I use both the PESTF and the ESTF channel, have done so for nearly a year now, while back then ESTF seemed very active, ESTF seems dead now compared to PESTF, I have both turned on in one chat box tab and the only channel name I ever see is PESTF.
Most of the runs I get through it go fine as well as most others have said.
I have used both Elite STF and Public Elite STF, both are ok, neither really better then the other, lots of the same faces, and both sides have the occasional newb who probably should have read the guides online and practiced on normal before doing private elite stf. I accidently left ESTF a few months ago and felt it wasn't worth the trouble trying to get reinvited, public is almost the same.
An even better channel is DPS-5000, invite only but you need to have your DPS tested. I mostly try to use this now. Last match I was in I was doing 11k DPS the whole match with most of the group 8-10k, was like 10 min left on opt almost. Use this one if you can.
Yes for me its also dps-5000, its great to have a team where all have a high dps.
Sometimes we do a ise, cse & kase all in 15 minutes, you gotta love that.
If i need other players i always 1st goto pestf, 2nd estf.
Keybind: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=9355971&postcount=463
Bone1970 don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Fed Tac.
Bone Trader don't belief in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Fed Tac.
Bone2 don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. KDF Eng.
Warning: Not a native English-speaker, sorry if my English sucks.
An even better channel is DPS-5000, invite only but you need to have your DPS tested. I mostly try to use this now. Last match I was in I was doing 11k DPS the whole match with most of the group 8-10k, was like 10 min left on opt almost. Use this one if you can.
bunch of elitists...
but yeah. if you want a good group, it is DPS-5k that you should turn to. if you want challenge, go to PESTF, as you will probably have to carry the team.
and for that sole reason, I prefer PESTF over DPS-5k, its a bit more challenge (god, I am starting to sound the guy, who refused to play STFs with me, because it was "too easy" for him).
plus PESTF is much more fun, to see the theories of great 3k DPS players, and how they argue, how they have better ideas, then those who have proven to be better
one of my recent TRIBBLE players incident concerned a response from an individual who i wasnt even talking to in helping getting their match set up.
Pretty sad in the channel. Then again it is PUBLIC
Shocking how inexperienced and ill-equipped the users are in the public elite channel. Just had a match start where the match maker stated: " How do you run CSE? I haven't done this one that much."
They didn't know what pattern meant, and didn't understand how to defend the kang at all.
Please people, gtfo of eSTF match macking if you don't know what you are doing.
Then educate them rather then belittle them. When someone doesn't know the match (that well) then take a bit of time in the queue chat to explain it to them. Now if they ask what to do AFTER the game started, yeah it complicates things. I consider myself to be a very elite STFer (got 2 toons with over 800 STFs in their belt) so I know a fair thing about the STFs and I really don't mind taking a minute to explain how things work to people. We've all had to learn sometime, no one became "pr0" after 1 match you know...
Then educate them rather then belittle them. When someone doesn't know the match (that well) then take a bit of time in the queue chat to explain it to them. Now if they ask what to do AFTER the game started, yeah it complicates things. I consider myself to be a very elite STFer (got 2 toons with over 800 STFs in their belt) so I know a fair thing about the STFs and I really don't mind taking a minute to explain how things work to people. We've all had to learn sometime, no one became "pr0" after 1 match you know...
Personally, I think your talking to deaf ears. from what Ive seen in this thread, the majority of these people haven't a clue about actually "building" a team.. That one guy calling someone else TRIBBLE.. That's pretty pathetic. Guys like that in general tend to get the entire team killed time and time again, and then blame it on everyone else.. The one thing this thread has taught me though is that elite STF, doesn't even have a modicum of professionalism, let alone being elite.. Most of these guys should eat a little humble pie and go back to basics, like training new people to be part of the team, instead of calling then TRIBBLE because they don't have the cajones to admit their own deficiencies. Oh, Me?/ i'm not elite.. I dont have hundreds of dollars or months of time to waste on a single virtual ship that can only be used in one game, and i'll be honest, no matter how hard i could try, my ego simply could never be as big as some of these peoples.. Besides, last week i was only doing 798 damage, right now i'm only doing 3000 continuous. Thats not elite. Thats minimal, but it suits me fine..
And like a couple posters have already mentioned: There was a time when NO ONE knew what they were doing; or (gasp) had run a few Normals, heard Elites were different; and had to ask a question like the one the OP is mentioning. Anyone who says "Not me, I knew everything my first time; and performed flawlessly is either:
a) Lying
or
b) Was with a group (Fleet or otherwise) willing to 'show the newbies the ropes' without passing judgment on what their current in game skill set or weapons loadout was.
Or C), be smart enough to find what to do on the internet. Wiki have almost every eSTF walkthrough. Not to mention Youtube videos. It's not that hard when you really want to know.
