I'm normally very anti-nerd, let me start with that. But I am a proponent of balance, and having a faction-specific thing like this is very unbalanced.
And you say they are vulnerable but they have quite a bit of hull to them. Read my post above -- it shouldn't take more than a single torp to kill them. Also I don't think the Particle Gen. skill of the captain should improve them. Why should it, logically? The ship has a particle generator on board and particle generation might affect Warp Plasma or possibly ship-board energy weapons but how would it impact something you launch from your ship then you fly away? Just illogical.
Well P Gen improves the dmg they do if you shoot them with energy weapons... why shouldn't it. Does P Gen not improve tractor beam or Gravity well damage ?
Improving dmg on exotic attacks is sort of the point of P Gen.
Frankly there is nothing unbalanced about Aceton at all... Including the recharge on them.
They are easily countered... I don't know why you take more then one torp to kill one... what kind of torps are you running ?
The problem I think most people find with them is ... two fold. One feds don't load enough torps in general... and 2 pug players all seem to be confused by what they are, I have seen people sit 2k away from one and rapid fire it.... as funny as that is its pretty sad.
I remember fighting one good klink premade that dropped these in numbers... we dropped a few players before we realized the easiest way to counter them was to do the fed spiral, comboed with some torp spread and TBR. These are pretty easy to counter really... however if your pug team mates are making it hard by shooting them when there in the middle of the group ya I can understand the frustration.
This is a lot of good points but not really relevant to the discussion. All I'm saying is increase the cooldown on AA or make it easier to kill with a torp. It is what it is...
Thats my point... why are you the only one with torps to kill it. lol
When I shoot at them with my dedicated torp boats they die in one hit...
I can understand not fully speced / no console torps perhaps taking 2 shots... but thats what you trade for not maxing your torps. imo
They are also killed by kinetic dmg in general...
Gravity well does kill them.
Tractor beam repulsors kills them and pushes them out of range with ease.
My point is Feds in general come into FvK Completely unprepared to fight Klingons.
Some of the premade feds will argue that dual specing into energy and kinetic is a waste... and they are 100% wrong. More escorts need to be running a torp for hull spike... more sci need to be running them... and even cruisers should have one or 2 torps.
The Premade feds also convince people that Gravity well is a terrible skill... truth is it completely shuts down cloaking in any kind of range of it... and the GW doff will pop secondaries on people after they recloak which is super effective.
Torpedos one shot bops even through there low shield numbers.... yet most escorts are still rocking 4 dhc in the FvK Que.
I look at it this way... I know my premade runs lots of torpedos... (really like any half decent fed premade) we walk all over the klinks.
I think the issues with aceton are really limited to pugs... where the chances of having proper Klink Control skills on the scis are almost zero... and the DPS players bring nothing at all to counter cloak or aceton... or in most cases even carrier pets.
A vanilla torpedo without using spread or high yield? can i haz 1?
I have one shot them with both quantums and plasmas... I would imagine phasics would have no chance, I guess those are the flavor right now.
I also run Gravity well as well though on my scis... I know the few times I have fought klinks dropping them the GW likely took a good chunk off them as well.
Ya I don't know when the last time you fvfed was... but I seem to remember Danoobs all over the damn place.
Monday night? All weekend? :P
When was the last time you saw a nearly all Carrier or even all Carrier team fedside?
You might see some ships with 1 hangar, you might see a carrier here and there. Sure you'll see some Danubes and there are a Fed players who stand out as spam offenders.
However, it's exceedingly rare in my experience to run into a full on 4 or 5 man carrier team with every double hangar carrier running hangar reduction doffs like you run into KDF side.
1 console lets 1 team force the other team to waste their time firing at a spam-item.
= Win for the console user
Also:
Risk of a team full of AA & siphon abusers -or- just leave the Klingons to suck each other dry and fight other Feds. ^_^
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] @Aquitaine985 Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre. 2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
When was the last time you saw a nearly all Carrier or even all Carrier team fedside?
You might see some ships with 1 hangar, you might see a carrier here and there. Sure you'll see some Danubes and there are a Fed players who stand out as spam offenders.
However, it's exceedingly rare in my experience to run into a full on 4 or 5 man carrier team with every double hangar carrier running hangar reduction doffs like you run into KDF side.
I would say its just as rare to run into 4+ carrier teams klink side as well.
Really lets be completely honest with ourselves... the only reason you don't see more fed carrier teams is because most Bug ships go on fed toons. ;P
I also firmly believe that if the time sets gave all the extra bonuses on any ship... you would see more vestas as well. (and I think there numbers are already pretty close to on par with the wells ships)
Really I don't even remember the last time I qued to pug with my klink and ran into the other 4 guys being all carriers... unless there is some Klink premade running 5 man carrier teams.
just about any HY with any torp is enough to kill assimilators. everyone carrying those cutting beams makes them die more then ever, even with all energy users
I use KCB on all my ships and it clears AA easy. On my KDF all my ships carry AA as i do STFs a lot/pvp and its one of the few all around generally good consoles to use actually worth a slot.
Are they OP? Hell no. Even if i could put 5 down at once they are easy to kill or easy to avoid by moving. Saying that it totally controls the battle field is a massive overstatement. People control the battlefield, you chose when and where you move.
If you arent speced into torps your missing a key weapon. How people can think torps are useless when 1 HYT of quantums can deal almost 100k dmg to a single target is beyond me. Some of the hardest ships to fight are torpedo/mine ships.
AA are totally fine, and if you see a escort strafe one he gets what he gets thats the whole point.
The radiation DOT is pretty weak if you don't fire on it.
You'll excuse me if I don't sympathize for those complaining who use mines, heavy torpedoes, pets, FAW, etc. etc.
If the radiation damage bothers you so much, hit it with a regular torpedo, push it away, move away, or hit it with AMS and then FAW. The later will cause it to damage everything (yes, that means the KDF team who has been deploying it).
The radiation DOT is pretty weak if you don't fire on it.
You'll excuse me if I don't sympathize for those complaining who use mines, heavy torpedoes, pets, FAW, etc. etc.
If the radiation damage bothers you so much, hit it with a regular torpedo, push it away, move away, or hit it with AMS and then FAW. The later will cause it to damage everything (yes, that means the KDF team who has been deploying it).
agreed with all of this, plus i've used them extensively against a few friends who are decently skilled PvPers, and they only find them slightly annoying
that would suggest to me that the ones complaining about them are actually below average in skill level...which isn't a bad thing because no one starts out being a PvP god after all, but when someone like that comes here and cries nerf instead of adapting to what their opponent is using (like you're supposed to be doing in the first place), they're only hurting themselves in the long run, not to mention everyone else who uses something like the assimilators for reasons OTHER than PvP...like say, the NWS, where these things are a godsend
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Unless, you think spammy garbage is fun and exciting?
there are plenty of different powers in the game to clear away spam; if you don't have any of them, ask a team mate who does to clear it for you...that's what you're supposed to be doing in PvP anyway - working as a TEAM
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
The assimilators must be flattered. I assume you meant something other than "volleys" because that would further emphasize the point.
Attack shots whatever term is useful. I just shoot torps and they die as anything else.
I have no idea if it is flattered by my killing over anyone else klling it.
true, but it stack with ES and plasmonic leach and still there is subsystem targeting... and even if I also play with a kdf toon and use the plasmonich leack, I must admit that draining 50+ energy from a ship (and some points spent in power insulator) is too much.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
This is the worst kind of BS spam I've ever seen any any game. I can't believe it's still in its current vastly OP'd form in the game, still being abused by people.
It is far from overpowered. A Borg Cube destroys it within seconds of spawning. At most, all it does is give me a second, maybe two seconds if I'm lucky, to make my escape to a distance safe enough for me to heal up. Take it into ANY Elite STF, and it is exactly that, a two second distraction for you to get away.
It is far from overpowered. A Borg Cube destroys it within seconds of spawning. At most, all it does is give me a second, maybe two seconds if I'm lucky, to make my escape to a distance safe enough for me to heal up. Take it into ANY Elite STF, and it is exactly that, a two second distraction for you to get away.
This is pvp discussion not pve. lol
They are pretty annoying but that's about it. Would be nice if it didn't kill heavy torps, since that's the only torp I use nowadays. Usually I just try to fly away from them once they are popped.
Usually I just try to fly away from them once they are popped.
that's really what anyone should be doing, if they can't outright destroy it
and to forestall any incoming arguments from anyone here of 'but then you're letting it dictate where you can and can't fight!!!!!', well, pardon my french, but...NO ****!!! it's called CROWD CONTROL for a reason!
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Comments
Well P Gen improves the dmg they do if you shoot them with energy weapons... why shouldn't it. Does P Gen not improve tractor beam or Gravity well damage ?
Improving dmg on exotic attacks is sort of the point of P Gen.
Frankly there is nothing unbalanced about Aceton at all... Including the recharge on them.
They are easily countered... I don't know why you take more then one torp to kill one... what kind of torps are you running ?
The problem I think most people find with them is ... two fold. One feds don't load enough torps in general... and 2 pug players all seem to be confused by what they are, I have seen people sit 2k away from one and rapid fire it.... as funny as that is its pretty sad.
I remember fighting one good klink premade that dropped these in numbers... we dropped a few players before we realized the easiest way to counter them was to do the fed spiral, comboed with some torp spread and TBR. These are pretty easy to counter really... however if your pug team mates are making it hard by shooting them when there in the middle of the group ya I can understand the frustration.
Thats my point... why are you the only one with torps to kill it. lol
When I shoot at them with my dedicated torp boats they die in one hit...
I can understand not fully speced / no console torps perhaps taking 2 shots... but thats what you trade for not maxing your torps. imo
They are also killed by kinetic dmg in general...
Gravity well does kill them.
Tractor beam repulsors kills them and pushes them out of range with ease.
My point is Feds in general come into FvK Completely unprepared to fight Klingons.
Some of the premade feds will argue that dual specing into energy and kinetic is a waste... and they are 100% wrong. More escorts need to be running a torp for hull spike... more sci need to be running them... and even cruisers should have one or 2 torps.
The Premade feds also convince people that Gravity well is a terrible skill... truth is it completely shuts down cloaking in any kind of range of it... and the GW doff will pop secondaries on people after they recloak which is super effective.
Torpedos one shot bops even through there low shield numbers.... yet most escorts are still rocking 4 dhc in the FvK Que.
I look at it this way... I know my premade runs lots of torpedos... (really like any half decent fed premade) we walk all over the klinks.
I think the issues with aceton are really limited to pugs... where the chances of having proper Klink Control skills on the scis are almost zero... and the DPS players bring nothing at all to counter cloak or aceton... or in most cases even carrier pets.
A vanilla torpedo without using spread or high yield? can i haz 1?
I have one shot them with both quantums and plasmas... I would imagine phasics would have no chance, I guess those are the flavor right now.
I also run Gravity well as well though on my scis... I know the few times I have fought klinks dropping them the GW likely took a good chunk off them as well.
Monday night? All weekend? :P
When was the last time you saw a nearly all Carrier or even all Carrier team fedside?
You might see some ships with 1 hangar, you might see a carrier here and there. Sure you'll see some Danubes and there are a Fed players who stand out as spam offenders.
However, it's exceedingly rare in my experience to run into a full on 4 or 5 man carrier team with every double hangar carrier running hangar reduction doffs like you run into KDF side.
Usually one or two volleys does the job.
As to CDs, never noticed.
R.I.P
Feds balling up for protection dictates the field of combat
BoPs decloaking dictate the field of combat.
I see no difference here.
All pets clutter the field and require tactics to clear.
I see no difference.
R.I.P
Also:
Risk of a team full of AA & siphon abusers -or- just leave the Klingons to suck each other dry and fight other Feds. ^_^
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
I would say its just as rare to run into 4+ carrier teams klink side as well.
Really lets be completely honest with ourselves... the only reason you don't see more fed carrier teams is because most Bug ships go on fed toons. ;P
I also firmly believe that if the time sets gave all the extra bonuses on any ship... you would see more vestas as well. (and I think there numbers are already pretty close to on par with the wells ships)
Really I don't even remember the last time I qued to pug with my klink and ran into the other 4 guys being all carriers... unless there is some Klink premade running 5 man carrier teams.
The assimilators must be flattered. I assume you meant something other than "volleys" because that would further emphasize the point.
Are they OP? Hell no. Even if i could put 5 down at once they are easy to kill or easy to avoid by moving. Saying that it totally controls the battle field is a massive overstatement. People control the battlefield, you chose when and where you move.
If you arent speced into torps your missing a key weapon. How people can think torps are useless when 1 HYT of quantums can deal almost 100k dmg to a single target is beyond me. Some of the hardest ships to fight are torpedo/mine ships.
AA are totally fine, and if you see a escort strafe one he gets what he gets thats the whole point.
The radiation DOT is pretty weak if you don't fire on it.
You'll excuse me if I don't sympathize for those complaining who use mines, heavy torpedoes, pets, FAW, etc. etc.
If the radiation damage bothers you so much, hit it with a regular torpedo, push it away, move away, or hit it with AMS and then FAW. The later will cause it to damage everything (yes, that means the KDF team who has been deploying it).
Funny thing there, usually it's the dedicated spam carrier, spamming mines & pets that also happen to have AAs loaded.
So you'll excuse me if I don't sympathize with anyone trying to protect spammy garbage toys like AA.
agreed with all of this, plus i've used them extensively against a few friends who are decently skilled PvPers, and they only find them slightly annoying
that would suggest to me that the ones complaining about them are actually below average in skill level...which isn't a bad thing because no one starts out being a PvP god after all, but when someone like that comes here and cries nerf instead of adapting to what their opponent is using (like you're supposed to be doing in the first place), they're only hurting themselves in the long run, not to mention everyone else who uses something like the assimilators for reasons OTHER than PvP...like say, the NWS, where these things are a godsend
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Actually what it suggests is an inability on your part to absorb information being presented to you.
Unless, you think spammy garbage is fun and exciting?
there are plenty of different powers in the game to clear away spam; if you don't have any of them, ask a team mate who does to clear it for you...that's what you're supposed to be doing in PvP anyway - working as a TEAM
there is a hard cap per player already - 2
maybe in PvP, that hard cap could be extended to the entire team
then you'd never have to deal with more than 2 acetons at any given moment and they can keep their current stats
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Attack shots whatever term is useful. I just shoot torps and they die as anything else.
I have no idea if it is flattered by my killing over anyone else klling it.
R.I.P
true, but it stack with ES and plasmonic leach and still there is subsystem targeting... and even if I also play with a kdf toon and use the plasmonich leack, I must admit that draining 50+ energy from a ship (and some points spent in power insulator) is too much.
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
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This is pvp discussion not pve. lol
They are pretty annoying but that's about it. Would be nice if it didn't kill heavy torps, since that's the only torp I use nowadays. Usually I just try to fly away from them once they are popped.
that's really what anyone should be doing, if they can't outright destroy it
and to forestall any incoming arguments from anyone here of 'but then you're letting it dictate where you can and can't fight!!!!!', well, pardon my french, but...NO ****!!! it's called CROWD CONTROL for a reason!
/rantoff
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"