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  • jonnymindjonnymind Member Posts: 11
    edited February 2013
    Oh come on, people. 5 front cannons and 16 base turn rate, and you'd like to tank? Really?


    And then, why not just adding a button "I win", that you can click at will after paying 50 bucks per click?

    No, that's not how decent games work. I'll tell you what this ship is for, and I hope you get it.

    This ship is for serious roleplaying (finally! a thing that this game WAS lacking). Whith this ship you HAVE to party. Get a friend with a cruiser, which will draw the fire, and a friend with a science, that will control the situation, and then you, with this shiny ship, can be the punch of the group.

    Wait for the cruiser to take fire and for the science to clear the field from fighters & small fires, and then you get in and punch a tac cube down in 2 seconds.

    Fail to coordinate with your team, and you're toasted.

    You didn't know when you bought this ship? -- bad for you; the 85 troop complement clearly states healing and shield recovery are bad. Exp when they are all dead (see the bar of live troop below your hud?)

    You thought this was a "you win" button and then you find out this is just another very specialized, social oriented, task-specific, fantastic ship? Oh, sorry. Go cry over your mom and ask for more money to buy something else that will make you look cool and kick a...es.

    Sorry for the rant, I usually don't drama, but hearing "bugs" and complains like "hey, how come I don't kick everyone's b..t with my new smart buy?"

    Be considerate. Paying in MMRPG can give you just some special ability and a better or more diverse gameplay style. They can't make you the king of the hill. Sorry for that, lads.

    --
    Also, kudos to devs. Finally, an escort that is really an "ESCORT" (the term means: help out and guard). With currently existing "escorts", you can easily do a group of 5 heavy escort carriers and they will take the mission home better than any other combination. With this ship, a group composed of, say, 1 science, 2 cruisers and 2 kumaris can really perform better than a group with just 5 generic escorts. It's a boost on diverse and cooperative gameplay. It was due time.
  • darkkindness2darkkindness2 Member Posts: 257 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    jonnymind wrote: »
    Oh come on, people. 5 front cannons and 16 base turn rate, and you'd like to tank? Really?


    And then, why not just adding a button "I win", that you can click at will after paying 50 bucks per click?

    No, that's not how decent games work. I'll tell you what this ship is for, and I hope you get it.

    This ship is for serious roleplaying (finally! a thing that this game WAS lacking). Whith this ship you HAVE to party. Get a friend with a cruiser, which will draw the fire, and a friend with a science, that will control the situation, and then you, with this shiny ship, can be the punch of the group.

    Wait for the cruiser to take fire and for the science to clear the field from fighters & small fires, and then you get in and punch a tac cube down in 2 seconds.

    Fail to coordinate with your team, and you're toasted.

    You didn't know when you bought this ship? -- bad for you; the 85 troop complement clearly states healing and shield recovery are bad. Exp when they are all dead (see the bar of live troop below your hud?)

    You thought this was a "you win" button and then you find out this is just another very specialized, social oriented, task-specific, fantastic ship? Oh, sorry. Go cry over your mom and ask for more money to buy something else that will make you look cool and kick a...es.

    Sorry for the rant, I usually don't drama, but hearing "bugs" and complains like "hey, how come I don't kick everyone's b..t with my new smart buy?"

    Be considerate. Paying in MMRPG can give you just some special ability and a better or more diverse gameplay style. They can't make you the king of the hill. Sorry for that, lads.

    --
    Also, kudos to devs. Finally, an escort that is really an "ESCORT" (the term means: help out and guard). With currently existing "escorts", you can easily do a group of 5 heavy escort carriers and they will take the mission home better than any other combination. With this ship, a group composed of, say, 1 science, 2 cruisers and 2 kumaris can really perform better than a group with just 5 generic escorts. It's a boost on diverse and cooperative gameplay. It was due time.

    No one has suggested that they want the Kumari escorts to be a tank that I've seen; what HAS been pointed out is that the shield modifier on them appears to be considerably lower than the tooltip points out, AND that they have a nerf to healing abilities that can't be explained with power level scaling. BOTH of these have been confirmed to be bugs by the devs, having something to do with the party leader level matching system doing something to the shields and healing abilities of the Kumari escorts.

    Pointing out that in-game performance does not match tooltip values is not whining for a buff, and the Kumari escorts will continue to be the most fragile ships in the game after the fix that has already been found for these bugs is applied.

    Again, bug reporting is NOT begging for an escort that can tank as well as a cruiser.