But I agree, the easiest solution is to jump in elite, not knowing what to do, not sticking with your team, blowing generators and probes everywhere, and hope someone will start hand-holding you.
The channel clearly states you need to know the optional and the STF. Like it or not, it's clearly stated. There is also a link with every optional and stf, to learn how to do them.
Being rude doesn't mean being wrong.
I've never done an STF and honestly, it'll be a while before I'm up to it. But just to be clear, I'd like to get a consensus as to what's expected of a new(ish) player trying them out.
Is it really expected for that player to go offsite to the wiki and study up on how to do it before ever trying one for the first time? And if you do your best, are very nice, but you just aren't that good the first time, will that get you blacklisted (of sorts) with other players?
Because if I'm being honest here, that criteria makes me pretty sure that I'm simply not STF material. I'm pretty sure now I won't be giving them a shot.
I'm not being snarky here. I have no beef with the community if this is what's expected for STFs. I just know that it's not something I'd enjoy. I'd rather play and have fun while learning from trial-and-error and other players. Doing homework before I ever try one for the first time just doesn't appeal to me.
Like the gentleman above said. Search the web and you tube first. Get to know the stfs your interested in. ask questions, learn each STFs pattern and flow. the AI ships arent very intellegent so they attack at the same time every time and you can learn to develop a rhythm. While learning patterns, stick with the "easy" work ( spheres or probes ) letting the heavies take down the remaining cubes gates and generators ( it'll also alleviate anyone complaining at you because the generators came down too soon and you blew the "optional". Most importantly, look for the jobs you end up liking. I personally enjoy the insanity of probes and spheres.. They keep you moving and they keep you constantly changing from offense to defense and back again.. Loads of fun..
Speaking as a average STFer I have to admit I was bad and due to the fleet I am in I was pushed into Elites earlier than I should have been with inadequate gear. I personally never read the wikis if I didnt know what to do I would ask in game trained a little on Normal and only when I started getting the option almost all the time did I advance on Elite.
I currently do mostly ISE and just recently KASE. I am still doing CSN and have even touched HON yet.
Best thing to do is if you don't know what to do ask. I was a newbie once and I will help as much as I can if I"m in a team. I'm not a Elitist by any count and my DPS is Average but I can hold my own.
I would join a fleet and also train with them as sometimes they have better tactics that is not available in the Wiki and sometimes works even better to get the optional
NO TO ARC
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
Centurion Kares RRW Tomalak
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I've never done an STF and honestly, it'll be a while before I'm up to it. But just to be clear, I'd like to get a consensus as to what's expected of a new(ish) player trying them out.
Is it really expected for that player to go offsite to the wiki and study up on how to do it before ever trying one for the first time? And if you do your best, are very nice, but you just aren't that good the first time, will that get you blacklisted (of sorts) with other players?
Because if I'm being honest here, that criteria makes me pretty sure that I'm simply not STF material. I'm pretty sure now I won't be giving them a shot.
I'm not being snarky here. I have no beef with the community if this is what's expected for STFs. I just know that it's not something I'd enjoy. I'd rather play and have fun while learning from trial-and-error and other players. Doing homework before I ever try one for the first time just doesn't appeal to me.
dont worry. half of the players are worse than the worst, so they cant recognize someone being bad, unless they say it out load.
join a fleet, ask them for some guidance, and some tryout runs (some fleets who are dealing with new people, tend to have someone who is appointed to do that).
but if you ask politely in the PESTF channel, I dont think there will be too many ppl who will say to you to gtfo (and you can be damned sure, that their skills are pretty low, so in a week or so, with some guidance you can easily be better)
STFs are easy as hell, people just do not understand the mechanics, or do not have good builds, or just simply bad with clicking a button every once in a while.
dont worry. half of the players are worse than the worst, so they cant recognize someone being bad, unless they say it out load.
This gentleman is quite correct, but please dont confuse what these people are discussing with the 'Elite STF's ) that you get from the stf menu. If you simply click on the icon and select an STF or an elite stf to join, your going to be part of a PUG, or Pick up group.. In Pugs, no one usually knows anyone else. None have ever fought with anyone else in that team before and in general, no one has a clue.. In an Elite STF group, they tesm together regularly, know each other and each others strengths and weaknesses, which is more important in many ways than having a nice big ship that does a lot of damage. the Elite groups, and the Elite public selection really have nothing in common.. Start with a normal STF ( double chevron ) but as has been said, the people in those arent that good so dont take anything they say or do as correct till someone you know knows can verify it.. As ferdzo0 said and others, a fleet is the best ally you can have..
From someone who left eliteSTF (not kicked) because of the idiotic rules being formed on a daily basis and someone who does a lot of parsing to check strategies, builds, tweaks; I would say the average publiceliteSTF compared to eliteSTFer are pretty much the same. You get a huge number of sub 2k DPS in both rooms. There are only a handful of impressive players you meet in either.
