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Why would a real Romulan side with the Federation?
dogmaticus
Member Posts: 82 Arc User
I was thinking while making choice about the allegiance that there is no reason why a true Romulan would want side with the Feds.
I love Federation side, but as a Romulan I can't see myself joining them.
So my question is - how do you, lore-wise, justify joining Federation?
I love Federation side, but as a Romulan I can't see myself joining them.
So my question is - how do you, lore-wise, justify joining Federation?
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Because the Klingons stole their tech and spent the better part of a century trying to kill them.
All you really want is peace, so you join the Federation hoping that you can explore a new homeworld for yourself and settle there with peace and harmony and all it costs you is some Romulan marks and a cloaking device here and there.
Just a thought, though to be honest I find the Fed/Rom alliance far more tenuous a link than the KDF one too.
^^^ THIS. Reunification is the lore core needed to justify allying oneself with the Federation, and the Vulcans.
Not that the Federation is innocent and pure, but at least they're typically easier to 'read' than the Klingon Empire.
That actually convinced me the most. Honestly - I want to side with the Federation, but at the same time need to find the way to feel good about myself doing that
In Nemesis I did not get the feeling of reunification - it was much stronger present in TNG as Spocks "undercover" work within the Empire was depicted.
At the same time - as much as the TOS era decent Romulans might've hated the Klingons ("Rihannsu"), historically speaking they seemed like a natural ally.
But to join the Federation as a more predictable side, and one easier to manipulate in Romulan Republics' favor - that makes sense to me. I found my purpose
Most of the romulans we see work for the military or tal shiar and tend to fall into the sterotypical, sneaky, untrusting bad guy role that probably would not want to help starfleet.
The majority of the romulan people however are no different to humans. they are just people trying to go about their daily lives but are being kept under the thumb by a paranoid and oppressive government. they are expected to hate the federation but i doubt any of them have much reason to hate them except for being told it. Now they are out from under the thumb they can start to think for themselves. if starfleet is providing aid and friendship then why not trust them.
we have also seen some romulans working with starfleet on more than one occasion, even if they are not best friends, so its not uncommon.
you dont have to love someone to be their ally. in certain circumstances, even through our own history, you dont even have to like an ally so long as you get something out of it.
IMO there is still more justification for RR players joining the Federation over the KDF, their leader is a reunificationist after all.
That... did not turn out well. So your options are either to join with the Tal Shiar, and be a Bad Guy; or find allies to help bring the remaining independent Romulans together, and keep them alive long enough to form a self-sustaining society.
In Star Trek, that basically means the Federation or the KDF. You have to swallow your pride and ask for an alliance... not "help," because you're not that desperate. Just a mutual agreement to share technology and open borders, in exchange for supplies and additional defense.
The only real other option, running off on your own to be a privateer/pirate/hermit isn't very heroic. Wouldn't fit well with the "epic" style of storytelling they're going for in STO.
Edit: Oh yeah, forgot about the Reunification movement. That's a pretty big part of it as well, especially with D'tan in charge.
Keep calm, and continue firing photon torpedoes.
Obviously I used words "real" and "true" to put slightly xenophobic tone into my post, which would be very Romulan, at least from a human perspective.
Romulans are isolationists. In a way that lead to a creation of Tal Shiar, and to their growing power. They can be also seen as xenophobes, but in their own eyes, they simply never had reason to trust the "outside" world. They were persecuted on Vulcan, and they found true freedom by establishing their own civilization, away from other species.
I think that if you read "Rihannsu", which in my eyes is the best source for information about Romulans (even if mr. Roddenberry didn't agree with the depiction there...), you will see that cultural Romulans are not like humans (again - at least not the TOS and later eras humans), even though on personal level they might be similar.
The insults the romulans throw at the Klingons in the shows are pretty harsh:
During a meeting between high ranking members of the Federation Alliance in 2374, Romulan Senator Letant made a derogatory remark against Martok, telling an aide:
"Klingons can be quite entertaining, don't you agree? Every Romulan zoo should have a pair!" (DS9: "Tears of the Prophets")
Romulans allied with the Cardassian True Way of coruse.
The simple truth is that Roms are whatever any given writer wanted them to be. They could be sneaky, they could be honorable, they could be loyal, they could be conquerors, they could be allies.
They've always done what they needed to do to survive. Whether that's giving Klingons cloaks or giving the Defiant a cloak. I don't see them as being any different in STO.
Back in the day, there was a musician who went by "Sting" who wrote a little song about Russians loving their children too. At the time, it was still the tail end of the 'cold war' and it referred to what was once a fairly stereotypical American outlook of Russians as 'freedom-hating communists' and so forth. The message was that, look behind the politicians and the military men and all the wealthy/powerful types whose main interest was simply keeping that power, and you'll find the common citizen is simply a person, not so different than you or I.
So no, I don't believe that the entire population of Romulan people are all scheming, conniving backstabbers or that every one of them hates the idea of contact with other races. It's just not practical. In any pool of individuals that large, with them being capable of free will and rational thought, as well as emotions, there will be many different outlooks, ideas and ideals. They're simply not going to be one homogenous bunch of clones. Diversity of thought and belief is not a function of being human, it's a function of being sentient. IDIC is not solely for Vulcans (which, by the way, Romulans are a branch of.)
On the lore front, there is the reunification aspect. Not everyone will want it, true. But -some- people do. Maybe your captain is one of those. Maybe not. That's for you to decide, but it's definitely a factor to look at when considering the Federation as an ally.
Also, there's the little fact that very recently (like, within the last couple years, I think) Jm'pok's Klingons have been actively waging a war of conquest to take systems from the Romulans. This is in the game. To me, that's kind of a big deal. I have two options, one has just recently been killing my people for conquest, the other has only ever fought in defense and is generally peace-first -- who would I choose to ally with? I wouldn't be so fast to forget war if I were a Romulan trying to recover from all this devastation, myself.
Lastly, though Sugihara (sp?) is written as a doofus in the mission, the closing dialog you get on the mission when you make your choice makes it fairly clear what you can expect from either side. The KDF offer military aid to fight those honorless Tal'shiar. Not a lot more. The Feds say they will help defend you from the Tal'shiar and offer aid for rebuilding/reconstruction. So while the KDF may go more all-out to exterminate the Tal'shiar, the Feds are offering defense, and going to be there with 'humanitarian' aid as well, it would seem. So it depends on how your character thinks, but each has a slightly different offer in what they're bringing to the table.
In the past, the RSE has worked with both the Klingons and Starfleet (I was about to say "the Federation", but the Feds as a whole don't seem to want to have a lot to do with the RSE).
When they've worked with Klingons, the alliances seem to have been more a case of "take our broken-down second-hand ships, give us your cloaking tech, and don't expect any further help." And going the other way, well, the attack on Khitomer and the attempted interference in the succession of Chancellors didn't help matters any. Sure, you can work with them because they're powerful - but they're notoriously fickle, too.
The Feds at least have a reputation for being almost naively altruistic, and tend not to go back on their word once its given (okay, sometimes they're unreliable, but most of the time they stick to what they say). And honestly, what the new Republic needs more than military might is material assistance - sure, the military help comes in handy from time to time, but that's not filling Romulan bellies, is it?
That's like saying all Americans are gun-toting maniacs. Only some of them are.
All the official depictions of the Romulans we've had have been military/ diplomatic. And all of them have been just "Bad Vulcans"
Until Enterprise and then the Vulcans themselves played the role.
But if you stop to talk to any Romulan civilians during The Romulan Mystery and New Romulus, you'll see a variety of personalities come through. That's what I like about (...what I've been able to gather about...) the direction Cyptic has taken in LoR (...since WINE refuses to play nice) . The Romulans are no longer Planet of Hats.
I'm hoping the new KDF missions also expand the depiction of the citizens of the Empire beyond, "Derp! We likes fightins! We duz!" The most they had was a farmer or two.
Yes Romulans and Klingon's have worked together in the past but it has never worked out well for long and fact After your home was destroyed your people scattered and broken the Feds sent ships to support and provide relief, while the Klingon's decided to invade what little space you had left.
Despite the constant trouble between the feds and the Romulan people they were there with help and support while the Klingon's were there with a dagger and a blaster.
"It appears we have lost our sex appeal, captain."- Tuvok
Keep calm, and continue firing photon torpedoes.
Personally I think this is a veiled attempt to have more new Romulans join the KDF - I think anyone who is attempting to do that should put forth what the faction as a whole has to offer, rather that a "lore" excuse - which does not hold up to scrutiny as most posters have shown.
Before LoR I player about 40% Fed and 60% KDF - but for my 2 new Romulans they both went Fed - why -
1)My Fed fleet is farther along allowing me access to high level gear(there are very few KDF fleets much past T3
2)The KDF Q's are absolutley horrendous - wait times are really bad - they have gotten better as a lot of KDF players are here trying the new content but how long will that last?
Personally I think that Cryptic should make almost all Q's cross faction - and make a PvP Q which take both sides and mix and matches them - you could get 2 KDF 3 Fed - vs 3KDF 2 Fed- would make for very interesting matchs.
But until that happens Fed side is best for many things.
I think you are mixing up stereotypes with culture. Romulan culture has always been as 'bad guys'. They commit infanticide, genocide, slavery. They are on whole xenophobic and militaristic. Trechery is a socially accepted fact. Reputation is more important than honor. etc.
You get Klingon or Starfleet backup in some quests, or get to use their intelligence networks to accomplish missions/pay off debts of honor (though Klingon side, at least, they left some of the bridge officer dialogue very Klingon, while others reflect you're a Romulan using Klingon stuff). You're pretty much choosing which side you want to work more closely with, but you're not making a big, Republic-changing decision, because regardless of your choice, the Republic gets Starfleet humanitarian aid and defense and KDF assistance in attacking Tal Shiar operatives.
It's why, at the end of Devil's Choice, both Starfleet and the KDF send 'hero ships' to help defend New Romulus. You, as an individual commander (since Romulans don't seem to have 'captains'...), might have chosen to align yourself with one or the other, but both sides are involved with the Republic as a whole. Though I would've liked seeing your liaison's ship join the fight alongside the other 'hero ships'... might've let them avoid the repair cycle a bit longer before I managed to down the dreadnaughts.
And DS9 didn't do the Klingons any favors by making them low rent samurai.
Later, the Feds sent help to colonies.
What did the Klingons ? They attacked Romulan colonies to take them back. They took this opportunity to wage war against the remnant of the Empire. Talk about honor....
Just like Donatra did before, the Fed can be trusted to some extent. The KDF on the other hand are not.
WW2
Major Power Allies: England, France, Russia, US
Quasi Axis Power: Finland (Due to the 'winter war')
Go back a little further and see some really strange stuff. Or simply look at the cold war and all the little alliances and nations divided and created.
Just dont tell them it was a fake or that'll change quick.
Officially Nerfed In Early 2410
As for reasons to go Fed then i guess it is just reunification.
Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
You are not the Roluman Star Empire. You haven away from it to stand on your own. But your people need help from the Federation and the KDF. If you want "Romulan" reasoning to ally with the Federation, how about this?
You are just "using" the Federation an an means to your end of a new, independent home world. You need the help of the Federation and the KDF. So you play nice with the Federation staying on their good side. All the while, playing the Federation off against the KDF, to help earn their help as well.
Romulan manipulation at it's finest.