test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
B'Rel torpedo boat help please
captainretset
Member Posts: 92 Arc User
Finally, all the reading about torpedo boats got the better of me and 2000 Zen were splurged! As an escort/bug player who mainly binds the lot to his space bar, it was a shock trying to get firing orders and buffs co-ordinated etc!
I tried to set it up myself, using all the info on here that I could find. It wasn't very good so, in the end, I shamelessly plagiarised everything could from cmdrskyfaller - thanks for sharing all that info!
I have earnt many thousands of DL in empire defense whilst testing/practising.
I have gone for Breen cluster, Romulan Hyper, Tricobalt and Hargh'Peng on the front and plasma mines on the rear. 2 X tax boffs. 2 X sci boffs who have SS1 and VM1 as main powers. My questions are:
1) The other rear weapon? I have some good Mk XII quantum mines, a second Breen cluster or the Omega torp. None are ready to fire after I get overhead, which doesn't seem ideal.
2) Consoles. I am not sure what are best to use. I am an F2P player who only recently re-specced my KDF character for the bug ship. It is a build that shoves everything into weapons, torpedoes, shields, hull and power. There is nothing in stealth, de-compiler etc. I do not wish to spend 500 Zen on another re-spec. Also, I will be badly specced for my Bug and other ships if I do so. With this in mind, I went for
2 X Neutronium
Assim module - mainly for the crits
Zero point module - for crits and plasma damage
2 x Stealth modules, Mk XII rare
3 X ambiplasma envelope Mk XII rare
This along with 2 piece KHG and a Tachyon Deflector Array Mk XII [PrtG] [CMS] [Ins].
You can see I am trying to make up for what is missing in my skill tree by consoles alone. Am I doing the right thing here or am I doomed?
3) I want to do my attack runs as cmdrskyfaller suggests; fire front torps in order I have listed them, dispersal III and plasma mines at 1km etc. However, I get so involved firing correctly that I am not looking at what is going on. I tried to use my programmable keyboard but it makes mistakes and slows up the sequence. I now just spam my torpedo fire button but, of course, the fastest often go first. How can I do something decent using the integral keybind function? I am familiar with how to keybind, BTW.
My goal is to use it in PVP. I am a new PVPer and realise that I am staring at a big hill whilst wondering if my legs are up to it ... I'm not much good even in the bug, lol.
I tried to set it up myself, using all the info on here that I could find. It wasn't very good so, in the end, I shamelessly plagiarised everything could from cmdrskyfaller - thanks for sharing all that info!
I have earnt many thousands of DL in empire defense whilst testing/practising.
I have gone for Breen cluster, Romulan Hyper, Tricobalt and Hargh'Peng on the front and plasma mines on the rear. 2 X tax boffs. 2 X sci boffs who have SS1 and VM1 as main powers. My questions are:
1) The other rear weapon? I have some good Mk XII quantum mines, a second Breen cluster or the Omega torp. None are ready to fire after I get overhead, which doesn't seem ideal.
2) Consoles. I am not sure what are best to use. I am an F2P player who only recently re-specced my KDF character for the bug ship. It is a build that shoves everything into weapons, torpedoes, shields, hull and power. There is nothing in stealth, de-compiler etc. I do not wish to spend 500 Zen on another re-spec. Also, I will be badly specced for my Bug and other ships if I do so. With this in mind, I went for
2 X Neutronium
Assim module - mainly for the crits
Zero point module - for crits and plasma damage
2 x Stealth modules, Mk XII rare
3 X ambiplasma envelope Mk XII rare
This along with 2 piece KHG and a Tachyon Deflector Array Mk XII [PrtG] [CMS] [Ins].
You can see I am trying to make up for what is missing in my skill tree by consoles alone. Am I doing the right thing here or am I doomed?
3) I want to do my attack runs as cmdrskyfaller suggests; fire front torps in order I have listed them, dispersal III and plasma mines at 1km etc. However, I get so involved firing correctly that I am not looking at what is going on. I tried to use my programmable keyboard but it makes mistakes and slows up the sequence. I now just spam my torpedo fire button but, of course, the fastest often go first. How can I do something decent using the integral keybind function? I am familiar with how to keybind, BTW.
My goal is to use it in PVP. I am a new PVPer and realise that I am staring at a big hill whilst wondering if my legs are up to it ... I'm not much good even in the bug, lol.
Post edited by captainretset on
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
In addition, you haven't mentioned your Doff loadout.
For doffs I have 3 X projectile weapons, an evasive recharge conn and a damage resistance with BFI hazard, all purple.
Dude, get the mk 12 Jemmie space set. It helps tremendously for what you're doing.
Also, just to give you a heads up, a Torpedo Boat wont survive on its own. It doesn't do enough damage to shields to be of any real effect. I hope you have high yield as a skill, and hope to God whatever you fight against, doesn't have a transporter ability, or a point defense ability.
If he's got the mk 12 jem space set, he'll detect you before you get into range to deal any real torpedo damage. Assuming he hasn't laid a plethora of mines around him already, in which case, a single attack run will render your destruction, without him ever firing a shot.
I've seen countless idiots try and fight me in their B'rel torp boats, more often than not, they fail miserably. you need 3 more torp boats with you, and voice communication to truly coordinate your attack. To at least spread out the mines between each other, or for one to "take one for the team" while you and the other two can focus on the fight.
Most players who are smart, will be running the mk 12 jem set, just for the stealth detection, and would be running a detection ability time to time. And if they are smart, at least a single tricobalt mine launcher. (to a cloaked b'rel, a single tric mine, will bring it to near death, 2? it's gone)
Torp boats aren't as effective as a lot of people over dramatize them to be.
I have read everything B'Rel related I can find. It's all been very helpful, especially yours
However, after building and playing with it, I am still left wondering about the consoles and macro for firing order and can find nothing on here to help me.
From my little PVP experience and the muddle ups I sometimes make trying to get a good attack run in the B'Rel, I fear you may be spot on. Still, I wanted to do something different and the idea has always appealed. I will persevere for a while ..
The breen space set for torpedoes, and the romulan torpedo set is what I would run.
Cluster torpedos from the breen do substantially more damage than regular quantums and trics. the romulan plasma torps fire a stream or a volley of plasma torpedoes.
Fire romulan plasma torps, followed by a cluster, after the cluster is deployed immediate fire the two tricobalts.
Cluster removes the shield, or most of it, plasma torps from Romulans finish the shields and just start to eat the hull, tricobalts finish it off.
This is all assuming you're dealing with a player who's an idiot and wont counter your volley, but you want the plasma torps to be launched immediately as soon as your cluster is deployed, and tricobalts deployed immediately just after your final plasma deploys.
The real killers will be the tricobalts. The set up is really to prepare the target for the trics to impact with the least notice as possible.
If the player is an utter moron and doesn't launch his counters for missiles, which he should have already on his ship, if you don't kill him, you'll at least do crippling damage, before he then, wipes you out of course. Meaning your second attack run after respawn is what will kill him. But most often than not, it ends up being a tie at that point, you both usually kill each other if he knows to counter.
BTW, if he's got a countering build, like mine for instance: (point defense, BFI, DOffs that limit kinetic damage, hull armor that resist kinetic damage, shields that have kinetic damage resistance, i.e. Jem Hadar.... etc) Your first volley of all 4, including the cluster torpedo wont even deal damage that's noticable at all.
Anyone who's smart, will gear their ship towards kinetic, Antiproton, Polaron, and Tetryon, because they are the three most common energy types used in PVP, and kinetic is the most common distraction. If you gear your cruiser towards tanking out like this, players like you, in your Torpedo Boat, will never survive to even complete one pass, let alone bring the hull down under 80%.
The biggest drawback also, to be effective as a torp boat, is you have to get in close to the enemy ship, assuming the enemy ship is run by an utter idiot, assuming he has no tric mines nearby, and assuming he doesn't have anything to detect cloaked ships (which he should be timing the start of the match vs estimated BoP speed) immediately after decloak, most often than not, he'll bring you to near death, if not already dead.You have to get in close, just to limit the number of torps the target can shoot down before impact.
But, I will add though, the only time you truly see effectiveness of a torpedo boat, is in PvE i.e. Elite Space STFs against the borg.
Let your team knock down the shields to near gone, then fire in this order: CLuster Torpedo, Romulan Plasma, then both Tricobalts. You can wipe a borg Cube from 100% HP to 15% HP with that single move, IF the shields are already brought down to be nearly gone completely.
Mr know it all here folks. dont need 3 brels at all, all u need is a breen cluster crit and you are dead......anyone is dead. they crit at 90k every time. romm boffs, tach converter zero point, TRIBBLE mod and you have base 13% crit chance. use tac buffs and u will crit ALOT. so please take yur nose turning somewhere else, maybe you just bumped into a brel noob.
To the op. try this. breen 2 piece will boost transphasics alot including the cluster.....get it.
i use the breen 2 piece and fleet elite axion deflector. 2 breens, hargh, regular mkxii tranny up front. tric mines in the rear to troll spawn reset (especially handy when fedscrubs think its fun to camp outnumbered klinks).
key to the torp boat: release cluster bombs within 1km of target....immediately tractor if omega is down and whatch half theyre health pop or with a crit, obliterate them.
you should never fire youre breens from a distance, they are slow and easily shot down. basicly you are widdling youre target down until u get that nice breen crit!
gl and if you have any questions, ask me ill check the thread from time to time.
oh and equip an ams to really TRIBBLE them off. leech console dosent really work with torps.
oh that reminds me...u dont need weapon power with all torps. put power in aux (for better stealth) and engines.
clusters do nothing to sheilds, they bypass the sheild to do dmg, iv killed players with 100% sheilds. tricoblat torps are worthless on a brel, you have no way of stripping a sheild face. plus they nerfed trics in half.
i loled when i read..."torp boats are only effective in pve" wtf????/ are you spreading misinformation, so new brel pilots are mislead?
DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS GUY
90k Crit? Are you stoned? You can't even go beyond 10k for a crit.
Plasma torps eliminate shields, Breen Cluster, can also cut down shields. You're not the only one who's run a Torp boat. To get into 1km of the target, means you're going to be hit by the mines the player has launched.
Tricobalt torpedos, deal more damage, even via crit than the Cluster does. You can even do the math yourself.
Torpedo boats are largely useless unless grouped.
LOL!!! This is true for your build.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
really? so i imagined my 80K crit on an unbuffed tricobalt mine, 40K crit on a beam overload strike, and countless 20-50K crits on HY3 quantum torpedo volleys, did i?
i think not
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Playing around with builds in empire defences and STFs, I have noticed that sometimes the Breen crits and a large string of 4 figure numbers pass up the screen - I can believe an 80K hit is possible.
I totally take on board that 1v1, I will have zero chance and I would fully concur. My intent is to sneak in during a fight, having picked an occupied target who is fresh out of buffs and then do a torp and mine run. If (when?) I am decloaked I intend to run ... fast ... !
@beefsupreme79: Thanks for the many hints. I'll release the Breen closer in future and will try the Breen set/weapons you have suggested. Funnily enough, I picked up an AMS console for 300K EC on the exchange yesterday as I thought it looked good - I am sure I'll find a slot for it
Pics or vid, or it didn't happen.
retset, the Breen Cluster firs 10 transphasic mines, the highest crit any one mine can do, is 2500 unless the shields on the enemy ship are dead. Then you can push up to 3k for a crit, assuming you have an over 110% boost to critical severity via several ship consoles you can mount. Which, of all that damage, only 40% of it actually goes into the ship you're fighting if its shields are up (hense why you want Romulan Plasma Torps, they cut shields down)
Out of 10, you'll b elucky if you broke 20k between all 10 of them if not 15k. People tend to over exaggerate the DPS they push out. Even with a HY Torp, HY III only increases the torpedos damage by 78%
Running a volley of 4 quantums for example, that runs a maximum DPS of 4,400 for all 4 quantums, with a crit between all 4, again, assuming you have the 110% critical severity, assuming you ALWAYS have critical hits with every torpedo, maxes the critical hit to 8,788 DPS. With 20% going into the target if shields are up, that is 1753 DPS per HY3 that is used, assuming all 4 are direct hits and criticals.
DPS wise is lower ifyou count reload time to use HY3 again.
As far as Alpha goes, that's over 12k in Alpha Damage, which, doing the math with shield pen, etc. You'll max at around 3k damage is done to the actual ships hull itself.
In English,
It's batcrap stupid to rely purely on crits to do any decent damage, rendering toward DPS, between ability recharges, etc. You're lucky if you're pulling 110-240 DPS throughout a fight overall with shields on the target at max, or near max capacity. Which is why you need a second BoP to at least run a disruptor boat to deminish shields overall.
Math doesn't lie.
OOOHHH and I forgot to mention, with RECHARGE TIME of HY3, waiting those seconds for it to recharge, that renders the HY3 damage dealt, to 100-200 DPS WITH critical hits. Not enough.
Which, btw, unless you're fighting IDIOTS, they'll have their hull back up at 100% before you can do another attack, assuming you're not destroyed after your initial attack.
perhaps you should have your head examined cause i have had my attacks do way more damage than they usually do, on all sorts of ships
Let's see the screenshots/vids.
OOOHH and in PVP, you'll never have an 80k critical hit.
And it's very obvious why....
He's right, though. The derp damage from this post is OVER 9000!!!!!
we dont need to prove ourselves to someone like you, furthermore havent you ever had any of your weaps do an insane amount of damage than normal?
Nope, never once.
Pics or vid, or it didn't happen.
And FYI, you'll never have an 80k critical hit in a PVP, ever.
tell that to all the people who've gotten 100K+ crits from their spinal lances or javelins
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Really?
So tell me, what ship player run, has 100k HP? What ship in this entire game can a player use, that has even 50k HP?
BS meter just went through the roof.
FYI, highest HP ship in the game has 44,000 HP. Getting a crit beyond that, wouldn't even calculate in the game, you can't over damage a target to destroy it beyond its allotted HP.
yes you can, because unlike you, i know how the game's mechanics work, and there is NOTHING preventing a crit from dealing more damage than a target has hull
anyone who's played the game for more than a month knows this, to say nothing of the people who've done all kinds of testing on how various parts of the game's code interact with each other
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
screen shot/vid or it not true
Show me the tests.
Show me the videos of more damage occuring a ship, than the HP it has.(excluding shields damage etc)
None exist, Game will render a transphasic torpedo to 200 damage dealt just for a finishing blow that could have been thousands more.
Game doesn't calculate damage dealt beyond allotted HP.
Or better yet, show me a high damage critical.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3LpH2NLUuU
Highest critical he dealt through that entire match, was 3,431
you must think this is amusing or something, continuing to tell such blatant lies when everyone else is calling your BS
well, i'm not laughing, and neither is anyone else in this topic, so kindly get the hell out, troll, and let the thread get back on topic
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
This ship didn't go even beyond a 3 digit critical^^^
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL2BN3jAzkI
Not one hit went beyond 800 damage. Not one hit went beyond the remaining HP of any ship he destroyed. ^^^
Misrepresenting the damages dealt, give noobies bad ideas into failures they shouldn't have done to begin with. Over exaggerating ability, is going to hurt Ret more than it'll ever help him.
Really? Then why the sam hell does my Odyssey Tactical cruiser has 57,704 hull HP and 10,544 shield HP, and why I have been hit for well over 200k damage from those damn Borg Invisi-torps?
Edit: Here is a pic for my hull and shields
http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p292/Tazuren/Nights-Predator-hull-and-shield_zpse2b6f661.png
[06/16 11:51] [Combat (Self)] Your Advanced Dual Heavy Radiant Antiproton Cannons - Hypercharge deals 237970 (113626) Antiproton Damage(Critical) to Tactical Cube.
AHAHAHA! Eat it Borg!
[09/15 11:01] [Combat (Self)] You lose 12187085 Cold Damage from Death.
Death is OP, please nerf. I BLAME KURLAND FOR THIS!
http://blaze214263.deviantart.com/art/My-Hull-362133562?ga_submit_new=10%253A1364514545
ok I run a Tricobalt bomberr for lots of pve and pvp using my nice breen ship from the xmas event and I have been watching the figures carefully since the Tricobalts got noobed down a little.
Thebest hits I have seen from trics are when you use Dispersal Pattern Beta III where each mine hits 35k damage (35k X 4)
Torps do not hit 80k-100k per hit. Its not realistic...and its noobish...and if your char IS hitting this then I suggest uninstall the hack your using and learn to play
Greetings