STFs aren't difficult, they are very basic and never change, its the same thing every time. The behaviour of jumping straight to elites is something the devs could have prevented with just better game design. Why not start ripping the false confidence of people from the ultra-easy mode episodes? Make the borg default an elite enemy and get the lazy players to have to try before they finish the episodes. They also need to put some major unlocking mechanism (account wide) on elite STFs, actually elite play in general because there are just as many failures in no win scenario and ce elite.
From someone who left eliteSTF (not kicked) because of the idiotic rules being formed on a daily basis and someone who does a lot of parsing to check strategies, builds, tweaks; I would say the average publiceliteSTF compared to eliteSTFer are pretty much the same. You get a huge number of sub 2k DPS in both rooms. There are only a handful of impressive players you meet in either.
STFs aren't difficult, they are very basic and never change, its the same thing every time. The behaviour of jumping straight to elites is something the devs could have prevented with just better game design. Why not start ripping the false confidence of people from the ultra-easy mode episodes? Make the borg default an elite enemy and get the lazy players to have to try before they finish the episodes. They also need to put some major unlocking mechanism (account wide) on elite STFs, actually elite play in general because there are just as many failures in no win scenario and ce elite.
Correct,
My dps is pants 4-6k in elites however not everything in ESTF's is dps orientated for instance the guys who go to the other side of the map blow the nanogens and pull the cubes to the other gate, that is pure win.
Or the people that let rip on gates before the nanos are down then they wonder why its still 100% and theres 20 nanite spheres and 5 norm spheres mashing there face and they are still shooting gates/nanos while they being repaired.
i do pugs every saturday and 70% of the people are great, however it only needs 1 or 2 to really make it hell.
for people that say "you must research", i think thats pretty bad. People just want to play not research, join a fleet ask some fleet mates to play, find the best tactics that work for you. for instance some groups in cure dont kill the cubes until all the probes are down, some take the cubes down to 10% each and some just sweep right to left mowing everything down in there path. Last option is great if you have a carrier for kang.
All in all its up to you to work out how best to play, i know i suck, the only way to get better is to group with other people, learn new stuff, get better gear.
the best non-pro tip i can give anyone is : try and always run estfs with the same bunch of mates, mates dont mind so much if you fail, your runs will get faster and faster and the number 1: Mates/friends communicate > if you mess up and pull a cube etc tell people its not the end of the world.
This time i'll take a step back from being channel PESTF channel owner and comment as a PLAYER of a GAME
Just as another poster mentioned about parsing builds in STF's, he's right, even when I was in ESTF long before setting up PESTF I saw the same mix of high and low DPS cruisers and escorts etc.... and the same *sigh* moment when someone says of I can't do such a such a job cause I havent got the DPS... (i'm convinced its just an excuse cause they get bored minding kang)
Anyways! Fact of the matter is, you dont need crazy dps to do STF's...(i talk primarily of space) 3k and you're good to go really. anything more then that only means a quicker run...
ONCE YOU KNOW THE MISSIONS. as i mentioned before they arent rocket science once you've done a mission 3-4 times, its rinse and repeat stuff, we all know we're gunna end up doing hundreds so they become 2nd nature or at least should.
Regards PESTF, ESTF, or any STF channel in general they are a place to find groups that can do the missions.... no one ever promised we'd be setting records, but from my own experience as a player on either channel, once im grinding and getting the missions (which happens 99% of the time, i could count on 1 hand the bad games I've had) I'm happy.
there are a wide range of skill/build levels on channel, so you have to be aware of that... ALWAYS establish roles in match window before starting the game, its at this point you may "spot the noob" and decide to run with them or not. this was the same over on ESTF and is common to any grinding STF channel. if you start a game without chatting in the match window before hand... then you might as well pug... ive seen guys do it and stop them, going wooooooooah, who the F's doing what? never presum that everyone just knows we're not psychic (yet)
STF channels are about reducing the chances of a bad game (ie pugs) by being able to talk to your team to set up the plan etc before starting. Once someone doesnt do a big BOOBOO like letting a probe through or crossing a line, you're good to go...
if looking for the quickest of the quick games then yes maybe dps-5k is for you... (anyone got an invite or who do i mail btw?!) there have been channels like above before but I feel the games might not be as continuous as PESTF or ESTF( its a numbers game min 1-2k subs to have games running round the clock)
in summing up, we're a GRINDING channel, we provide quality groups to grind with, we keep things simple and have a "does what it says on the tin" attitude... and the fact that 90% of games go off without a hitch i'm happy... dont get hung on an odd bad game THEY DO HAPPEN, we're NOT an elite of the elite channel, although we do have a large number of "elite" guys, there is a mix....Neither is ESTF btw, just cause its private (going public again i hear) theres no test of your eliteness over there either before being invited. we're a place to pick up some guys to do a mission with 100 fold better chances of knowing whats going on then the Q's... that's all we're here for..
