Yes, i think hot bar is a part of it. the whole point of this is swapping ships is a pain. not the ship swapping itself but all the problems that come with it. what this does, as far as i understand it is allow you to have multiple ships preset up so that swapping is easier and you cant get straight back into the action with minimal fuss. No need to reasign boffs, doffs and powers. you can also have different builds for a ship, so one could be pvp focused, while another could be pve focused etc.
the ability to swap in sector space is just one aspect of it to make it even easier. its not the main point of it.
it is of course totally optional and no one is forced to use it. will we see people magically change ships in sector space? maybe (i suspect it will actually happen from your bridge). but we have seen people magically appear and disappear in sector space when they change zones or instance for 4 years, so that argument kind of falls over.
i have heard a ton of people complain about swapping ships and the numerous problems that it throws up, and the desire to have multiple builds that can be swapped in and out quickly.
is it my number one desire? no, not really but its up there. however unless you poll everyone all the time, on every department of development you will never know what the number one issue is. even if you can find the highest rated desire, it does not mean the majority actually wants it either. you can win a poll but have the combined losers still out number the people who wanted it.
Well, I know that EEPH mentioned swapping in sector space recently.
Good points about switching ships if you tend to have different builds on different ships and jump between different types of content frequently.
I do hope that for the sake of immersion/lore they, if they do implement this, they will provide an animation during the switch that shows the old ship warping out and the new ship warping in -- not just ships magically changing form like I said up top.
As far as saving the hot bar I don't have any information on this. I would have thought that developing and implementing that tech smoothly would have had priority over hot swapping ships.
Personally, I never got in the habit of swapping ships for different content. I didn't think it was worth it since I knew I was going to have to reassign my buttons every time.
If/when we can save hot bars, then I can see looking into hot swapping ships (with appropriate warp animations) -- but only then.
But for now, Hot swapping ships -- officially a possibility in the near term.
Saving hot bar load outs -- nothing official that I know of. So far I am just speculating -- pure rumor starting on my part -- about saving load outs. If anyone has any real information on if/when saving load outs has been talked about maybe they can post here?
A lot of people are defending it, so they must be on the right track. Can think of a few more important things to keep my interest in this game going. Like more story, less bugs, and a way to get Romulan DOFFs that doesn't involve having to routinely ditch a bunch of Acamarians, Orions, Tellarites, and what-have-you-not sneaking aboard, while assembling a clone army of former Tal Shiar agents in order to secretly take over the world.
But that is just me. Others, they like their Starships pulled out from their own little pocket universe.
I imagine that adding the ability to swap ships is relatively easy - Pretty much just bring up the menu to change ships via a button, rather than an NPC.
I see this complaint akin to one the beginning of December(ish) that complained that Cryptic were releasing too many bug patches...
I imagine that adding the ability to swap ships is relatively easy - Pretty much just bring up the menu to change ships via a button, rather than an NPC.
I see this complaint akin to one the beginning of December(ish) that complained that Cryptic were releasing too many bug patches...
What would a MMORPG be without excessive button pressing in order to make everything happen at once. Some kind of environment, where you interacted with stuff? *Other* than buttons?
What would a MMORPG be without excessive button pressing in order to make everything happen at once. Some kind of environment, where you interacted with stuff? *Other* than buttons?
Pretty happy with this myself : dont really care/need the ability to swap them out in sector space, its more the feature of it actually remembering BO/UI and ship builds. ( as long as it works )
As it stands, i have so many ships that i love : current system is such a pain that i even have a couple of alts that exist for the sole reason of flying a specifically themed ship/crew
This way? i can swap my ship every STF if so desire, with a downtime of a click or two? great!
I strongly doubt it was anyone's #1 concern; however, that doesn't mean it wasn't on anyone's radar. And a brief browse through the forums will show that there isn't any one issue that's everybody's #1; might as well pick something they can do, and that will please a number of people (including me, as it happens).
As a comparative matter, when they did the Dyson stuff, there was a survey as to which DQ foe folks wanted to see. Voth placed on the list; I don't think they were #1 on more than a few lists, but they were there on a lot of lists at a lower place. (Personally, I voted for Kazon, because I actually think the species had unexplored potential, but obviously I was in the minority.)
It wasn't the most important thing but having to go all the way to the shipyard place just to change my ship and then to have to look around my other ships and banks for the stuff I need and then to have to assign it in space? Annoying.
