Well, acetone assimilators do a small amount of AoE damage over their lifetime, which is sufficient to work as "point defense" vs mines and heavy torps.
Well if that isn't just the most annoying thing ever. Only 1 weapon type in the game can kill them, and you have to waste a high yield volley on them to make sure they go down. It's like you have to carry every freakin' weapon and potential boff layout in the game if you actually want a chance at surviving. I'm sure this is old news to you vets, but man it seems like a lot of work just to be able to pew some peeps.
faced the klingons in a shuttle and won a few times
defense point turret - tell evberyone on the team - "hey , put in a defense point turret"
if everyone had a defense point turret like the masked shuttle man then sextra ships get exploded and you donlt have to cray home to mama and can try to win
in a shuttle, with maybe one or two players not afraid to lose
its being seen losing that bothers most peolp[l -not losing
faced the klingons in a shuttle and won a few times
defense point turret - tell evberyone on the team - "hey , put in a defense point turret"
if everyone had a defense point turret like the masked shuttle man then sextra ships get exploded and you donlt have to cray home to mama and can try to win
in a shuttle, with maybe one or two players not afraid to lose
its being seen losing that bothers most peolp[l -not losing
which may be more fruitful or somethng and if not then at least an attempt at tactics that are not "run like a yellow belly and complain with words"
oh yeha, how to counter the siphon thing and klinks
one tactic is psychologivcal, type all kinds of stuff in zones, get them mad or somethng and have them focus everyitng on a fast ship , preferabley a shuttle
that lures away stuff
and never attavck, let thme attack, and run, run some more and head for rocks - you choose the ground
this is be superior to floating in a circle and exploding and then quitting after rays from floating apparati are hitting all over the place
the best makeup tream wise is someone with a brain and like a couple others in whatever ship
thats what he would have said iuf he knew english and played star trek online pvp
no beam no matter hpw strong can go through a giant floating space rock
the first wave of torpedo planes that attacked the jhapanese at midway all gots blown up
fortunatley the other pilots didn;t point their craft in the other direction and cry home to mama
Nah, the Feddies just use their sci spam BS and subsystem targeting to disable and hold ships while bludgeoning them to death. They don't need energy draining.
I love it when Feddies complain about KDF drain abilities, but don't seem to see a problem with pre-made sci spamming teams that also toss in a few pay-to-win abilities (graviton pulse being one). I don't do either, tbh. The only P2W I use is Impulse Capacitance Cell (which can be overcome with sci spam or subnukes). Other than that, I just rely on decloak alphastrikes, skill, and a bit of luck.
wow troll posting much? my buddy muz has a sphion carrier build. sub target with energy sphion with aa and leach. dude are you nuts? all feds have in terms of lame consoles is ams. not counting TRIBBLE from lock boxes. trust me klinks cry all the time because pvp takes so long for them to pop. thought they would learn by now its just not a fun game......
Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
I have always been a strong supporter of using the skills availble to a player/team to the best degree, and win on it. Energy drains is just the newest trend, CPB+Tachyon before that. Then its just up to the opposing player/team to find some counter to it and take it from there. People who complain and whine about it, and do not adapt are called scrubs and deserves to be defeated, over and over.
BUT...
The second note.
Problem with the drain builds is that there are no viable hard counters to it. With the introduction of a new skill set that adds resistance to sci powers (which i find utterly ridiculous) this will only provide a soft passive mitigated counter, where the are no real active abilities to prevent getting annihilated. A good balanced game provides abilties to use and active abilities to counter it with. Unfortuantly there are none here. A second problem is that this build is a klingon only build causing pvp imbalance, and makes FvK pvp matches moot as the feds cant do **** to counter it. Another growing trend as ive seen and experienced is that certain Fed fleets (which i wont mention) is starting to adapt a mini version of the energy drain builds, and is rather encouarging people to use it then dettering.
The solution:
If you cant beat them, join them is the slogan for many. As mentioned before using an energy drain build to counter it could work but can you imagine how loooooooooong those matches will last when no one is capable of doing anything? Add them doffs to the picture and you can play for 1 hour and the score is still 0-0. Hardly fun and hardly a solution. A second solution will be to remove aceton assimilators, plasmonic leech and the energy siphon drones from the game completly , problem solved. It will restore balance to the game and FvK pvp will have meaning. A third possible solution as being enforced today is to sanction both feds and klinks using explicit energy drain builds to win.
