Well they need to think loong term vs short term money but it seems people are happy enough to buy keys instead of ships..
^^^
They are - if there was verifiable proof that putting a ship in the C-Store generated more Zen sales then putting the same ship in a lockbox and selling Master Keys - then the ship WOULD be in the C-Store, and the lockbox system we have would disappear from the game.
The more profit you can generate, the BETTER your 'long term' outlook. If it even does get to the point where Master keys don't sell at a rate considered very profitable, they'll disappear.
Cryptic is still one of a handful of MMO developers still hiring (and not laying off a percentage of Dev staff or closing shop) - so I'd say whatever they're doing with regard to profits generation is working for them and keeping their parent company (PWE) happy.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
You're being exploited by engaging in a completely voluntary system? No one is forcing you to buy lobi's, or the stuff in the lobi store.
THIS.
You can complete ALL PvE content with the free RA ships and mk XI white equipment. Anything better than that is vanity only. Anything better than that is just for efficiency and getting it is 100% voluntary. Sufficed to say, if you get anything better, then you WILL have to pay for it. And it's still entirely voluntary since it's not necessary.
And guess what? You can get mk XI white equipment from vendors on ESD and QS for pretty cheap. You can buy mk XI white deflectors, engines, and shields for relatively cheap, and the same goes for consoles. Which requires no lobi, no lock-box keys, nothing more than 200k ECs.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
The point is ones ability to use the Lobi as they wish, not determining whether or not it is warranted or required. This always seems to be a major sticking point.
As you state, I volunteer. Likewise, I pay real money to get the Lobi from opening boxes. So not letting me use what I have already purchased and requiring me to purchase more is an exploit by Cryptic against me, a customer. It is also against anyone else using this system in this situtation.
In this example, it would be the same thing as not being able to move energy credits from one character to another, dillithium from one character to another, or inventory from one character to another. Note how the last three are all possible, but not moving the Lobi.
Do you do any of these three items in your regular game play?
Do you see any reason why I shouldn't be able to use a fourth system, even if you don't?
So not letting me use what I have already purchased and requiring me to purchase more is an exploit by Cryptic against me, a customer.
I do not think that word means what you think it does... All this means is that you didn't plan properly and loaded all your lobi on one character, knowing full well that you couldn't move them to a different one.
Is this a means of getting you to spend more money? Not only yes, but hell yes it is. But that is also something you chose to do, and as such means you are not being exploited by anyone.
You can not be a victim if you agree to take part in the first place.
Convice everyone silly enough to buy keys to stop (or at least enough to not make it worth while).
They are certainly expoliting innate human nature of lust to have the latest and best on anything..yes even in a "virtual" world and some who need to have it...will eventually.
True but sad...just at this moment as they launched the dominion boxes...there are lots of people who already opened over 200 boxes...if you dont believe it read it on other threads...not even 2 hrs from launching time and Cryptic already making a "great" profit on those who need to have it...addictive isn't it but smart business plan. Dont get me wrong...and there is nothing wrong about it...but if you see it for what it is... a huge "money maker" for them :cool:
They are certainly expoliting innate human nature of lust to have the latest and best on anything..yes even in a "virtual" world and some who need to have it...will eventually.
To take advantage of a (person, situation, etc) unethically or unjustly for ones own ends.
As in not allowing you to use Lobi that you already purchased and forcing you to purchase more.
So it means exactly what I think it does. Strike 1.
Your rest of your argument assumes that the items were available in the Lobi store before I obtained the Lobi. Not that case. I had the Lobi before the augmentation kit was available. Assuming - strike two.
I didn't purchase the temperal lock boxes because there wasn't anything that I wanted and I had all this Lobi already. that is when the augmentation kit came to the Lobi store. Also, this same system is being used for the Jem Hadar sets.
Like I said, everybody seems to have the same sticking point that they just can't get pasted...
To take advantage of a (person, situation, etc) unethically or unjustly for ones own ends.
As in not allowing you to use Lobi that you already purchased and forcing you to purchase more.
So it means exactly what I think it does. Strike 1.
Your rest of your argument assumes that the items were available in the Lobi store before I obtained the Lobi. Not that case. I had the Lobi before the augmentation kit was available. Assuming - strike two.
I didn't purchase the temperal lock boxes because there wasn't anything that I wanted and I had all this Lobi already. that is when the augmentation kit came to the Lobi store. Also, this same system is being used for the Jem Hadar sets.
Like I said, everybody seems to have the same sticking point that they just can't get pasted...
There are reasons Lobi was made character bound. It's very simply too easy to farm it. You can in theory constantly make new characters and farm that starter lobi over and over. If you do this 5 times a day for a week, you have 35 lobi. You do this for a whole year you have ~1500 lobi. They can't be having that.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
To take advantage of a (person, situation, etc) unethically or unjustly for ones own ends.
As in not allowing you to use Lobi that you already purchased and forcing you to purchase more.
So it means exactly what I think it does. Strike 1.
Not true - they state UP FRONT an Lobi acquired by a character is bound to that character. Thus they ARE NOT restricting you from using that Lobi as they outlined. You agreed to that when you used a Master Key to open a lockbox. (Also, buying Master Keys and using them is not required to Level up, or do any in game mission or PvP content.)
Again, if you agree to participate; and do participate, it's not exploitation. You could have (before using any keys) even mailed Master Keys and Lockboxes acquired by the character that already had Lobi; to another character that you want to start amassing Lobi on - but again, having rules stated and in place BEFORE you decide to participate; and after knowing the situation, you CONTINUE to participate does not equal 'exploitation'.
(And BTW - I'm no lover or defender of Lockboxes as I've never purchased a Master Key in any fashion, or even had, or used one to open a Lockbox to date. That said, I am a big believer is taking/owning up to the actions you take. As long as a majority of the STO playerbase countinue to purchase Zen, and buy Master Keys with that Zen to the point that Cryptic/PWE continuues to see the paradigm is EXTREMELY profitable; the paradigm will continue -- and the players have no one to blame but themselves.)
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
To take advantage of a (person, situation, etc) unethically or unjustly for ones own ends.
As in not allowing you to use Lobi that you already purchased and forcing you to purchase more.
So it means exactly what I think it does. Strike 1.
You cite, and I emphasize, "not allowing use of Lobi". Has Cryptic revoked your ability to spend lobi?
Since it's release, Lobi has been character bound. As such, an implicit agreement is made upon it's purchase that, as long as it remains character bound, the currency can only be used for the benefit of the currency-possessing character, not the whole account.
If there is any chance that a claim of "unethicalness" can be made, it would be against you for attempting to change Cryptic's definition of "character bound" for your own benefit.
Your rest of your argument assumes that the items were available in the Lobi store before I obtained the Lobi. Not that case. I had the Lobi before the augmentation kit was available. Assuming - strike two.
I didn't purchase the temperal lock boxes because there wasn't anything that I wanted and I had all this Lobi already. that is when the augmentation kit came to the Lobi store. Also, this same system is being used for the Jem Hadar sets.
Which beggars the following questions:
1: At what time did you accumulate this stockpile of Lobi?
2: Considering that the first Augmentation pack, Crystal Nanofiber, was released character bound with the Tholian Lockbox (coincidentally, the second lockbox to contain lobi at-launch), the precedent was set that future augmentation packs would most likely be character bound, too. Common sense indicates that Character bound currency & character bound service = only benefiting a character with sufficient stockpiles of said character bound currency, and 2 toons wanting service = 2 toons needing stockpile of currency...
Like I said, everybody seems to have the same sticking point that they just can't get pasted...
Yeah, our "sticking point" is a seeming lack of comprehension of the limits of "character bound".
I'm thinking of you, in that I can see a slight case of you maybe getting away with this if your entire stockpiles of lobi was built in the short timeframe that the Ferengi lockbox was the only lobi-spitting lockbox. However, you do realize that at that time Lobi was clearly a "minor consolation prize" seemingly intended to help get past certain countries laws against online gambling - by adding an item/currency that has a clear monetary value, they can say that your $1.25 master key opening a random in-game box gave you at least $.75 worth of "lobi crystals" + $.50 minimum worth of booster/mini DOff pack/ship/console/grand prize ship/whatever box spits out at you - by returning a minimum value equal to the initial investment, there is no loss, and therefore most "online gambling" laws do not apply...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
You assume the use of force is a condition for exploitation. That assumption is wrong.
No, not at all. Again, Lobi is NOT required to fully play STO mission/event content, nor is it required for anything with regard to character leveling, or the Fleet or the Reputation system. It is COMPLETELY optional (and up to the individual player) -- AND the terms regarding it's acquisition and use in game are clearly stated BEFORE a player purchases/uses it.
^^^
Given alol that, it's not 'explotation' as you go into the situation knowing full well what the terms are. If you don't like said terms, don't acquire/use Lobi.
You seem to define 'explotation' as 'anything I don't like that costs me currency (in game or otherwise)'.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Comments
Convice everyone silly enough to buy keys to stop (or at least enough to not make it worth while).
^^^
They are - if there was verifiable proof that putting a ship in the C-Store generated more Zen sales then putting the same ship in a lockbox and selling Master Keys - then the ship WOULD be in the C-Store, and the lockbox system we have would disappear from the game.
The more profit you can generate, the BETTER your 'long term' outlook. If it even does get to the point where Master keys don't sell at a rate considered very profitable, they'll disappear.
Cryptic is still one of a handful of MMO developers still hiring (and not laying off a percentage of Dev staff or closing shop) - so I'd say whatever they're doing with regard to profits generation is working for them and keeping their parent company (PWE) happy.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
You're being exploited by engaging in a completely voluntary system? No one is forcing you to buy lobi's, or the stuff in the lobi store.
THIS.
You can complete ALL PvE content with the free RA ships and mk XI white equipment. Anything better than that is vanity only. Anything better than that is just for efficiency and getting it is 100% voluntary. Sufficed to say, if you get anything better, then you WILL have to pay for it. And it's still entirely voluntary since it's not necessary.
And guess what? You can get mk XI white equipment from vendors on ESD and QS for pretty cheap. You can buy mk XI white deflectors, engines, and shields for relatively cheap, and the same goes for consoles. Which requires no lobi, no lock-box keys, nothing more than 200k ECs.
As you state, I volunteer. Likewise, I pay real money to get the Lobi from opening boxes. So not letting me use what I have already purchased and requiring me to purchase more is an exploit by Cryptic against me, a customer. It is also against anyone else using this system in this situtation.
In this example, it would be the same thing as not being able to move energy credits from one character to another, dillithium from one character to another, or inventory from one character to another. Note how the last three are all possible, but not moving the Lobi.
Do you do any of these three items in your regular game play?
Do you see any reason why I shouldn't be able to use a fourth system, even if you don't?
I do not think that word means what you think it does... All this means is that you didn't plan properly and loaded all your lobi on one character, knowing full well that you couldn't move them to a different one.
Is this a means of getting you to spend more money? Not only yes, but hell yes it is. But that is also something you chose to do, and as such means you are not being exploited by anyone.
You can not be a victim if you agree to take part in the first place.
They are certainly expoliting innate human nature of lust to have the latest and best on anything..yes even in a "virtual" world and some who need to have it...will eventually.
True but sad...just at this moment as they launched the dominion boxes...there are lots of people who already opened over 200 boxes...if you dont believe it read it on other threads...not even 2 hrs from launching time and Cryptic already making a "great" profit on those who need to have it...addictive isn't it but smart business plan. Dont get me wrong...and there is nothing wrong about it...but if you see it for what it is... a huge "money maker" for them :cool:
ROFL. Did NOT expect to see this kind of reference on a SciFi based game forum.
To take advantage of a (person, situation, etc) unethically or unjustly for ones own ends.
As in not allowing you to use Lobi that you already purchased and forcing you to purchase more.
So it means exactly what I think it does. Strike 1.
Your rest of your argument assumes that the items were available in the Lobi store before I obtained the Lobi. Not that case. I had the Lobi before the augmentation kit was available. Assuming - strike two.
I didn't purchase the temperal lock boxes because there wasn't anything that I wanted and I had all this Lobi already. that is when the augmentation kit came to the Lobi store. Also, this same system is being used for the Jem Hadar sets.
Like I said, everybody seems to have the same sticking point that they just can't get pasted...
There are reasons Lobi was made character bound. It's very simply too easy to farm it. You can in theory constantly make new characters and farm that starter lobi over and over. If you do this 5 times a day for a week, you have 35 lobi. You do this for a whole year you have ~1500 lobi. They can't be having that.
Not true - they state UP FRONT an Lobi acquired by a character is bound to that character. Thus they ARE NOT restricting you from using that Lobi as they outlined. You agreed to that when you used a Master Key to open a lockbox. (Also, buying Master Keys and using them is not required to Level up, or do any in game mission or PvP content.)
Again, if you agree to participate; and do participate, it's not exploitation. You could have (before using any keys) even mailed Master Keys and Lockboxes acquired by the character that already had Lobi; to another character that you want to start amassing Lobi on - but again, having rules stated and in place BEFORE you decide to participate; and after knowing the situation, you CONTINUE to participate does not equal 'exploitation'.
(And BTW - I'm no lover or defender of Lockboxes as I've never purchased a Master Key in any fashion, or even had, or used one to open a Lockbox to date. That said, I am a big believer is taking/owning up to the actions you take. As long as a majority of the STO playerbase countinue to purchase Zen, and buy Master Keys with that Zen to the point that Cryptic/PWE continuues to see the paradigm is EXTREMELY profitable; the paradigm will continue -- and the players have no one to blame but themselves.)
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
You cite, and I emphasize, "not allowing use of Lobi". Has Cryptic revoked your ability to spend lobi?
Since it's release, Lobi has been character bound. As such, an implicit agreement is made upon it's purchase that, as long as it remains character bound, the currency can only be used for the benefit of the currency-possessing character, not the whole account.
If there is any chance that a claim of "unethicalness" can be made, it would be against you for attempting to change Cryptic's definition of "character bound" for your own benefit.
Which beggars the following questions:
1: At what time did you accumulate this stockpile of Lobi?
2: Considering that the first Augmentation pack, Crystal Nanofiber, was released character bound with the Tholian Lockbox (coincidentally, the second lockbox to contain lobi at-launch), the precedent was set that future augmentation packs would most likely be character bound, too. Common sense indicates that Character bound currency & character bound service = only benefiting a character with sufficient stockpiles of said character bound currency, and 2 toons wanting service = 2 toons needing stockpile of currency...
Yeah, our "sticking point" is a seeming lack of comprehension of the limits of "character bound".
I'm thinking of you, in that I can see a slight case of you maybe getting away with this if your entire stockpiles of lobi was built in the short timeframe that the Ferengi lockbox was the only lobi-spitting lockbox. However, you do realize that at that time Lobi was clearly a "minor consolation prize" seemingly intended to help get past certain countries laws against online gambling - by adding an item/currency that has a clear monetary value, they can say that your $1.25 master key opening a random in-game box gave you at least $.75 worth of "lobi crystals" + $.50 minimum worth of booster/mini DOff pack/ship/console/grand prize ship/whatever box spits out at you - by returning a minimum value equal to the initial investment, there is no loss, and therefore most "online gambling" laws do not apply...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
No, not at all. Again, Lobi is NOT required to fully play STO mission/event content, nor is it required for anything with regard to character leveling, or the Fleet or the Reputation system. It is COMPLETELY optional (and up to the individual player) -- AND the terms regarding it's acquisition and use in game are clearly stated BEFORE a player purchases/uses it.
^^^
Given alol that, it's not 'explotation' as you go into the situation knowing full well what the terms are. If you don't like said terms, don't acquire/use Lobi.
You seem to define 'explotation' as 'anything I don't like that costs me currency (in game or otherwise)'.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."