We have been complaining about the hotbar shifting around when you change ships.
Perhaps while testing a fix for this they made this to make it easier to debug and test than constantly landing/switching/launching.
Either that or the function was always there and they decided "hey, while we're at it let's just let them do this as well."
Also someone mentioned it may be tied to some of the new pvp stuff.
Either way it is kind of neat, and probably didn't take much to implement.
Wow, some people really will complain about everything.
Look, I get that some are worried about "immersion", and others are worried that the public zones are becoming ghost towns. But those are two separate issues, not directly related to swapping ships.
We can't have tens of thousands of Admirals whipping around blowing up the same ships in the same instances over and over and an MMO world where changes only "stick" until the next player comes along, and then start drawing the line at "believeability". That's simply not possible in this sort of game.
What this change means: I can be in the Dyson Sphere, and ask to queue up for PvE with a friend/fleetmate and not have to hold up the team for ten minutes while I transwarp and run halfway around ESD. I don't have to worry about how recently I've transwarped at all.
What this change means: I have more reason to actually fly the ships I have, hence I'm likely to buy more ship slots.
What this change means: If my team needs a Tank and I'm in an Escort for solo, it's a one-minute switch instead of a ten-minute delay.
What this change DOES NOT mean: The line of immersion is eradicated and you can no longer play the game. Sorry, that doesn't work. There are already a hundred little things in the game that should "break immersion" for you. Multiple clones of Duty Officers on your ship? Check. Respawn in 15 seconds? Check. You want a true space RPG? They call that "EVE Online".
As for the argument that "Because people get this, they'll want that, and then these, and them THAT!!"? Yeah, that's called a "slippery slope". And it's a logical fallacy. Meaning it's illogical and won't hold up to scrutiny. Really? You see someone saving five minutes' time to change ships as equivalent to free gear and ships and a "level me up" button? Then the problem lies with you.
Look, if you wanna roleplay, fine. Do it. But don't pretend like your desire to play the game in a non-standard way should prevent others from getting improvements they ask for. You don't have to eat the cake if you don't like cake. But stop calling people whiners, or complainers, or lazy, or "fake" trekkies because of this. Stop projecting your own values onto other people. It's insulting, and it's dishonest.
Me? I'm stoked. I've already tried out the quick-inventory system on Tribble, and it's fantastic. This, too, will make the game more pleasurable to play, keep people in queues more, get people playing. ESD will stop being the go-to ship-swap hub, because every player can TW to it. Meaning ESD will be a more calm place--easier to role-play in.
If you're concerned about the lack of hub-specific content, that's okay too. But instead of asking that an inconvenience remain to keep people there (against their will, no less), why not instead ask for new, creative, inventive things to do in said hubs. Someone mentioned using the lower levels of ESD for some unique missions--I think that's fantastic. Maybe add buffs or debuffs depending on if you queue for a PvE or PvP from a particular hub. Maybe add temporary unique modifications that you can only get from one Hub, that wear off over time and/or can be replaced? Say, visit DS9 to get an overboost to Polaron weapons, or visit ESD for a phaser boost, etc, etc.
Ask for improvements, don't poo-poo improvements other people want and you don't happen to like. If the hubs are barren and lifeless, then figure out a way to make them less so. Our fleet has ESD Dance Parties, and DS9 Meetups--heck, initiate a gambling ring in a Ferengi hub somewhere--the mechanics to roll a die exist in game, use them. The game is there for you to play, it's your own fault if you can't think of a reason to do so.
I, for one, really look forward to this. Is it testable in Tribble/Redshirt? Which am I supposed to be using anyway? If so, how do I activate the functionality (I can't find it)?
i cannot remember any instance where people have asked for it. what ticks me off is that there are far easier things to do that people DO want, like the same uniform for crew that you have on the boffs and yourself, for the ability for your boffs to wear off duty wear additional skins for some of the ships that only have one...
I can recall several instances where it has come up in in-game conversation over the last two years, and I just read several forum hits when searching for this thread that shows that, yes, this has been requested. Maybe not number one, but this is certainly something I myself and others I know and play with have talked about.
Now, if anyone wants to gripe about "immersion breaking", how about the fact that our Impulse Engines are lit up in Sector Space and leaving trails, and not our Warp Nacelles? That seems more obnoxious to my eyes.