Conculsion:
Cryptic, get your **** together and stop giving one side the advantage, cause you cant find a proper solution on how to fix klinks! What makes you think you can release romulans as a playable faction when you cant fix klinks who has been there from day 1?
Edit:
Restore the game back to 1.2! Everything got screwed past that.
Co-founder of The Spanish Inquisition TSI - Cause no one expects it!
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
The KDF has the Carrier drain builds and the feds have the Carrier TB+BTsS lockdown builds.
The TB danube shuttles where tweaked when they where too OP and the Siphon drones, Aceton assimilator and even the Plasmonic leech have all been nerfed as well from when they where OP.
I don't see what all the whining is about.
The OP got beat by a team that was built to a purpose of a single game mechanic.
That is all. No OP, No exploitation, NO special "KDF" advantage.
Its like crying over being Focus Fired upon in PvP as being OP.
Would the game not be better if these 3 items were entirely removed from the game and the previous owners of them compensated in dilithium/zen?
No. If the KDF is to lose out on some items that the community finds to be too much, then the feds can lose the same amount as per the community finds to be too much, like danube TB shuttles or some such.
wow troll posting much? my buddy muz has a sphion carrier build. sub target with energy sphion with aa and leach. dude are you nuts? all feds have in terms of lame consoles is ams. not counting TRIBBLE from lock boxes. trust me klinks cry all the time because pvp takes so long for them to pop. thought they would learn by now its just not a fun game......
Nah, I'm just pointing out that a lot of Feddies like to whine about how 'OP' the KDF is without really taking a look at their own methods. I've personally experienced these sci-spam teams, and they are rather effective. Again, you have to have a competent and prolific cross-healing cruiser or sci-based ship around to really try combating it, because they throw around more disables and confuses than most ships can really counter (trying to carry just one copy of sci team along with 1-2 tactical teams is a pain in the butt). That kind of setup usually only happens with pre-mades.
My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
It's like you have to carry every freakin' weapon and potential boff layout in the game if you actually want a chance at surviving.
Exactly. The PvP game is designed for teamwork through build choices working to a team dynamic but sponsors solo play and when that teamwork dynamic is finally needed at the endgame, the weeks of solo play have spoiled the chance of any good teaming becuase everybody is only playing for themselves and one can't counter all builds by oneself.
what i will say is pandas have met these builds and has beaten them, its about team deliverance and anti power builds.
What and who Pandas or TSI or whatever top notch fleet can beat is irelevant. The issue is that an average klink team can run energy drain builds and beat any fed fleet, (mayhap not the very best of the fed fleets) and that is alarming as it breaks pvp play.
What would be more beneficial and helpful to the pvp community is to provide information as to how and what to do when encountering this setup. That approach is more useful then saying that >insert fed/klink team here< can beat said energy drain build and not telling how. Its sounds so arrogant and so DoB like. And a repeat of DoB is the last this community needs.
And this goes for everyone.
Co-founder of The Spanish Inquisition TSI - Cause no one expects it!
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
Just to remind that siphon drones r totaly broken TRIBBLE.
Right. Becuase you are suppossed to survive being focus fired upon by a Drain team and suffer little or no effect from having multiple drain powers on you from more than one foe (at least 4 by my count).
Thats like me being attacked by 4 feds and saying DPS is unfair becuase I died.
Exactly. The PvP game is designed for teamwork through build choices working to a team dynamic but sponsors solo play and when that teamwork dynamic is finally needed at the endgame, the weeks of solo play have spoiled the chance of any good teaming becuase everybody is only playing for themselves and one can't counter all builds by oneself.
That doesnt sound logical. If u dont know what ur enemie brings to the match u cant make any smart choice. And if ur pugging u would need about 5 minutes first just to form ur team.
Right. Becuase you are suppossed to survive being focus fired upon by a Drain team and suffer little or no effect from having multiple drain powers on you from more than one foe.