for people that say "you must research", i think thats pretty bad. People just want to play not research, join a fleet ask some fleet mates to play, find the best tactics that work for you. for instance some groups in cure dont kill the cubes until all the probes are down, some take the cubes down to 10% each and some just sweep right to left mowing everything down in there path. Last option is great if you have a carrier for kang.
t
the problem with research is the lack of experience. you need to know the basic strategies, but nothing more. there are ppl clinging to those, like its the Bible.
while the truth is, most of the knowledge comes from experience. I know loads of ppl who dont know how the stfs actually work, what comes after what, when spawns what, and so on, only know how to follow one, maybe two rules (RML is not not popular because ppl fear it, ppl just dont know, that all of it depend only on the defender)
and thats why PESTF is probably so suckie. ppl just cannot stray from the given rules, and are giving up on the slightest sign of failiure on them.
not once have I seen ppl start to cry on the chat, because one of my pets (mind you, my pets usually deal better dps, than the general crowd of PESTF) critted and killed a gen early.
and the best part, we still somehow killed the transformer, before the spheres arrived, even if one guy was just shouting in the chat, and I also was there, who was stupid enough to blow early O.o
(i'm convinced its just an excuse cause they get bored minding kang)
I used to do that now I (a sci in a sci ship - lulz) just plain say, that its boring, and easy, so if noone can take the kang, I would be a waste on it for sure
in summing up, we're a GRINDING channel, we provide quality groups to grind with, we keep things simple and have a "does what it says on the tin" attitude... and the fact that 90% of games go off without a hitch i'm happy... dont get hung on an odd bad game THEY DO HAPPEN, we're NOT an elite of the elite channel, although we do have a large number of "elite" guys, there is a mix....Neither is ESTF btw, just cause its private (going public again i hear) theres no test of your eliteness over there either before being invited. we're a place to pick up some guys to do a mission with 100 fold better chances of knowing whats going on then the Q's... that's all we're here for..
yep. in the end PESTF is popular, and is not a fail channel. it just has loads of stupid ppl, that is inevitable, and you can always put them on ignore plus there is a point, where they stop being annoying, and start to be really entertaining
I'll agree with you on that... newer guys wont know its ok to pop certain stuff early once you have dps, or RML is quite easy... with DPS, and one guy can mind probes...
like i said, the guidelines we give in the channel info are to try make games noob proof...
no stf channel is perfect... but if games go without a hitch which they do... then it works... i do games on channel different then i do with fleet mates.... you have to accept theres a range of skills and good/bad builds in game....and work with this... such is life!
that said... DO NOT COME ON CHANNEL WITHOUT KNOWING THE MISSIONS... OR HAVING AT LEAST A CLUE AS TO WHATS WHAT, READ THE CHANNEL INFO... THANKS!
otherwise you might as well pug... and defeats the purpose of using an STF channel
I'll agree with you on that... newer guys wont know its ok to pop certain stuff early once you have dps, or RML is quite easy... with DPS, and one guy can mind probes...
oh, I was trying to point out, that on PESTF not only the newer guys dont know that
personally I rly dont mind, as I have learnt to carry, so these things are more amusing, than annoying. however those, who are now learning, can be at a really bad position, as those who are not rly great, will kind of abuse them, for not being good, while those who do that, arent too good either.
still, PESTF is something, that people will realise, how good it is only, when its gone. just like the gorn jokes of DS9
still, PESTF is something, that people will realise, how good it is only, when its gone. just like the gorn jokes of DS9
its very easy for guys to get hung up on the occasional bad game or group... forgetting the fact the last 20 matches they had previous were perfect....
anyways that's me done... if PESTF aint for you, more power to you, use what ever you like
*misses gorn jokes*
and again... whos got the invites for DPS-5k? im curious... i've 6-8k engi and sci's with 10K tacs,
Seriously it keeps you on your toes, and you have to watch what your teammates are doing and you have to be ready to adjust your play accordingly.
Yea you get the groups and can cloak don constantly even after explaining it....but thats pretty rare and sometimes you melt the instances so fast pugging its like GG after 10 min and out.
Lest it has some variety.
The kang is the only one that i tend to avoid, partially because its the one i have done the lest, and its the one i do not understand as well, and its the one that if your or your teams dps is lacking your going to have a brutally hard time of it.
If your a noob run the normal ones a few times and look at the strats, run them with fleet mates, heck our fleet drags every noob to stf no matter how TRIBBLE their gear is, but they take the time to explain the stf to them so at lest they know what is going on.
probably part of the problem with the "elite" channels is every time someone has a bad pug run they in fleet or local complaining about it and then people are saying join elite channel, "elite" players in bad runs can carry the runs to a degree, average or worse players in bad runs cannot carry, then they just bounce up to elite channels where they are not geared out for it, and slow the whole show down.
public ques are there for a reason learn to use them learn to love them.
that i will have to disagree with actually, plenty of guys come on channel running RML and do speed runs on ISE to great success...
this thread is now a vent thread originally started by a troll, and the issues discussed have all centred around a minority of players on channel.