    Edit: Link to the Dev post confirming and describing the bugs, as well as that a solution has already been found - http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=8234921&postcount=11
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  • boglejam73boglejam73 Member Posts: 890 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    jonnymind wrote: »
    Oh come on, people. 5 front cannons and 16 base turn rate, and you'd like to tank? Really?


    And then, why not just adding a button "I win", that you can click at will after paying 50 bucks per click?

    No, that's not how decent games work. I'll tell you what this ship is for, and I hope you get it.

    This ship is for serious roleplaying (finally! a thing that this game WAS lacking). Whith this ship you HAVE to party. Get a friend with a cruiser, which will draw the fire, and a friend with a science, that will control the situation, and then you, with this shiny ship, can be the punch of the group.

    Wait for the cruiser to take fire and for the science to clear the field from fighters & small fires, and then you get in and punch a tac cube down in 2 seconds.

    Fail to coordinate with your team, and you're toasted.

    You didn't know when you bought this ship? -- bad for you; the 85 troop complement clearly states healing and shield recovery are bad. Exp when they are all dead (see the bar of live troop below your hud?)

    You thought this was a "you win" button and then you find out this is just another very specialized, social oriented, task-specific, fantastic ship? Oh, sorry. Go cry over your mom and ask for more money to buy something else that will make you look cool and kick a...es.

    Sorry for the rant, I usually don't drama, but hearing "bugs" and complains like "hey, how come I don't kick everyone's b..t with my new smart buy?"

    Be considerate. Paying in MMRPG can give you just some special ability and a better or more diverse gameplay style. They can't make you the king of the hill. Sorry for that, lads.

    --
    Also, kudos to devs. Finally, an escort that is really an "ESCORT" (the term means: help out and guard). With currently existing "escorts", you can easily do a group of 5 heavy escort carriers and they will take the mission home better than any other combination. With this ship, a group composed of, say, 1 science, 2 cruisers and 2 kumaris can really perform better than a group with just 5 generic escorts. It's a boost on diverse and cooperative gameplay. It was due time.

    Hey, great post. Only problem is the devs have already confirmed the shield/heal complaints as valid bugs, and is not simply a case of people begging for escort tank.

    Other than that - yeah, great post.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • jonnymindjonnymind Member Posts: 11
    edited February 2013
    Again, bug reporting is NOT begging for an escort that can tank as well as a cruiser.

    Edit: Link to the Dev post confirming and describing the bugs, as well as that a solution has already been found - http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=8234921&postcount=11

    Sorry, I didn't mean to mock everyone reporting a legit bug. But if you scroll the messages, there are really some (more than some, actually) talking along the lines I have indcated.


    Oh, and let me add: at last, this is a ship that's not just fun to fly with; it's a ship that makes teaming more fun for others. For a cruiser, it's not fun to draw fire when there's no one taking out the source of your pain FAST. That is, an escort like this can really be fun to fly WITH, not just INTO. It makes a great add, and things more fun, also if it's not YOU that is flying in it. It gives more value to the other roles as well, and that's absolutely what this game, and especially the escort role, was missing.
  • cpc2011acpc2011a Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Perhaps if ships were once again able to be tested on tribble, things like this might not happen. Might want to consider re-enabling that for the future Stahl.
  • zerobangzerobang Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    *sigh*

    what do we have the Tribble servers for again? testing stuff? ...doesn't look like it.

    not even the select minority like last time gets to test the ship... so we get another bugged release... another PR fail... probably another apology thread soon by dStahl for the latest QA fail.


    Good thing i asked around in game chat before i bought.


    Anyway the Bridge looks pretty good, got a bridge-invite and it looks pretty spot on, compared to what was seen on ENTERPRISE.

    But really... does the window in the captains quarter that looks out the BACK of the ship really have to show the same Planet and asteroid field, the exact same TEXTURE as the Viewscreen that looks in front of the ship !?

    That is the first thing that catches the eye, was it too hard to make a screenshot in any random system, turn the camera 180? around make another screenshot and use those 2?

    *ouch my immersion just ...died*



    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/qwo7enx1/_GameClient2013022122284452.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/86l5tilb/_GameClient2013022122292137.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/nyoti62y/_GameClient2013022122355496.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/p06o3d71/_GameClient2013022122372612.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/29iek7qj/_GameClient2013022122295750.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/ir2iuixg/_GameClient2013022122295427.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/vijh41n7/_GameClient2013022122322734.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/sl0gkkjd/_GameClient2013022122292826.jpg

    http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080924042208/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8a/Kumari_bridge.jpg
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • jcswwjcsww Member Posts: 6,835 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    cpc2011a wrote: »
    Perhaps if ships were once again able to be tested on tribble, things like this might not happen. Might want to consider re-enabling that for the future Stahl.

    If they did that, they would get twice the TRIBBLE for completely ignorning the feedback, bug reports, and suggestions from those who test it. :P
  • usscapitalusscapital Member Posts: 985 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    did they not let a few people test out the vesta on tribble ? , it seems odd to me they release these ships with out doing the same testing . no wonder they have problems which could have been avoided
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  • reconalpha1reconalpha1 Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    One thing if for sure, that once the bugs are fixed, this ship will be a heal hog; just like the BoP would be if it didn?t have its clocking ability.
  • tacofangstacofangs Member Posts: 2,951 Cryptic Developer
    edited February 2013
    zerobang wrote: »
    *sigh*

    what do we have the Tribble servers for again? testing stuff? ...doesn't look like it.

    not even the select minority like last time gets to test the ship... so we get another bugged release... another PR fail... probably another apology thread soon by dStahl for the latest QA fail.


    Good thing i asked around in game chat before i bought.


    Anyway the Bridge looks pretty good, got a bridge-invite and it looks pretty spot on, compared to what was seen on ENTERPRISE.

    But really... does the window in the captains quarter that looks out the BACK of the ship really have to show the same Planet and asteroid field, the exact same TEXTURE as the Viewscreen that looks in front of the ship !?

    That is the first thing that catches the eye, was it too hard to make a screenshot in any random system, turn the camera 180? around make another screenshot and use those 2?

    *ouch my immersion just ...died*



    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/qwo7enx1/_GameClient2013022122284452.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/86l5tilb/_GameClient2013022122292137.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/nyoti62y/_GameClient2013022122355496.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/p06o3d71/_GameClient2013022122372612.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/29iek7qj/_GameClient2013022122295750.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/ir2iuixg/_GameClient2013022122295427.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/vijh41n7/_GameClient2013022122322734.jpg
    http://i.imagebanana.com/img/sl0gkkjd/_GameClient2013022122292826.jpg

    http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080924042208/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8a/Kumari_bridge.jpg


    Those are both viewscreens. Neither is a window, so there is no reason they couldn't both show the same image.

    The ready room (and viewscreen) were modeled after Shran's ready room on the Kumari in Proving Ground.
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  • farmallmfarmallm Member Posts: 4,630 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    Very nice, Looking forward to buying one in the future. My Tactical Captain isn't up to level yet to use/enjoy the ship. Which is why I will buy one. Soon as I get her up to level. I will buy one.
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  • zerobangzerobang Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    Those are both viewscreens. Neither is a window, so there is no reason they couldn't both show the same image.

    The ready room (and viewscreen) were modeled after Shran's ready room on the Kumari in Proving Ground.


    Wow i thought you made that room up,
    you guys clearly did your Homework here :D

    *slaps google for not showing me THAT picture*

    and that also explains why the *window* is showing the same static snow as the Viewscreen (if you look real close).


    ...still it is a bit ...odd that a Viewscreen would be ...so deep inside the wall, just like a Window to look outside, one would expect a Screen to be on top of a wall... like a TV, but if it was like that in the Show then that is of course the way to do it!

    It is still a bit uhm misleading at first sight
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • weylandjuarezweylandjuarez Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    zerobang wrote: »
    Wow i thought you made that room up,
    you guys clearly did your Homework here :D

    *slaps google for not showing me THAT picture*

    and that also explains why the *window* is showing the same static snow as the Viewscreen (if you look real close).


    ...still it is a bit ...odd that a Viewscreen would be ...so deep inside the wall, just like a Window to look outside, one would expect a Screen to be on top of a wall... like a TV, but if it was like that in the Show then that is of course the way to do it!

    It is still a bit uhm misleading at first sight

    You've been Taco'ed :D
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  • tacofangstacofangs Member Posts: 2,951 Cryptic Developer
    edited February 2013
    Viewscreens in pretty much every show have been inset into the wall. They aren't separate pieces hung on a nail in the wall. They're built into the structure of the room.

    Admittedly, there was some fudging necessary on the Kumari bridge since they didn't show every angle of it. But I did my damnedest to keep it as faithful to what I could see in the show. I've got a couple folders full of screenshots I took watching Proving Ground, Babel One and a couple others.

    Here's another angle on Shran's ready room. I think you have to specifically search for "Kumari Ready Room" to get those, so no big deal.

    ETA: Thomas The Cat gets credit for all of the Andorian consoles and decals.

    ETA2: To my knowledge, there are only two other rooms on the Kumari ever shown. One is the room where they tortue a Vulcan in (I think) Awakening? And the other is some nonsense room that's broken/on fire at the beginning of Babel One.
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  • zerobangzerobang Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    i only want to know now where Shran hides his Xbox :D

    or... lets call it "Entertainment Provisions" ?
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  • aeolusdallasaeolusdallas Member Posts: 143 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    i just read like 4 bug reports in the forums about these ships and a developer commented on them. bottom line is that these ships are easily killed if you stay away from its 45 degree front arc. sounds like these new ships are squishy. i thought they were going to be better then the vista ships but i guess i was wrong.

    They have been described as Glass Cannons from the very beginning..................
  • superherofansuperherofan Member Posts: 342 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I'm glad I found out about the cannon abilities being affected by the consoles. I was totally planning on picking up the 3-pack...

    ETA: At least the bridge from the screencaps don't have BOFFs that either float or have their legs go into the ground.
  • felderburgfelderburg Member Posts: 854 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    What are those weird dark lines in the middle of the blue wall panels?
  • crypticarmsmancrypticarmsman Member Posts: 4,115 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    Viewscreens in pretty much every show have been inset into the wall. They aren't separate pieces hung on a nail in the wall. They're built into the structure of the room.

    Admittedly, there was some fudging necessary on the Kumari bridge since they didn't show every angle of it. But I did my damnedest to keep it as faithful to what I could see in the show. I've got a couple folders full of screenshots I took watching Proving Ground, Babel One and a couple others.

    Here's another angle on Shran's ready room. I think you have to specifically search for "Kumari Ready Room" to get those, so no big deal.

    ETA: Thomas The Cat gets credit for all of the Andorian consoles and decals.

    ETA2: To my knowledge, there are only two other rooms on the Kumari ever shown. One is the room where they tortue a Vulcan in (I think) Awakening? And the other is some nonsense room that's broken/on fire at the beginning of Babel One.

    Um, the 'nonsense room' on fire at the beginning of "Babel One" were the remains of its Bridge after being attacked 9an attack which ultimatelt led to the destruction of the ship. ;)
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  • sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 382 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    pyryck wrote: »
    "Squishy" = "Glass cannon" = trade defense for an exceptional offense

    Andorian ships are better than VEsta in terms of firepower output especially in a massive alpha strike.

    Andorian ships are not as good as VEsta at mitigating incoming return fire.

    Thank You, Sir! Escorts trade durability/staying power for overwhelming firepower and maneuverability. This is nothing new and not a bug. These new ships may have a boat load of bugs, but that ain't one of them. Ships are designed to meet the criteria of their mission profiles/combat roles, it real life and any game worth its salt.

    Bugs are fixable, not a horrific plague that merits anyone killing themselves, or for that matter going all "drama queen" on the forums. If you want to act like you're two years old, don't do it here. Intelligent responses carry more weight and yeild better results than any temper tantrum.

    That said i still want to get these new Escorts, eventually. :cool:
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  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    Admittedly, there was some fudging necessary on the Kumari bridge since they didn't show every angle of it. But I did my damnedest to keep it as faithful to what I could see in the show. I've got a couple folders full of screenshots I took watching Proving Ground, Babel One and a couple others.

    Aha, so you're the one responsible for this! ;) Nice work Taco, I visited the bridge of a friend that already got it and when I saw that you've recreated Shran's ready room I jumped out of my chair. :P I was getting these ships anyway, but seing that made my day.
    From an ENT fan, thank you for making it authentic to what we've seen in the show, that just makes this ship that much more enjoyable.
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  • cyjetcyjet Member Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    I'm new to STO so i didn't have much expirience with ZEN ships to compare.

    But i've bought a package of those today, my first ZEN ship. And to me it's incredible :) A good design, and capabilities - to hit hard :)
    I've transferred 2500 ZEN about a week ago to buy a good ship at last. It's was such a pain to choose one... Nothing was trully satisfying. And then those ships apears on the store - EXACTLY what i was looking for. So i paid for additional 2500... Pure damage. And SO MUCH FUN to fly :) From the beginning of the game my tactic was to kill the enemies before they inflict too much damage. And i've died a lot anyway.

    In solo PvE i want to kill things faster, and with good equip it's not too hard to survive.
    In STO... Well, there should be someone else to tank or heal. When the group is bad, we're screwed anyway...

    The not very pleasing thing is that the abilities sets cannons abilities on the cooldown.

    And i expected a ground costumes with the ships as the news says... But i already heard that this is the ship "costumes".

    And... I'm newbie, but if i'm understand it correctly, i shouldn't bother about those very rare Andorian phasers because our 4th tier fleet ones have better DPS? Or there is something special about them...
  • usscapitalusscapital Member Posts: 985 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    just purchased the kumari or what ever it is called lol , not a bad ship tbh but i prefer cruiser's myself .
    how does it compair to the jem'hadar bug ship (fire power etc) ?
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  • tacofangstacofangs Member Posts: 2,951 Cryptic Developer
    edited February 2013
    Um, the 'nonsense room' on fire at the beginning of "Babel One" were the remains of its Bridge after being attacked 9an attack which ultimatelt led to the destruction of the ship. ;)

    That's not the bridge though. In the background, you can see the same door that they used in the torture room (with the silver swoops), which is NOT present on the Kumari Bridge. Those doors flank the viewscreen, which they do not on the kumari Bridge, and the viewscreen is the wrong shape. Hence, Nonsense room.
    shpoks wrote: »
    Aha, so you're the one responsible for this! ;) Nice work Taco, I visited the bridge of a friend that already got it and when I saw that you've recreated Shran's ready room I jumped out of my chair. :P I was getting these ships anyway, but seing that made my day.
    From an ENT fan, thank you for making it authentic to what we've seen in the show, that just makes this ship that much more enjoyable.

    Glad you like it! It's always hard when it comes to something like this. The ship is ancient by 2409 standards, and JamJamz spiced up the exteriors to fit iin today. The bridge SHOULD have been upgraded significantly by now. But. . . we're fans, and we want to see what we saw on the shows. . .
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  • themariethemarie Member Posts: 1,055 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    That's not the bridge though. In the background, you can see the same door that they used in the torture room (with the silver swoops), which is NOT present on the Kumari Bridge. Those doors flank the viewscreen, which they do not on the kumari Bridge, and the viewscreen is the wrong shape. Hence, Nonsense room.



    Glad you like it! It's always hard when it comes to something like this. The ship is ancient by 2409 standards, and JamJamz spiced up the exteriors to fit iin today. The bridge SHOULD have been upgraded significantly by now. But. . . we're fans, and we want to see what we saw on the shows. . .

    The artwork is superb, both inside and out. I just expect things to work properly out of the box, especially when I drop cash on it.

    That's not your department though... ;)
  • neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    Viewscreens in pretty much every show have been inset into the wall. They aren't separate pieces hung on a nail in the wall. They're built into the structure of the room.

    Admittedly, there was some fudging necessary on the Kumari bridge since they didn't show every angle of it. But I did my damnedest to keep it as faithful to what I could see in the show. I've got a couple folders full of screenshots I took watching Proving Ground, Babel One and a couple others.

    Here's another angle on Shran's ready room. I think you have to specifically search for "Kumari Ready Room" to get those, so no big deal.

    ETA: Thomas The Cat gets credit for all of the Andorian consoles and decals.

    ETA2: To my knowledge, there are only two other rooms on the Kumari ever shown. One is the room where they tortue a Vulcan in (I think) Awakening? And the other is some nonsense room that's broken/on fire at the beginning of Babel One.

    Them shelves look mighty empty :D
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  • crypticarmsmancrypticarmsman Member Posts: 4,115 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    That's not the bridge though. In the background, you can see the same door that they used in the torture room (with the silver swoops), which is NOT present on the Kumari Bridge. Those doors flank the viewscreen, which they do not on the kumari Bridge, and the viewscreen is the wrong shape. Hence, Nonsense room.

    I stand corrected sir (good eye for detail); and it shows in the work you do; which has always been phenomenal. :D
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  • shield309shield309 Member Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    If this is posted somewhere I apologize in advance but I was looking for some commenting from the designers on the intent of the wing cannons. The DPS is more or less similar to other cannons with the big individual hit and slow rate of fire. I assume they are to provide the brig crits.
  • tradiktradik Member Posts: 86 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    tacofangs wrote: »
    ..snip...

    I rarely get a chance to commend staff, but here it is: Taco, great job on the bridge. Seriously. The ship is beautiful, inside and out.

    We were spending time last night comparing it to screencaps from the Show, and, acknowledging the fact that he Show ship is a Battlecruiser, IIRC, the Escort version bridge would be a little smaller with less stations, and you nailed it. I didn't even see the ready room the first visit I made to it...an invited fleetmate actually discovered it to my pleasant surprise.

    Exterior wise, it captured the Andorian look, and the material skins are sweet. The minor differences in the three variants give it just enough creative license for the owner, and some unique character.
  • psymantispsymantis Member Posts: 329 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    It's people like Mr Taco that are the reason I still play this game. Now if only we could clone him and staff the whole place with them.
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