I hope ur just kidding me. But these Bops firing at me r just awful and the carriers is running high aux but im sure as a pvper u know this
Assimilators are quite annoying, really don't do anything on my ship. I haven't had too much contact with people using Siphon drones myself. Just annoyed i can't use mines when ever some one is spamming **** loads of A. Assims.
Only time I PvP is in Ker'rat, quite fun. And yes I'm one of those sci captains, who gravity well ya, then give ya 1 subnuke, target shields, partical burst and mine ya.
It works sometimes hehe. TRIBBLE KDF ganging up on the poor sci captain! But I do love seeing those Vo'Quv carriers. They're so easy to blow up.
Quote about STO on consoles: "Not quite as bad as No man's sky, but a close second."
That doesnt sound logical. If u dont know what ur enemie brings to the match u cant make any smart choice. And if ur pugging u would need about 5 minutes first just to form ur team.
Sucks, yes. Thats life in the PuGs.
The other guys pugging are not going to send you a letter saying what they intend to field anymore than you plan to let them know in advance what you intend to use.
Thats life not on a team and is the very nature of what it means to PuG.
PuG = you take your chances on what you may have to fight next. If its a formed team set to a certain dynamic of gameplay, be it teamwork or drain or Carrier spam or Sci spam or whatever, then your chances of victory drop dramatically unless your PuG team has the right abilities and knows how to use them.
I hope ur just kidding me. But these Bops firing at me r just awful and the carriers is running high aux but im sure as a pvper u know this
I expect it becuase I do PvP.
If I fight a team in Kerrat or anywhere I expect the fed Crusiers to use EWP, heal the escorts and use whatever they have to win. Just like I expect those fed escorts to fight, run, return and focus fire on targets and the Scienc ships SNB me and attempt to CC me.
Its a team and I expect them to fight like one unit and compliment each other.
You fought a team that was focus firing on you with everything they had, of course you will suffer and die becuase you are one player and can not be expected to fight a team of people on your on.
Sucks, yes. Thats life in the PuGs.
The other guys pugging are not going to send you a letter saying what they intend to field anymore than you plan to let them know in advance what you intend to use.
Thats life not on a team and is the very nature of what it means to PuG.
PuG = you take your chances on what you may have to fight next. If its a formed team set to a certain dynamic of gameplay, be it teamwork or drain or Carrier spam or Sci spam or whatever, then your chances of victory drop dramatically unless your PuG team has the right abilities and knows how to use them.
Yeah that sucks. But i like pugging. U never know what will happen.
But as i told. This game is not primary team based (even if a lot of players think it is).
I expect it becuase I do PvP.
If I fight a team in Kerrat or anywhere I expect the fed Crusiers to use EWP, heal the escorts and use whatever they have to win. Just like I expect those fed escorts to fight, run, return and focus fire on targets and the Scienc ships SNB me and attempt to CC me.
Its a team and I expect them to fight like one unit and compliment each other.
You fought a team that was focus firing on you with everything they had, of course you will suffer and die becuase you are one player and can not be expected to fight a team of people on your on.
U missed the point. The siphon drones r broken because u cant gain any power from abilities that say u will get x amount of shield power if u use eptsx or +25 in all subsystems if u use epts power transfer.
And if u get drained u cant kill the drones with AoE because ur beams got no power and torps will do nearly no dmg as long as the drones shields r up.
Yep, he was tanking them fine until those siphons got added to the mix. He couldn't do jack then; 20 power for each subsystem across the board for him.
So you're saying if you have 6 power insulators and you're in the middle of a field of aceton assimilators, it drains nothing? I find that hard to believe, but at this point anything is possible it seems. And where in its description does it say that aceton assimilators magically gobble up mines? Mines should counter assimilators, not the other way around. I wonder if this aspect of them is working as intended or if it's some strange bug that just happens to make mines useless against assimilator users.
They do not stack if you have two assimilators from the same player. I'd imagine it wouldn't stack if there were more than one player using it, since the leech console doesn't stack either, no?