I agree with an earlier poster: You're a frelling Vice Admiral. You don't think you could arrange for another ship to be flown out to you? Devs are also talking about letting you command a small group of ships you own--the swapping would be simple at that point. This is probably just step one of that.
I see that my thread has been merged with this one. I apologize for starting off my thread in a way which made it look as though switching ships was my real concern. I was trying to get around to some comments on EEPH recent post (and its inadequacies) in as kind and constructive of a way as possible. I can see that I made a mistake and I would like to correct it now.
Since my actual intent was to address EEPH's comments in another thread I have posted them in the appropriate thread but I will CC here just to be clear.
Also thanks to BranFlakes for clarifying that in fact Tray Switching (not just ship switching) is in fact in the works. That is welcome and good news. Too bad EEPH couldn't be bothered to list it among the small handful of things he thought people might care about.
Having reread EEPH's statements I see that he did not say "changing ships in sector space" he merely made a vague comment about "ship switching" and perhaps I misinterpreted his comments or read more into them than I should have. Note however that in my separate thread I specifically ask for input to clarify the issue that EEPH's vagueness created.
The problem is that historically when people misinterpret his comments he takes no responsibility for it. Instead he makes comments that amount to "Well if you misunderstood, that's your problem". That may even have some truth to it -- but it's not what an EP should say. If there is miscommunication an EP should take some responsibility and assure people that he will try to be as clear as possible in the future -- not pass condescending blame to members of the community.
Let me see if I can answer a few of the big questions posed on this thread...
Third, there are lots of requests for more communication.
Stephen D'Angelo
Executive Producer
Star Trek Online
The issue (since correctly identifying the most important issue at any given juncture seems to be one of your great weaknesses) is not one of needing more communication, but better communication.
You failed to answer the biggest question...
Did you learn anything from your PR failures last time and what can you do to assure us that you will not make the same mistakes this time?
Judging from how you ignored and disregarded all of those who posed variations on this question or voiced their concerns over your past performance in the EP position by having dodged the biggest 'elephant in the room question' I can only surmise that you take no responsibility for past failures and have no intention to make any effort to improve in the level of respect that you give to concerns of the community.
Oh yeah, except you did mention how scared of you we all are.
As a case in point I take your patronizing and condescending "I know change is scary" type comments to be an accusation of cowardice leveled against those who question your vision and priorities for the game.
Your last stint as EP was an unmitigated PR debacle due mostly to your own statements and comments to the community about things that were going on more so than the actual things or changes themselves.
I concur with the assessment that your communication style is one of mealy mouthed weasel words. From the looks of this post, it would seem that nothing has changed.
This decision is more about game and less about star trek.......which, in my view, is not a good sign of things moving forward.
This game stands or falls on how well it reflects the IP.
If it wasn't for the game, I wouldn't play star trek, just saying but if the game is just a theatral movie where you click stuff and know already how things go, meh I'd be playing other games.
Games are meant to be games for a reason-imo
Say the word, it saves the world. CUUCUUMBEER!"-With slight partigen with it." Proud member or DPS-800"-We kill dem mines with our scitter turrets."
If it wasn't for the game, I wouldn't play star trek, just saying but if the game is just a theatral movie where you click stuff and know already how things go, meh I'd be playing other games.
Games are meant to be games for a reason-imo
Your perspective is perfectly valid, but there are many others (myself included), for whom if it wasn't for Star Trek, they wouldn't play the game.
The reason this game exists (technically) is because of the IP it is based on. If there is no Star Trek, then this just becomes yet another pointless, generic MMO with a lot of quality and gameplay issues. Personally, if this game hadn't been STAR TREK Online (emphasis mine), I wouldn't have even looked twice at it.
I'm not just talking about purrty space ships and pew pew that happen to look like Star Trek, but the entire premise, storyline, playstyle and motivation of the game. The core - the very heart - of this game is Star Trek. Lose sight of that and the game will end up in serious trouble.
There is a fine line that Cryptic need to walk in balancing the Star Trek aspect and the game aspect. Now the problem you run into with an IP based game like this (moreso than other games) is that you get quite a polarised community. Part of that polarised community are the IP fans - from casual to hardcore - who value the IP and its representation in the game as much as (if not more than) the gameplay. From this perspective, gameplay is meant to support the IP, not the other way around. Everything that the designers do ideally should reflect the IP and align with the 'laws of the universe' according to the IP.
