First, never expect a fair and balanced fight in a PUG match.
You should often expect to at least once out of three matches to come across someone using known broken or ?not working correctly? abilities or combinations of abilities.
You will be required to wait, not always, but often to get into a PVP match
Kerrat is not for the faint of heart. Expect to be brutalized or to brutalize others.
I use everything under the sun. You need at least Three Dual Heavy cannons against Real opponents, as a tac in an escort. Also you need at least four energy consoles if you want to step up against Good Opponents, and not just the typical Fail Fed.
To be fair mav... the one exception to the 3 dhc or better rule... is sort of what he was planning to do with the KHG bonus. For the amount of extra dmg you get from the KGH. (its equal to 3 torp dmg units) its like his bug would have a 8 tac console setup.
The thing is if you are going to bother with torps AT ALL imo you HAVE to commit to them. No silly one launcher in front eating your dps... go all in and run 2 so you can keep the torp rapid fire going... I did this with a goomba for a good while and honestly my dmg was much higher, and more important my KILLS where much higher then they where in a full cannon setup....
On my feds 2 torps works on most ships but I did hate it on my bug... it felt much weaker then just going cannons... that KHG set is the torpedo holy grail... if I ever get a second bug for my klink or the KHG set ever gets some cross faction love I will be running 2 DHC on that ship.
The builds mat not directly cross to your bug, I don't remember to many people posting good bug builds... but go read some of the ideas about escort piloting in that thread.
If I may say, a lot of people have protested that antiproton weapons work best against the Borg hulls. Which is why a good number or PVP players have that blood red beam. And I know for a fact that heavy dual cannons are the most powerful type of weapons. So, if your ship is capable, I would equip it with some antiproton weaponry, dual cannons if possible.
As for the consoles, you'll need some antiproton mag regulators to boost the DPS of the antiproton weapons. It may also be a good idea to pick up some RCS accelerators to increase your turn rate and shield booster console. For torpedo, my favorite is the tricobalt torp with a high yield skill buff to pimp out the progectile. If you train one of your tac officers in a high yield skill and fire a tricobalt torpedo, then you could easily deal a massive amout of damage. It's quite aggitating to players who lose a portion of their shields and have their hull unprotected. makes them go out like a star.
No offense, but do you actually PvP? None of this really makes sense to me. Can you even get purple XII anti-proton weapons that don't have the Borg proc., which is a complete waste in PvP? And the anti-proton mag regulators are like 50 mil. EC a pop. It seems like a lot of EC to spend on something that won't give you the most bang for your buck because of the Borg proc.
RCS also seems like a waste of a Eng. console slot that could be better used for a defensive console. Honestly, the Bug already turns faster than pretty much every other ship in the game and so far I have not had a problem lining up enemies except maybe a Defiant with Evasive maneuvers activated.
Tricobalt doesn't make much sense to me either. The slow flight speed of it means they could have their shields back up by the time it reaches them, or they could just shoot it down if I recall correctly. Then it has, what, like a 60 second cooldown or something crazy so there could be many opportunities where someone's shields are down but my Tricobalt is on cooldown. And finally, I like to get close to my enemies (3km or closer) for the increased energy damage as well as getting my torpedo to connect before they can use a shield buff. This could be a problem considering the splash damage would hit me as well.
To be fair mav... the one exception to the 3 dhc or better rule... is sort of what he was planning to do with the KHG bonus. For the amount of extra dmg you get from the KGH. (its equal to 3 torp dmg units) its like his bug would have a 8 tac console setup.
The thing is if you are going to bother with torps AT ALL imo you HAVE to commit to them. No silly one launcher in front eating your dps... go all in and run 2 so you can keep the torp rapid fire going... I did this with a goomba for a good while and honestly my dmg was much higher, and more important my KILLS where much higher then they where in a full cannon setup....
On my feds 2 torps works on most ships but I did hate it on my bug... it felt much weaker then just going cannons... that KHG set is the torpedo holy grail... if I ever get a second bug for my klink or the KHG set ever gets some cross faction love I will be running 2 DHC on that ship.
I would still rather have a third energy weapon than a second torp 9/10 times.
the KHG set just makes that punch in the face that much harder.
And hey if you get a couple purple torp doffs, every so often you get a free hit in anyway.
2 torps, is viableish. But I'm abit of a traditionalist, even with the new found prowess of KHG.
one piece of advice and one only (you may want to write this down)
ANY Advice you get on this forum should be considered Suspect
Always Compare sources and never go with any one persons advice (especially not MINE )
So if he especially shouldn't listen to you. Then he should definitely listen to everyone else.
Which, is quite true.
You couldn't pvp your way out of a wet paper bag.
There are some people on this forum I'd trust with giving advice. You are definitely not one of them, since you feel anything but canon is some "evil mauler build" (which really is a complement by the way. Afterall, to maul someone in pvp, is to utterly decimate them and leave them unable to Respond to an assault.).
If you absolutely want a torpedo, you might consider putting it in one of your aft weapon slots, thus freeing the space for another DHC at the cost of merely one turret.
And of course, you don't need a torpedo damage console, really. I'd be among those who would suggest using 5 tetryon pulse generators.
Why would one try to spin around when the forward firepower is as enormous as it will be in the proposed setup? I'd rather propose to use torp spread and an aft launcher as a means to point defense and such - for a quick reaction to something (like carrier pets or aceton assimilators, for example) that bothers from behind, so you don't have to turn around. The single torpedo launcher will not be his main DPS source anyway, whatever he does... so its function is clearly not that.
The torpedo may not be my main DPS weapon, but I'd say over half of my kills come from torpedoes, and once shields are down, the torpedoes are by far the main DPS dealer. I think I'd rather lose the DPS of a DHC rather than lose the DPS of a turret if it meant not being able to use the torpedo on my target.
I use everything under the sun. You need at least Three Dual Heavy cannons against Real opponents, as a tac in an escort. Also you need at least four energy consoles if you want to step up against Good Opponents, and not just the typical Fail Fed.
The Tetryon proc even with it's recent buff is still a complete joke.
Phased Tetryons are hawt on the other hand due to the phaser proc that they come with.
Much as I love my Blue Guns, I'm under no illusion about their proc's power, and there's a reason why my main Thunder, switched to Phased Tets.
This is interesting, and something that I already have experienced. I was in a PvP the other night with a Fed player named King in an escort. I could not for the life of me get his facing shield to ever completely drop even with my 3 DHC's so my Quantum torpedoes never really had a chance to shine. I don't know what his setup was, but he had more tanking ability than most cruisers and he would always kill me if we got into a 1v1 dogfight because I could never drop his shields.
Now, with this in mind, I'm wondering if going for dual torpedoes up front would expand this problem to other players that don't even have that great of tanking ability. I suppose I could at least try it out, but I'm afraid I may never be able to lower an experienced player's shields to where the torpedoes can actually do some real damage. It also seems to highlight the greater need for all Tetryon consoles as opposed to using a torpedo console. I think I'm going to remove the Zero Point console whether or not I use 1 or 2 torps up front for this reason alone.
If you were to go with the 2 Torps I would not entertain any torps than the Transphasic torps.
Because you'll almost never blow a shield down with just 2 DHCs blazing away.
2 T Torps with 2 Torp Doffs will net a Machine Gun Effect, and their bleedthrough especially with high yield pumping them up, is actually rather substantial.
If you do do 2 torps. Put them UpFront.
Single Torp. It Goes Upfront.
Period. you lose way too much time on target trying to position your ship's TRIBBLE to let loose a torp. More than enough time for an opponent to get a shield up.
Now, with this in mind, I'm wondering if going for dual torpedoes up front would expand this problem to other players that don't even have that great of tanking ability. I suppose I could at least try it out, but I'm afraid I may never be able to lower an experienced player's shields to where the torpedoes can actually do some real damage. It also seems to highlight the greater need for all Tetryon consoles as opposed to using a torpedo console. I think I'm going to remove the Zero Point console whether or not I use 1 or 2 torps up front for this reason alone.
No honestly it will solve the issue of shields down.... the issue with only one tube is always timing. Even with doffs you just can't rely on them and you will.. and I guarantee you have already experienced this... see an open facing and just not have a torp there to finish the job.
You are RUNNING Phased tets... which have a phaser proc... the thing with using 2 launchers + doffs is you Will ALWAYS have a torp on the way... try it out and you will understand... one torp per second... is killer when those torps hit for 7k non-crit which is what the KHG will do for you. A shield proc on someone .... and boom you land 2-3 torps and if your lucky one of them was HY pattern.
Honesty don't be trying to 1 on 1 anyone ever... WHY ? This is a team game... your a new player stick with the team... ESCORT THEM... read my other post about escort mind set. Trying to head of and 1 on 1 people is not a good idea. Even the best escort pilots will go down sometimes if they get shield proced. If you stick with the team... you will do better... also read my post about the target of my target window... you NEED to have that somewhere where you always see it if you fly and ESCORT. You need to know who your target is shooting at... it will also give you a quick way to check who your team is shooting at. Don't be silly and try to solo someone... see who your team is shooting at ... and get in on the same shield facing... at that point I guarantee you your torps will start hitting hull and people will start sploding.
The Phasic thing... ya forget that... sure they will go through shields... and do damn near nothing... stick with heavy hull smashers phtons and quantums for the kill.
Boy do I have something to show you later about phasics husanak
You'll **** your pants.
Try being put down to 30 or lower at the end of someone's first pass. Without your shields ever going down. 4 torp consoles, for phasics, with doffs is OMFG amazing.
Throw on the KHG and you'll be killin people with it.
Double phasic is the only way to go if you are going double barrel.
It's ludicrous. Hell I'll even go log in to show ya if you wanna see.
Boy do I have something to show you later about phasics husanak
You'll **** your pants.
Try being put down to 30 or lower at the end of someone's first pass. Without your shields ever going down. 4 torp consoles, for phasics, with doffs is OMFG amazing.
Throw on the KHG and you'll be killin people with it.
Ya I have played with them on my always cloaked brel... found the newest changes wanting... but perhaps I didn't give it enough of the old collage try. lol
Ya I have played with them on my always cloaked brel... found the newest changes wanting... but perhaps I didn't give it enough of the old collage try. lol
Make sure they aren't the stupid breen torps. Those things are useless even with the changes. They are especially worthless thanks to the torp doff.
Just to be clear, the torp doffs y'all are talking about are just the regular projectile doffs? If so, I already have a couple purple ones I could slot.
Of course, that is only true if your opponent is so polite not to have a mentionable amount of hull healing power and no armor or other damage resistance.
Few people will be that dum... er, cooperative.
Or if they are smart people and are shield tanking. Rather than being a sponge hoping to get lucky with 2 fpbs :P
DPS ain't your bag anyway man. What are you doing in this thread?
Just to be clear, the torp doffs y'all are talking about are just the regular projectile doffs? If so, I already have a couple purple ones I could slot.
Yep those are the ones.. 20% chance to reduce by 5 seconds on purple.
Yep those are the ones.. 20% chance to reduce by 5 seconds on purple.
Yep those be the ones. They only stack twice (yet you can have 3 equipped. I suspect this is a Bug). But with 2 torps you have ludicrously good chances to proc with each firing. They seem to proc more than 50 percent of the time as well, for some dumb TRIBBLE reason. (Cryptic math no doubt) to the point you could bind the things to your friggin space bar.
Also side note for sophlogimo. You used them on a ship with only 2 consoles. with 4 they are a whole another ball game. Throw in the KHG, which adds a -huge- bonus as well and maybe a decloak bonus and you could probably one pass someone with HY2, and torp spam.
Exactly those. They greatly increase your firing rate for torpedoes, down to, mostly, "1 torp per second". It is a bit of a gamble, though, because they only have a certain probability to reduce the cooldown of the torps.
Yes they are not 100%... however with 2 launchers and 3 doffs... your chance of NOT procing at least one 5 second (which will give you that 1 per sec)... is 25%... so for the most part you will be 1 per second while you have someone arced almost for sure.
i was about half way done building transphasic boats out of my engineers, trying to give them some purpose. their energy weapon damage will always be pathetic, so thought maybe just fireing transphics and throwing heals with just a few disruptor turrets for procs would be more effective. haven't used them for a wile, not since the transphasic or mine buff. i'll get back to them at some point
As much as I appreciate your fascination with a more interesting personality than yourself, would you please focus your attention in the discussion not on people, but on arguments.
From my tests with an Advanced Escort, I can say: Transphasics are good in theory, but only in an environment where nobody expects them. As soon as the target has at least 1 Monotanium console (or two to three Neutronium), the effectively remaining something like 30% of original dps are just healed away by a combination of Hazard Emitters, the Borg proc and native crew repair. Even if it is buffed to close to 5000 dpv (and with projectile weapons doffs, that almost equals dps) with a combination of transphasic compressors, partial KHG and partial Breen set, that means just 1500 dps to hull. You'll need more than 20 seconds for an unbuffed escort hull to defeat it without it applying any heals... and which hull is unbuffed, anyway. 20 seconds, during which the targetted escort might just toast your ship with DHC/turret fire, taking down your shields and your hull.
And what's more, that damage you do with transphasics is usually from you alone... your team mates will not really benefit from the damage you do, as they still have to take down the target's shields to do damage, too. Unless they also are transphasics torpedo ships, at which point you will see people switching to even more hull heals and armor quite quickly.
i'm going to type slowly, so pay attention. there are a bajillion things wrong with just about everything you think and do in this game, as many of us have tried to tell you many times before. i shall address this post only right now, and i shall list them in order of their appearance in your post.
1: mav has all the right and the reasoning to address you, the person in his post. this is a public forum, and we are all contributing members.
2: torps on escorts are always questionable, unless you are of the top players in the game at timing them to hit hull between your target's tac teams. hell, even mav his self has come around to slightly agree with this.
