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Forums > Home› The Foundry for Star Trek Online› The Foundry for Star Trek Online - Discussion & Feedback

Admiral Quinn in Foundry Missions

maninblack017maninblack017 Member Posts: 152 Arc User
edited August 2013 in The Foundry for Star Trek Online - Discussion & Feedback
Okay this has been bugging me for a while.

In the mission I am working on, there is a briefing with several of the top brass in Starfleet. I want the Chief Admiral of Starfleet at the briefing. In STO, that is Admiral Quinn. My question is: Is it better to try re-creating him and having him serve his role of Head of Starfleer or would it be better to create a new character in his place? I don't want to hit any STO taboo here by doing the wrong move. And Im hoping that by re-creating Quinn, I'm not violating any rules of the Foundry since he is an in-game character. Any advice?
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"The time has come to see the world as it is." - Captain James T. Kirk
Twitter - @SDVargo
Post edited by maninblack017 on
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Comments

  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    It's surprising that there is no extant skin for Quinn, but there is no reason NOT to use him.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • isthisscienceisthisscience Member Posts: 863 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    From what I understand, they prefer you not to but there is nothing banning you from it. It is possible to recreate him from eye - I did so in Your Mission Has Ended, though not perfectly so. STO academy website has the slider positions for a number of aliens, maybe they have Quinn too? Not sure.
  • stoutesstoutes Member Posts: 4,219 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Hi there,

    Good question! I tried to use him as a mission door as well, you might try and recreate him but i doubt if you will ever get him spot-on (due to foundry limitations).

    If you want couple of high-ranking officers, the easiest way to do this (and thus avoiding problems) is to just create new chars. You can create their own story and why they are so highly ranked.

    Thereby you will avoid doing something against the TOS/EULA and in the same time you will be more flexible storywise.
    maxvitor wrote: »
    Nerf is OP, plz nerf
    That's quite the paradox, how could you nerf nerf when the nerf is nerfed. But how would the nerf be nerfed when the nerf is nerfed? This allows the nerf not to be nerfed since the nerf is nerfed? But if the nerf isn't nerfed, it could still nerf nerfs. But as soon as the nerf is nerfed, the nerf power is lost. So paradoxally it the nerf nerf lost its nerf, while it's still nerfed, which cannot be because the nerf was unable to nerf.

    I call it, the Stoutes paradox.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    The EULA doesn't prohibit you from using any character that was created for STO. Jorel Quinn is definately not a character seen in any of the TV shows. There WAS an Admiral Quinn(Gregory) in TNG, but he was a human not a Trill. That and he doesn't resemble the STO char at all.... and he died in Conspiracy.... (Or maybe he got cured, not sure)

    Here's a pic I made of the sliders for the costume I used. http://marhawkman.deviantart.com/gallery/#/art/Admiral-Quinn-costume-sliders-395606858?_sid=3cd28466
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I normally have a Commander character serve as an aide-de-camp, who represents Quinn with the excuse that he is too busy personally congratulating Lieutenants on their promotions to attend important Briefings

    ''junior officers serve as aides-de-camp to certain senior officers. Flag Lieutenant is the Royal Navy's equivalent''
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    adverbero wrote: »
    I normally have a Commander character serve as an aide-de-camp, who represents Quinn with the excuse that he is too busy personally congratulating Lieutenants on their promotions to attend important Briefings
    Nice lampshade hanging.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    starswordc wrote: »
    Nice lampshade hanging.

    It saves me a bit of time too , since i can just hit random on the NPC instead of recreating Quinn
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • drogyn1701drogyn1701 Member Posts: 3,606 Media Corps
    edited August 2013
    I like making up and re-using my own admirals. I even just promoted a gal who used to be a captain. She's now an admiral in Starfleet Intelligence. Obviously that could be a problem if people play my missions "out of order" which is just the chronological order in which I made them, but it could be fun if they notice.
    The Foundry Roundtable live Saturdays at 7:30PM EST/4:30PM PST on twitch.tv/thefoundryroundtable
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    drogyn1701 wrote: »
    I like making up and re-using my own admirals. I even just promoted a gal who used to be a captain. She's now an admiral in Starfleet Intelligence. Obviously that could be a problem if people play my missions "out of order" which is just the chronological order in which I made them, but it could be fun if they notice.

