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So exactly why are the Romulans' alien gen being locked to hybrid and paygated again?

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  • daemonhelddaemonheld Member Posts: 288 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    Since this is our first, building a big Free Expansion is a bit of an unknown return on investment at this point, and yes they are extremely expensive to build. We have faith that if we build to a higher bar, even though it is free, it will pay off in a better game in the end. We are growing and learning and surviving in a very challenging time for the PC gaming market.

    I am one of the lucky people that have created Roms on Tribble, and I really have to ask... with the AMAZING work that you all have done on the faction (that I've seen so far).. The environments seem hugely improved graphically. From the starter planet, to the ship interiors... The Ally mission where you are on Qo'noS.. just.. everything. BEAUTIFUL.

    So, are the FEDS and KDF going to benefit at all from the things learned when creating the Rom faction? Specifically, ship interiors and mission maps?

    Pleasepleasepleaseplease.... Oh pleasepleaseplease...

    Jolan'tru
  • dalolorndalolorn Member Posts: 3,655 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    ...A limited form of custom Alien will be available at launch as a perk to anyone who is a Lifetime member or past/current subscriber....

    ...If you would like to make a custom Romulan alien, you have a few options. You can either sub for a month...

    Okay, question: If I, having used a game time code shortly before S6 released, wanted to create this 'alien', would I have to subscribe again?

    Sure, I'm probably not going to be getting it and focus on regular Romulans, but I'm curious.

    Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.p3OEBPD6HU3QI.jpg
  • thehavrahathehavraha Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    I'll reiterate once again.

    A limited form of custom Alien will be available at launch as a perk to anyone who is a Lifetime member or past/current subscriber.

    We may unrestrict this further down the road, but at launch it is restricted.

    Even then, custom aliens are intended to be more in line with "hybrids" than "make something completely non-Romulan looking".

    If you would like to make a custom Romulan alien, you have a few options. You can either sub for a month or you can wait and see if it eventually unlocks for non-subscribing members at a later date.

    You also have the option to not buy any of the other premium items we are putting into the Romulan faction, but we appreciate it when you do.

    I appreciate this response Dan, but despite the fact that you have reiterated the intent of the Romulan alien gen to "be more in line with hybrids", I haven't been presented with a reason as to why that holds up under scrutiny. I have presented several arguments as to why the reasons presented so far don't really hold up. Will you try?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] I am a Cheestah.
    Check out my Foundry missions
    Fed: "To Helna and Back", "Rema Donna", "Animations with Helna", "Mudd's Weapons", "Waiting for Wednesday", "Monolith"
    KDF: "Time the Enemy", "Time the Ally", "Time the Traitor"
  • thehavrahathehavraha Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    daveyny wrote: »
    As I said...

    I have no problem with You, pounding your head against this particular brick wall...

    Just don't expect too much in the long run.

    And why do you expect US to agree with you?

    You're fighting an up-hill battle, one that takes it's place, in a long line of decisions that Cryptic has made, and will probably NOT Reverse.

    There's always going to be something that They do that annoys/pizzes-off somebody...

    In this particular case, I don't believe this is a battle worth going ten rounds for.

    YMMV
    <shrug>

    I'll go 10 rounds in every argument if I think I'm right.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] I am a Cheestah.
    Check out my Foundry missions
    Fed: "To Helna and Back", "Rema Donna", "Animations with Helna", "Mudd's Weapons", "Waiting for Wednesday", "Monolith"
    KDF: "Time the Enemy", "Time the Ally", "Time the Traitor"
  • thehavrahathehavraha Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    abaddon653 wrote: »
    So back near the beginning of this topic, you know before it degenerated into an "I can argue better then you" topic, people where going on about how the Romulan Republic is more open and welcoming of aliens then the Empire. Yes this is true, they have managed to work through most of the xenophobia their former leaders and spin doctors pumped out to the Romulan citizens and I was pleased that I was not calling every alien I bumped into an insulting name or showing veiled contempt.

    The problem I am seeing here is that most of you are looking at this from the Republics point of view, but there is a problem with that. Since the Sundering nearly two thousand years previous, the Romulan leadership have earned their people a terrible reputation as backstabbers and liers.