,
well, I am running a parser in all of my STF games (the only ones that I did not parse, were accidents on my part, pressing the /combatlog 0 early, or forgetting it to start while it was already in the chat window), and I can tell you, the avg in that channel, is around 4k, and I was generously including the 10-20k DPS ppl too
most of them are not stupid, or rude, but they are not outstanding, they are just not particularly good.
its very easy for guys to get hung up on the occasional bad game or group... forgetting the fact the last 20 matches they had previous were perfect....
yeah, negative effects are with you a bit longer. still, I usually run pugs, and I barely notice an improvement from PESTF (there is one tho, so it is something )
the problem is, if there is a problem, then it is something, I would not expect from a channel run, while I could accept it in pugs (and as mentioned above, I pug a lot, and I barely experience one there either)
and again... whos got the invites for DPS-5k? im curious... i've 6-8k engi and sci's with 10K tacs,
try the record runs forum topic. ppl there are from that channel, they should be able to help you out (tbh I dont know who sent my inv, Hulk just asked if I want one, I said yes, told it to the authorities, and I got an inv )
I can tell you, the avg in that channel, is around 4k, and I was generously including the 10-20k DPS ppl too
most of them are not stupid, or rude, but they are not outstanding, they are just not particularly good.
Yeah listen PESTF is for getting the optionals in reasonable time without the frustration and chaos of pugging and it delivers on that 99% of the time. 4k average is plenty for the ESTFs if people play their positions correctly. If you are looking for high-DPS metagamers in PESTF then you are doing it wrong.
Yeah listen PESTF is for getting the optionals in reasonable time without the frustration and chaos of pugging and it delivers on that 99% of the time. 4k average is plenty for the ESTFs if people play their positions correctly. If you are looking for high-DPS metagamers in PESTF then you are doing it wrong.
I dont try to argue PESTF is a bad thing. I just try to poove, that those who whine, kinda have a basis.
and as those who whine, are part of that lower DPS crowd, it is understandable, that they can get into trouble way easier. I am still glad PESTF is around, it can be entertaining in many ways
Yeah listen PESTF is for getting the optionals in reasonable time without the frustration and chaos of pugging and it delivers on that 99% of the time. 4k average is plenty for the ESTFs if people play their positions correctly. If you are looking for high-DPS metagamers in PESTF then you are doing it wrong.
Ok well that summed it up much better then my wall of text...!
try the record runs forum topic. ppl there are from that channel, they should be able to help you out (tbh I dont know who sent my inv, Hulk just asked if I want one, I said yes, told it to the authorities, and I got an inv )
any chance of a forum link? or where to find? thanks!
The first person that you should call "idiot" is yourself.....you see there is a private channel called EliteStf , that place is home of experienced Elite Stf players who play only over private Stf queues where you can get optionals with every run.
Everyone in this game was a newbie/noob at some point , public Stf is place where most of players learn about tactic and gameplay of Stf missions.
So all this whining about bad public Stf players is pointless and unnecessarily :cool:.
Wow. Public STF in NOT a place to learn. If you'd have read the channel rules you'd know that. So before you call someone an "idiot" you should have at least some expertise on the subject which you obviously do not...
Wow. Public STF in NOT a place to learn. If you'd have read the channel rules you'd know that. So before you call someone an "idiot" you should have at least some expertise on the subject which you obviously do not...
I take new people on runs all the time, including those from that channel. It does not take most people long to figure out how to run the STFs. If necessary, I buy the people some equipment to make sure they can do the runs right.
NERF CANNONS - THEY NEED A 50% NERF
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
Comments
Most of the runs I get through it go fine as well as most others have said.
Yes for me its also dps-5000, its great to have a team where all have a high dps.
Sometimes we do a ise, cse & kase all in 15 minutes, you gotta love that.
If i need other players i always 1st goto pestf, 2nd estf.
Bone1970 don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Fed Tac.
Bone Trader don't belief in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. Fed Tac.
Bone2 don't believe in a no-win senario, Kirk's protege. KDF Eng.
Warning: Not a native English-speaker, sorry if my English sucks.
but... I have a carrier, and it still fails the optional. I dont get it
bunch of elitists...
but yeah. if you want a good group, it is DPS-5k that you should turn to. if you want challenge, go to PESTF, as you will probably have to carry the team.
and for that sole reason, I prefer PESTF over DPS-5k, its a bit more challenge (god, I am starting to sound the guy, who refused to play STFs with me, because it was "too easy" for him).
plus PESTF is much more fun, to see the theories of great 3k DPS players, and how they argue, how they have better ideas, then those who have proven to be better
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
Pretty sad in the channel. Then again it is PUBLIC
Then educate them rather then belittle them. When someone doesn't know the match (that well) then take a bit of time in the queue chat to explain it to them. Now if they ask what to do AFTER the game started, yeah it complicates things. I consider myself to be a very elite STFer (got 2 toons with over 800 STFs in their belt) so I know a fair thing about the STFs and I really don't mind taking a minute to explain how things work to people. We've all had to learn sometime, no one became "pr0" after 1 match you know...
Personally, I think your talking to deaf ears. from what Ive seen in this thread, the majority of these people haven't a clue about actually "building" a team.. That one guy calling someone else TRIBBLE.. That's pretty pathetic. Guys like that in general tend to get the entire team killed time and time again, and then blame it on everyone else.. The one thing this thread has taught me though is that elite STF, doesn't even have a modicum of professionalism, let alone being elite.. Most of these guys should eat a little humble pie and go back to basics, like training new people to be part of the team, instead of calling then TRIBBLE because they don't have the cajones to admit their own deficiencies. Oh, Me?/ i'm not elite.. I dont have hundreds of dollars or months of time to waste on a single virtual ship that can only be used in one game, and i'll be honest, no matter how hard i could try, my ego simply could never be as big as some of these peoples.. Besides, last week i was only doing 798 damage, right now i'm only doing 3000 continuous. Thats not elite. Thats minimal, but it suits me fine..
But I agree, the easiest solution is to jump in elite, not knowing what to do, not sticking with your team, blowing generators and probes everywhere, and hope someone will start hand-holding you.
The channel clearly states you need to know the optional and the STF. Like it or not, it's clearly stated. There is also a link with every optional and stf, to learn how to do them.
Being rude doesn't mean being wrong.
Is it really expected for that player to go offsite to the wiki and study up on how to do it before ever trying one for the first time? And if you do your best, are very nice, but you just aren't that good the first time, will that get you blacklisted (of sorts) with other players?
Because if I'm being honest here, that criteria makes me pretty sure that I'm simply not STF material. I'm pretty sure now I won't be giving them a shot.
I'm not being snarky here. I have no beef with the community if this is what's expected for STFs. I just know that it's not something I'd enjoy. I'd rather play and have fun while learning from trial-and-error and other players. Doing homework before I ever try one for the first time just doesn't appeal to me.
I currently do mostly ISE and just recently KASE. I am still doing CSN and have even touched HON yet.
Best thing to do is if you don't know what to do ask. I was a newbie once and I will help as much as I can if I"m in a team. I'm not a Elitist by any count and my DPS is Average but I can hold my own.
I would join a fleet and also train with them as sometimes they have better tactics that is not available in the Wiki and sometimes works even better to get the optional
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
dont worry. half of the players are worse than the worst, so they cant recognize someone being bad, unless they say it out load.
join a fleet, ask them for some guidance, and some tryout runs (some fleets who are dealing with new people, tend to have someone who is appointed to do that).
but if you ask politely in the PESTF channel, I dont think there will be too many ppl who will say to you to gtfo (and you can be damned sure, that their skills are pretty low, so in a week or so, with some guidance you can easily be better)
STFs are easy as hell, people just do not understand the mechanics, or do not have good builds, or just simply bad with clicking a button every once in a while.
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
This gentleman is quite correct, but please dont confuse what these people are discussing with the 'Elite STF's ) that you get from the stf menu. If you simply click on the icon and select an STF or an elite stf to join, your going to be part of a PUG, or Pick up group.. In Pugs, no one usually knows anyone else. None have ever fought with anyone else in that team before and in general, no one has a clue.. In an Elite STF group, they tesm together regularly, know each other and each others strengths and weaknesses, which is more important in many ways than having a nice big ship that does a lot of damage. the Elite groups, and the Elite public selection really have nothing in common.. Start with a normal STF ( double chevron ) but as has been said, the people in those arent that good so dont take anything they say or do as correct till someone you know knows can verify it.. As ferdzo0 said and others, a fleet is the best ally you can have..
STFs aren't difficult, they are very basic and never change, its the same thing every time. The behaviour of jumping straight to elites is something the devs could have prevented with just better game design. Why not start ripping the false confidence of people from the ultra-easy mode episodes? Make the borg default an elite enemy and get the lazy players to have to try before they finish the episodes. They also need to put some major unlocking mechanism (account wide) on elite STFs, actually elite play in general because there are just as many failures in no win scenario and ce elite.
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Correct,
My dps is pants 4-6k in elites however not everything in ESTF's is dps orientated for instance the guys who go to the other side of the map blow the nanogens and pull the cubes to the other gate, that is pure win.
Or the people that let rip on gates before the nanos are down then they wonder why its still 100% and theres 20 nanite spheres and 5 norm spheres mashing there face and they are still shooting gates/nanos while they being repaired.
i do pugs every saturday and 70% of the people are great, however it only needs 1 or 2 to really make it hell.
for people that say "you must research", i think thats pretty bad. People just want to play not research, join a fleet ask some fleet mates to play, find the best tactics that work for you. for instance some groups in cure dont kill the cubes until all the probes are down, some take the cubes down to 10% each and some just sweep right to left mowing everything down in there path. Last option is great if you have a carrier for kang.
All in all its up to you to work out how best to play, i know i suck, the only way to get better is to group with other people, learn new stuff, get better gear.
the best non-pro tip i can give anyone is : try and always run estfs with the same bunch of mates, mates dont mind so much if you fail, your runs will get faster and faster and the number 1: Mates/friends communicate > if you mess up and pull a cube etc tell people its not the end of the world.
Regards
some sucky dude in a fleet defient
This time i'll take a step back from being channel PESTF channel owner and comment as a PLAYER of a GAME
Just as another poster mentioned about parsing builds in STF's, he's right, even when I was in ESTF long before setting up PESTF I saw the same mix of high and low DPS cruisers and escorts etc.... and the same *sigh* moment when someone says of I can't do such a such a job cause I havent got the DPS... (i'm convinced its just an excuse cause they get bored minding kang)
Anyways! Fact of the matter is, you dont need crazy dps to do STF's...(i talk primarily of space) 3k and you're good to go really. anything more then that only means a quicker run...
ONCE YOU KNOW THE MISSIONS. as i mentioned before they arent rocket science once you've done a mission 3-4 times, its rinse and repeat stuff, we all know we're gunna end up doing hundreds so they become 2nd nature or at least should.
Regards PESTF, ESTF, or any STF channel in general they are a place to find groups that can do the missions.... no one ever promised we'd be setting records, but from my own experience as a player on either channel, once im grinding and getting the missions (which happens 99% of the time, i could count on 1 hand the bad games I've had) I'm happy.
there are a wide range of skill/build levels on channel, so you have to be aware of that... ALWAYS establish roles in match window before starting the game, its at this point you may "spot the noob" and decide to run with them or not. this was the same over on ESTF and is common to any grinding STF channel. if you start a game without chatting in the match window before hand... then you might as well pug... ive seen guys do it and stop them, going wooooooooah, who the F's doing what? never presum that everyone just knows we're not psychic (yet)
STF channels are about reducing the chances of a bad game (ie pugs) by being able to talk to your team to set up the plan etc before starting. Once someone doesnt do a big BOOBOO like letting a probe through or crossing a line, you're good to go...
if looking for the quickest of the quick games then yes maybe dps-5k is for you... (anyone got an invite or who do i mail btw?!) there have been channels like above before but I feel the games might not be as continuous as PESTF or ESTF( its a numbers game min 1-2k subs to have games running round the clock)
in summing up, we're a GRINDING channel, we provide quality groups to grind with, we keep things simple and have a "does what it says on the tin" attitude... and the fact that 90% of games go off without a hitch i'm happy... dont get hung on an odd bad game THEY DO HAPPEN, we're NOT an elite of the elite channel, although we do have a large number of "elite" guys, there is a mix....Neither is ESTF btw, just cause its private (going public again i hear) theres no test of your eliteness over there either before being invited. we're a place to pick up some guys to do a mission with 100 fold better chances of knowing whats going on then the Q's... that's all we're here for..
www.elitedefensestarfleet.com
/channel_join PublicEliteSTF
PublicEliteSTF Channel Info: bit.ly/PublicEliteSTFV2
WE WANT A KDF BOP 3 PACK!!
the problem with research is the lack of experience. you need to know the basic strategies, but nothing more. there are ppl clinging to those, like its the Bible.
while the truth is, most of the knowledge comes from experience. I know loads of ppl who dont know how the stfs actually work, what comes after what, when spawns what, and so on, only know how to follow one, maybe two rules (RML is not not popular because ppl fear it, ppl just dont know, that all of it depend only on the defender)
and thats why PESTF is probably so suckie. ppl just cannot stray from the given rules, and are giving up on the slightest sign of failiure on them.
not once have I seen ppl start to cry on the chat, because one of my pets (mind you, my pets usually deal better dps, than the general crowd of PESTF) critted and killed a gen early.
and the best part, we still somehow killed the transformer, before the spheres arrived, even if one guy was just shouting in the chat, and I also was there, who was stupid enough to blow early O.o
edit:
I used to do that
yep. in the end PESTF is popular, and is not a fail channel. it just has loads of stupid ppl, that is inevitable, and you can always put them on ignore
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
like i said, the guidelines we give in the channel info are to try make games noob proof...
no stf channel is perfect... but if games go without a hitch which they do... then it works... i do games on channel different then i do with fleet mates.... you have to accept theres a range of skills and good/bad builds in game....and work with this... such is life!