Star Trek has always been primarily about exploration - not just of space, but of the human condition. Not only that, but it attempted to be as scientifically credible as possible (as well as science fiction is able to) and give a decent sense of realism in how the universe operated. They didn't always get it right, but in general they did a fair job.
Star Trek aficionados are going to expect a certain level of faithfulness to the IP in any Star Trek game they play, this one included - and that is perfectly reasonable. If a developer is going to take on an IP like this, they'd better be ready to represent it well, or else they're going to end up burned at the stake (figuratively speaking).
This debate is a prime example of players raising concerns about how well the game is representing the IP - in particular the sub-par design of sector space and social hubs, and the benefits v's the drawbacks of having instant ship swaps in sector space. The points raised are valid, so what are Cryptic's plans to address player concerns? At this stage we will have to wait and see.
Games are meant to be games for a reason - yes, and that reason is primarily entertainment and fun. Many people here derive their entertainment and fun from the Star Trek theme of the game. Lose that, and you lose them, and I guarantee that they are much more than just a vocal minority in number.
As always, just my thoughts.
Somewhere on the wrong side of insanity.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.
I'd say the answer to this is pretty simple. Allow people to quick change ships anywhere they like... for a ec fee.... like when they're using transwarp to mission.
You wanna be lazy/quick? Pay anywhere from 10.000 to 100.000 ec depending on how far you are from a space dock.
Thus, such a solution will be an added incentive to save some ec by goin to spacedock for some, and will be realistically correct as such a move far away from dock is BOUND TO BE COSTLY.
I'd say the answer to this is pretty simple. Allow people to quick change ships anywhere they like... for a ec fee.... like when they're using transwarp to mission.
You wanna be lazy/quick? Pay anywhere from 10.000 to 100.000 ec depending on how far you are from a space dock.
Thus, such a solution will be an added incentive to save some ec by goin to spacedock for some, and will be realistically correct as such a move far away from dock is BOUND TO BE COSTLY.
Problem solved.
Whilst it does offer some kind of incentive to return to ESD, the solution you offer doesn't address the concerns of the other posters here, namely:
* being able to switch ships in hostile sector space, and the break in realism/immersion;
* a perceived break in realism/immersion if ship changes are as quick and uneventful as outfit changes.
* the complaints over the design of sector space and the lack of compelling reason to traverse/explore it;
* the low populations of (and again, lack of compelling reason to visit) other social centres such as DS9, Drozana, K7, and so on.
Until these are addressed, it won't solve the problem for the players concerned by them.
As always, just my thoughts.
Somewhere on the wrong side of insanity.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.
Whilst it does offer some kind of incentive to return to ESD, the solution you offer doesn't address the concerns of the other posters here, namely:
* being able to switch ships in hostile sector space, and the break in realism/immersion;
* a perceived break in realism/immersion if ship changes are as quick and uneventful as outfit changes.
* the complaints over the design of sector space and the lack of compelling reason to traverse/explore it;
* the low populations of (and again, lack of compelling reason to visit) other social centres such as DS9, Drozana, K7, and so on.
Until these are addressed, it won't solve the problem for the players concerned by them.
As always, just my thoughts.
Of course, my idea is strictly related to that ability and only one aspect about how it should be implemented. I'm just as unhappy about some of these issues as well, but I also realize that some players might find it appealing and/or convenient. As for me, it will definitely kill some of the immersion.
Let's take the points everyone makes and find some sort of middle ground.
And I believe making this particular convenience "not so convenient" will keep me (I don't care whether anyone else is using it or not) from using it too much (or at all), thus solving my personal "immersion" problem. And a little extra EC sink wont hurt the game at all imo.
I'm all for more detail in the game, all for more/better sector space detail and reasons to explore it, and in general I think the game is severely lacking in the "not pew pew pew" department. We only have cluster diplomatic missions (of which the first contact ones dont even work for me for nearly a year now) and the tour the galaxy event as content thats not related in any way to freakin DPS. And I think this is terribly sad for a Star Trek game.
Of course, my idea is strictly related to that ability and only one aspect about how it should be implemented. I'm just as unhappy about some of these issues as well, but I also realize that some players might find it appealing and/or convenient. As for me, it will definitely kill some of the immersion.
Let's take the points everyone makes and find some sort of middle ground.
And I believe making this particular convenience "not so convenient" will keep me (I don't care whether anyone else is using it or not) from using it too much (or at all), thus solving my personal "immersion" problem. And a little extra EC sink wont hurt the game at all imo.
I'm all for more detail in the game, all for more/better sector space detail and reasons to explore it, and in general I think the game is severely lacking in the "not pew pew pew" department. We only have cluster diplomatic missions (of which the first contact ones dont even work for me for nearly a year now) and the tour the galaxy event as content thats not related in any way to freakin DPS. And I think this is terribly sad for a Star Trek game.
Fair point in relation to your idea. I would have to say personally I don't think the ship swapping thing is really the core issue - with sector space and social hubs well designed and giving plenty of reason to be there, explore and so on, then switching ships in sector space isn't an issue if done right. I can see the believability and immersion issues with switching ships in hostile space, so I would be happy with it limited to a friendly sector or one with some form of hub facility.
I think the sector space and hub facility design is another issue that really needs to be addressed on its own merit. I don't know of an easy fix that doesn't detract from existing features - the overly available transwarp system kind of gimps any attempt to make sector space more appealing, and any move to gimp/remove transwarp is going to draw ire from sectors of the playerbase.
I would agree with you on the diplomatic missions. I've only ever seen one First Contact mission on the several characters I've levelled to Ambassador status, and when I did it I thought it sucked. Empty, linear chat that really made it a non event, and the rewards were pathetic.
Diplomatic investigations aren't much better, with the only exception if you get on a run of half a dozen or so you can quickly zoom between and pick up the 100 diplo exp each. I found them to be not much more than a filler, and a really lame attempt at putting diplomacy into the game. If it wasn't for the fact that they pumped a little diplomatic exp towards my commendation level, I wouldn't have bothered with them, especially when the ones in high level clusters want 20 units of the more expensive commodities and you're forking out tens of thousands of EC each time. This is an aspect of the game that they could do much, much better.
At the moment I'm too tired to think of anything else to say that is meaningful, so I'll leave it there, but in closing I think regardless of what comes from the ship swapping system, sector space really needs some love to make it a vital part of the game again.
As always, just my (mostly coherent) thoughts.
Somewhere on the wrong side of insanity.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.
Comments
The favorite child of a PWE executive maybe?
the ability to swap in sector space is just one aspect of it to make it even easier. its not the main point of it.
it is of course totally optional and no one is forced to use it. will we see people magically change ships in sector space? maybe (i suspect it will actually happen from your bridge). but we have seen people magically appear and disappear in sector space when they change zones or instance for 4 years, so that argument kind of falls over.
i have heard a ton of people complain about swapping ships and the numerous problems that it throws up, and the desire to have multiple builds that can be swapped in and out quickly.
is it my number one desire? no, not really but its up there. however unless you poll everyone all the time, on every department of development you will never know what the number one issue is. even if you can find the highest rated desire, it does not mean the majority actually wants it either. you can win a poll but have the combined losers still out number the people who wanted it.
Good points about switching ships if you tend to have different builds on different ships and jump between different types of content frequently.
I do hope that for the sake of immersion/lore they, if they do implement this, they will provide an animation during the switch that shows the old ship warping out and the new ship warping in -- not just ships magically changing form like I said up top.
As far as saving the hot bar I don't have any information on this. I would have thought that developing and implementing that tech smoothly would have had priority over hot swapping ships.
Personally, I never got in the habit of swapping ships for different content. I didn't think it was worth it since I knew I was going to have to reassign my buttons every time.
If/when we can save hot bars, then I can see looking into hot swapping ships (with appropriate warp animations) -- but only then.
But for now, Hot swapping ships -- officially a possibility in the near term.
Saving hot bar load outs -- nothing official that I know of. So far I am just speculating -- pure rumor starting on my part -- about saving load outs. If anyone has any real information on if/when saving load outs has been talked about maybe they can post here?
-S2
But that is just me. Others, they like their Starships pulled out from their own little pocket universe.
---
Where on earth is the rage about the APB or Biochemist nerfs? I expected GD to be flooded with them.
My character Tsin'xing
I didn't realize that we had enough on 8.5 patch notes...mind showing me a link?
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
My character Tsin'xing
I see this complaint akin to one the beginning of December(ish) that complained that Cryptic were releasing too many bug patches...
What would a MMORPG be without excessive button pressing in order to make everything happen at once. Some kind of environment, where you interacted with stuff? *Other* than buttons?
---
My character Tsin'xing
Will have to save them up for a longcoat then. Thanks. :P
---
free jkname
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
As it stands, i have so many ships that i love : current system is such a pain that i even have a couple of alts that exist for the sole reason of flying a specifically themed ship/crew
This way? i can swap my ship every STF if so desire, with a downtime of a click or two? great!
As a comparative matter, when they did the Dyson stuff, there was a survey as to which DQ foe folks wanted to see. Voth placed on the list; I don't think they were #1 on more than a few lists, but they were there on a lot of lists at a lower place. (Personally, I voted for Kazon, because I actually think the species had unexplored potential, but obviously I was in the minority.)
Granted, I never read or heard anyone in game who specifically asked for this, but it is still a welcome feature imo.
We have been complaining about the hotbar shifting around when you change ships.
Perhaps while testing a fix for this they made this to make it easier to debug and test than constantly landing/switching/launching.
Either that or the function was always there and they decided "hey, while we're at it let's just let them do this as well."
Also someone mentioned it may be tied to some of the new pvp stuff.
Either way it is kind of neat, and probably didn't take much to implement.
Look, I get that some are worried about "immersion", and others are worried that the public zones are becoming ghost towns. But those are two separate issues, not directly related to swapping ships.
We can't have tens of thousands of Admirals whipping around blowing up the same ships in the same instances over and over and an MMO world where changes only "stick" until the next player comes along, and then start drawing the line at "believeability". That's simply not possible in this sort of game.
What this change means: I can be in the Dyson Sphere, and ask to queue up for PvE with a friend/fleetmate and not have to hold up the team for ten minutes while I transwarp and run halfway around ESD. I don't have to worry about how recently I've transwarped at all.
What this change means: I have more reason to actually fly the ships I have, hence I'm likely to buy more ship slots.
What this change means: If my team needs a Tank and I'm in an Escort for solo, it's a one-minute switch instead of a ten-minute delay.
What this change DOES NOT mean: The line of immersion is eradicated and you can no longer play the game. Sorry, that doesn't work. There are already a hundred little things in the game that should "break immersion" for you. Multiple clones of Duty Officers on your ship? Check. Respawn in 15 seconds? Check. You want a true space RPG? They call that "EVE Online".
As for the argument that "Because people get this, they'll want that, and then these, and them THAT!!"? Yeah, that's called a "slippery slope". And it's a logical fallacy. Meaning it's illogical and won't hold up to scrutiny. Really? You see someone saving five minutes' time to change ships as equivalent to free gear and ships and a "level me up" button? Then the problem lies with you.
Look, if you wanna roleplay, fine. Do it. But don't pretend like your desire to play the game in a non-standard way should prevent others from getting improvements they ask for. You don't have to eat the cake if you don't like cake. But stop calling people whiners, or complainers, or lazy, or "fake" trekkies because of this. Stop projecting your own values onto other people. It's insulting, and it's dishonest.
Me? I'm stoked. I've already tried out the quick-inventory system on Tribble, and it's fantastic. This, too, will make the game more pleasurable to play, keep people in queues more, get people playing. ESD will stop being the go-to ship-swap hub, because every player can TW to it. Meaning ESD will be a more calm place--easier to role-play in.
If you're concerned about the lack of hub-specific content, that's okay too. But instead of asking that an inconvenience remain to keep people there (against their will, no less), why not instead ask for new, creative, inventive things to do in said hubs. Someone mentioned using the lower levels of ESD for some unique missions--I think that's fantastic. Maybe add buffs or debuffs depending on if you queue for a PvE or PvP from a particular hub. Maybe add temporary unique modifications that you can only get from one Hub, that wear off over time and/or can be replaced? Say, visit DS9 to get an overboost to Polaron weapons, or visit ESD for a phaser boost, etc, etc.
Ask for improvements, don't poo-poo improvements other people want and you don't happen to like. If the hubs are barren and lifeless, then figure out a way to make them less so. Our fleet has ESD Dance Parties, and DS9 Meetups--heck, initiate a gambling ring in a Ferengi hub somewhere--the mechanics to roll a die exist in game, use them. The game is there for you to play, it's your own fault if you can't think of a reason to do so.
I, for one, really look forward to this. Is it testable in Tribble/Redshirt? Which am I supposed to be using anyway? If so, how do I activate the functionality (I can't find it)?
---
Now, if anyone wants to gripe about "immersion breaking", how about the fact that our Impulse Engines are lit up in Sector Space and leaving trails, and not our Warp Nacelles? That seems more obnoxious to my eyes.
I agree with an earlier poster: You're a frelling Vice Admiral. You don't think you could arrange for another ship to be flown out to you? Devs are also talking about letting you command a small group of ships you own--the swapping would be simple at that point. This is probably just step one of that.
Since my actual intent was to address EEPH's comments in another thread I have posted them in the appropriate thread but I will CC here just to be clear.
Also thanks to BranFlakes for clarifying that in fact Tray Switching (not just ship switching) is in fact in the works. That is welcome and good news. Too bad EEPH couldn't be bothered to list it among the small handful of things he thought people might care about.
Having reread EEPH's statements I see that he did not say "changing ships in sector space" he merely made a vague comment about "ship switching" and perhaps I misinterpreted his comments or read more into them than I should have. Note however that in my separate thread I specifically ask for input to clarify the issue that EEPH's vagueness created.
The problem is that historically when people misinterpret his comments he takes no responsibility for it. Instead he makes comments that amount to "Well if you misunderstood, that's your problem". That may even have some truth to it -- but it's not what an EP should say. If there is miscommunication an EP should take some responsibility and assure people that he will try to be as clear as possible in the future -- not pass condescending blame to members of the community.
My direct response to EP's post can be seen here:
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=14585771#post14585771
Originally Posted by stephendangelo View Post
Let me see if I can answer a few of the big questions posed on this thread...
Third, there are lots of requests for more communication.
Stephen D'Angelo
Executive Producer
Star Trek Online
The issue (since correctly identifying the most important issue at any given juncture seems to be one of your great weaknesses) is not one of needing more communication, but better communication.
You failed to answer the biggest question...
Did you learn anything from your PR failures last time and what can you do to assure us that you will not make the same mistakes this time?
Judging from how you ignored and disregarded all of those who posed variations on this question or voiced their concerns over your past performance in the EP position by having dodged the biggest 'elephant in the room question' I can only surmise that you take no responsibility for past failures and have no intention to make any effort to improve in the level of respect that you give to concerns of the community.
Oh yeah, except you did mention how scared of you we all are.
As a case in point I take your patronizing and condescending "I know change is scary" type comments to be an accusation of cowardice leveled against those who question your vision and priorities for the game.
Your last stint as EP was an unmitigated PR debacle due mostly to your own statements and comments to the community about things that were going on more so than the actual things or changes themselves.
I concur with the assessment that your communication style is one of mealy mouthed weasel words. From the looks of this post, it would seem that nothing has changed.
-S2
If it wasn't for the game, I wouldn't play star trek, just saying but if the game is just a theatral movie where you click stuff and know already how things go, meh I'd be playing other games.
Games are meant to be games for a reason-imo
CUUCUUMBEER! "-With slight partigen with it."
Proud member or DPS-800 "-We kill dem mines with our scitter turrets."
Your perspective is perfectly valid, but there are many others (myself included), for whom if it wasn't for Star Trek, they wouldn't play the game.
The reason this game exists (technically) is because of the IP it is based on. If there is no Star Trek, then this just becomes yet another pointless, generic MMO with a lot of quality and gameplay issues. Personally, if this game hadn't been STAR TREK Online (emphasis mine), I wouldn't have even looked twice at it.
I'm not just talking about purrty space ships and pew pew that happen to look like Star Trek, but the entire premise, storyline, playstyle and motivation of the game. The core - the very heart - of this game is Star Trek. Lose sight of that and the game will end up in serious trouble.
There is a fine line that Cryptic need to walk in balancing the Star Trek aspect and the game aspect. Now the problem you run into with an IP based game like this (moreso than other games) is that you get quite a polarised community. Part of that polarised community are the IP fans - from casual to hardcore - who value the IP and its representation in the game as much as (if not more than) the gameplay. From this perspective, gameplay is meant to support the IP, not the other way around. Everything that the designers do ideally should reflect the IP and align with the 'laws of the universe' according to the IP.
Star Trek has always been primarily about exploration - not just of space, but of the human condition. Not only that, but it attempted to be as scientifically credible as possible (as well as science fiction is able to) and give a decent sense of realism in how the universe operated. They didn't always get it right, but in general they did a fair job.
Star Trek aficionados are going to expect a certain level of faithfulness to the IP in any Star Trek game they play, this one included - and that is perfectly reasonable. If a developer is going to take on an IP like this, they'd better be ready to represent it well, or else they're going to end up burned at the stake (figuratively speaking).
This debate is a prime example of players raising concerns about how well the game is representing the IP - in particular the sub-par design of sector space and social hubs, and the benefits v's the drawbacks of having instant ship swaps in sector space. The points raised are valid, so what are Cryptic's plans to address player concerns? At this stage we will have to wait and see.
Games are meant to be games for a reason - yes, and that reason is primarily entertainment and fun. Many people here derive their entertainment and fun from the Star Trek theme of the game. Lose that, and you lose them, and I guarantee that they are much more than just a vocal minority in number.
As always, just my thoughts.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.
You wanna be lazy/quick? Pay anywhere from 10.000 to 100.000 ec depending on how far you are from a space dock.
Thus, such a solution will be an added incentive to save some ec by goin to spacedock for some, and will be realistically correct as such a move far away from dock is BOUND TO BE COSTLY.
Problem solved.
Whilst it does offer some kind of incentive to return to ESD, the solution you offer doesn't address the concerns of the other posters here, namely:
* being able to switch ships in hostile sector space, and the break in realism/immersion;
* a perceived break in realism/immersion if ship changes are as quick and uneventful as outfit changes.
* the complaints over the design of sector space and the lack of compelling reason to traverse/explore it;
* the low populations of (and again, lack of compelling reason to visit) other social centres such as DS9, Drozana, K7, and so on.
Until these are addressed, it won't solve the problem for the players concerned by them.
As always, just my thoughts.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.
Of course, my idea is strictly related to that ability and only one aspect about how it should be implemented. I'm just as unhappy about some of these issues as well, but I also realize that some players might find it appealing and/or convenient. As for me, it will definitely kill some of the immersion.
Let's take the points everyone makes and find some sort of middle ground.
And I believe making this particular convenience "not so convenient" will keep me (I don't care whether anyone else is using it or not) from using it too much (or at all), thus solving my personal "immersion" problem. And a little extra EC sink wont hurt the game at all imo.
I'm all for more detail in the game, all for more/better sector space detail and reasons to explore it, and in general I think the game is severely lacking in the "not pew pew pew" department. We only have cluster diplomatic missions (of which the first contact ones dont even work for me for nearly a year now) and the tour the galaxy event as content thats not related in any way to freakin DPS. And I think this is terribly sad for a Star Trek game.
Fair point in relation to your idea. I would have to say personally I don't think the ship swapping thing is really the core issue - with sector space and social hubs well designed and giving plenty of reason to be there, explore and so on, then switching ships in sector space isn't an issue if done right. I can see the believability and immersion issues with switching ships in hostile space, so I would be happy with it limited to a friendly sector or one with some form of hub facility.
I think the sector space and hub facility design is another issue that really needs to be addressed on its own merit. I don't know of an easy fix that doesn't detract from existing features - the overly available transwarp system kind of gimps any attempt to make sector space more appealing, and any move to gimp/remove transwarp is going to draw ire from sectors of the playerbase.
I would agree with you on the diplomatic missions. I've only ever seen one First Contact mission on the several characters I've levelled to Ambassador status, and when I did it I thought it sucked. Empty, linear chat that really made it a non event, and the rewards were pathetic.
Diplomatic investigations aren't much better, with the only exception if you get on a run of half a dozen or so you can quickly zoom between and pick up the 100 diplo exp each. I found them to be not much more than a filler, and a really lame attempt at putting diplomacy into the game. If it wasn't for the fact that they pumped a little diplomatic exp towards my commendation level, I wouldn't have bothered with them, especially when the ones in high level clusters want 20 units of the more expensive commodities and you're forking out tens of thousands of EC each time. This is an aspect of the game that they could do much, much better.
At the moment I'm too tired to think of anything else to say that is meaningful, so I'll leave it there, but in closing I think regardless of what comes from the ship swapping system, sector space really needs some love to make it a vital part of the game again.
As always, just my (mostly coherent) thoughts.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately be explained by stupidity" ~ Robert Heinlein.