    chronology is a *****

    I'd put in some dialogue asking her about it with somekind of humorus or sarcastic response about an Undercover opp or demotion
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • drogyn1701drogyn1701 Member Posts: 3,606 Media Corps
    edited August 2013
    adverbero wrote: »
    chronology is a *****

    I'd put in some dialogue asking her about it with somekind of humorus or sarcastic response about an Undercover opp or demotion

    Well she's a Vulcan so it would have to be very, very subtle, haha
    The Foundry Roundtable live Saturdays at 7:30PM EST/4:30PM PST on twitch.tv/thefoundryroundtable
  • nagoraknagorak Member Posts: 882 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    isthisscience wrote: »
    From what I understand, they prefer you not to but there is nothing banning you from it. It is possible to recreate him from eye - I did so in Your Mission Has Ended, though not perfectly so. STO academy website has the slider positions for a number of aliens, maybe they have Quinn too? Not sure.

    Way back one of the community reps said this, I think, but since then BranFlakes in his Foundry EULA FAQ basically said there is nothing preventing us from using him or the other Cryptic NPCs. I actually don't think anyone at Cryptic really cares one way or another if we use Quinn or other NPCs.
    DerelictionDutyR.jpg

    Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
  • erei1erei1 Member Posts: 4,081 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Quinn and a lot of others NPCs are fine. The problem comes when you try to add a NPC resembling and played on screen by a real actor, IE Sela, Worf, Picard.... Those people exist IRL, at least the actors that play them. And you can't use their likeness without their consent.

    Now, if you can have the consent of Patrick Stewart or Michael Dorn, I'm pretty sure Cryptic can make an exception.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    erei1 wrote: »
    Quinn and a lot of others NPCs are fine. The problem comes when you try to add a NPC resembling and played on screen by a real actor, IE Sela, Worf, Picard.... Those people exist IRL, at least the actors that play them. And you can't use their likeness without their consent.

    Now, if you can have the consent of Patrick Stewart or Michael Dorn, I'm pretty sure Cryptic can make an exception.
    I think there's foundry costumes for some of those.... so if you use an extant foundry costume....
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    drogyn1701 wrote: »
    Well she's a Vulcan so it would have to be very, very subtle, haha

    Haha , i always liked tuvoks style of humor
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • maninblack017maninblack017 Member Posts: 152 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Out of curiosity, what is the policy regarding the Enterprise?
    I loved when it made a cameo in BOLDLY THEY RODE because lets face it, who doesn't want to fight alongside the USS Enterprise? Are we allowed to use/recreate the Enterprise-F or is that a no-no?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "The time has come to see the world as it is." - Captain James T. Kirk
    Twitter - @SDVargo
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I think we can. It's 100% Cryptics creation. this includes Shon.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    maninblack017 wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what is the policy regarding the Enterprise?
    I loved when it made a cameo in BOLDLY THEY RODE because lets face it, who doesn't want to fight alongside the USS Enterprise? Are we allowed to use/recreate the Enterprise-F or is that a no-no?
    Enterprise-F and crew are fine; Cryptic owns those. Previous Enterprises are off-limits for depiction, but you can talk about them.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    maninblack017 wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what is the policy regarding the Enterprise?
    I loved when it made a cameo in BOLDLY THEY RODE because lets face it, who doesn't want to fight alongside the USS Enterprise? Are we allowed to use/recreate the Enterprise-F or is that a no-no?

    I wanted too but was irritated when i found there was no oddyssey Uniforms

    The ship itself is simple but i wanted to have authentic crew appearance, so i shelved the idea until ( or if ever )they add in the missiing uniforms
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    and along these lines I created: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=840001
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • nagoraknagorak Member Posts: 882 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    starswordc wrote: »
    Enterprise-F and crew are fine; Cryptic owns those. Previous Enterprises are off-limits for depiction, but you can talk about them.

    That was also covered. You can use any of the ships from Star Trek. The EULA specifically says actor likeness, a ship model is not an actor. The model of the Enterprise D, sitting in the house of whomever owns it now, isn't going to call its lawyer and demand a royalty.

    The reason there is confusion about this is way back in the pre-PWE days some of the community reps answered questions regarding what the EULA allowed by basically saying no to everything. That has since been corrected.
    DerelictionDutyR.jpg

    Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    nagorak wrote: »
    That was also covered. You can use any of the ships from Star Trek. The EULA specifically says actor likeness, a ship model is not an actor. The model of the Enterprise D, sitting in the house of whomever owns it now, isn't going to call its lawyer and demand a royalty.
    Oh. Cool.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    nagorak wrote: »
    That was also covered. You can use any of the ships from Star Trek. The EULA specifically says actor likeness, a ship model is not an actor. The model of the Enterprise D, sitting in the house of whomever owns it now, isn't going to call its lawyer and demand a royalty.

    The reason there is confusion about this is way back in the pre-PWE days some of the community reps answered questions regarding what the EULA allowed by basically saying no to everything. That has since been corrected.

    The only limitation i can think of there is you can only use ship models Cryptic has access too

    You can't put in the akula class for example
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • nagoraknagorak Member Posts: 882 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    adverbero wrote: »
    The only limitation i can think of there is you can only use ship models Cryptic has access too

    You can't put in the akula class for example

    Also, I suppose ships from some of the books that aren't also shown in one of the TV series or movies probably can't be used, since they are outside of what is licensed for the game. Of course, the same thing applies to characters from those sources.
    DerelictionDutyR.jpg

    Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I really wish I could put in a Vree Xill. But alas....
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • adverberoadverbero Member Posts: 2,045 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    markhawkman wrote: »
    I really wish I could put in a Vree Xill. But alas....

    thats one funky looking ship
    solar_approach_by_chaos_sandwhich-d74kjft.png


    These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
  • isthisscienceisthisscience Member Posts: 863 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    You could perhaps put Picard in, just so long as you do a really bad likeness so it looks nothing like Patrick Stewart?
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    isthisscience wrote: »
    You could perhaps put Picard in, just so long as you do a really bad likeness so it looks nothing like Patrick Stewart?
    Knowing gamers and Trekkies, that would just incite complaining (and therefore bad reviews) from folks who don't take part in Foundry writing and therefore don't realize the restrictions we work with. It's easier to just use them as active offscreen if you really want previous series' characters in your mission.

    For example, in "Bait and Switch" I've had a character mention offhand that Riker's a fleet admiral now (AFAIK his actual status as of STO has not been revealed, so I think I can get away with it) and I've had the player's orders come from Geordi La Forge's niece Nadifa (found her on Memory Beta; she turned up as a high schooler in a TNG novel).
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
    — Sabaton, "Great War"
    VZ9ASdg.png

    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • erei1erei1 Member Posts: 4,081 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    isthisscience wrote: »
    You could perhaps put Picard in, just so long as you do a really bad likeness so it looks nothing like Patrick Stewart?
    You can if you claim it's a Picard that doesn't look like Patrick Stewart (I wonder how). Otherwise, you can't.
    Picard is played by Patrick Stewart. No matter how good or bad you make him appear in STO, it's still Picard played by Patrick Stewart on screen, and thus, is supposed to look like him.

    For example, I played a mission with Q that didn't look like any Q from the TV, and the player ask why, and Q answer he took another shape for fun. It's fine, because the Foundry author says he doesn't look like any TV actor.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    adverbero wrote: »
    thats one funky looking ship
    Well, it's good to remember that in that picture you are actually seeing TWO Xills. They're flying in formation, I think the full scene had a dozen or so preparing to fight the Shadows and Vorlons.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • w0nd3rw411w0nd3rw411 Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    erei1 wrote: »
    You can if you claim it's a Picard that doesn't look like Patrick Stewart (I wonder how). Otherwise, you can't.
    Picard is played by Patrick Stewart. No matter how good or bad you make him appear in STO, it's still Picard played by Patrick Stewart on screen, and thus, is supposed to look like him.

    For example, I played a mission with Q that didn't look like any Q from the TV, and the player ask why, and Q answer he took another shape for fun. It's fine, because the Foundry author says he doesn't look like any TV actor.

    I do have a little work around in mind.... but considering that actors get paid for their likenesses when really crummy action figures are made it would really have to look nothing like Patrick Stewart. How about a black captain Picard? or a female Jean Picard? At one point I was tossing around creating a mission where you met an alternate next generation crew. a Female Jean Picard, Female Geordi La Forge, Male Beverly Crusher (yes Beverly is gender neutral) Female Data etc...
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