Well if that isn't just the most annoying thing ever. Only 1 weapon type in the game can kill them, and you have to waste a high yield volley on them to make sure they go down. It's like you have to carry every freakin' weapon and potential boff layout in the game if you actually want a chance at surviving. I'm sure this is old news to you vets, but man it seems like a lot of work just to be able to pew some peeps.
You could always fly away. Or ignore them. If no one is shooting at it, the radiation damage is very low. If someone uses FAW (which was why I use it), then everyone pays for it. Sounds fair to me.
Assimilators are quite annoying, really don't do anything on my ship. I haven't had too much contact with people using Siphon drones myself. Just annoyed i can't use mines when ever some one is spamming **** loads of A. Assims.
Pre mine buff, I used it to punish FAW spammers. Post mine buff, I now use it to keep those annoying tricobalt mines in check. It's a legitimate counter.
I should probably just link previous posts I've made but what the hell, I can say it again. I'm flying a fed escort these days because I'm terrible at it and want to get better. I've spent the most time in a Kar'fi and I've given up my drain build because it became unsatisfying.
"How to counter a siphon/drain team?"
It depends on what you're really facing. If it's almost any Vo'Quv or a mediocre Kar'fi pilot then Torp Spread, TBR, GW, Warp Plasma, Iso if you got it. These work against players who got into a carrier and loaded up some siphons because they saw how effective they are. These players launch siphons at 10k and tank up, new (or just terrible) Kar'fi pilots will have devoted their sci slots to heals, and are usually engineers. They will allow you keep your distance and escape if you need to for your spam clearing tools to come off cd.
If a Kar'fi pilot knows what they're doing you're pretty screwed most times. Somebody who has figured out the ship has put a tac in it. They are running an exceptionally powerful combination aside from siphons. They will pin you in place and launch siphons from mine deployment range. Pooping them right on top of you means Torp Spread just became a lot harder catch the whole batch in. They will not allow you keep your distance. The Kar'fi has some wheels on it and they know how to use it to dog you. Their hangars recharge faster than your aoe. They're packing probably a BO3, for sure BO2, if they're a real TRIBBLE a tric pattern because they're tracking your aoe rotation anyway. If you spec for aoe against somebody like this then you've still got a real threat left after you've cleared the siphons. Forget about Iso or anything with a console cooldown. A decent tac knows how to use GDF, the Kar'fi can pair it with Phase Shift, an otherwise liability of a console, to become untargetable but still able to fire energy weapons. So even if a team coordinates with one person clearing spam and one alpha'ing, there's still a get out of jail free card, not to mention he just ate half your alpha before popping GDF with Phase Shift. A good Kar'fi pilot will make you fight the carrier or the siphons, and punish you for either choice. A great Kar'fi pilot will TBR you away from your support and turn it into a 1v1, which it never really is against a carrier.
You have to fight a good Kar'fi pilot and his siphons; if you try to deal with just one you will lose. Pressure dps will eventually win out, but only if your weapon power is not being drained away. Cruisers, FAW is only going to help if you stay way ahead of the siphon deployment. Once you're behind the curve you're shooting pretty flashlights. Same with CSV. Escorts give the CRF to the carrier and the TS to the drones. Kinetic for pets once siphons are in play.
The biggest threat to a good Kar'fi pilot is a decloaking Defiant or a speed tank they can't lock down who is watching their buff rotation. Subsystem disables are a problem. EWP can be a pain. drunk is right about his EWP, but I'll bet damn few players have the uptime on it that he does. A team that ran it at his level would probably do really well against a siphon team. Kinetic sci builds who can TBR and throw some cc on the carrier are threatening.
Things that are generally not a threat are FAW cruisers or all energy builds. The drain barely has to start before they're rendered ineffective.
_______________ CommanderDonatra@Capt.Sisko: ahhh is it supposed to do that? Norvo Tigan@dontdrunkimshoot: hell ya, maybe
Elaborate how repulse is used in such an encounter.
Repulse the siphon drones (primary problem)
The damage from TBR1 is roughly 1000 dps (TBR lasts 10 seconds) on a tactical buff with 6 points in particles OR two-three particle generator consoles. Not only are you pushing them away from you, but you are destroying them as well. Since field generators will prove ineffective if your shield power is drained, you're better off employing a hard counter particle generator for the following:
Repulsors gravitons are effected by aux power levels. The higher your power, the further the push. Since you're drained you won't be pushing them too far. However, particle generator component to this is not linked to aux power.
The damage from repulsors is kinetic bleed through. In fact, if transphasic mines/torps are also employed, this will tenfold be that much more effective.
Meaning, even if you are drained you are still doing enough damage to destroy the siphon drones.
A team with repulsors on their boffs will be extremely effective in countering them even in their current status of OP.
A carrier can launch siphons every 30 seconds, in effect once those siphons are destroyed (which they will be) by 1 ship using buffed repulsors. That carrier's effectiveness has been drastically impacted. If more siphons appear while that player's 45 second is in effect, then it is another player's turn to repulse and destroy. If this is cycled, coordinated, and executed correctly, then it will work.
Not theoretical, this has been tested.
Now I'm not going to say Power Siphons are "ok". They're not. The Devs say the samething, and I think everyone else says so too. This is a current rag tag solution we came up with.
Comments
Well if that isn't just the most annoying thing ever. Only 1 weapon type in the game can kill them, and you have to waste a high yield volley on them to make sure they go down. It's like you have to carry every freakin' weapon and potential boff layout in the game if you actually want a chance at surviving. I'm sure this is old news to you vets, but man it seems like a lot of work just to be able to pew some peeps.
@DevolvedOne
you ran like a chicken for the hills
faced the klingons in a shuttle and won a few times
defense point turret - tell evberyone on the team - "hey , put in a defense point turret"
if everyone had a defense point turret like the masked shuttle man then sextra ships get exploded and you donlt have to cray home to mama and can try to win
in a shuttle, with maybe one or two players not afraid to lose
its being seen losing that bothers most peolp[l -not losing
which is why the shuyttle man is king
u da man. mad props homie
@DevolvedOne
thats what i'm talk'n
its like "oh boo hoo, siphboin drones and like 7 year old teammtes"
whereas the glorious shuttle man is like, "bring it"
which may be more fruitful or somethng and if not then at least an attempt at tactics that are not "run like a yellow belly and complain with words"
oh yeha, how to counter the siphon thing and klinks
one tactic is psychologivcal, type all kinds of stuff in zones, get them mad or somethng and have them focus everyitng on a fast ship , preferabley a shuttle
that lures away stuff
and never attavck, let thme attack, and run, run some more and head for rocks - you choose the ground
this is be superior to floating in a circle and exploding and then quitting after rays from floating apparati are hitting all over the place
the best makeup tream wise is someone with a brain and like a couple others in whatever ship
thats what he would have said iuf he knew english and played star trek online pvp
no beam no matter hpw strong can go through a giant floating space rock
the first wave of torpedo planes that attacked the jhapanese at midway all gots blown up
fortunatley the other pilots didn;t point their craft in the other direction and cry home to mama
wow troll posting much? my buddy muz has a sphion carrier build. sub target with energy sphion with aa and leach. dude are you nuts? all feds have in terms of lame consoles is ams. not counting TRIBBLE from lock boxes. trust me klinks cry all the time because pvp takes so long for them to pop. thought they would learn by now its just not a fun game......
I have always been a strong supporter of using the skills availble to a player/team to the best degree, and win on it. Energy drains is just the newest trend, CPB+Tachyon before that. Then its just up to the opposing player/team to find some counter to it and take it from there. People who complain and whine about it, and do not adapt are called scrubs and deserves to be defeated, over and over.
BUT...
The second note.
Problem with the drain builds is that there are no viable hard counters to it. With the introduction of a new skill set that adds resistance to sci powers (which i find utterly ridiculous) this will only provide a soft passive mitigated counter, where the are no real active abilities to prevent getting annihilated. A good balanced game provides abilties to use and active abilities to counter it with. Unfortuantly there are none here. A second problem is that this build is a klingon only build causing pvp imbalance, and makes FvK pvp matches moot as the feds cant do **** to counter it. Another growing trend as ive seen and experienced is that certain Fed fleets (which i wont mention) is starting to adapt a mini version of the energy drain builds, and is rather encouarging people to use it then dettering.
