Folks, a casual fly-by of this thread has shown me a lot of name-calling and other flamish/trollish posting.
I could go back and start moderating this thread from the first insult, or I could just close it.
I'd rather people stop throwing insults around and maybe go back and edit some posts before they have to be moderated.
If you must criticize someone else's position and demolish their arguments, please do it politely.
Cheers
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Folks, a casual fly-by of this thread has shown me a lot of name-calling and other flamish/trollish posting.
Sadly, as I stated here, The DOFF section has descended into name-calling and general rudeness now that no one (Devs) seem to care about giving feedback. We used to be one of the most (if not the most) civilized groups on here.
Part of the past civility I think was that the Dev in charge (Heretic) was seen to actually care about this part of the game and at least pretended to take our constructive criticism (as such our criticism tended to lean toward the constructive end of the scale more often). Now we have become like the rest of the forum (I see threads that descend into anarchy all over these forums) because, as I see it, there is no more Dev feedback. As such, our frustration with this game builds up, and eventually gets released in derailing threads (and forcing them to be closed by moderators) with attacks at our fellow gamers.
Personally, I find it a sad commentary on the individuals posting here as a whole, but at least I can take solace in the fact that is is virtually universal throughout this forum (not unique to the DOFFs Section) as well as in most forums for MMO games (as in most MMO games Devs act the same way they do here and either Don't post at all, post in vague fluffness, or only post in designated Dev posts and in generally off topic threads, like those in Ten Forward.) Not to say it is justified, just glad to see it isn't just STO or DOFFing.
In my experience, calling attention to alleged rudeness is more often than not a catalyst for unproductive discourse rather than any supposed rudeness itself. It's a form of passive-aggressive behavior.
I am curious why Bluegeek complained about perceived rudeness several days after the discussion in this thread was already over, but immediately after a PWE advocate who had been arguing in a similar style and along similar lines (persistently making obviously faulty claims about the doff system, trying to get players to accept a Dil nerf) had been discredited in another thread.
Nor am I at all sure to what rudeness Bluegeek is referring. The previous page was simple discussion about speculation, with no interpersonal commentary at all, and the pages before that were analysis of an argument by way of comparison with facts and experience. Pretty substantial stuff.
Perhaps you could show us where you feel the discussion was improper, Bluegeek?
If you must criticize someone else's position and demolish their arguments, please do it politely.
I wouldn't worry about it if I were you, people can really become aggressive when they feel you act against their very own little interest. And the fact is that they will agree with instant and easy rewards, but not with someone defending the interest of those who actively play the game, especially if they aren't good enough at it to take huge advantages from their knowlegde.
To make it clear they are angry because some people make profits on the exchange and some others have to pay because they want the stuff and they don't know how to easily get it - and they are in the paying camp.
So FYI everyone, the easy CXP comes from exploration mission - the reclain artifact ones. With the right doffs you can crit 22%. 5k cxp if you crit a blue, 2.5k if you crit a green (I don't remember exactly how much, it could be a bit less) and with purple doffs only these missions reward around 1k each on success. You can't really fail them. You can find them everywhere, there are several in every sector. Like I said, 15 minutes at most.
I'm curious about the next useless and tedious small argument you will find to say that it's impossible, because it is, I've run some tests and you can definitely make 20k cxp a day with this.
If you have some more available slots (it happens) you might start a hamlet (7k dev cxp on crit) or an orion syndicate + the 3 days survival mission (5k cxp on crit). I must be forgetting some other missions; you'll have to find them.
Even if you don't crit them the rewards are sufficient to allow you to make 20k a day, no matter what useless detail you'll find to say I'm wrong.
Now that this thread has become a "how to break the doff system and get instant rewards", enjoy a pointless game, I gave you a way to remove any challenge from the starbase system, and you might even be able to get the holy grail, the zero interaction with other players 'one man starbase'.
So FYI everyone, the easy CXP comes from exploration mission - the reclain artifact ones. With the right doffs you can crit 22%. 5k cxp if you crit a blue, 2.5k if you crit a green (I don't remember exactly how much, it could be a bit less) and with purple doffs only these missions reward around 1k each on success. You can't really fail them. You can find them everywhere, there are several in every sector. Like I said, 15 minutes at most.
If you think these are the best ways to earn cxp then you're doing it wrong. It's not the worse way by any means, but 22% crit chance is rather small. The problem is that there are no purple science doffs that have both efficient + teamwork without having multiple negative traits. If you're going to "break the system" at least do it with a metal bat and not a whiffle ball bat.
BTW, what you're doing is not breaking the system. It's called playing STO and sinking game-earned resources into a revolving door that spits out less than you put in (especially now that you get 1 dil. per white doff released). If you can't figure out the exploration missions are not the best for CXP, then I guess I can't expect you to figure out that what you're doing is actually what the devs. intended for people to do.
If you think these are the best ways to earn cxp then you're doing it wrong. It's not the worse way by any means, but 22% crit chance is rather small. The problem is that there are no purple science doffs that have both efficient + teamwork without having multiple negative traits. If you're going to "break the system" at least do it with a metal bat and not a whiffle ball bat.
BTW, what you're doing is not breaking the system. It's called playing STO and sinking game-earned resources into a revolving door that spits out less than you put in (especially now that you get 1 dil. per white doff released). If you can't figure out the exploration missions are not the best for CXP, then I guess I can't expect you to figure out that what you're doing is actually what the devs. intended for people to do.
If you read the OP breaking the system is only about fleet doffs and fleet doffs only. I don't mind about fleetmarks, this is a useless currency since most of the starbase stuff is inferior to the lockbox one.
I gave a way to make 10k white doffs with a T2 starbase in a small fleet; with the last changes you can create even more white doffs.
I gave these tips about assignment because they were insisting and became to insult me because I frustrated them when I said no. I didn't mean to give the most efficient way to generate tons of cxp, shorter assignments give better rewards. I gave a way to generate 20k cxp in 15 minutes a day, which is a completely different challenge.
Of course it's playing the game but anyway, this starbase stuff offers no challenge for poor rewards, but in the meatime the devs found a way to kill the doff system, which is the best fail of season 6. Fleet doffs shouldn't even exist if they want people to play the doff system, and it's a bit annoying to see that the devs are quick to kill some parts game because some people don't want to play this specific part of it, while some other people were enjoying it a lot.
It's obvious that the starbase system isn't working as intented, it shouldn't be a challenge at all if you play smart and you'll get plenty of rewards you couldn't get before season 6 without playing the game (doffing), and now you'll get them without playing much. No challenge and the doff system killed, that's not something I call "content" for the game. The starbase is now only a long road between cooldowns with this epic fail doff vendor.
25k fleet credits for a purple doff at T5, when everyone will run with 10M or so of fleet credits is an insult for genuine doffers.
I agree about the killing doffing part. Once bases hit T5 (or is is T4?) there's going to be a flood of purple doffs on the market and in people's inventory. It wasn't so easy to get even my very first purple doff, much less a full roster. Now, everyone, even players that hardly ever use the doff system other than click spamming to fill it up, will be able to have a full purple roster.
BUT, I still don't agree that your OP represents any type of system breaker, no matter how many times you repeat yourself. You're still inputting massive amounts of time and resources and receiving less in return, even with your rotating door theory.
Now, your way to generate 20k cxp in 15 minutes is also an exaggeration. I don't remember exact numbers,but I'm pretty sure your numbers are high. On success with Purple doffs I remember you get around 850 for the uncommon missions, but I don't remember the crit numbers so we'll just go with yours. Let's say you visit 4 or 5 systems and pick up 5 of these uncommon "Artifact" missions and 1 rare, which is about the average you can find per session if you're trying to do them every day.
I get 22% crit chance on the uncommons (combined 8% failure/disaster rate) and 26% chance on the rares (13% combined failure/disaster rate). So you will fail 1 every other day and you will only crit 1 per day (or on average a little over 1). We'll say the one you crit is the rare one to make up for rounding down to 1, which will inflate the numbers somewhat, but no matter.
(850x5)+5,000[even though this number is probably an exaggeration on your part like this entire thread]=9,250. 9,250=/=20,000 And this is not even taking into account that you will fail some of them contrary to your claim of guaranteed success (unless of course you want less crit chance and use 2 research lab scientists, but I do this mission for the crit rewards and the cxp is just a nice byproduct).
You exaggerate the results of this process by more than double just as you exaggerate the ease of completing the fleet bases.
You exaggerate the results of this process by more than double just as you exaggerate the ease of completing the fleet bases.
Not if you choose to put 15 recover artifiact missions and fill the rest of your 20 slots with some random mission. You can usually get 2-3 recover artifact in each sector. I know very few people will focus on getting such a weird and specific roster but it's definitely possible.
My point is to prove that there's a way to get a T5 starbase without any difficulty even if you barely play the game in a 10 people fleet. Yes you need to heavily use specific game mechanics but it's doable with the fleet vendor stuff. The remarks I made about fleetmarks are here to give an easy way to get them without really playing the game since it looked impossible for some people here, but it's not the core of this topic. TBH I don't care if people easily get loads of fleetmarks without playing the pve missions. This topic is about the leaks of the doff vendor.
Not if you choose to put 15 recover artifiact missions and fill the rest of your 20 slots with some random mission. You can usually get 2-3 recover artifact in each sector. I know very few people will focus on getting such a weird and specific roster but it's definitely possible.
My point is to prove that there's a way to get a T5 starbase without any difficulty even if you barely play the game in a 10 people fleet. Yes you need to heavily use specific game mechanics but it's doable with the fleet vendor stuff. The remarks I made about fleetmarks are here to give an easy way to get them without really playing the game since it looked impossible for some people here, but it's not the core of this topic. TBH I don't care if people easily get loads of fleetmarks without playing the pve missions. This topic is about the leaks of the doff vendor.
In case you haven't noticed the fleet doff vendor sucks unless you want a bunch of flight deck officers or warfare specialists. Then you can upgrind them and break them back down, but this costs dilithium not to mention diminishing returns of 3:5. Everything people have said to you in this thread just goes in one ear...err, eye and out the other.
And please please please stop exaggerating so much. You can't do 15 recover artifact missions per day. Even if you could find 15 of them one day (which btw I have never ever seen), the next day they would all be on cooldown so you'd be lucky to find a single one. Even though there are many different missions of this type, they do have cooldowns, which I think is about a day for the uncommons and it seems longer for the rare missions. Take a screenshot with 15 of these "Artifact" missions running or this is just another blatant exaggeration. I've been doing these missions for months because of the Strange Artifact reward. I've had around 8 or 9 running at one point when I hadn't recently done any in the past, but the next day I could only find 1 or 2 because of the cooldowns. I don't even think there are 15 separate artifact missions, much less 15 that pop all at once.
There are absolutely 15 artifact assignments. Each of the 12 sector block has its own pool of 3-4 assignments (I haven't kept exact records, but I believe each sector inside a sector block has an assignment named after it), each of which may or may not be up that day in sector or dept head.
Skurf are you Fed or KDF? I have a much harder time finding them as KDF than I do as Fed, so if you are it's possible that's why you can't get more than 8-9.
I run 5 of the 20h exploration assignments each day for cxp, particle traces, and artifacts, and I calculated that I end up with, on average, enough cxp to do a cxp turnin every other day, so his 20k cxp/day figure sounds about right to me.
I'm sick if stating the obvious in this thread. Why are you bickering me if you don't even know how the game work?
Here are two screenshots. 9 Explo missions are running, all of them with 26% of crit and 7% of failure for max crit chance. I could have done more but I didn't want to give up my regular and important assignments. These 9 assignments comes from 4 sectors only; took me less than 5 minutes to slot. I didn't even bother to visit the kdf space to get the rare ones.
Now please, for the sake of this discussion, if you aren't doing this on purpose to kill it, please, if I mention a feature you don't know, just assume it exists and what I state about it is true...
Now that this thread has become a "how to break the doff system and get instant rewards", enjoy a pointless game, I gave you a way to remove any challenge from the starbase system, and you might even be able to get the holy grail, the zero interaction with other players 'one man starbase'.
I am 38k/37k/39k starbase xp so pretty much on-line to hit T3 by the end of Sept
this will be a T3 one man built starbase
It is a work of pure insanity - luckily for me insanity has an end and that is T3 - so I won't be geeting my purples through the base - but since I have over 600 purples for 6 Fed toons I am not in big need of a lot more - no more than another 600! (I have about 1200 blues but I am in no hurry to grind them into purples)
and Garak in case you have not seen it watch it a few times its great:
I made a small mistake. Actually, with purple doffs only, the CXP on crit on the artifact missions is 4.5k for an uncommon one. I leave the rest to your fertile imaginations. 20k CXP a day was a very low and conservative guess.
Your random screenshots prove nothing except the invalidity of your claims.
In the first SS, we see you have five exploration missions running, it looks like most of them from the Sirius block. We also see you have CAWC, Asylum on Betazed, and Caitian Flight Training Program, picked up in T'Ong. Caitian Flight Training Program is a 20 hour mission with 11h 13m remaining.
From this first SS we can make several deductions:
1. Your claims are invalid because you just started those exploration missions, but also have a Caitian Flight Training Program that you started earlier that day, therefore contrary to your claims you are logging in more than once per day.
2. Your claims are invalid because the supply of high CXP doff missions you are encountering is insufficient to fill your log, proof being you queued CAWC which is a poor yield mission because it takes two days to complete, has only two slots and its crit rate caps at about 25% (and no the high crit modifier does not make up for this).
The second SS further disproves your claims. It shows you have queued Purchase Prototype, another 20h assignment, approximately three hours before you queued Caitian Flight Training, and six hours before the time the SS was taken.
From this second SS we may make two additional deductions:
1. You are logging in not once nor twice but at least three times a day
2. You are queueing poor choices of assignments - checking the XC I see heavy antiproton turrets are currently running 20k a stack, and plans are running 15k ea. Thus the Purchase Prototype assignment is not only a poor choice from the standpoint of CXP but it is in fact a net loss in EC as well.
The third SS shows two more 20 hour assignments, queued about 1h35 and 2h before the others. Amongst these is Recover Jem'Hadar Cache and Grant Sanctuary.
From this third SS we may make two additional deductions:
1. You are logging in at least four times a day
2. You are, again, queueing poor choices of assignments: Grant Sanctuary has poor CXP yield and it usually crits out white doffs so it is not a good choice on the basis of EC either.
In conclusion:
1. Your claims are invalid because you play way, way more than the 15m/day you claim
2. Your claims are invalid because you are apparently unable to find and/or choose good high-yield assignments
3. Your claims are invalid because your overall nominal yield is far below the 20k CXP/day you claim you claim to achieve
I made a small mistake. Actually, with purple doffs only, the CXP on crit on the artifact missions is 4.5k for an uncommon one. I leave the rest to your fertile imaginations. 20k CXP a day was a very low and conservative guess.
That "guess" as to your overall yield is not substantiated by any data you have provided, indeed it is contradicted by what you have linked. Curiously you provide random SSes of this and that but not of this claim you have about the artifact mission (which is unique and therefore irrelevant to your overall point).
Here are two screenshots. 9 Explo missions are running, all of them with 26% of crit and 7% of failure for max crit chance. I could have done more but I didn't want to give up my regular and important assignments. These 9 assignments comes from 4 sectors only; took me less than 5 minutes to slot. I didn't even bother to visit the kdf space to get the rare ones.
Your screenshots only show seven Exploration missions.
Your screenshots only show seven Exploration missions.
Doesn't matter. He won't admit he is wrong, ever. When confronted with hard facts, his only response is to be insulting and to tell everyone to learn how to play.
You guys are just feeding a T-monster now.
If you're looking for constructive information, you are barking up the wrong thread, based on a flawed OP.
Move on. Let this thread die the quiet, shameful death it deserves.
You haven't posted anything else in this thread. Why come in now with an antagonistic remark?
Bluegeek?
That quote from you isn't proof of anything. It's you making a claim, a BIG claim and the evidence you attempted to provide isn't enough to back up your claim. Most of your post was quibbling about minor details that are nearly irrelevent.
diogene0 presented 2 statements that formed the core of his argument.
The first is that, yes, you CAN get 10k or more Cxp in 1 day of doffing.
The second is that it doesn't take a lot of time to queue missions to do this.
None of your arguments refuted either of those 2 main points. You simply quibbled about HOW to go about it.
And for further proof that it's possible:
one of my characters did those 8 assignments in the same day, and no, I wasn't logged on very long as that char. I spent too much time cycling through 9 chars for that.
You got a string of crits on missions that cap out with a crit rate of ~25%, mostly with cooldowns of over a day. Does not prove that 20k/day avg in 15 minutes of play is sustainable.
In fact it proves the contrary which is that only with luck and careful mission selection (requiring travel time) can 20k CXP/day be achieved.
Your random screenshots prove nothing except the invalidity of your claims.
Uh, yeah, I read your post and.... no. I don't see your point at all.
The quote you linked proves otherwise.
That quote from you isn't proof of anything. It's you making a claim
In responding to my "point" you prove you had identified it and were therefore being pointlessly insulting.
In the same strain of antagonism, you are insulting my reasoned post as "quibbling" and conflating the above back-and-forth with the overall argument in question (CXP yield).
It seems to me you are intentionally responding out of context with unnecessarily insulting language with no purpose other than to be antagonistic...after I debunked the arguments made by someone who seems to have no end other than to champion PWE.
But of course I will allow you to apologize and cool it down, if you so prefer. Do you?
I am curious why Bluegeek has not responded after complaining about antagonism (when a similar thread was "lost" by a PWE champion) and reading over this very forum today.
Will you permit this poster to insult and antagonize others?
You got a string of crits on missions that cap out with a crit rate of ~25%, mostly with cooldowns of over a day. Does not prove that 20k/day avg in 15 minutes of play is sustainable.
In fact it proves the contrary which is that only with luck and careful mission selection (requiring travel time) can 20k CXP/day be achieved.
Really? I got 13k out of only 8 assignments out of 20. If we assume an average crit chance of 25%, you can reasonably expect to get 5 crits out of each set of missions you queue. But, for many missions that's very low. Some missions can easily get more than 25% crit chance. And you don't need to queue that specific set of misisons. You can do a different sector each day and thus avoid a large part of the cooldown issue.
In responding to my "point" you prove you had identified it and were therefore being pointlessly insulting.
How does that work? I understood what you were trying to say, but I feel that you are incorrect.
In the same strain of antagonism, you are insulting my reasoned post as "quibbling" and conflating the above back-and-forth with the overall argument in question (CXP yield).
It seems to me you are intentionally responding out of context with unnecessarily insulting language with no purpose other than to be antagonistic...after I debunked the arguments made by someone who seems to have no end other than to champion PWE.
But of course I will allow you to apologize and cool it down, if you so prefer. Do you?
I am curious why Bluegeek has not responded after complaining about antagonism (when a similar thread was "lost" by a PWE champion) and reading over this very forum today.
Will you permit this poster to insult and antagonize others?
Perhaps the mods feel that I am in fact NOT being insulting and that you are overreacting to people challenging your claims?
I never said I was doing that, I offered a couple of screenshots to show that it was easily doable, but I slot as many exploration mission as I could without sacrificing my current interests (recruitments). I never told I would sacrifice two days of recruitment for you.
Maybe it was 7, maybe it was 9, I didn't pay attention to every details, but the fact is that it took me less than 5 minutes to slot these assignments with a 26% crit chance.
With 4.5k cxp on crit, actually, exploration missions will provide enough cxp with crits. The 15 other missions (1k cxp each) are a nice bonus.
I still don't get why you can't stop bickering on minor details every time. I think every normal person reading this thread will understand that:
- the starbase system is flawed and is self-feeding if you play smart
- the fleetmarks aren't a problem in any way if you choose the right assignments without spending much time on game.
The time I'm actually spending on the game was never debatable. You proved you didn't read what i was saying. You're arguing on ridiculous details because you won't admit that I was right from the start. Now I'm off, all these ridiculous attempts of trolling to prevent the devs from getting reliable information here is mere spam and flood, so I won't feed the flooders anymore.
In conclusion:
1. Your claims are invalid because you play way, way more than the 15m/day you claim
2. Your claims are invalid because you are apparently unable to find and/or choose good high-yield assignments
3. Your claims are invalid because your overall nominal yield is far below the 20k CXP/day you claim you claim to achieve
1 - I enjoy my vacations
2 - I'm currently slaving on the foundry so I neglect doffs and I put TRIBBLE in my rosters and assign random TRIBBLE I find when I make a break. On a good day you see this : http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=5125092012090500001.jpg
3 - I never said I was using my doffs as a cxp generator. I don't care about fleetmarks and the starbase stuff. I just said it was possible but I have NO interest in doing it.
FYI i'm using my roster as a recruitment tool:
- missions rewarding doffs, including white ones you can send in exchanges
- colonial chains repetables for purples I can grind
- I usually slot useless assignments I find before cancelling them when I find better ones. This is a pretty efficient way to maximize my doffing time, ites weird you never got this.
I think I should write a blog to tell you more about my life, if you're so interested into it.
Maybe it was 7, maybe it was 9, I didn't pay attention to every details, but the fact is that it took me less than 5 minutes to slot these assignments with a 26% crit chance.
I counted 9. But they're mixed in with the other stuff thoroughly and you have to look at all 3 screen caps.
Maybe it was 7, maybe it was 9, I didn't pay attention to every details, but the fact is that it took me less than 5 minutes to slot these assignments with a 26% crit chance.
The problem here is that you didn't bother to spend a couple seconds to count the number of missions you had.
This lack of attention to detail raises questions about the rest of your claims.
After all, if you didn't pay attention to having seven or nine missions, then I wonder how much attention you paid to how long it took to gather those missions.
There's also the problem with how long it takes to gather enough DOFFs to do these missions all with a 26% critical success chance.
The time I'm actually spending on the game was never debatable. You proved you didn't read what i was saying. You're arguing on ridiculous details because you won't admit that I was right from the start. Now I'm off, all these ridiculous attempts of trolling to prevent the devs from getting reliable information here is mere spam and flood, so I won't feed the flooders anymore.
The screenshots you provided show that you are spending a fair amount of time playing the game. This goes against your claim that you can do these missions without spending very much time.
Sure, you can accept the missions very quickly, but it requires a fairly decent amount of time preparing to be able to complete all of these missions with such a constant high critical success chance.
There's also the cooldown between missions which means you will spend more time as you have to go to different sectors in order to find missions to pick up.
There's also the problem with how long it takes to gather enough DOFFs to do these missions all with a 26% critical success chance.
So far, this is the only legitimate problem that's been raised. Trying to nitpick "ohhhh you didn't actually have 9 missions running, only 7! (even though obviously more than 7 assignments exist)" or "you spent 45 minutes picking up assignments instead of the 15 (even though the assignments in question could have been picked up in 15 minutes)" is idiotic, and people should know better.
Gathering the doffs required to run a large number of concurrent artifact assignments is a significant investment, as last I checked a positive-traited purple research lab sci doff is ~3m+ ec (the other 2 slots are cheaper to fill, and the support doffs from zenas and hromi work for them).
I made a small mistake. Actually, with purple doffs only, the CXP on crit on the artifact missions is 4.5k for an uncommon one. I leave the rest to your fertile imaginations. 20k CXP a day was a very low and conservative guess.
I just critted one of the uncommons with all purples and 1 crit trait each and got around 1.5k exploration xp. Also, it's weird: a few days ago the highest crit percentage was 22% for the uncommons, which you mentioned and I confirmed by looking at one of my projects in progress. Now it's at 26%, which I can also confirm as that is what I'm getting as well. Very odd. And maybe I was wrong...there could be 15 or more total Artifact missions, but I have never seen that many pop at once nor would it be a sustainable day-by-day possibility since they would be on cool-down the next day. I run a few of these missions every day and there are many sectors that I fly through that have none available (in sector or dep. head) because they're either just not popping or on cooldown due to me continuously doing them.
There are a total of 42 possible artifact assignments - each sector (not sector block) has one named after it. I just took a look around the galaxy to see how many of the 20h exploration assignments I could find.
Keep in mind this as Fed - I see far fewer artifact assignments as KDF, and I don't know why that is.
For a total of 24 available artifact assignments, and that's with 5 on CD because I did them yesterday.
Those results aren't conclusive, but running 10 artifact assignments each day (enough, on average, to do an exploration report every day) should certainly be sustainable assuming you have enough research lab scientists. 15 would be possible on some days, but might not be always attainable depending on luck.
edit: the amount of cxp you get from the assignment varies with how many data samples/particle traces you get - the fewer of those, the more cxp. On one crit on a green assignment I got 4 particle traces and 2145 cxp, another crit on a green assignment I got 3 particle traces and 2478 cxp. On one success on a blue assignment I got 20 data samples and 1134 cxp, another success on a blue assignment I got 0 data samples and 1396 cxp.
There are a total of 42 possible artifact assignments - each sector (not sector block) has one named after it. I just took a look around the galaxy to see how many of the 20h exploration assignments I could find.
Keep in mind this as Fed - I see far fewer artifact assignments as KDF, and I don't know why that is.
For a total of 24 available artifact assignments, and that's with 5 on CD because I did them yesterday.
Those results aren't conclusive, but running 10 artifact assignments each day (enough, on average, to do an exploration report every day) should certainly be sustainable assuming you have enough research lab scientists. 15 would be possible on some days, but might not be always attainable depending on luck.
edit: the amount of cxp you get from the assignment varies with how many data samples/particle traces you get - the fewer of those, the more cxp. On one crit on a green assignment I got 4 particle traces and 2145 cxp, another crit on a green assignment I got 3 particle traces and 2478 cxp. On one success on a blue assignment I got 20 data samples and 1134 cxp, another success on a blue assignment I got 0 data samples and 1396 cxp.
Also, it's sustainable even without purples. but purples do give better results. Oh and if you get lucky you can get Strange alien artifacts!
Comments
I could go back and start moderating this thread from the first insult, or I could just close it.
I'd rather people stop throwing insults around and maybe go back and edit some posts before they have to be moderated.
If you must criticize someone else's position and demolish their arguments, please do it politely.
Cheers
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Sadly, as I stated here, The DOFF section has descended into name-calling and general rudeness now that no one (Devs) seem to care about giving feedback. We used to be one of the most (if not the most) civilized groups on here.
Part of the past civility I think was that the Dev in charge (Heretic) was seen to actually care about this part of the game and at least pretended to take our constructive criticism (as such our criticism tended to lean toward the constructive end of the scale more often). Now we have become like the rest of the forum (I see threads that descend into anarchy all over these forums) because, as I see it, there is no more Dev feedback. As such, our frustration with this game builds up, and eventually gets released in derailing threads (and forcing them to be closed by moderators) with attacks at our fellow gamers.
Personally, I find it a sad commentary on the individuals posting here as a whole, but at least I can take solace in the fact that is is virtually universal throughout this forum (not unique to the DOFFs Section) as well as in most forums for MMO games (as in most MMO games Devs act the same way they do here and either Don't post at all, post in vague fluffness, or only post in designated Dev posts and in generally off topic threads, like those in Ten Forward.) Not to say it is justified, just glad to see it isn't just STO or DOFFing.
I am curious why Bluegeek complained about perceived rudeness several days after the discussion in this thread was already over, but immediately after a PWE advocate who had been arguing in a similar style and along similar lines (persistently making obviously faulty claims about the doff system, trying to get players to accept a Dil nerf) had been discredited in another thread.
Nor am I at all sure to what rudeness Bluegeek is referring. The previous page was simple discussion about speculation, with no interpersonal commentary at all, and the pages before that were analysis of an argument by way of comparison with facts and experience. Pretty substantial stuff.
Perhaps you could show us where you feel the discussion was improper, Bluegeek?
I wouldn't worry about it if I were you, people can really become aggressive when they feel you act against their very own little interest. And the fact is that they will agree with instant and easy rewards, but not with someone defending the interest of those who actively play the game, especially if they aren't good enough at it to take huge advantages from their knowlegde.
To make it clear they are angry because some people make profits on the exchange and some others have to pay because they want the stuff and they don't know how to easily get it - and they are in the paying camp.
So FYI everyone, the easy CXP comes from exploration mission - the reclain artifact ones. With the right doffs you can crit 22%. 5k cxp if you crit a blue, 2.5k if you crit a green (I don't remember exactly how much, it could be a bit less) and with purple doffs only these missions reward around 1k each on success. You can't really fail them. You can find them everywhere, there are several in every sector. Like I said, 15 minutes at most.
I'm curious about the next useless and tedious small argument you will find to say that it's impossible, because it is, I've run some tests and you can definitely make 20k cxp a day with this.
If you have some more available slots (it happens) you might start a hamlet (7k dev cxp on crit) or an orion syndicate + the 3 days survival mission (5k cxp on crit). I must be forgetting some other missions; you'll have to find them.
Even if you don't crit them the rewards are sufficient to allow you to make 20k a day, no matter what useless detail you'll find to say I'm wrong.
Now that this thread has become a "how to break the doff system and get instant rewards", enjoy a pointless game, I gave you a way to remove any challenge from the starbase system, and you might even be able to get the holy grail, the zero interaction with other players 'one man starbase'.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
If you think these are the best ways to earn cxp then you're doing it wrong. It's not the worse way by any means, but 22% crit chance is rather small. The problem is that there are no purple science doffs that have both efficient + teamwork without having multiple negative traits. If you're going to "break the system" at least do it with a metal bat and not a whiffle ball bat.
BTW, what you're doing is not breaking the system. It's called playing STO and sinking game-earned resources into a revolving door that spits out less than you put in (especially now that you get 1 dil. per white doff released). If you can't figure out the exploration missions are not the best for CXP, then I guess I can't expect you to figure out that what you're doing is actually what the devs. intended for people to do.
@DevolvedOne
If you read the OP breaking the system is only about fleet doffs and fleet doffs only. I don't mind about fleetmarks, this is a useless currency since most of the starbase stuff is inferior to the lockbox one.
I gave a way to make 10k white doffs with a T2 starbase in a small fleet; with the last changes you can create even more white doffs.
I gave these tips about assignment because they were insisting and became to insult me because I frustrated them when I said no. I didn't mean to give the most efficient way to generate tons of cxp, shorter assignments give better rewards. I gave a way to generate 20k cxp in 15 minutes a day, which is a completely different challenge.
Of course it's playing the game but anyway, this starbase stuff offers no challenge for poor rewards, but in the meatime the devs found a way to kill the doff system, which is the best fail of season 6. Fleet doffs shouldn't even exist if they want people to play the doff system, and it's a bit annoying to see that the devs are quick to kill some parts game because some people don't want to play this specific part of it, while some other people were enjoying it a lot.
It's obvious that the starbase system isn't working as intented, it shouldn't be a challenge at all if you play smart and you'll get plenty of rewards you couldn't get before season 6 without playing the game (doffing), and now you'll get them without playing much. No challenge and the doff system killed, that's not something I call "content" for the game. The starbase is now only a long road between cooldowns with this epic fail doff vendor.
25k fleet credits for a purple doff at T5, when everyone will run with 10M or so of fleet credits is an insult for genuine doffers.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
BUT, I still don't agree that your OP represents any type of system breaker, no matter how many times you repeat yourself. You're still inputting massive amounts of time and resources and receiving less in return, even with your rotating door theory.
Now, your way to generate 20k cxp in 15 minutes is also an exaggeration. I don't remember exact numbers,but I'm pretty sure your numbers are high. On success with Purple doffs I remember you get around 850 for the uncommon missions, but I don't remember the crit numbers so we'll just go with yours. Let's say you visit 4 or 5 systems and pick up 5 of these uncommon "Artifact" missions and 1 rare, which is about the average you can find per session if you're trying to do them every day.
I get 22% crit chance on the uncommons (combined 8% failure/disaster rate) and 26% chance on the rares (13% combined failure/disaster rate). So you will fail 1 every other day and you will only crit 1 per day (or on average a little over 1). We'll say the one you crit is the rare one to make up for rounding down to 1, which will inflate the numbers somewhat, but no matter.
(850x5)+5,000[even though this number is probably an exaggeration on your part like this entire thread]=9,250. 9,250=/=20,000 And this is not even taking into account that you will fail some of them contrary to your claim of guaranteed success (unless of course you want less crit chance and use 2 research lab scientists, but I do this mission for the crit rewards and the cxp is just a nice byproduct).
You exaggerate the results of this process by more than double just as you exaggerate the ease of completing the fleet bases.
@DevolvedOne
Not if you choose to put 15 recover artifiact missions and fill the rest of your 20 slots with some random mission. You can usually get 2-3 recover artifact in each sector. I know very few people will focus on getting such a weird and specific roster but it's definitely possible.
My point is to prove that there's a way to get a T5 starbase without any difficulty even if you barely play the game in a 10 people fleet. Yes you need to heavily use specific game mechanics but it's doable with the fleet vendor stuff. The remarks I made about fleetmarks are here to give an easy way to get them without really playing the game since it looked impossible for some people here, but it's not the core of this topic. TBH I don't care if people easily get loads of fleetmarks without playing the pve missions. This topic is about the leaks of the doff vendor.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
In case you haven't noticed the fleet doff vendor sucks unless you want a bunch of flight deck officers or warfare specialists. Then you can upgrind them and break them back down, but this costs dilithium not to mention diminishing returns of 3:5. Everything people have said to you in this thread just goes in one ear...err, eye and out the other.