    So despite the Republic having evolved out of their xenophobia the populations of the rest of the quadrant at the very least distrust the Romulan people if not outright hating them. So what it boils down to is not the Romulans xenophobia but everyone elses Romuphobia. Would you join a group who had a reputation for jabbing sharp objects in your back?

    Now I feel the same as some of you, the alien block is just....off and needs to be rethought. But from a story and canon point of view the current system makes sense.

    This is one of the better arguments I've heard, but I think it falters a bit when it runs into the fact that most of the people you're fighting for are just friends from your new home.

    It's not unheard of for an outsider to be welcomed with open arms by simple townsfolk, and I would see a similar story working - an alien who wanted to live a simple farming life on a Romulan colony, for whatever reason ... political asylum, expulsion from his previous society, crashed ship ... whatever your plot, finds his friends being kidnapped and his home destroyed on this Romulan colony world, and realizes it's happening across the sector, and the only way to protect them and save himself is to fight under the banner of the Romulan Republic.

    Sure, the Romulophobia may be a think, but that's dealt with during the events of the game's story. So I don't think it's that large of a hurdle to prevent full alien gen from being locked off.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] I am a Cheestah.
    Check out my Foundry missions
    Fed: "To Helna and Back", "Rema Donna", "Animations with Helna", "Mudd's Weapons", "Waiting for Wednesday", "Monolith"
    KDF: "Time the Enemy", "Time the Ally", "Time the Traitor"
  • zeuxidemus001zeuxidemus001 Member Posts: 3,357 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    All signs point to full speed ahead. We are already looking to the future and share in the excitement that if Legacy of Romulus works, we can move on to other factions and other locations. We would love to see end-game expand into the Delta Quadrant. So much galaxy out there!

    Yeah I just wish I could turn my fake romulan alien on kdf side into a real romulan I'd just rather not lose all the tier 5 doffing stuff its achieved or else I would just delete it and start over with that one.
  • tobar26thtobar26th Member Posts: 799 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    The host of the first and only podcast devoted entirely to the Foundry and Star Trek Online is never wrong ;)


    Except when he is




    This is a sponsored post :P It may or may not be my actual view ;)
  • gespensterjaegergespensterjaeger Member Posts: 157 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    Since this is our first, building a big Free Expansion is a bit of an unknown return on investment at this point, and yes they are extremely expensive to build. We have faith that if we build to a higher bar, even though it is free, it will pay off in a better game in the end. We are growing and learning and surviving in a very challenging time for the PC gaming market.

    if this is true dstahl why did you do the horrible move on the dreadnaught locking it to 2000 usd worth in keys for the frigate hangar bays ?
    is money that much of a problem for cryptic or arent we supporting the game enough ?
    you do know there is sites selling the attack ships for money in real world just cause of this?

    anyways i hope the expansion goes well i like the game i really do sometimes.
    but things like these are horrible for players.
    please let it be the last time you employ the mentality of paying for a ship but only get 50% of the aktual ship. and locking the rest down.
    800 lobi crystals man 800 and you only get 50%

    the reclusive is 800 but you get 100% of the ship includeing acess to frigates.

    anyways expansion i hope it goes the right way and its the last of the bad mentality.
    i will support the new legacy of romulys with the 125 euro for the legacy pack.

    but iam praying you change ur ways regarding such locking of ships.

    i may sound very negative but i want the game to succeed but at the same time i need to stand tall on my moral values on whats wrong.

    thats why i vocalize myself and hope you hear it.
    If only they fix Cloaking bugg :( *new message BOOM decloacked.
  • walshicuswalshicus Member Posts: 1,314 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    thehavraha wrote: »
    REMOVING a features "free" quality, LIMITING its options, and calling it a perk is one hell of a twisted idea of a "reward". We enable Cryptic to further squeeze us for money by pay-gated previously free features when making excuses as to why harming our options, freedom of choice, and wallet is not "that much to ask for."

    You've never had access to Romulan faction "Alien Gen" characters. Nothing has been removed.
    http://mmo-economics.com - analysing the economic interactions in MMOs.
  • thlaylierahthlaylierah Member Posts: 2,987 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Any way you want to slice it, it's not a smart idea to limit something in this sandbox game due to "immersion."

    That boat left the dock long ago unless it's more a dev prejudice?

    I don't mind it being pay gated, but want to be able to make my specially created Alien Race for the Romulan side as well as Fed and Klingon.
  • mikeflmikefl Member Posts: 861 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    tobar26th wrote: »
    The host of the first and only podcast devoted entirely to the Foundry and Star Trek Online is never wrong ;)


    Except when he is




    This is a sponsored post :P It may or may not be my actual view ;)

    I don't listen to these podcasts anymore for this reason. I want to hear the guest and not the host and more questions and less arguing. It's the same in his forum posts. Always a one sided debate with an agenda and nothing much comes of it but wasted time. Good for attention drama but that's it.
    Gold Sub since March 2010
    Lifetime Sub since June 2010
  • zerobangzerobang Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    I'll reiterate once again.

    A limited form of custom Alien will be available at launch as a perk to anyone who is a Lifetime member or past/current subscriber.

    So what you are saying is NO Homer Simpson Romulans and NO Avatar-Navi Romulans?

    GOOD!

    As long as i get my more custom Traits, and a few more hair options etc. i'm happy anyway.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • thehavrahathehavraha Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Any way you want to slice it, it's not a smart idea to limit something in this sandbox game due to "immersion."

    That boat left the dock long ago unless it's more a dev prejudice?

    I don't mind it being pay gated, but want to be able to make my specially created Alien Race for the Romulan side as well as Fed and Klingon.

    Agreed, this is my point exactly.

    It looks like, from Dan's response, this has less to do with money (which was one of my original theories), and more to do with that prejudice. SOMEONE at Cryptic doesn't like aliens and wants to limit them, but instead of actually going after the Fed and KDF aliens, they're going after the Romulans to "restrict them", and probably all future faction aliens too.

    This opens up a bevy of hypocrisies. For instance, NO ONE is concerned about breaking someone's immersion in SPACE, where you can fly a low level fleet ship against any other Level 50 character (as its recently been hinted on Priority One by Dan that we may very well see that Tier 5 Connie) , but because SOMEONE might make a wacky alien that breaks you immersion on ground, we have to restrict all the freedoms of the character creator!

    What effect will this have on the Foundry, and the ability to make aliens for the Romulan faction in our original stories that may NEED them? All of this is a dangerous precedent that MUST be avoided.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] I am a Cheestah.
    Check out my Foundry missions
    Fed: "To Helna and Back", "Rema Donna", "Animations with Helna", "Mudd's Weapons", "Waiting for Wednesday", "Monolith"
    KDF: "Time the Enemy", "Time the Ally", "Time the Traitor"
  • thehavrahathehavraha Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    zerobang wrote: »
    So what you are saying is NO Homer Simpson Romulans and NO Avatar-Navi Romulans?

    GOOD!

    As long as i get my more custom Traits, and a few more hair options etc. i'm happy anyway.

    Your distaste for Homer Simpson and Na'vi effects MY ability to make my original Romulan-space alien, or perhaps even original aliens in Foundry stories.

    Why don't you have a problem flying low level ships at Tier 5? Isn't that immersion breaking? You shouldn't be able to restrict my creativity because you don't like what someone else is making for their own personal character experience.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] I am a Cheestah.
    Check out my Foundry missions
    Fed: "To Helna and Back", "Rema Donna", "Animations with Helna", "Mudd's Weapons", "Waiting for Wednesday", "Monolith"
    KDF: "Time the Enemy", "Time the Ally", "Time the Traitor"
  • lordfuzunlordfuzun Member Posts: 54 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    daemonheld wrote: »
    Was giving a "tour" of my Rommie ship to a fleetmate on Tribble today and noticed how improved the setting was. Halls and rooms are all "normal size" other than the Singularity Core engine room, which is jaw-droppingly gorgeous...

    There were several times where it was said by one, the other, or both... that the Feds and the KDF are *really* going to need updating.

    Jolan'tru

    That's the funny thing about MMORPGs. The old stuff is what it it. The latest stuff always build upon and improves from that they did before. And most of the time, they don't have to resources to revisit all of the old stuff to spruce it up.
  • zorena#3961 zorena Member Posts: 254 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    zerobang wrote: »
    So what you are saying is NO Homer Simpson Romulans and NO Avatar-Navi Romulans?

    GOOD!

    As long as i get my more custom Traits, and a few more hair options etc. i'm happy anyway.

    Im a former subscriber, I make navi!
    Noone.
  • catoblepasbetacatoblepasbeta Member Posts: 1,532 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Considering the already extremely limited species options the Romulan Republic has, making the Hybrids microtransaction-bound is pretty bizarre. I can understand restricting some of the alien option to cut down on the plethora of ridiculous looking aliens, but making them paygated is pretty irritating. I don't buy the answer i have heard before about the reason being 'xenophobia'. We can already play as Remans and get Reman officers without paying a single red cent, and the storyline shows absolutely no prejudice by the RR against Remans, who were about as socially hated as possible within Romulan Culture as possible. It makes no sense for the RR to single out hybrids for prejudice if they already accept Remans with open arms.
  • purplegamerpurplegamer Member Posts: 1,015 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    Since this is our first, building a big Free Expansion is a bit of an unknown return on investment at this point, and yes they are extremely expensive to build. We have faith that if we build to a higher bar, even though it is free, it will pay off in a better game in the end. We are growing and learning and surviving in a very challenging time for the PC gaming market.

    This is the kind of response that inspires confidence in the team. I think you're absolutely right that quality breeds player loyalty--even if it takes time and some heartache.

    You guys nailed it with LoR.
  • ussultimatumussultimatum Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    dastahl wrote: »
    I'll reiterate once again.

    A limited form of custom Alien will be available at launch as a perk to anyone who is a Lifetime member or past/current subscriber.

    We may unrestrict this further down the road, but at launch it is restricted.

    Even then, custom aliens are intended to be more in line with "hybrids" than "make something completely non-Romulan looking".

    If you would like to make a custom Romulan alien, you have a few options. You can either sub for a month or you can wait and see if it eventually unlocks for non-subscribing members at a later date.

    You also have the option to not buy any of the other premium items we are putting into the Romulan faction, but we appreciate it when you do.


    I think it's a good call.

    It should have been done with the KDF when they launched as well.


    I completely disagree with the OP on this issue.


    Nothing is being taken away from anyone.


    Silver players can still make Aliens through Fed OR KDF alien gen, and the new trait system makes all races much more flexible.


    There is no option they have now, that is being taken away and they are gaining new options with all of the new content, ships and romulan characters that they can make and play for free.


    The OP is wrong, nothing is being taken away from them because there is no Romulan faction now that has alien-gen available to anyone.

    New feature, new faction, new expansion.

    Rom focused content, romulan storyline, Romulan colonist survivor works better with the theme than the sideshow of freaks you see running around ESD.


    This is one of the best decisions about the New Rom expansion so far imo, and also adds a teeny, tiny, itty, bitty little perk to subs/golds.
  • ghlaghgheeghlaghghee Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    thehavraha wrote: »
    These Romulans are CLEARLY not the xenophobic Romulans of the Tal Shiar as they try to help even the Remans and Klingons. So that excuse cannot be used.

    Facts not in evidence, besides...
    thehavraha wrote: »
    Some developers have told me that the Romulan faction story is very Romulan specific. I have played very deeply into the Romulan faction and yes, although it is specific to the Romulan faction and the creation of New Romulus, it is NOT about you being a Romulan.

    An argument can be made that the large role played by the destruction of Romulus does argue for a Romulan protagonist. Besides, at some point you pose as a Tal Shiar operative, which would seem substantially more reasonable for an actual Romulan. Also, people call you "greenblood" a fair amount.

    Ultimately, Romulans aren't a real faction. I can't imagine why you'd want to put a non-Rom through the Rom campaign (comedy value?) But if you do, you pay less than I did to get my Carrier-Akira.

    Otherwise, since you're really playing KDF or Fed, just roll that.
  • nadiezjanadiezja Member Posts: 629 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    The race that is almost certain to be most popular - the Romulans - are free.

    The race that's almost certain to be second most popular - the Remans - are unlockable in-game.

    They want to charge for Alien? That's startlingly generous of them. If I were a money-grubbing evil capitalist, I'd be giving out generic aliens for free and charging for Romulans.
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