The solution:
If you cant beat them, join them is the slogan for many. As mentioned before using an energy drain build to counter it could work but can you imagine how loooooooooong those matches will last when no one is capable of doing anything? Add them doffs to the picture and you can play for 1 hour and the score is still 0-0. Hardly fun and hardly a solution. A second solution will be to remove aceton assimilators, plasmonic leech and the energy siphon drones from the game completly , problem solved. It will restore balance to the game and FvK pvp will have meaning. A third possible solution as being enforced today is to sanction both feds and klinks using explicit energy drain builds to win.
Conculsion:
Cryptic, get your **** together and stop giving one side the advantage, cause you cant find a proper solution on how to fix klinks! What makes you think you can release romulans as a playable faction when you cant fix klinks who has been there from day 1?
Edit:
Restore the game back to 1.2! Everything got screwed past that.
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
The TB danube shuttles where tweaked when they where too OP and the Siphon drones, Aceton assimilator and even the Plasmonic leech have all been nerfed as well from when they where OP.
I don't see what all the whining is about.
The OP got beat by a team that was built to a purpose of a single game mechanic.
That is all. No OP, No exploitation, NO special "KDF" advantage.
Its like crying over being Focus Fired upon in PvP as being OP.
R.I.P
R.I.P
Nah, I'm just pointing out that a lot of Feddies like to whine about how 'OP' the KDF is without really taking a look at their own methods. I've personally experienced these sci-spam teams, and they are rather effective. Again, you have to have a competent and prolific cross-healing cruiser or sci-based ship around to really try combating it, because they throw around more disables and confuses than most ships can really counter (trying to carry just one copy of sci team along with 1-2 tactical teams is a pain in the butt). That kind of setup usually only happens with pre-mades.
This is no solution in PuG-matches. But i can understand that players demand seperate PvP-queues.
Just to remind that siphon drones r totaly broken TRIBBLE.
Exactly. The PvP game is designed for teamwork through build choices working to a team dynamic but sponsors solo play and when that teamwork dynamic is finally needed at the endgame, the weeks of solo play have spoiled the chance of any good teaming becuase everybody is only playing for themselves and one can't counter all builds by oneself.
R.I.P
Repulse.
TRH has effectively countered the OP builds revolving around vampire carriers.
Challenge us.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
What and who Pandas or TSI or whatever top notch fleet can beat is irelevant. The issue is that an average klink team can run energy drain builds and beat any fed fleet, (mayhap not the very best of the fed fleets) and that is alarming as it breaks pvp play.
What would be more beneficial and helpful to the pvp community is to provide information as to how and what to do when encountering this setup. That approach is more useful then saying that >insert fed/klink team here< can beat said energy drain build and not telling how. Its sounds so arrogant and so DoB like. And a repeat of DoB is the last this community needs.
And this goes for everyone.
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
Right. Becuase you are suppossed to survive being focus fired upon by a Drain team and suffer little or no effect from having multiple drain powers on you from more than one foe (at least 4 by my count).
Thats like me being attacked by 4 feds and saying DPS is unfair becuase I died.
R.I.P
Elaborate how repulse is used in such an encounter.
PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
That doesnt sound logical. If u dont know what ur enemie brings to the match u cant make any smart choice. And if ur pugging u would need about 5 minutes first just to form ur team.
I hope ur just kidding me. But these Bops firing at me r just awful and the carriers is running high aux but im sure as a pvper u know this
Only time I PvP is in Ker'rat, quite fun. And yes I'm one of those sci captains, who gravity well ya, then give ya 1 subnuke, target shields, partical burst and mine ya.
It works sometimes hehe. TRIBBLE KDF ganging up on the poor sci captain!
R.I.P
You could always fly away. Or ignore them. If no one is shooting at it, the radiation damage is very low. If someone uses FAW (which was why I use it), then everyone pays for it. Sounds fair to me.
Pre mine buff, I used it to punish FAW spammers. Post mine buff, I now use it to keep those annoying tricobalt mines in check. It's a legitimate counter.
"How to counter a siphon/drain team?"