And please please please stop exaggerating so much. You can't do 15 recover artifact missions per day. Even if you could find 15 of them one day (which btw I have never ever seen), the next day they would all be on cooldown so you'd be lucky to find a single one. Even though there are many different missions of this type, they do have cooldowns, which I think is about a day for the uncommons and it seems longer for the rare missions. Take a screenshot with 15 of these "Artifact" missions running or this is just another blatant exaggeration. I've been doing these missions for months because of the Strange Artifact reward. I've had around 8 or 9 running at one point when I hadn't recently done any in the past, but the next day I could only find 1 or 2 because of the cooldowns. I don't even think there are 15 separate artifact missions, much less 15 that pop all at once.
@DevolvedOne
Skurf are you Fed or KDF? I have a much harder time finding them as KDF than I do as Fed, so if you are it's possible that's why you can't get more than 8-9.
I run 5 of the 20h exploration assignments each day for cxp, particle traces, and artifacts, and I calculated that I end up with, on average, enough cxp to do a cxp turnin every other day, so his 20k cxp/day figure sounds about right to me.
*sigh*
I'm sick if stating the obvious in this thread. Why are you bickering me if you don't even know how the game work?
Here are two screenshots. 9 Explo missions are running, all of them with 26% of crit and 7% of failure for max crit chance. I could have done more but I didn't want to give up my regular and important assignments. These 9 assignments comes from 4 sectors only; took me less than 5 minutes to slot. I didn't even bother to visit the kdf space to get the rare ones.
http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/8373032012090400005.jpg
http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/1753702012090400004.jpg
crit chance: http://img15.hostingpics.net/pics/8004092012090400006.jpg
Now please, for the sake of this discussion, if you aren't doing this on purpose to kill it, please, if I mention a feature you don't know, just assume it exists and what I state about it is true...
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
I am 38k/37k/39k starbase xp so pretty much on-line to hit T3 by the end of Sept
this will be a T3 one man built starbase
It is a work of pure insanity - luckily for me insanity has an end and that is T3 - so I won't be geeting my purples through the base - but since I have over 600 purples for 6 Fed toons I am not in big need of a lot more - no more than another 600! (I have about 1200 blues but I am in no hurry to grind them into purples)
and Garak in case you have not seen it watch it a few times its great:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t02v9EUHs30&feature=related
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
In the first SS, we see you have five exploration missions running, it looks like most of them from the Sirius block. We also see you have CAWC, Asylum on Betazed, and Caitian Flight Training Program, picked up in T'Ong. Caitian Flight Training Program is a 20 hour mission with 11h 13m remaining.
From this first SS we can make several deductions:
1. Your claims are invalid because you just started those exploration missions, but also have a Caitian Flight Training Program that you started earlier that day, therefore contrary to your claims you are logging in more than once per day.
2. Your claims are invalid because the supply of high CXP doff missions you are encountering is insufficient to fill your log, proof being you queued CAWC which is a poor yield mission because it takes two days to complete, has only two slots and its crit rate caps at about 25% (and no the high crit modifier does not make up for this).
The second SS further disproves your claims. It shows you have queued Purchase Prototype, another 20h assignment, approximately three hours before you queued Caitian Flight Training, and six hours before the time the SS was taken.
From this second SS we may make two additional deductions:
1. You are logging in not once nor twice but at least three times a day
2. You are queueing poor choices of assignments - checking the XC I see heavy antiproton turrets are currently running 20k a stack, and plans are running 15k ea. Thus the Purchase Prototype assignment is not only a poor choice from the standpoint of CXP but it is in fact a net loss in EC as well.
The third SS shows two more 20 hour assignments, queued about 1h35 and 2h before the others. Amongst these is Recover Jem'Hadar Cache and Grant Sanctuary.
From this third SS we may make two additional deductions:
1. You are logging in at least four times a day
2. You are, again, queueing poor choices of assignments: Grant Sanctuary has poor CXP yield and it usually crits out white doffs so it is not a good choice on the basis of EC either.
In conclusion:
1. Your claims are invalid because you play way, way more than the 15m/day you claim
2. Your claims are invalid because you are apparently unable to find and/or choose good high-yield assignments
3. Your claims are invalid because your overall nominal yield is far below the 20k CXP/day you claim you claim to achieve
That "guess" as to your overall yield is not substantiated by any data you have provided, indeed it is contradicted by what you have linked. Curiously you provide random SSes of this and that but not of this claim you have about the artifact mission (which is unique and therefore irrelevant to your overall point).
Stop insulting other posters.
Is the mod going to do anything about it? We'll see.
Doesn't matter. He won't admit he is wrong, ever. When confronted with hard facts, his only response is to be insulting and to tell everyone to learn how to play.
You guys are just feeding a T-monster now.
If you're looking for constructive information, you are barking up the wrong thread, based on a flawed OP.
Move on. Let this thread die the quiet, shameful death it deserves.
My character Tsin'xing
The quote you linked proves otherwise.
You haven't posted anything else in this thread. Why come in now with an antagonistic remark?
Bluegeek?
diogene0 presented 2 statements that formed the core of his argument.
The first is that, yes, you CAN get 10k or more Cxp in 1 day of doffing.
The second is that it doesn't take a lot of time to queue missions to do this.
None of your arguments refuted either of those 2 main points. You simply quibbled about HOW to go about it.
And for further proof that it's possible:
one of my characters did those 8 assignments in the same day, and no, I wasn't logged on very long as that char. I spent too much time cycling through 9 chars for that.
My character Tsin'xing
In fact it proves the contrary which is that only with luck and careful mission selection (requiring travel time) can 20k CXP/day be achieved.
In responding to my "point" you prove you had identified it and were therefore being pointlessly insulting.
In the same strain of antagonism, you are insulting my reasoned post as "quibbling" and conflating the above back-and-forth with the overall argument in question (CXP yield).
It seems to me you are intentionally responding out of context with unnecessarily insulting language with no purpose other than to be antagonistic...after I debunked the arguments made by someone who seems to have no end other than to champion PWE.
But of course I will allow you to apologize and cool it down, if you so prefer. Do you?
I am curious why Bluegeek has not responded after complaining about antagonism (when a similar thread was "lost" by a PWE champion) and reading over this very forum today.
Will you permit this poster to insult and antagonize others?
My character Tsin'xing
Maybe it was 7, maybe it was 9, I didn't pay attention to every details, but the fact is that it took me less than 5 minutes to slot these assignments with a 26% crit chance.
With 4.5k cxp on crit, actually, exploration missions will provide enough cxp with crits. The 15 other missions (1k cxp each) are a nice bonus.
I still don't get why you can't stop bickering on minor details every time. I think every normal person reading this thread will understand that:
- the starbase system is flawed and is self-feeding if you play smart
- the fleetmarks aren't a problem in any way if you choose the right assignments without spending much time on game.
The time I'm actually spending on the game was never debatable. You proved you didn't read what i was saying. You're arguing on ridiculous details because you won't admit that I was right from the start. Now I'm off, all these ridiculous attempts of trolling to prevent the devs from getting reliable information here is mere spam and flood, so I won't feed the flooders anymore.
1 - I enjoy my vacations
2 - I'm currently slaving on the foundry so I neglect doffs and I put TRIBBLE in my rosters and assign random TRIBBLE I find when I make a break. On a good day you see this : http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=5125092012090500001.jpg
3 - I never said I was using my doffs as a cxp generator. I don't care about fleetmarks and the starbase stuff. I just said it was possible but I have NO interest in doing it.
FYI i'm using my roster as a recruitment tool:
- missions rewarding doffs, including white ones you can send in exchanges
- colonial chains repetables for purples I can grind
- I usually slot useless assignments I find before cancelling them when I find better ones. This is a pretty efficient way to maximize my doffing time, ites weird you never got this.
I think I should write a blog to tell you more about my life, if you're so interested into it.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
My character Tsin'xing
The problem here is that you didn't bother to spend a couple seconds to count the number of missions you had.
This lack of attention to detail raises questions about the rest of your claims.
After all, if you didn't pay attention to having seven or nine missions, then I wonder how much attention you paid to how long it took to gather those missions.
There's also the problem with how long it takes to gather enough DOFFs to do these missions all with a 26% critical success chance.
The screenshots you provided show that you are spending a fair amount of time playing the game. This goes against your claim that you can do these missions without spending very much time.
Sure, you can accept the missions very quickly, but it requires a fairly decent amount of time preparing to be able to complete all of these missions with such a constant high critical success chance.
There's also the cooldown between missions which means you will spend more time as you have to go to different sectors in order to find missions to pick up.
I counted seven. He has the same missions spread across multiple screenshots.
His first screenshot shows five missions.
His second screenshot also shows five missions, three of which were on the previous screenshot.
His third screenshot shows four missions, all of which were shown in the previous screenshot.
Looking at the names of the missions across all of the screenshots shows a grand total of seven Exploration missions.
So far, this is the only legitimate problem that's been raised. Trying to nitpick "ohhhh you didn't actually have 9 missions running, only 7! (even though obviously more than 7 assignments exist)" or "you spent 45 minutes picking up assignments instead of the 15 (even though the assignments in question could have been picked up in 15 minutes)" is idiotic, and people should know better.
Gathering the doffs required to run a large number of concurrent artifact assignments is a significant investment, as last I checked a positive-traited purple research lab sci doff is ~3m+ ec (the other 2 slots are cheaper to fill, and the support doffs from zenas and hromi work for them).
I just critted one of the uncommons with all purples and 1 crit trait each and got around 1.5k exploration xp. Also, it's weird: a few days ago the highest crit percentage was 22% for the uncommons, which you mentioned and I confirmed by looking at one of my projects in progress. Now it's at 26%, which I can also confirm as that is what I'm getting as well. Very odd. And maybe I was wrong...there could be 15 or more total Artifact missions, but I have never seen that many pop at once nor would it be a sustainable day-by-day possibility since they would be on cool-down the next day. I run a few of these missions every day and there are many sectors that I fly through that have none available (in sector or dep. head) because they're either just not popping or on cooldown due to me continuously doing them.
@DevolvedOne
Keep in mind this as Fed - I see far fewer artifact assignments as KDF, and I don't know why that is.
ZA: 3
AT: 3
BU: 1
OB: 0
EE: 3
OL: 0
PC: 1
PV: 3
Sir: 2
Reg: 3
AC: 0
IP: 3
GO: 1
Pel: 1
For a total of 24 available artifact assignments, and that's with 5 on CD because I did them yesterday.
Those results aren't conclusive, but running 10 artifact assignments each day (enough, on average, to do an exploration report every day) should certainly be sustainable assuming you have enough research lab scientists. 15 would be possible on some days, but might not be always attainable depending on luck.
edit: the amount of cxp you get from the assignment varies with how many data samples/particle traces you get - the fewer of those, the more cxp. On one crit on a green assignment I got 4 particle traces and 2145 cxp, another crit on a green assignment I got 3 particle traces and 2478 cxp. On one success on a blue assignment I got 20 data samples and 1134 cxp, another success on a blue assignment I got 0 data samples and 1396 cxp.
My character Tsin'xing
Captain Ruri Gokou of the U.S.S. Kitty Hawk
Catian Atrox Carrier