I have noticed a few things with the responses here :
- Some folks equate Fleet Marks and Reputation marks .
I don't see them as equal .
Rep marks were always fairly easy to obtain (even the Romulan ones , once you got the Eppoh trade going) , while FM's... -- especially on the KDF side are somewhat of a pain .
- Some folks don't see the previous 'Bonus' of 20% as a big deal .
To them I say , 20% may not be a big deal , but play for a few days and that 20% becomes 40 then 60 then 100 or more .
Play 5 days a week during bonus hours and the bonus becomes 100% (5 x 20) .
Still see that as "you loose nothing" ?
- Some folks said that they are in a BIG FLEET so this does not matter to them .
To these folks I say that I am in a Fleet that walks both lines .
Our FED Starbase was among the first 5 Starbases in game that reached T5 .
But our KDF fleet chugs along like a small Fleet's Fed base , with about 3-9 active players and some casuals ... -- thus that is my living example of how things can go slowly ... and now not only slowly , but stopping while we get the smaller projects (Embassy/Mine/Spire) going .
I have all but stopped playing Fed because of the need that I see @ our Kdf side , and when our Spire had our T3 project slotted , it was almost a couple of weeks until we got that going ... -- BECAUSE OF FLEET MARKS -- and this was with 20% bonus Mark events , and with some of us pouring our Winter Event Marks into it from Winter Eppoh breeding .
So when I'm telling you that this has hurt all players , not just small Fleets , I am telling you this as someone from a Large Fleet that looks at what's going on around him , and not just bangs on his chest about not needing Bonus Fleet Marks because "I'm in a Big Fleet and My Fleet is doing Great !" .
No offense guys , but anybody who says that has little to no compassion toward his fellow players .
But All Hail Cryptic for managing to bury this thread in no man's land .
Must have touched a nerve .
Captain Gecko on Priority 1 , time index 29:50
" The Hourly Event's Calendar , the design with that was the hope to get ppl to stick around for maybe an extra hour , 'cause of that extra event that's coming up that they might want to stick around to , but because it was so common , the amount of awards you could get was so limited , while what happens on a Weekend , it's meant to cause a huge boost for that time period , and that huge boosts turns into a lot of numbers for us, then when those numbers go up , the money goes up as well . "
So in short , they took away your Bonus Marks , just so they can give them back to you at a later time (when they need a cash infusion) and you should just deal with it .
...
The Grind just got worse for everybody -- and I mean EVERYBODY , even those who will flock to the Bonus Weekends yet to come , and the small fleets that didn't see the end of it .... , well they might as well ask Cryptic for a telescope .
ENJOY. Cryptic loves you .
*sigh*
When Cryptic refers to players as statistics and numbers, I think they lose site of what is really important. I am a BIG supporter of capitalism. I have never seen a company 'publicly' reduce consumers to mathematics. Cryptic should be keeping their statistics behind closed doors.
Damn it! Over the past few days, I have been reinstalling 'STO' slowly. Now, I do not even want to look at the site.
So basically Cryptic who are running this game slowly into the ground has stuck everything during a weekend timeframe and then said "TRIBBLE you" to the folks playing during the week?
Thats fine, i guess my wallet will be opening up to another MMO I play during weekdays.
"You know when that shark bites, with its teeth dear... scarlet billows start to spread..."
I know right? The WORKING CLASS! Wonder if anyone else has CAUGHT on to this???? Come one people, are we going to let Cryptic get away with that? Really? As I remember, were the ones that are paying for the monthly membership (Unless your LifeTime membership) So, don't that makes us the customers? Don't we have a say in this?
For me, bottom line is the timing of the daily bonus mark event was what governed when I would play. I used to play every single day, logging in when the event began, collecting Defera invasion zone and STF fleet marks plus rep marks on some lower alts, set my rep and DoFF projects for the day, then logged off by the time the bonus marks event ended.
I don't understand the switch to weekend events. Defera invasion zone is a 20 hour cooldown. I could therefore play it seven times a week for a bunch of bonus marks. If the event is switched to a weekend thing, surely this means I can only run the Defera invasion hard missions twice?
Want to feel sick? Take a look at the calendar and see when the next reputation marks (read: not including fleet marks) weekend event is - 3 weeks away, with a likely frequency of every 4 or even 6 weeks. How oh how on Earth is this an improvement over several hours every day? This is nothing short of a catastrophic nerf of mark income.
No more discussion or faffing about with talk of unpopular events. Reverse this change now.
I know right? The WORKING CLASS! Wonder if anyone else has CAUGHT on to this???? Come one people, are we going to let Cryptic get away with that? Really? As I remember, were the ones that are paying for the monthly membership (Unless your LifeTime membership) So, don't that makes us the customers? Don't we have a say in this?
Well, if this is true, I have insurance on my AMEX no matter when I bought something.. if this is true... I'll be MOOOOAAAAR than happy to file my wonderful game purchase and be over and done with it as obviously Cryptic is saying to their weekday, gold players & lifetime playerbase 'Hey FU, we got your money. NEXXXXT!' How is this fair by any level? Either way, we'll see if I have to make that wonderful call. :eek:
I think if you are tired of all the TRIBBLE then you should go play farmville or one of the thousands of other games out there.
I am a huge star trek fan and dedicated to this game. Cryptic just shot all of us dedicated players in the head with this TRIBBLE. Last bonus weekend was Dyson space. I am sure the numbers were up but the rewards suck so a lot of people don't even bother.
Personally I think doubling the input to the starbase is a stupid idea and getting rid of the double XP in the rep system is even more stupid, I enjoy the fact that I now can rep some of my alternate characters.
Although I am all about free open opinions I think your opinion smells like a large load of fertilizer.
I am in a small fleet an we bust our humps to build up the base just to be competitive with the rest of the game.
Please before you say something as stupid as this again, THINK!!!!
A wise man listens twice and speaks once. That is why we have two ears and 1 mouth.
I resemble that remark.... and I don't care. To me, +20% fleet marks isn't worth remembering when the event is on the calendar.
Yeah, THAT is what the current bonus marks event really is. The NEW event is double, but not the old.
Well My fleet is on the very small end...but who is on can only dump 400k worth of Fleet Credits in a month before burn out. And that is hardly enough to get anything to tier 2 in 3 months =.=
The absolute biggest hurtle is Dilth. Nothing is as slow as Refined Dilth gain a day. The hard cap of 8k a day...which you have to decide: go to Fleet, go to Rep or go to Zen. The gaining Rare Dilth a day is not the issue, you can get 20k per character, with KDF it goes to crazy amounts more. But regardless you are hard capped to 8k per day of Refined.
Those with out the funds to always buy everything or pay the monthly...will save some for Zen. This is how the " Big Fleets " get their Refined Dilth in a timely manner.
Then there's the Rep system. Some of these take more then 8k Dilth some even take 32k ><, that 32k is 4 days of just dumping into one personal Rep project.
So between those two, Fleet Dilth needs tend to get dumped to the back for later at least until personal Rep dilth needs are done.
The few int he fleet can really fill everything needed for any project in either minutes or hours...it's the Dilth that goes completed for weeks all due to a daily limit hard cap.
--Someone mentioned that these changes are directed at the casual player, it makes sense really. Someone at cryptic had to look at last years numbers and most likely saw that a high number of said casual players were not spending enough money on the game.
So you reduce their ability to progress in the game unless they pay for it.
Business 101.
The hard core players of STO (lifers, gold subs, etc) play a lot, and most likely dump money into the game on a weekly basis. Thats why Cryptic keeps adding end-game content, to keep these core of players in the game and spending money.
This "protest" thread is only 5 pages long, most of the community really doesn't seem to care.
For those small fed fleets (I can't speak about KDF fleets, I don't play KDF):
If your reaction that you can't level your fleet as fast as you want, your not trying hard enough.
I am personally in a two man Fed Fleet. We can get 7 daily projects started within 30 mins of them opening everyday. If we are short dilith or Fleet Marks, we buy them from traders, (get access to thetradingchannel) people are always happy to sell for some EC or keys.
Can't get enough doffs? easy! Mini-packs, they are cheap, drop a lot of commons, and you can make up for buying the pack by selling the uncommon or rare doffs! Better yet, Grind them down to commons and put them in the star base projects.
Makes friends with other fleets, I personally try to donate left over common doffs to other fleets to help them with their projects. they help me with anything I am might be short on.
My fleet is 4 weeks away from T3 Spire. We plan to celebrate the achievement by offering free invites and provisions to our Spire until we run out of provisions.
--Someone mentioned that these changes are directed at the casual player, it makes sense really. Someone at cryptic had to look at last years numbers and most likely saw that a high number of said casual players were not spending enough money on the game.
So you reduce their ability to progress in the game unless they pay for it.
....... they won't lol. no matter how Cryptic may try to force them to pay, the casuals will just walk away instead of paying a red cent. Cutting off the nose to spite the face this is.
You can't really peev off the casuals and the hardcore players at the same time and see the game survive. It IS a business, of course. But simultaneously peeving off both the casuals and the hardcore players in the same breath as we are seeing often now? Is how you KILL that business.
Im sick and tired of 1 man fleets, literal armies of alts, and qq on the forum about it.
B- but... It's Cryptic's fault that I have to do all the reps for all 55 of my characters. My Joined Trill space hooker without the Borg gear? I think that's madness! Guh! I need my pills!
Too much instant gratification in this busted TRIBBLE game. I say take away the double xp rep tokens first, followed by giving leaver penalties to private groups, followed by tripling the amount of everything a starbase needs and giving a player account a hard cap of 10 character slots
Im sick and tired of 1 man fleets, literal armies of alts, and qq on the forum about it.
I agree
Also stop map invites
make members have to be in a fleet 1 month before the store opens for them as well
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Nope, he actually did hit the nail on the head there - you just refuse to see it, as allways.
What I was getting at, is that many of the things that people often cite as "bad" changes are only bad for a certain part of the population. the part that likes them thinks they're good, the part that doesn't curses Cryptic for "ruining" something....
What I was getting at, is that many of the things that people often cite as "bad" changes are only bad for a certain part of the population. the part that likes them thinks they're good, the part that doesn't curses Cryptic for "ruining" something....
I'm quoting you in the hopes your point makes it through the resentment.
I have never seen a company stupe to such lows, I mean even SOE has never done the thing that PWE has done. Seriously.
it's just money money money to them.
and the problem is PWE is monolithic much like EA and any kind of lawsuit will never see the light of day.
Folks, I think it's time to seriously consider finding a new game.
Well how the hell do u think games get made by ppl giving there time n skills for free?
Plz go n try a game that was made for free by fans u find its not half as good as sto. Try wing commander saga that was made for free by fans of the wing commander games.
P,s thanks for nacro this thread that was dead.
Is there some sort of reward or additional benefit if the starbase is finished in a day instead of a month?
I've always viewed starbases as a resource sucking, time wasting clubhouse which offers few benefits other than the "No girls allowed!" sign tacked onto the front door.
The Fleet vessels are nice, but a mere ten percent improvement in hull points over the 'regular version' hardly seems a benefit at all when one considers all the resources a group has to put into a starbase just to get to the privilege of being able to purchase one.
The Fleet gear is okay but again, there really isn't enough of a difference between how it performs over the 'regular version' to make a big fuss over once again being accorded the privilege of being able to purchase it.
The numerous threads posted all throughout this forum which state how various Fleet members have been abused or taken advantage of or have stolen from a Fleet again makes a Starbase hardly seem worth the effort.
I dislike the emphasis a lot of people place on hurrying to complete a starbase or any of the Holdings. It makes me feel like my only value to someone else is the size of my donation. It devalues me as a human being. I left a Fleet where the only time the leaders gave a damn about me was when I clicked on the 'Contribute' button. Otherwise they did what they damn well pleased and never acknowledged my existence. Until the next time they slotted a project for that damnable clubhouse and they were a little short on Dilithium.
So it takes longer to build your Special Place now. Please wake me up when we get to the part where I am supposed to care. I wouldn't want to miss it.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
My point was that this one fool wants everything slowed down even more.
I am in a small fleet with few actives and a few casuals. Even the actives haven't logged in since the last weekend event. Most of the players log in to auto refine dilithium and maybe do an STF or two and then log out. My point was that I am an active player, I play everyday for many hours. I also am a subscriber which means that I have a say in what the developers do with the product I am paying for. Anyone, who makes a purchase has a say in how their money is invested in this game.
If all they care about is raising numbers and profits on the weekend they are basically telling the dedicated active players that they are not worth it and should go play something else.
I also want to point out to some that posted does it matter if the base is finished in 1 day or 6 months. Well no not really but to have a project sitting for weeks is ridiculous and the bonus marks helped it a lot considering that I had 17 toons that I used to run through certain conent and several members of my fleet have multiple toons as well. To me it is a punch in the face making the event once in a blue moon.
Pfft... please... in my fleet the main bottleneck is dil costs. Everything else is easy to get. Fleet marks and Expertise are largely a formality. Don't act like you're special just because you're in a small fleet. My fleet has less than six players who contribute regularly. But we have no issues with Exp or FM.
Comments
- Some folks equate Fleet Marks and Reputation marks .
I don't see them as equal .
Rep marks were always fairly easy to obtain (even the Romulan ones , once you got the Eppoh trade going) , while FM's... -- especially on the KDF side are somewhat of a pain .
- Some folks don't see the previous 'Bonus' of 20% as a big deal .
To them I say , 20% may not be a big deal , but play for a few days and that 20% becomes 40 then 60 then 100 or more .
Play 5 days a week during bonus hours and the bonus becomes 100% (5 x 20) .
Still see that as "you loose nothing" ?
- Some folks said that they are in a BIG FLEET so this does not matter to them .
To these folks I say that I am in a Fleet that walks both lines .
Our FED Starbase was among the first 5 Starbases in game that reached T5 .
But our KDF fleet chugs along like a small Fleet's Fed base , with about 3-9 active players and some casuals ... -- thus that is my living example of how things can go slowly ... and now not only slowly , but stopping while we get the smaller projects (Embassy/Mine/Spire) going .
I have all but stopped playing Fed because of the need that I see @ our Kdf side , and when our Spire had our T3 project slotted , it was almost a couple of weeks until we got that going ... -- BECAUSE OF FLEET MARKS -- and this was with 20% bonus Mark events , and with some of us pouring our Winter Event Marks into it from Winter Eppoh breeding .
So when I'm telling you that this has hurt all players , not just small Fleets , I am telling you this as someone from a Large Fleet that looks at what's going on around him , and not just bangs on his chest about not needing Bonus Fleet Marks because "I'm in a Big Fleet and My Fleet is doing Great !" .
No offense guys , but anybody who says that has little to no compassion toward his fellow players .
But All Hail Cryptic for managing to bury this thread in no man's land .
Must have touched a nerve .
When Cryptic refers to players as statistics and numbers, I think they lose site of what is really important. I am a BIG supporter of capitalism. I have never seen a company 'publicly' reduce consumers to mathematics. Cryptic should be keeping their statistics behind closed doors.
Damn it! Over the past few days, I have been reinstalling 'STO' slowly. Now, I do not even want to look at the site.
Thats fine, i guess my wallet will be opening up to another MMO I play during weekdays.
I don't understand the switch to weekend events. Defera invasion zone is a 20 hour cooldown. I could therefore play it seven times a week for a bunch of bonus marks. If the event is switched to a weekend thing, surely this means I can only run the Defera invasion hard missions twice?
Two is a lower number than seven.
No more discussion or faffing about with talk of unpopular events. Reverse this change now.
Well, if this is true, I have insurance on my AMEX no matter when I bought something.. if this is true... I'll be MOOOOAAAAR than happy to file my wonderful game purchase and be over and done with it as obviously Cryptic is saying to their weekday, gold players & lifetime playerbase 'Hey FU, we got your money. NEXXXXT!' How is this fair by any level? Either way, we'll see if I have to make that wonderful call. :eek:
Yeah, THAT is what the current bonus marks event really is. The NEW event is double, but not the old.
My character Tsin'xing
The absolute biggest hurtle is Dilth. Nothing is as slow as Refined Dilth gain a day. The hard cap of 8k a day...which you have to decide: go to Fleet, go to Rep or go to Zen. The gaining Rare Dilth a day is not the issue, you can get 20k per character, with KDF it goes to crazy amounts more. But regardless you are hard capped to 8k per day of Refined.
Those with out the funds to always buy everything or pay the monthly...will save some for Zen. This is how the " Big Fleets " get their Refined Dilth in a timely manner.
Then there's the Rep system. Some of these take more then 8k Dilth some even take 32k ><, that 32k is 4 days of just dumping into one personal Rep project.
So between those two, Fleet Dilth needs tend to get dumped to the back for later at least until personal Rep dilth needs are done.
The few int he fleet can really fill everything needed for any project in either minutes or hours...it's the Dilth that goes completed for weeks all due to a daily limit hard cap.
--Someone mentioned that these changes are directed at the casual player, it makes sense really. Someone at cryptic had to look at last years numbers and most likely saw that a high number of said casual players were not spending enough money on the game.
So you reduce their ability to progress in the game unless they pay for it.
Business 101.
The hard core players of STO (lifers, gold subs, etc) play a lot, and most likely dump money into the game on a weekly basis. Thats why Cryptic keeps adding end-game content, to keep these core of players in the game and spending money.
This "protest" thread is only 5 pages long, most of the community really doesn't seem to care.
For those small fed fleets (I can't speak about KDF fleets, I don't play KDF):
If your reaction that you can't level your fleet as fast as you want, your not trying hard enough.
I am personally in a two man Fed Fleet. We can get 7 daily projects started within 30 mins of them opening everyday. If we are short dilith or Fleet Marks, we buy them from traders, (get access to thetradingchannel) people are always happy to sell for some EC or keys.
Can't get enough doffs? easy! Mini-packs, they are cheap, drop a lot of commons, and you can make up for buying the pack by selling the uncommon or rare doffs! Better yet, Grind them down to commons and put them in the star base projects.
Makes friends with other fleets, I personally try to donate left over common doffs to other fleets to help them with their projects. they help me with anything I am might be short on.
My fleet is 4 weeks away from T3 Spire. We plan to celebrate the achievement by offering free invites and provisions to our Spire until we run out of provisions.
Enjoy!
You can't really peev off the casuals and the hardcore players at the same time and see the game survive. It IS a business, of course. But simultaneously peeving off both the casuals and the hardcore players in the same breath as we are seeing often now? Is how you KILL that business.
B- but... It's Cryptic's fault that I have to do all the reps for all 55 of my characters. My Joined Trill space hooker without the Borg gear? I think that's madness! Guh! I need my pills!
I agree
Also stop map invites
make members have to be in a fleet 1 month before the store opens for them as well
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Whenever something really cool is added, Cryptic also adds some total BS. Or makes stupid changes.
I think you've hit a nail on the head here.
My character Tsin'xing
Therefore, it stands to reason that the reps are going to be sped up... so the hourly mark events needed to go.
Starbase is a starbase. It's supposed to be a hellish grind for anyone attempting it solo. Get more members in your fleet.
Odan Brota (Science Officer): Captain of a 28k DPS Scryer Intel Science Vessel, U.S.S. Kepler
Patiently waiting for a Romulan Science Vessel
Nope, he actually did hit the nail on the head there - you just refuse to see it, as allways.
My character Tsin'xing
I'm quoting you in the hopes your point makes it through the resentment.
Wow, and the hits just keep coming.
I have never seen a company stupe to such lows, I mean even SOE has never done the thing that PWE has done. Seriously.
it's just money money money to them.
and the problem is PWE is monolithic much like EA and any kind of lawsuit will never see the light of day.
Folks, I think it's time to seriously consider finding a new game.
Well how the hell do u think games get made by ppl giving there time n skills for free?
Plz go n try a game that was made for free by fans u find its not half as good as sto. Try wing commander saga that was made for free by fans of the wing commander games.
P,s thanks for nacro this thread that was dead.
I've always viewed starbases as a resource sucking, time wasting clubhouse which offers few benefits other than the "No girls allowed!" sign tacked onto the front door.
The Fleet vessels are nice, but a mere ten percent improvement in hull points over the 'regular version' hardly seems a benefit at all when one considers all the resources a group has to put into a starbase just to get to the privilege of being able to purchase one.
The Fleet gear is okay but again, there really isn't enough of a difference between how it performs over the 'regular version' to make a big fuss over once again being accorded the privilege of being able to purchase it.
The numerous threads posted all throughout this forum which state how various Fleet members have been abused or taken advantage of or have stolen from a Fleet again makes a Starbase hardly seem worth the effort.
I dislike the emphasis a lot of people place on hurrying to complete a starbase or any of the Holdings. It makes me feel like my only value to someone else is the size of my donation. It devalues me as a human being. I left a Fleet where the only time the leaders gave a damn about me was when I clicked on the 'Contribute' button. Otherwise they did what they damn well pleased and never acknowledged my existence. Until the next time they slotted a project for that damnable clubhouse and they were a little short on Dilithium.
So it takes longer to build your Special Place now. Please wake me up when we get to the part where I am supposed to care. I wouldn't want to miss it.
My character Tsin'xing