3: transphasics are only good in theory, rarely in practice, even with 100% build dedication do they perform as well as plasma torps, and thats just sad.
4: if you run a monotanium, you are not paying attention. with the amount of shield resists going around the +18 from neutronium is more than enough for 1 ship.l
5: if you are running 2/3 neutroniums, you have not done the math on how the defensive stats stack, and are most likely doing a lot of other stuff wrong. even great engineers in cruisers rarely run more than 1.
6: what the f is buffed dpv? damage per volley? dumbass.
7: you will never get 20 seconds straight on an escort full attack facings and buffs. you got this one as close as you possibly could tho, but i had to read it 5 times to be sure. english is not your first language is it?
8: okay, you may be coming around here......escorts are the ships that do the damage. good job sophie.
Now children, let's play nice. It is just a video game afterall. Let's try to keep the insults and attitude out of this thread and stick to helping me learn how to PvP
So in that regard, I'd like to discuss why my choice of [DMG]x2 modifier is a bad one. Essentially, I chose this modifier because of the low Tetryon base damage. The bonus damage that criticals give will be less on Tetryons than any other weapon and when you start multiplying a smaller number by the same percentage as a larger base number, the difference in damage output of critical hits between Tetryon weapons and other weapons becomes exponential. In this respect, Tetryons would be the worst weapon type to increase anything that has to do with critical chance or critical damage.
Admittedly, I didn't crunch the numbers, so I very well could be wrong about choosing [DMG]x2. By choosing it, I figured I would increase my overall continuous damage output to be more equal to other weapon types, while letting my torpedoes do most of the critical spike damage. I also hoped that in the small window between when my enemy's shields are down and my torpedoes hit, I would be able to do the highest amount of continuous hull damage rather than relying on low-percentage criticals to hit. This should effectively soften up the target slightly more, which will give torpedoes a better chance to kill.
Now, I could possibly afford to switch weapon modifier types (although not console types), but I want to be absolutely convinced that my reasoning is flawed and that a better modifier would increase my damage. Truthfully though, one of the reasons I chose [DMG]x2 over [ACC]x2 was due to the price difference. The [ACC]x2 were nearly twice as expensive so it would probably take all of my resources to switch to those.
Another thing to consider is that overall Phased Tetryon weapons have 1 less modifier than regular energy types. Does this make the choice of modifiers less important and thus [ACC]x2 less worthwhile/valuable than using a weapon with [ACC]x3?
Now children, let's play nice. It is just a video game afterall. Let's try to keep the insults and attitude out of this thread and stick to helping me learn how to PvP
So in that regard, I'd like to discuss why my choice of [DMG]x2 modifier is a bad one. Essentially, I chose this modifier because of the low Tetryon base damage. The bonus damage that criticals give will be less on Tetryons than any other weapon and when you start multiplying a smaller number by the same percentage as a larger base number, the difference in damage output of critical hits between Tetryon weapons and other weapons becomes exponential. In this aspect, Tetryons would be the worst weapon type to increase anything that has to do with critical chance or critical damage.
Admittedly, I didn't crunch the numbers, so I very well could be wrong about choosing [DMG]x2. By choosing it, I figured I would increase my overall continuous damage output to be more equal to other weapon types, while letting my torpedoes do most of the critical spike damage. I also hoped that in the small window between when my enemy's shields are down and my torpedoes hit, I would be able to do the highest amount of continuous damage rather than relying on low-percentage criticals to hit. This should effectively soften up the target slightly more, which will give torpedoes a better chance to kill.
Now, I could possibly afford to switch weapon modifier types (although not console types), but I want to be absolutely convinced that my reasoning is flawed and that a better modifier would increase my damage. Truthfully though, one of the reasons I chose [DMG]x2 over [ACC]x2 was due to the price difference. The [ACC]x2 were nearly twice as expensive so it would probably take all of my resources to switch to those.
Another thing to consider is that overall Phased Tetryon weapons have 1 less modifier than regular energy types. Does this make the choice of modifiers less important and thus [ACC]x2 less worthwhile/valuable than using a weapon with [ACC]x3?
tetryon weapons do the same base damage as all the other weapon types. where have you experienced otherwise?
and no, acc is always the best mod for any weapon, unless you are a tac then crtD and crtH become viable depending on your piloting style and loadout. dmg, is ALWAYS the least beneficial mod.
also, with everyone and their gammie numnums running 2 tac teams, landing torps on hull is quite possibly one of the hardest things to do in the game right now.
and yes, acc mod weapons are the highest priced. they are better. have you ever been shopping before? for anything? if you can't tell that a benz is a far better engineered car than a chevy based on price tag alone....well....
and yes, the trade off on the 1 modifier for the phased tets is a close call. but if i can buff my tet damage through consoles and still get a random phaser proc....well....again....
and please, stop putting so much effort into this thought process. if you have maco or omega gear you could have blue markX weapons and be just fine.
the piloting is the cake sir, most of the rest..... just icing.