that said... DO NOT COME ON CHANNEL WITHOUT KNOWING THE MISSIONS... OR HAVING AT LEAST A CLUE AS TO WHATS WHAT, READ THE CHANNEL INFO... THANKS!
otherwise you might as well pug... and defeats the purpose of using an STF channel
www.elitedefensestarfleet.com
/channel_join PublicEliteSTF
PublicEliteSTF Channel Info: bit.ly/PublicEliteSTFV2
WE WANT A KDF BOP 3 PACK!!
oh, I was trying to point out, that on PESTF not only the newer guys dont know that
personally I rly dont mind, as I have learnt to carry, so these things are more amusing, than annoying. however those, who are now learning, can be at a really bad position, as those who are not rly great, will kind of abuse them, for not being good, while those who do that, arent too good either.
still, PESTF is something, that people will realise, how good it is only, when its gone. just like the gorn jokes of DS9
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
that i will have to disagree with actually, plenty of guys come on channel running RML and do speed runs on ISE to great success...
this thread is now a vent thread originally started by a troll, and the issues discussed have all centred around a minority of players on channel.
as you say yourself (although PESTF aint going anywhere)
its very easy for guys to get hung up on the occasional bad game or group... forgetting the fact the last 20 matches they had previous were perfect....
anyways that's me done... if PESTF aint for you, more power to you, use what ever you like
*misses gorn jokes*
and again... whos got the invites for DPS-5k? im curious... i've 6-8k engi and sci's with 10K tacs,
www.elitedefensestarfleet.com
/channel_join PublicEliteSTF
PublicEliteSTF Channel Info: bit.ly/PublicEliteSTFV2
WE WANT A KDF BOP 3 PACK!!
Seriously it keeps you on your toes, and you have to watch what your teammates are doing and you have to be ready to adjust your play accordingly.
Yea you get the groups and can cloak don constantly even after explaining it....but thats pretty rare and sometimes you melt the instances so fast pugging its like GG after 10 min and out.
Lest it has some variety.
The kang is the only one that i tend to avoid, partially because its the one i have done the lest, and its the one i do not understand as well, and its the one that if your or your teams dps is lacking your going to have a brutally hard time of it.
If your a noob run the normal ones a few times and look at the strats, run them with fleet mates, heck our fleet drags every noob to stf no matter how TRIBBLE their gear is, but they take the time to explain the stf to them so at lest they know what is going on.
probably part of the problem with the "elite" channels is every time someone has a bad pug run they in fleet or local complaining about it and then people are saying join elite channel, "elite" players in bad runs can carry the runs to a degree, average or worse players in bad runs cannot carry, then they just bounce up to elite channels where they are not geared out for it, and slow the whole show down.
public ques are there for a reason learn to use them learn to love them.
well, I am running a parser in all of my STF games (the only ones that I did not parse, were accidents on my part, pressing the /combatlog 0 early, or forgetting it to start while it was already in the chat window), and I can tell you, the avg in that channel, is around 4k, and I was generously including the 10-20k DPS ppl too
most of them are not stupid, or rude, but they are not outstanding, they are just not particularly good.
yeah, negative effects are with you a bit longer. still, I usually run pugs, and I barely notice an improvement from PESTF (there is one tho, so it is something
the problem is, if there is a problem, then it is something, I would not expect from a channel run, while I could accept it in pugs (and as mentioned above, I pug a lot, and I barely experience one there either)
try the record runs forum topic. ppl there are from that channel, they should be able to help you out (tbh I dont know who sent my inv, Hulk just asked if I want one, I said yes, told it to the authorities, and I got an inv
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
I dont try to argue PESTF is a bad thing. I just try to poove, that those who whine, kinda have a basis.
and as those who whine, are part of that lower DPS crowd, it is understandable, that they can get into trouble way easier. I am still glad PESTF is around, it can be entertaining in many ways
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
Ok well that summed it up much better then my wall of text...!
any chance of a forum link? or where to find? thanks!
www.elitedefensestarfleet.com
/channel_join PublicEliteSTF
PublicEliteSTF Channel Info: bit.ly/PublicEliteSTFV2
WE WANT A KDF BOP 3 PACK!!
There you go
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
thanking you good sir!/madame/it!
www.elitedefensestarfleet.com
/channel_join PublicEliteSTF
PublicEliteSTF Channel Info: bit.ly/PublicEliteSTFV2
WE WANT A KDF BOP 3 PACK!!
I prefer 'they' or 'them'.
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
Wow. Public STF in NOT a place to learn. If you'd have read the channel rules you'd know that. So before you call someone an "idiot" you should have at least some expertise on the subject which you obviously do not...
I take new people on runs all the time, including those from that channel. It does not take most people long to figure out how to run the STFs. If necessary, I buy the people some equipment to make sure they can do the runs right.
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF