectful.
It's really not that complicated. You'd need ships with industrial grade replicators. Those would replicate parts at the construction site which are then moved and assembled by worker bees and personnel. At some point the station will be able to house those replicators and will only need a steady resource supply. I do not know in which form replicators store the resources that are required to replicate the parts, but once replicated they are assembled rather traditionally. I think that makes more sense than "carrying" space stations around in a giant ship.
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What you are proposing to me, sounds more psuedo-science verging on pure fantasy, as there is nothing on any ship that we have seen thus far that can create something in a timely basis that even looks remotely like ESD or other deep space stations that can come from a starship. Additionally, it seems to me you have completely skipped the prospect of the kind of power required to convert such a structure with all the complex internals etc. It sounds like trying to use a 3D printer to create the Taj Mahal, if this were the case Voyager should have been able to build several craft in the Delta quadrant, but they were only able to build one, and even during the design process were forced to scale down the design specs to save resources. However it is not, because starships do not house infinite energy, and they certainly do not have the ability to construct large mechanical pylons that require a fleet of engineers.
Also, how would the worker bees be transferred? Answer : The carrier. Why? When is the last time you saw an episode where a star fleet vessel was towing around worker bees for a station construction project? Never. Additionally, given the mass of the carrier makes it far more logical in constructing such a station, as it would be able to hold the power, and maintain the heavy machinery to put something that large together in a far shorter time then 100 ships replicating Trillions^ of pieces of a starbase and trying to assemble it in any sort of rational amount of time.
Also, it would not carry the station there as a whole, much like a real modern building they would have the pieces held internally, and thus fabricated on site. Unlike a small ship however, the carrier could assemble the main pylons, with no need to expend the massive amount of energy and supplies that tapping a replicator for a job that size would entail. It would be a monumental waste of resources, personnel, equipment, and time. Without a doubt, specialized equipment was used to construct the stations, and in the entire time watching startrek, we never saw it. Startrek Armada however made a far more appealing case of how the stations were built, which detailed the process and design of the stations on site far more credibly then parlaying a massive group of military exploration vessels as a means to construct a station.
Meh, he'll just go into another one of his six pack wrapped up in another six pack rants.
"good" Undine? It doesn't take much to fool Janeway does it? Sign me up for some good old fashioned Undine Genocide! because the thousands we kill every day just by ourselves is just not enough!
I don't understand your worker bee argument as well. A Galaxy Class ship has like 20 of them on board, even more if you dedicate the vessel to support the contruction efforts. I don't understand why they should build humongous ships we never saw or heard of in order to build stuff. Sure, a starbase is a huge project and probably takes years to finish but they last the same time as well.
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Yes things will take a massive amount of energy, more then a single ship could generate thousands of miles of Tritanium by itself, and the fact that you don't understand something like that would need to be in a single piece as opposed to differing specs of quality replication says a lot regarding knowledge of densities, and metal treatments.
Um you are wrong sir, phasers, and phaser rifles run out of power, (See Siege of AR-558) during a prolonged combat scenario they run dry. I don't think you are as familiar with trek-nology as you think you are, let alone real world scenarios regarding functional/feasible/rational design measures.
As for Industrial Replicators, you never saw one inside of a ship, the only ones we ever saw made food, and small arms, and one Delta flyer.
As for Galaxy Class Starships having 20 worker bees, now you are clearly just making stuff up. Go ahead and prove they are anywhere in any schematics or even on this page http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Galaxy_class
They had no reason to show or talk about the ships because the carrier had nothing to do with the storyline, now there is a real possibility they can be talked about, and it hasn't ever truly been known how the stations themselves were constructed, they were just some how always there.
I am aware that things can run out of energy, yet they do so at random. The type 1 phaser can desintegrate probably all day before something happens while other phasers deplete as soon as the situation looks grim
We never saw industrial replicators, but they were mentioned in dialogue. Two replicators were enough to significantly help Bajor being reconstructed after the occupation, four replicators were used to construct structures like factories and powerplants and twelve of them were transportet via one vulcan transport vessel (all of this is cited on memory alpha in the article related to CFIs).
I don't make the numbers up but I was mistaken. The USS Enterprise was equipped with a dozen work pods which were called industrial manipulators which admittedly I suspect working in a similar manner as workbees do. This is stated in the TNG Technical Manual, page 158ff. The Galaxy just served as an example as to how many construction equipment and parts could fit in there if you tried, although I'm sure Starfleet Materiel Supply has ships better suited for that task.
Now regarding construction of starbases, to my knowledge the only records on starbase construction we have are about Terok Nor and found in the DS9 Technical Manual, page 20ff. According to it, the entire ops module was prefabricated at cardassia prime and then towed into Bajor's orbit by freighter where it was finished by welding parts which were produced at Bajor's ground facilities to it. Once a habitable atmosphere on board was available, more and more of the workforce were transfered to the station and with external support it grew from that point onward.
It is indeed not stated that industrial replicators were used while being in orbit but rather suggested that freighter brought parts that were fabricated/replicated in ground facilities which were then assembled in orbit by personnel.
I suspect Starfleet operates in a similiar manner. You get parts towed from all over the galaxy by convoys and weld them together at the contruction site. Nobody drags the whole spacedock part for a starbase around, it grows in time. I never stated that a single spaceship replicates the starbase, that was your interpretation.
Given the above information, we can assume that there is no such thing as a "base carrier". You might not accept Technical Manuals as canon, which they aren't since they were not "on-screen", yet they are based on the writer's bible and as far as I am concerned as long as on-screen doesn't directly contradict what is in those manuals, they are a viable secondary source.
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The point isn't the fact that the power runs out for dramatic effect, its that it does, and essentially, to build the station you are saying it can be just done by any ship, well if they could just build a station by any ship with a replicator on board, why would they need shipyards at all? Why wouldn't they just fabricate on the fly? Why are there several major shipyards located around the alpha quadrant? Why even require a space dock at all if they are completely self sustainable. Your evidence does not pass the smell test. Yes this stuff is fictional, but when you jump the shark on practicality with science fiction, it just starts to look silly and unrealistic. The fact that a station like ESD needs a warp core that dwarfs any ship building it. Taking for account of the exotic elements and specialized custom synthetic parts of that station that would need to be assembled. When I think about replicators I think about their inability to replicate Latinum. Which means their replication ability has limits, how far is yet to be seen, but the inability to create a base metallic element says something about the limitations of a sophisticated machinery unable to copy an inert piece of matter.
Considering Tritanium is a highly priced commodity, not to mention Dilithium, I doubt the raw material could be summoned on site, as well as plasma coolant, and perhaps other specialist chemically treated pieces of machinery the replicator is incapable of building.
Also you are ommiting key words used on the website regarding the replicators "The Federation Council approved the request, and gave the Cardassians twelve Class 4 replicators so that the Cardassians could at least start building new power plants and factories. " You also mistaken the Class 4 replicators for the number of replicators to be used. Nothing entails that they actually built complete power plants or factories with them, just that they were given the start to build them.
Also, they never even actually got to build them as "Unfortunately, all twelve CFI replicators, which were transported to Deep Space 9 via a Vulcan freighter were hijacked by the Maquis, under the direction of former Starfleet Security officer Michael Eddington. (DS9: "For the Cause") "
Given that replicators provide an almost infinite source of food, and clothing, they would prove invaluable. The ironic thing is you mention how it helped the Bajorans as if it built things like ESD while omitting the second generation technology that Bajor obviously still had post occupation.
Also regarding "Industrial Manipulators" there is no schematic I know of that shows where 20 of those are kept, nor have they ever been seen in operation in any show or movie.
As for the Galaxies design, its not a construction ship, and it was never meant to be. You do not build a Gigantic saucer section to house thousands of engineers and family with little to no industrial equipment. On top of that, there are few things the Enterprise itself could do as far as manipulating objects in space, tow, push, and shoot at it, that's it. The Enterprise and other starfleet ships are extremely poor in managing objects in space with engineering precision. Towing a comet or a space ship is one thing, but holding together large tritanium columns so that engineers could focus working on installing shield generators and other circuitry long term seems unlikely.
As for how much material fits in the Enterprises cargo bays... not much as seen in many many emergency decompressions on TNG
Regarding DS9, your example of what Cardassia did pretty much supports my assertions on starbase construction, designing the most complex and larger pieces at industrial facilities, and then transporting the pieces to the area for assembly, you could also argue that Cardassia's proximity to Bajor allows for the entire platform to be towed instead of assembled primarily because it would not take nearly the amount of time that it would take in deep space.
Frankly I don't know how many ships you think would work on a station, but it would more then likely encounter too many cooks in the kitchen regarding assembly. Too many people working in such a tight proximity they would all be bumping into each other trying to get work done. Its simply not logical. Just as getting 1,000 men to lift a girder is less practical then using a single industrial crane. You seem to be arguing that the men should solely be responsible for building a building and that no new types of technologies would ever possibly be present.
Question : How many oil drilling platforms have you seen on the ocean or tv? Plenty right? How often have you seen the ships that place them? A handful to none, right? I would be willing to bet this is the same situation with Trek. There are probably very few of these giant behemoths, and those that do exist, are being sent out all the time on deep space assignments to setup outposts. As it is unlikely such a vehicle would ever have a true shore leave vs rotating crew of engineers/scientist/technicians.
"What's good for the goose..."
Either you don't read or you don't understand what I write. I explicitly said that a station is not built by a single ship. I also said that there is indeed no evidence that replicators were used in space for construction purposes, only to replicate spare parts for on-the-fly ship maintenance (TNG manual). Yes, this is controversial to what I said earlier but I corrected that sentiment once I read up on it, sorry if it wasn't clear.
A shipyard is needed to, well, construct ships in space. It's in principle similiar to a drydock. However, Starfleet vessels ARE able to fully support themselves according to their size, the Galaxy (for example) was designed to do that for years. Of course it is not flying drydock and major repairs and refits need a dock.
And I'm pretty sure it's rather fact that a station like ESD doesn't have a warp core. Because it's a station. No warp drive and all. No moving, in fact.
A replicator doesn't create a buil
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