...or keep the attitude. That's cool too. Sorry, I didn't realize I was thinking too hard. I'll just take you at your word without wanting any reasoning whatsoever and take your completely out-of-context car metaphor as the hard truth for all things in life.
...or keep the attitude. That's cool too. Sorry, I didn't realize I was thinking too hard. I'll just take you at your word without wanting any reasoning whatsoever and take your completely out-of-context car metaphor as the hard truth for all things in life.
whats the deal with you people?
what attitude? some of you have the thinnest skin. you have tons of great advice in this thread to read already. and pages upon pages of other topics that are quite extensive on this topic itself alone.
this guy, sophie, gives horrible advice. some of us have taken upon ourselves to correct this behavior when we can. sorry ive offended you somehow.
i responded to your post on the first day. go back and read it.
and no, you may not be thinking too hard. but on the wrong side of the coin, maybe. like i said, i run on mkX blue weapons on a few toons, and with crappy mods...and do perfectly fine because i focus on piloting. there is no gear "i win" button or best setup, it really depends on you, the player.
and the car metaphor was actually right on point. things that are more expensive are most of the time worth the money. you said it yourself, you looked, and they are much more expensive than the other weapons. how was this at all out of context?
okay, how bout this one: you are at the ford dealer.......and you test drive the fiesta, then the mustang........
what attitude? some of you have the thinnest skin. you have tons of great advice in this thread to read already. and pages upon pages of other topics that are quite extensive on this topic itself alone.
this guy, sophie, gives horrible advice. some of us have taken upon ourselves to correct this behavior when we can. sorry ive offended you somehow.
i responded to your post on the first day. go back and read it.
and no, you may not be thinking too hard. but on the wrong side of the coin, maybe. like i said, i run on mkX blue weapons on a few toons, and with crappy mods...and do perfectly fine because i focus on piloting. there is no gear "i win" button or best setup, it really depends on you, the player.
and the car metaphor was actually right on point. things that are more expensive are most of the time worth the money. you said it yourself, you looked, and they are much more expensive than the other weapons. how was this at all out of context?
okay, how bout this one: you are at the ford dealer.......and you test drive the fiesta, then the mustang........
I find it hard to believe that gear is as unimportant as you make it out to be. Even though I'm new to PvP I'd be willing to bet I'd score higher in a PvP match and could take you out in a 1v1 against one of your blue mkX toons. Hit me up on STO and we can test it out - Entarra Adu@DevolvedOne. Although, since you know my gear, you'd probably just get all Tetryon resist consoles and lol all day :x
As for your analogy, it is out of context because we are dealing with a market that can be easily manipulated by someone or someones that have enough EC. As such, prices may not reflect the true relative value of an item. Are [ACC]x3 weapons really worth twice as much or are people buying them when they become available at lower prices and reposting them at higher prices (or just holding on to them) in order to inflate their value? It's also based on the assumption that the random number generator Cryptic created works perfectly and there are always the same number of each type of item dropping. Then there's the fact that certain types of weapons can be crafted and thus the supply of them will be higher than something that you can't craft.
To be fair mav... the one exception to the 3 dhc or better rule... is sort of what he was planning to do with the KHG bonus. For the amount of extra dmg you get from the KGH. (its equal to 3 torp dmg units) its like his bug would have a 8 tac console setup.
The thing is if you are going to bother with torps AT ALL imo you HAVE to commit to them. No silly one launcher in front eating your dps... go all in and run 2 so you can keep the torp rapid fire going... I did this with a goomba for a good while and honestly my dmg was much higher, and more important my KILLS where much higher then they where in a full cannon setup....
On my feds 2 torps works on most ships but I did hate it on my bug... it felt much weaker then just going cannons... that KHG set is the torpedo holy grail... if I ever get a second bug for my klink or the KHG set ever gets some cross faction love I will be running 2 DHC on that ship.
This is a little off-topic and I don't want to detract from the OP's questions, but have you ever tried two torps on a BO BoP? I'm having a little more success with the whole 2 x DHC, 1 x Quantum and 1 x DBB setup, but the DHCs are mostly there for appearances/knocking off shield slivers/chasing stragglers. I'd go two torps (I run two-piece KHG and take Torp Spread III) and shell out for the proper DOffs if I thought it'd be worth it.
You're really overthinking the mods/energy types badly. Pick an energy type (go with your favorite color if you like), try for at least one [Acc] if you can and roll with it. It's just not that big of a deal in the end, and especially not at the point where you're asking us for basic build help.
Comments
First, never expect a fair and balanced fight in a PUG match.
You should often expect to at least once out of three matches to come across someone using known broken or ?not working correctly? abilities or combinations of abilities.
You will be required to wait, not always, but often to get into a PVP match
Kerrat is not for the faint of heart. Expect to be brutalized or to brutalize others.
And well, enjoy this mess of a game.
To be fair mav... the one exception to the 3 dhc or better rule... is sort of what he was planning to do with the KHG bonus. For the amount of extra dmg you get from the KGH. (its equal to 3 torp dmg units) its like his bug would have a 8 tac console setup.
The thing is if you are going to bother with torps AT ALL imo you HAVE to commit to them. No silly one launcher in front eating your dps... go all in and run 2 so you can keep the torp rapid fire going... I did this with a goomba for a good while and honestly my dmg was much higher, and more important my KILLS where much higher then they where in a full cannon setup....
On my feds 2 torps works on most ships but I did hate it on my bug... it felt much weaker then just going cannons... that KHG set is the torpedo holy grail... if I ever get a second bug for my klink or the KHG set ever gets some cross faction love I will be running 2 DHC on that ship.
Cryptic screwed up all the poster data... but the info is still all there.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=255864
The builds mat not directly cross to your bug, I don't remember to many people posting good bug builds... but go read some of the ideas about escort piloting in that thread.
ANY Advice you get on this forum should be considered Suspect
Always Compare sources and never go with any one persons advice (especially not MINE )
No offense, but do you actually PvP? None of this really makes sense to me. Can you even get purple XII anti-proton weapons that don't have the Borg proc., which is a complete waste in PvP? And the anti-proton mag regulators are like 50 mil. EC a pop. It seems like a lot of EC to spend on something that won't give you the most bang for your buck because of the Borg proc.
RCS also seems like a waste of a Eng. console slot that could be better used for a defensive console. Honestly, the Bug already turns faster than pretty much every other ship in the game and so far I have not had a problem lining up enemies except maybe a Defiant with Evasive maneuvers activated.
Tricobalt doesn't make much sense to me either. The slow flight speed of it means they could have their shields back up by the time it reaches them, or they could just shoot it down if I recall correctly. Then it has, what, like a 60 second cooldown or something crazy so there could be many opportunities where someone's shields are down but my Tricobalt is on cooldown. And finally, I like to get close to my enemies (3km or closer) for the increased energy damage as well as getting my torpedo to connect before they can use a shield buff. This could be a problem considering the splash damage would hit me as well.
@DevolvedOne
I would still rather have a third energy weapon than a second torp 9/10 times.
the KHG set just makes that punch in the face that much harder.
And hey if you get a couple purple torp doffs, every so often you get a free hit in anyway.
2 torps, is viableish. But I'm abit of a traditionalist, even with the new found prowess of KHG.
So if he especially shouldn't listen to you. Then he should definitely listen to everyone else.
Which, is quite true.
You couldn't pvp your way out of a wet paper bag.
There are some people on this forum I'd trust with giving advice. You are definitely not one of them, since you feel anything but canon is some "evil mauler build" (which really is a complement by the way. Afterall, to maul someone in pvp, is to utterly decimate them and leave them unable to Respond to an assault.).
This is interesting, and something that I already have experienced. I was in a PvP the other night with a Fed player named King in an escort. I could not for the life of me get his facing shield to ever completely drop even with my 3 DHC's so my Quantum torpedoes never really had a chance to shine. I don't know what his setup was, but he had more tanking ability than most cruisers and he would always kill me if we got into a 1v1 dogfight because I could never drop his shields.
Now, with this in mind, I'm wondering if going for dual torpedoes up front would expand this problem to other players that don't even have that great of tanking ability. I suppose I could at least try it out, but I'm afraid I may never be able to lower an experienced player's shields to where the torpedoes can actually do some real damage. It also seems to highlight the greater need for all Tetryon consoles as opposed to using a torpedo console. I think I'm going to remove the Zero Point console whether or not I use 1 or 2 torps up front for this reason alone.
@DevolvedOne
Because you'll almost never blow a shield down with just 2 DHCs blazing away.
2 T Torps with 2 Torp Doffs will net a Machine Gun Effect, and their bleedthrough especially with high yield pumping them up, is actually rather substantial.
If you do do 2 torps. Put them UpFront.
Single Torp. It Goes Upfront.
Period. you lose way too much time on target trying to position your ship's TRIBBLE to let loose a torp. More than enough time for an opponent to get a shield up.
No honestly it will solve the issue of shields down.... the issue with only one tube is always timing. Even with doffs you just can't rely on them and you will.. and I guarantee you have already experienced this... see an open facing and just not have a torp there to finish the job.
You are RUNNING Phased tets... which have a phaser proc... the thing with using 2 launchers + doffs is you Will ALWAYS have a torp on the way... try it out and you will understand... one torp per second... is killer when those torps hit for 7k non-crit which is what the KHG will do for you. A shield proc on someone .... and boom you land 2-3 torps and if your lucky one of them was HY pattern.
Honesty don't be trying to 1 on 1 anyone ever... WHY ? This is a team game... your a new player stick with the team... ESCORT THEM... read my other post about escort mind set. Trying to head of and 1 on 1 people is not a good idea. Even the best escort pilots will go down sometimes if they get shield proced. If you stick with the team... you will do better... also read my post about the target of my target window... you NEED to have that somewhere where you always see it if you fly and ESCORT. You need to know who your target is shooting at... it will also give you a quick way to check who your team is shooting at. Don't be silly and try to solo someone... see who your team is shooting at ... and get in on the same shield facing... at that point I guarantee you your torps will start hitting hull and people will start sploding.
The Phasic thing... ya forget that... sure they will go through shields... and do damn near nothing... stick with heavy hull smashers phtons and quantums for the kill.
You'll **** your pants.
Try being put down to 30 or lower at the end of someone's first pass. Without your shields ever going down. 4 torp consoles, for phasics, with doffs is OMFG amazing.
Throw on the KHG and you'll be killin people with it.
Double phasic is the only way to go if you are going double barrel.
It's ludicrous. Hell I'll even go log in to show ya if you wanna see.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4032382&postcount=6
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4039502&postcount=22
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4039555&postcount=23
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4039661&postcount=24
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=4059242&postcount=38 {READ THIS ONE FOR SURE}
Ya I have played with them on my always cloaked brel... found the newest changes wanting... but perhaps I didn't give it enough of the old collage try. lol
Make sure they aren't the stupid breen torps. Those things are useless even with the changes. They are especially worthless thanks to the torp doff.
@DevolvedOne
Or if they are smart people and are shield tanking. Rather than being a sponge hoping to get lucky with 2 fpbs :P
DPS ain't your bag anyway man. What are you doing in this thread?
Yep those are the ones.. 20% chance to reduce by 5 seconds on purple.
Yep those be the ones. They only stack twice (yet you can have 3 equipped. I suspect this is a Bug). But with 2 torps you have ludicrously good chances to proc with each firing. They seem to proc more than 50 percent of the time as well, for some dumb TRIBBLE reason. (Cryptic math no doubt) to the point you could bind the things to your friggin space bar.
Also side note for sophlogimo. You used them on a ship with only 2 consoles. with 4 they are a whole another ball game. Throw in the KHG, which adds a -huge- bonus as well and maybe a decloak bonus and you could probably one pass someone with HY2, and torp spam.
You have a ship with 2 consoles. You also had a ship with a pitiful TRIBBLE Speed, and Turn rate giving you very limited time to use them.
Try 4, and a ship that can actually move.
Now try that with KHG bonus.
Also I've seen your idea of an Escort. You have no right to comment on anything, ever kid. My Shuttles tank better than you.
Yes they are not 100%... however with 2 launchers and 3 doffs... your chance of NOT procing at least one 5 second (which will give you that 1 per sec)... is 25%... so for the most part you will be 1 per second while you have someone arced almost for sure.
i'm going to type slowly, so pay attention. there are a bajillion things wrong with just about everything you think and do in this game, as many of us have tried to tell you many times before. i shall address this post only right now, and i shall list them in order of their appearance in your post.
1: mav has all the right and the reasoning to address you, the person in his post. this is a public forum, and we are all contributing members.
2: torps on escorts are always questionable, unless you are of the top players in the game at timing them to hit hull between your target's tac teams. hell, even mav his self has come around to slightly agree with this.
3: transphasics are only good in theory, rarely in practice, even with 100% build dedication do they perform as well as plasma torps, and thats just sad.
4: if you run a monotanium, you are not paying attention. with the amount of shield resists going around the +18 from neutronium is more than enough for 1 ship.l
5: if you are running 2/3 neutroniums, you have not done the math on how the defensive stats stack, and are most likely doing a lot of other stuff wrong. even great engineers in cruisers rarely run more than 1.
6: what the f is buffed dpv? damage per volley? dumbass.
7: you will never get 20 seconds straight on an escort full attack facings and buffs. you got this one as close as you possibly could tho, but i had to read it 5 times to be sure. english is not your first language is it?
8: okay, you may be coming around here......escorts are the ships that do the damage. good job sophie.
have fun kill bad guys
So in that regard, I'd like to discuss why my choice of [DMG]x2 modifier is a bad one. Essentially, I chose this modifier because of the low Tetryon base damage. The bonus damage that criticals give will be less on Tetryons than any other weapon and when you start multiplying a smaller number by the same percentage as a larger base number, the difference in damage output of critical hits between Tetryon weapons and other weapons becomes exponential. In this respect, Tetryons would be the worst weapon type to increase anything that has to do with critical chance or critical damage.
Admittedly, I didn't crunch the numbers, so I very well could be wrong about choosing [DMG]x2. By choosing it, I figured I would increase my overall continuous damage output to be more equal to other weapon types, while letting my torpedoes do most of the critical spike damage. I also hoped that in the small window between when my enemy's shields are down and my torpedoes hit, I would be able to do the highest amount of continuous hull damage rather than relying on low-percentage criticals to hit. This should effectively soften up the target slightly more, which will give torpedoes a better chance to kill.
Now, I could possibly afford to switch weapon modifier types (although not console types), but I want to be absolutely convinced that my reasoning is flawed and that a better modifier would increase my damage. Truthfully though, one of the reasons I chose [DMG]x2 over [ACC]x2 was due to the price difference. The [ACC]x2 were nearly twice as expensive so it would probably take all of my resources to switch to those.
Another thing to consider is that overall Phased Tetryon weapons have 1 less modifier than regular energy types. Does this make the choice of modifiers less important and thus [ACC]x2 less worthwhile/valuable than using a weapon with [ACC]x3?
@DevolvedOne
tetryon weapons do the same base damage as all the other weapon types. where have you experienced otherwise?
and no, acc is always the best mod for any weapon, unless you are a tac then crtD and crtH become viable depending on your piloting style and loadout. dmg, is ALWAYS the least beneficial mod.
also, with everyone and their gammie numnums running 2 tac teams, landing torps on hull is quite possibly one of the hardest things to do in the game right now.
and yes, acc mod weapons are the highest priced. they are better. have you ever been shopping before? for anything? if you can't tell that a benz is a far better engineered car than a chevy based on price tag alone....well....
and yes, the trade off on the 1 modifier for the phased tets is a close call. but if i can buff my tet damage through consoles and still get a random phaser proc....well....again....
and please, stop putting so much effort into this thought process. if you have maco or omega gear you could have blue markX weapons and be just fine.
the piloting is the cake sir, most of the rest..... just icing.
have fun kill bad guys
@DevolvedOne
whats the deal with you people?
what attitude? some of you have the thinnest skin. you have tons of great advice in this thread to read already. and pages upon pages of other topics that are quite extensive on this topic itself alone.
this guy, sophie, gives horrible advice. some of us have taken upon ourselves to correct this behavior when we can. sorry ive offended you somehow.
i responded to your post on the first day. go back and read it.
and no, you may not be thinking too hard. but on the wrong side of the coin, maybe. like i said, i run on mkX blue weapons on a few toons, and with crappy mods...and do perfectly fine because i focus on piloting. there is no gear "i win" button or best setup, it really depends on you, the player.
and the car metaphor was actually right on point. things that are more expensive are most of the time worth the money. you said it yourself, you looked, and they are much more expensive than the other weapons. how was this at all out of context?
okay, how bout this one: you are at the ford dealer.......and you test drive the fiesta, then the mustang........
I find it hard to believe that gear is as unimportant as you make it out to be. Even though I'm new to PvP I'd be willing to bet I'd score higher in a PvP match and could take you out in a 1v1 against one of your blue mkX toons. Hit me up on STO and we can test it out - Entarra Adu@DevolvedOne. Although, since you know my gear, you'd probably just get all Tetryon resist consoles and lol all day :x
As for your analogy, it is out of context because we are dealing with a market that can be easily manipulated by someone or someones that have enough EC. As such, prices may not reflect the true relative value of an item. Are [ACC]x3 weapons really worth twice as much or are people buying them when they become available at lower prices and reposting them at higher prices (or just holding on to them) in order to inflate their value? It's also based on the assumption that the random number generator Cryptic created works perfectly and there are always the same number of each type of item dropping. Then there's the fact that certain types of weapons can be crafted and thus the supply of them will be higher than something that you can't craft.
@DevolvedOne
This is a little off-topic and I don't want to detract from the OP's questions, but have you ever tried two torps on a BO BoP? I'm having a little more success with the whole 2 x DHC, 1 x Quantum and 1 x DBB setup, but the DHCs are mostly there for appearances/knocking off shield slivers/chasing stragglers. I'd go two torps (I run two-piece KHG and take Torp Spread III) and shell out for the proper DOffs if I thought it'd be worth it.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
You're really overthinking the mods/energy types badly. Pick an energy type (go with your favorite color if you like), try for at least one [Acc] if you can and roll with it. It's just not that big of a deal in the end, and especially not at the point where you're asking us for basic build help.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples