Way to ignore that magical illusory refinement cap.
A couple of others have said it, but I will say it to you again, as you really do not seem to get it.
You play your Andorian. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Liberated Borg. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Ferengi. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off.
You can play 3-4 hours and make 24,000 refined Dilithium. Or you can play a single characater for 3-4 hours and make 24,000 Dilithium ore and only refine 8,000 of it. The choice is yours. The cap is not really a hard cap because it's not 8,000 per account. It's 8k per character.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
A couple of others have said it, but I will say it to you again, as you really do not seem to get it.
You play your Andorian. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Liberated Borg. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Ferengi. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off.
You can play 3-4 hours and make 24,000 refined Dilithium. Or you can play a single characater for 3-4 hours and make 24,000 Dilithium ore and only refine 8,000 of it. The choice is yours. The cap is not really a hard cap because it's not 8,000 per account. It's 8k per character.
Critical thinking skills for the win!
Thecosmic1, you should charge in-game currency for this little training session!
Just do what they want you to do all along. Buy zen. Then with that zen, buy dilithium. There's no cap on that. Viola, Fleet projects completed. And your fleet will love you for it!
It seems very clear to me. 10 characters grinding out 80,000 per day - notice I did not say each - requires the same amount of time as 1 character grinding out that amount.
I would say it can probably be less time. If I'm switching characters, I can more rapidly do, say, ISE than I could on one character alone, because of the 1 hour cooldown on it.
In fact, it is FASTER to make 80,000 dilithium on 10 characters than it would be on one, so not only is the cap not hurting you, it helps you (if your primary ojective is to make dilithium.)
_________________________________________________ [Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth] [Louis Cipher][Outta Gum][Thysa Kymbo][Spanner][Frakk] [D'Mented][D'Licious]
Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING
I would say it can probably be less time. If I'm switching characters, I can more rapidly do, say, ISE than I could on one character alone, because of the 1 hour cooldown on it.
In fact, it is FASTER to make 80,000 dilithium on 10 characters than it would be on one, so not only is the cap not hurting you, it helps you (if your primary ojective is to make dilithium.)
I am well aware it is quicker. I was trying not to confuse him - which, apparently, was impossible - and I didn't want to see him have a forum rage-stroke if I said you can earn it faster by playing multiple characters then by playing 1.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Teaming with a small group of friends is no less an MMO than playing with a large group of people.
There is no good way to balance a Fleet project between 1-person Fleets and 500-person Fleets. And it's not as though you cannot join a 300-person Fleet and never interact with any of them in any way - or only team with 4 close friends who are also in the Fleet.
I have over 250 people in my Fleet. I have not played with most of them. We tend to divide in cliques when playing, but we all contribute to the Fleet projects - because we all want access to the Fleet gear and ships.
You don't need to be best-buds with anyone in a Fleet to be part of the experience. You can still be as solo-a-player as you wish to be even in a Fleet, but you can also contribute to the Fleet and get your hands on Fleet gear/ships that you can't get on your own.
The people choosing to do it all on there own should not be boosted, IMO.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
There are ways to balance fleet projects that doesn't favor any fleet regardless of size. And some would prefer to remain in a small clique of people they know, rather than being in a large group. But so long as the money for Zen is flowing from people buying it to convert to Dil, Cryptic or PWE just isn't going to give a ****.
I have contributed nearly 4,000,000 Fleet Credits worth of stuff to my Fleet. I have not purchased a single Zen since the game went FTP. You do not need to buy Dilithium.
I suggest you look up Levi3's posts. He took his Fleet base to T3 in all categories by himself, and is on his way to T4 right now.
And as I said, above, you can still be a small clique of people even when in a Fleet of 300. You are not required to socialize with anyone in any way. Heck, most of the time I can go into my base and not see anyone even in there - and that's with over 250 players.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
First, the Dilithium Cap is an illusion. If you have 10 characters you can grind-out 80,000 Dilithium per day - which is no different then having 1 character grind it out. It's the same amount of time required. You can even have 10 identical characters and ships if you are really hung-up on the idea of not liking to use alts.
As far as the Fleet projects, as the name states, they are FLEET PROJECTS. They are designed for the Fleet to accomplish. As has been stated many times, Cryptic based the numbers on the assumption of a 25-player Fleet each playing casually.
I am sorry some players are xenophobic introverts who refuse to make Fleets with other people, but STO is an MMO - Massive Multi-player Online game. It was designed to be played with other people. STO is not an SPG - Single-Player Game.
This game does not require you to be rich to play it. If you think you need every shiny new thing that comes into the C-Store each month, well, that's your hang-up. I do not need every Fleet special project just because it is there. I can do STFS with my T5 RA ships just as easily as I can my T5.5 C-Store and Fleet ships. It grows tiring constantly listening to people should "Nerf X" for no other reason than they want something now rather than earning it.
Pretty much all this. I will add that there are many different ways to play, and you have to accept the limitations on each way. The Starbases were designed to take a long time - wait til you see the requirement for claiming just a Tier 3 base.
__________________________________
STO Forum member since before February 2010. STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
Of course you don't. That in no way means there aren't people who are buying Zen to convert. To think otherwise is ignorance.
If people are choosing to buy Zen to convert to Dilithium they are doing so out of expediency, not necessity. IE, people want it NOW rather then waiting to work to get it.
Playing how many hours a day? Sure, there are exceptions to every rule. That's an extreme example.
How many hours he plays is unimportant. Your real complaint is as above: you want it at the same time anyone else can get it, even if you are only doing it by yourself while others are doing it grouped in the hundreds. Nerfing the system to make the solo player happy does nothing to benefit the hundreds who are willing to contribute to a common goal.
So I say again, STO is an MMO, not a SPG.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Of course it's important. To try and claim otherwise is silly. Sure, any one of us could grind out a T5 base by ourselves if we spent 24/7 doing it. However, I would bet most people don't play 24/7. Those that do are the exception, not the rule.
Or you can spend 3 hours a day doing it for a year. That's the point. You do not need to have it all today. If you get it all today you'll just be bytching that you have nothing to do tomorrow.
Really? So when I am suggesting things like reduced cost / increased timer projects (which would take a solo player even longer to complete due to increased timers), I'm actually asking for my small fleet to get things done in the same time as large fleets? Nice try.
I'm sorry. Were you under the impression that I have any idea who you are or what you might have previously typed at some point? I don't follow you around looking at what you type. I only worry about the things you say in the threads we're both in.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Or you can spend 3 hours a day doing it for a year. That's the point. You do not need to have it all today. If you get it all today you'll just be bytching that you have nothing to do tomorrow.
I agree with this. In fact, I am only spending 1.45 hours per day soloing both the Starbase and Embassy with no issues. I have Tier-3 Starbase gear and Tier-2 Embassy gear with no fuss. That amount of time also includes gaining about 15 million energy credits a day with smart buying and selling on the energy credit exchange. I have not spent any real cash for Zen in over a year. I also spent 3 months away from game from November through January.
Looking through various comments about projects,especially the special projects,i see that the vast majority see things as i do. That the projects are heavily expensive,especially in dilithium. 200,000 dilithium for projects like this? Vastly overpriced.
The dilithium cap does NOT help us at all,it just slows things down too much.
If the cap won't be altered or removed altogether,then how about it being heavily discounted in all projects no matter what they are? Better still,how about removing dilithium from all projects,so we can speed through them?
Useful projects are needed,and not banners that look like beach towels on a washing line.
In todays economic climate around the world,not everyone is rich or a lottery winner,enough to spend alot on this game.
If cryptic/pwe want to attract more players,surely cheaper prices is the order of the day.
This would give all a level playing field,and make the game alot fairer.
So cryptic/pwe,please wake up and smell the coffee.
Give us all a fair chance.
Being aware and giving a damn are two different things.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] ***Disenchanted***
Real Join Date: Monday, 17 May 2010
Being aware and giving a damn are two different things.
No company gives a damn really. They are there to make a profit, if you can't afford what they're selling, they're not going to offer you a discount just because you want one. They're a business looking to make a profit, not a charity or public service.
Besides, it's not like you have to spend a single penny to get anything in this game, especially when you are talking about the starbase system. The only reason anyone would spend real money on it, is because they don't want to wait.
As for the rest of the OP... Well it's such utter nonsense it's not worth responding to really.
I don't farm dilithium everyday and mostly just play and whatever I get before I log off I refine but its never near 8k a day and sometimes I don't play this game everyday. So whoever said just drop 5k into the fleet for dilithium doesn't realize that's really expensive for those that don't play everyday. I find it absurd right now the costs of everything in dilithium extremely high and ridiculous. If they want to keep players and attract players then they need to start making things cheaper or else this game will never grow.
I don't farm dilithium everyday and mostly just play and whatever I get before I log off I refine but its never near 8k a day and sometimes I don't play this game everyday. So whoever said just drop 5k into the fleet for dilithium doesn't realize that's really expensive for those that don't play everyday. I find it absurd right now the costs of everything in dilithium extremely high and ridiculous. If they want to keep players and attract players then they need to start making things cheaper or else this game will never grow.
What exactly are you doing with a Level 50 every day that doesn't include Dilithium? If you do STFs, you get Dilithium. If you do Dailies, you get Dilithium. If you mine, you get Dilithium. If you do Foundry, you get Dilithium. It's very difficult to not earn Dilithium with a Level 50.
I can understand if you are below 50, but for the vast majority of players who do have end-game characters there's really nothing to do but earn Dilithium. The reason there are constantly threads about wanting to raise the Dilithium cap is because it is so easy to earn more then 8k per day just casually playing.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
OP, is there anything in this game you like/enjoy/have fun with?
Insane prices for vanity (I hope it's obvious enough now) projects are fine. You don't need those decorated pillars. It won't make your fleet shields less efficient. It's just better looking and you won't be able to see it once PWE pulls the plug anyway.
By the way, my kdf fleet is one of the "big" fleets. Such projects get completed under 6h. If you don't like paying for this, why don't you leave your solo or 10 people fleet for a "big" one?
By the way, welcome to the F2P model where games get funded by 10% of the playerbase.
Wow this was a very helpful thread and all it's participants did a very good job delivering objective and useful information that will no doubt enhance my enjoyment in Star Trek Online.
This is one of the most accessible and forgiving free to play games on the market. There is a huge wad of content you get just for downloading the thing.
You want to get bit in the wallet just for logging on, try TOR. You want to hide your helmet? Well by all means, but first you'll need to give them a modest hiding-your-helmet tax. Armor doesn't match? Well there's a handy mechanic to color code the armor, but not for free! You'd like it to not take a million years to level? Break out a few bucks for the gaining-xp-at-a-normal-rate tax. In STO you get charged for extras, a basic playable game is intact and free. Not every F2P player base is so lucky.
Wow this was a very helpful thread and all it's participants did a very good job delivering objective and useful information that will no doubt enhance my enjoyment in Star Trek Online.
200,000 divided between even 40 people is only 5k dilithium a person. Sure, it's a pain for two people to put together at 100,000 dilithium a pop, but these are fleet projects, for an entire fleet.
I'm in a fleet with a guy that has jumped up over 3,000,000 liftime credits in a month. Thanks to the fact that he hates money and throws it at the game for dilithium, my fleet gets the featured projects done in no time. Too bad it feels like a hollow accomplishment. Whatever.
________________________________________________ WE... need MORE... ellipsis abuse on the... internet.
Op dont even try. The rich with deep pockets, how be it RL money, or ingame money are so unaware of reality that they mock posts like this all the time. When I first started playing pc games, there was never this push for rich only, however things have change. So like I said dont even try. They will not understand.
A good example was I just picked up the second heart of swarm and wings of liberty. I posted that 40bucks was too much for each. The response I got was well sense they sold a million copies I think the price is just fine. I was able to fit that expenditure into my budget, under normal circumstances I would not have been able to. My brother is a big starcraft fan like me, but with three kids he will never be able to afford that game. To the rich 40 bucks is a dime. The rest of us the normal person, its a ouch. So like I said they will not understand or give a damn.
For the record dilithium was the worse thing that ever happened to sto, as its built around people buying zen to sell for dilithium when someone needs large quanitys of dilithium.
Comments
You play your Andorian. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Liberated Borg. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off. You log into your Ferengi. You grind your 8,000. You refine it and log off.
You can play 3-4 hours and make 24,000 refined Dilithium. Or you can play a single characater for 3-4 hours and make 24,000 Dilithium ore and only refine 8,000 of it. The choice is yours. The cap is not really a hard cap because it's not 8,000 per account. It's 8k per character.
Critical thinking skills for the win!
Thecosmic1, you should charge in-game currency for this little training session!
I would say it can probably be less time. If I'm switching characters, I can more rapidly do, say, ISE than I could on one character alone, because of the 1 hour cooldown on it.
[Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth]
[Louis Cipher][Outta Gum][Thysa Kymbo][Spanner][Frakk]
[D'Mented][D'Licious]
Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING
I have over 250 people in my Fleet. I have not played with most of them. We tend to divide in cliques when playing, but we all contribute to the Fleet projects - because we all want access to the Fleet gear and ships.
You don't need to be best-buds with anyone in a Fleet to be part of the experience. You can still be as solo-a-player as you wish to be even in a Fleet, but you can also contribute to the Fleet and get your hands on Fleet gear/ships that you can't get on your own.
The people choosing to do it all on there own should not be boosted, IMO.
I suggest you look up Levi3's posts. He took his Fleet base to T3 in all categories by himself, and is on his way to T4 right now.
And as I said, above, you can still be a small clique of people even when in a Fleet of 300. You are not required to socialize with anyone in any way. Heck, most of the time I can go into my base and not see anyone even in there - and that's with over 250 players.
Pretty much all this. I will add that there are many different ways to play, and you have to accept the limitations on each way. The Starbases were designed to take a long time - wait til you see the requirement for claiming just a Tier 3 base.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
How many hours he plays is unimportant. Your real complaint is as above: you want it at the same time anyone else can get it, even if you are only doing it by yourself while others are doing it grouped in the hundreds. Nerfing the system to make the solo player happy does nothing to benefit the hundreds who are willing to contribute to a common goal.
So I say again, STO is an MMO, not a SPG.
I'm sorry. Were you under the impression that I have any idea who you are or what you might have previously typed at some point? I don't follow you around looking at what you type. I only worry about the things you say in the threads we're both in.
I agree with this. In fact, I am only spending 1.45 hours per day soloing both the Starbase and Embassy with no issues. I have Tier-3 Starbase gear and Tier-2 Embassy gear with no fuss. That amount of time also includes gaining about 15 million energy credits a day with smart buying and selling on the energy credit exchange. I have not spent any real cash for Zen in over a year. I also spent 3 months away from game from November through January.
Being aware and giving a damn are two different things.
***Disenchanted***
Real Join Date: Monday, 17 May 2010
No company gives a damn really. They are there to make a profit, if you can't afford what they're selling, they're not going to offer you a discount just because you want one. They're a business looking to make a profit, not a charity or public service.
Besides, it's not like you have to spend a single penny to get anything in this game, especially when you are talking about the starbase system. The only reason anyone would spend real money on it, is because they don't want to wait.
As for the rest of the OP... Well it's such utter nonsense it's not worth responding to really.
I can understand if you are below 50, but for the vast majority of players who do have end-game characters there's really nothing to do but earn Dilithium. The reason there are constantly threads about wanting to raise the Dilithium cap is because it is so easy to earn more then 8k per day just casually playing.
Insane prices for vanity (I hope it's obvious enough now) projects are fine. You don't need those decorated pillars. It won't make your fleet shields less efficient. It's just better looking and you won't be able to see it once PWE pulls the plug anyway.
By the way, my kdf fleet is one of the "big" fleets. Such projects get completed under 6h. If you don't like paying for this, why don't you leave your solo or 10 people fleet for a "big" one?
By the way, welcome to the F2P model where games get funded by 10% of the playerbase.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
You want to get bit in the wallet just for logging on, try TOR. You want to hide your helmet? Well by all means, but first you'll need to give them a modest hiding-your-helmet tax. Armor doesn't match? Well there's a handy mechanic to color code the armor, but not for free! You'd like it to not take a million years to level? Break out a few bucks for the gaining-xp-at-a-normal-rate tax. In STO you get charged for extras, a basic playable game is intact and free. Not every F2P player base is so lucky.
Not... not sure if sarcasm.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
I'm in a fleet with a guy that has jumped up over 3,000,000 liftime credits in a month. Thanks to the fact that he hates money and throws it at the game for dilithium, my fleet gets the featured projects done in no time. Too bad it feels like a hollow accomplishment. Whatever.
WE... need MORE... ellipsis abuse on the... internet.
A good example was I just picked up the second heart of swarm and wings of liberty. I posted that 40bucks was too much for each. The response I got was well sense they sold a million copies I think the price is just fine. I was able to fit that expenditure into my budget, under normal circumstances I would not have been able to. My brother is a big starcraft fan like me, but with three kids he will never be able to afford that game. To the rich 40 bucks is a dime. The rest of us the normal person, its a ouch. So like I said they will not understand or give a damn.
For the record dilithium was the worse thing that ever happened to sto, as its built around people buying zen to sell for dilithium when someone needs large quanitys of dilithium.