It depends on what you're really facing. If it's almost any Vo'Quv or a mediocre Kar'fi pilot then Torp Spread, TBR, GW, Warp Plasma, Iso if you got it. These work against players who got into a carrier and loaded up some siphons because they saw how effective they are. These players launch siphons at 10k and tank up, new (or just terrible) Kar'fi pilots will have devoted their sci slots to heals, and are usually engineers. They will allow you keep your distance and escape if you need to for your spam clearing tools to come off cd.
If a Kar'fi pilot knows what they're doing you're pretty screwed most times. Somebody who has figured out the ship has put a tac in it. They are running an exceptionally powerful combination aside from siphons. They will pin you in place and launch siphons from mine deployment range. Pooping them right on top of you means Torp Spread just became a lot harder catch the whole batch in. They will not allow you keep your distance. The Kar'fi has some wheels on it and they know how to use it to dog you. Their hangars recharge faster than your aoe. They're packing probably a BO3, for sure BO2, if they're a real TRIBBLE a tric pattern because they're tracking your aoe rotation anyway. If you spec for aoe against somebody like this then you've still got a real threat left after you've cleared the siphons. Forget about Iso or anything with a console cooldown. A decent tac knows how to use GDF, the Kar'fi can pair it with Phase Shift, an otherwise liability of a console, to become untargetable but still able to fire energy weapons. So even if a team coordinates with one person clearing spam and one alpha'ing, there's still a get out of jail free card, not to mention he just ate half your alpha before popping GDF with Phase Shift. A good Kar'fi pilot will make you fight the carrier or the siphons, and punish you for either choice. A great Kar'fi pilot will TBR you away from your support and turn it into a 1v1, which it never really is against a carrier.
You have to fight a good Kar'fi pilot and his siphons; if you try to deal with just one you will lose. Pressure dps will eventually win out, but only if your weapon power is not being drained away. Cruisers, FAW is only going to help if you stay way ahead of the siphon deployment. Once you're behind the curve you're shooting pretty flashlights. Same with CSV. Escorts give the CRF to the carrier and the TS to the drones. Kinetic for pets once siphons are in play.
The biggest threat to a good Kar'fi pilot is a decloaking Defiant or a speed tank they can't lock down who is watching their buff rotation. Subsystem disables are a problem. EWP can be a pain. drunk is right about his EWP, but I'll bet damn few players have the uptime on it that he does. A team that ran it at his level would probably do really well against a siphon team. Kinetic sci builds who can TBR and throw some cc on the carrier are threatening.
Things that are generally not a threat are FAW cruisers or all energy builds. The drain barely has to start before they're rendered ineffective.
CommanderDonatra@Capt.Sisko: ahhh is it supposed to do that?
Norvo Tigan@dontdrunkimshoot: hell ya, maybe
Repulse the siphon drones (primary problem)
The damage from TBR1 is roughly 1000 dps (TBR lasts 10 seconds) on a tactical buff with 6 points in particles OR two-three particle generator consoles. Not only are you pushing them away from you, but you are destroying them as well. Since field generators will prove ineffective if your shield power is drained, you're better off employing a hard counter particle generator for the following:
Repulsors gravitons are effected by aux power levels. The higher your power, the further the push. Since you're drained you won't be pushing them too far. However, particle generator component to this is not linked to aux power.
The damage from repulsors is kinetic bleed through. In fact, if transphasic mines/torps are also employed, this will tenfold be that much more effective.
Meaning, even if you are drained you are still doing enough damage to destroy the siphon drones.
A team with repulsors on their boffs will be extremely effective in countering them even in their current status of OP.
A carrier can launch siphons every 30 seconds, in effect once those siphons are destroyed (which they will be) by 1 ship using buffed repulsors. That carrier's effectiveness has been drastically impacted. If more siphons appear while that player's 45 second is in effect, then it is another player's turn to repulse and destroy. If this is cycled, coordinated, and executed correctly, then it will work.
Not theoretical, this has been tested.
Now I'm not going to say Power Siphons are "ok". They're not. The Devs say the samething, and I think everyone else says so too. This is a current rag tag solution we came up with.
-PaxOttomana of Turkish RP Heroes
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