The Sovereign retrofit/refit is 100% the next ship to come out as been stated by devs as also being on the top of the list of ships to come out this year including the VESTA!, but that can change. The dev really need to listen to us, we know more then they do. Also I am a bit worried that nothing is being done for the phasers? The only thing I can think of a a Special Rapid fire phasers as shown in nemesis or a console the improve firing rate for all weapons maybe?
Actually, that Boff layout will give it the punch that such a ship deserves. Of course, it is still not a true battleship (that is, a fat and heavy, slow-turning ship with a Commander Tactical slot), but it is close.
Here's the thing I don't get.
I never saw the E as a battleship.
I saw it as a giant fighter plane. It looks faster than the D, more apt to speed and turning, and forward fire directed.
Really, to me, it should be what the T5 Excelsior is plus cannons from my impression of it.
It was always stymied by sharing a tier, IMHO, because the Sovereign was intentionally designed as a 24th century Excelsior homage.
Then again, I never understood the Excelsior as a Tac ship. It struck me more as a sci-cruiser. Sulu's missions seemed science-y. The transwarp drive seemed science-y. The Enterprise-B struck me as the most science-oriented of any of the Enterprise's missions.
That's the reason BoPs were made science-y escorts in STO, because (as I recall) Cryptic defined a science ship as a ship prone to modification that is the testing bed for new and uncertain systems. BoPs tend to use experimental weapons. So did the Intrepid.
The impression I got was that escorts were light warships (the Akira was always a stretch there), cruisers were fairly conventional ships with a sturdy hull and tested design that an engineer could keep in shape, and science ships were the modular design ships that were at the forefront of testing for things like bioneural gelpacks, transwarp drives, new cloaking devices that can fire while cloaked, etc.
Ships that use gimmicks are sci-ships. I always thought the Excelsior was at least a sci-leaning cruiser.
I probably would have made the Excelsior a sci-ship, the Akira a cruiser, and the Nebula an escort (with tactical pod). (The Nebula might have had engineering escort and science escort variants.)
In turn, I would have made the Sovereign whatever the Excelsior was. Which probably means that whatever they have planned for the Vesta is what I would have made the Sovereign. (A sci dreadnaught, basically.)
I love the sovereign. The assault cruiser is, in my opinion the single best tanking ship we have. And most of that revolves around its bridge officer layout.
You can run two EPtS 3's, two EPtW 1's and still have three eng slots left over for utility. And, you have enough tactical ability to have two tactical teams and a cannon skill, or two BFAWs and a tac team (with conn officers dropping the recharge).
The ONLY, and I mean ONLY true upgrade to the ship as far as boff layouts goes, would be the one above. You improve its tactical ability (albeit minutely) while sacrificing nothing of its toughness.
Id like to see something like this for boffs, add another tac console, upgrade hull and shields to the Tier 5+ level (Increases in turn rate would be nice, but really not necessary, its already pretty spritely). That would cause me to buy it. Anything less, and its worthless to me as the sovvy we already have (more importantly the mirror universe assault cruiser with its extra crew) does everything I want it to.
Far as the console goes? I have no idea. Personally, Id prefer something passive to a 2 min CD ability. Maybe a supped-up Universal RCS console? Say, bonus defense, flight speed and turn rate. Maybe bumping the ship up to turn rate 11 and just significantly faster. That would be nice. Either something like that or a boost to Energy and Projectile Weapons similar to the D'kora's battle mode to help with aggro while tanking and just damage in general. Frankly, an offensive console would make sense for an Assault cruiser.
might it be possible that Cryptic, this time only, is looking out for us?
obviously the C-Store refit will not be in the C-Store as long as there is the LockBox Mirror Sovereign.
Also who would go for the Mirror Ships if better ones were in the Fleet Shop window already?
They pulled the Fleet Version, BECAUSE when the C-Store version gets released (just a question of time) the Fleet Version will receive the discount if you buy the Tier 5 Refit!!!
if they leave the Fleet version in now, some people might end up buying it for 2000 Zen and be pissed later if they have to buy the C-Store version for 2000 again only for a mediocre Console.
Also the Fleet Version needs to be +10% from the Refit, not from the default Tier 5 -> those stats might still change!
Just because Mark Rademaker (the Vestsa Class designer) said yes, that doesn't translate into a proper licensing agreement. And Rademarker may not be the only right owner to the design.
Just because Mark Rademaker (the Vestsa Class designer) said yes, that doesn't translate into a proper licensing agreement. And Rademarker may not be the only right owner to the design.
as far as im aware hes the designer of the entirety of the ship , but his design was done according to someone elses input though
But from what ive heard it HAS been approved the devs and rademaker have been in regular contact for a long time now , to the point rademaker cannot actually say anything about it on chats and blogs to people because of keeping things hush hush, its just going through the legal motions , which take time.
on julys ask cryptic we got the ' ask next month' as the only reply on the vesta , so heres hoping
as for the sovereign , i really think two Lt Cmdr slots could work on it , but i do think you need to limit what else this has , 180 degree launchers OR upgraded phasers
both would be a little much for a c-point ship
a little much! lol, with the new ships coming out and that have come out adding those abilities plus the boff changes and the stats changes will be still not over doing it compared to what the devs have been doing with the new ships.
if said console upgraded next weapon attack to fire at all targets like the armitage spam for say , 15 secs or so , kind of like a super fire at will , maybe that could work
but giving it a console with the ability to fire all torpedos on a 180 arc , AND some upgraded phaser stuff with no kind of cooldown ? thats going into balance issues , this thing can have whatever boff stations it needs , two Lt Tacs you could get away with
as for the other c-store ships , the only ones that overdo it are the flagships , and thats because they are special
Actually, that Boff layout will give it the punch that such a ship deserves. Of course, it is still not a true battleship (that is, a fat and heavy, slow-turning ship with a Commander Tactical slot), but it is close.
Yes...it does give you a great tactical punch but very weak tanking abilities compared to what it had before. The reason this boff layout is bad is because to restore some semblance of tanking you are forced to use the Universal Lt for ENG, that would mean absolutely no Sci boff abilities. With no Sci Boff abilities, you have no way to clear some debuffs the enemy throws you way such as subnucleonic beam (with Sci Team). If you choose to use the universal Lt for Science instead then you are left with only Com ENG and ENS ENG. So you can't chain Emergency Power to Shields and Emergency power to Weapons, which is important in my build to have a balanced attack and defense.
I don't think we need both a LtCom TAC and Lt TAC. It is a bit of an overkill on the offensive. A cruiser is nothing if it can't tank well. It's like a cruiser trying to be like an escort minus the manueverability and speed. It'll be a sitting duck despite its tactical abilities. Like I said in previous post, it's like a sumo wrestler trying to fight like a ninja.
if said console upgraded next weapon attack to fire at all targets like the armitage spam for say , 15 secs or so , kind of like a super fire at will , maybe that could work
but giving it a console with the ability to fire all torpedos on a 180 arc , AND some upgraded phaser stuff with no kind of cooldown ? thats going into balance issues , this thing can have whatever boff stations it needs , two Lt Tacs you could get away with
as for the other c-store ships , the only ones that overdo it are the flagships , and thats because they are special
Your right, I just rechecked the ships and they all have one console each. So the only things I can see which would go for the refit and retrofit are these:-
1) 180 degree Quantum torpedo launcher that can possibly fire both High yield and Torpedo spread.
2) Improved stats e.g. turn rate from 7 to 8, etc
3) Boff stations layout bump up that tac stations and possibly remove the ensign tac to balance it out or also possible have the suggested boff layout which is heavy on tac which I suggest to the devs many times, give the players a chance to try the new boff layout, a trial time, so we can see if we like or not. If we don't like it go back to the other boff layout.
4) I plus many other players would like to see skin tight shields if it is possible on here.
5) Nemesis costume hopefully and the a 2409/25th century costume for the ship plus all the fixes to the ship which have not been sorted out on the original sovereign in game e.g. nacelles to low to see from front view.
This is all I can think off at this time unless the new sovereign gets something completely new console or ability.
Comments
Here's the thing I don't get.
I never saw the E as a battleship.
I saw it as a giant fighter plane. It looks faster than the D, more apt to speed and turning, and forward fire directed.
Really, to me, it should be what the T5 Excelsior is plus cannons from my impression of it.
It was always stymied by sharing a tier, IMHO, because the Sovereign was intentionally designed as a 24th century Excelsior homage.
Then again, I never understood the Excelsior as a Tac ship. It struck me more as a sci-cruiser. Sulu's missions seemed science-y. The transwarp drive seemed science-y. The Enterprise-B struck me as the most science-oriented of any of the Enterprise's missions.
That's the reason BoPs were made science-y escorts in STO, because (as I recall) Cryptic defined a science ship as a ship prone to modification that is the testing bed for new and uncertain systems. BoPs tend to use experimental weapons. So did the Intrepid.
The impression I got was that escorts were light warships (the Akira was always a stretch there), cruisers were fairly conventional ships with a sturdy hull and tested design that an engineer could keep in shape, and science ships were the modular design ships that were at the forefront of testing for things like bioneural gelpacks, transwarp drives, new cloaking devices that can fire while cloaked, etc.
Ships that use gimmicks are sci-ships. I always thought the Excelsior was at least a sci-leaning cruiser.
I probably would have made the Excelsior a sci-ship, the Akira a cruiser, and the Nebula an escort (with tactical pod). (The Nebula might have had engineering escort and science escort variants.)
In turn, I would have made the Sovereign whatever the Excelsior was. Which probably means that whatever they have planned for the Vesta is what I would have made the Sovereign. (A sci dreadnaught, basically.)
I love the sovereign. The assault cruiser is, in my opinion the single best tanking ship we have. And most of that revolves around its bridge officer layout.
You can run two EPtS 3's, two EPtW 1's and still have three eng slots left over for utility. And, you have enough tactical ability to have two tactical teams and a cannon skill, or two BFAWs and a tac team (with conn officers dropping the recharge).
The ONLY, and I mean ONLY true upgrade to the ship as far as boff layouts goes, would be the one above. You improve its tactical ability (albeit minutely) while sacrificing nothing of its toughness.
Id like to see something like this for boffs, add another tac console, upgrade hull and shields to the Tier 5+ level (Increases in turn rate would be nice, but really not necessary, its already pretty spritely). That would cause me to buy it. Anything less, and its worthless to me as the sovvy we already have (more importantly the mirror universe assault cruiser with its extra crew) does everything I want it to.
Far as the console goes? I have no idea. Personally, Id prefer something passive to a 2 min CD ability. Maybe a supped-up Universal RCS console? Say, bonus defense, flight speed and turn rate. Maybe bumping the ship up to turn rate 11 and just significantly faster. That would be nice. Either something like that or a boost to Energy and Projectile Weapons similar to the D'kora's battle mode to help with aggro while tanking and just damage in general. Frankly, an offensive console would make sense for an Assault cruiser.
might it be possible that Cryptic, this time only, is looking out for us?
obviously the C-Store refit will not be in the C-Store as long as there is the LockBox Mirror Sovereign.
Also who would go for the Mirror Ships if better ones were in the Fleet Shop window already?
They pulled the Fleet Version, BECAUSE when the C-Store version gets released (just a question of time) the Fleet Version will receive the discount if you buy the Tier 5 Refit!!!
if they leave the Fleet version in now, some people might end up buying it for 2000 Zen and be pissed later if they have to buy the C-Store version for 2000 again only for a mediocre Console.
Also the Fleet Version needs to be +10% from the Refit, not from the default Tier 5 -> those stats might still change!
...
I thought that was approved months ago?
Just because Mark Rademaker (the Vestsa Class designer) said yes, that doesn't translate into a proper licensing agreement. And Rademarker may not be the only right owner to the design.
as far as im aware hes the designer of the entirety of the ship , but his design was done according to someone elses input though
But from what ive heard it HAS been approved the devs and rademaker have been in regular contact for a long time now , to the point rademaker cannot actually say anything about it on chats and blogs to people because of keeping things hush hush, its just going through the legal motions , which take time.
on julys ask cryptic we got the ' ask next month' as the only reply on the vesta , so heres hoping
as for the sovereign , i really think two Lt Cmdr slots could work on it , but i do think you need to limit what else this has , 180 degree launchers OR upgraded phasers
both would be a little much for a c-point ship
Rear Admiral , Engineering Division
U.S.S. Sheffield N.C.C. 92016
they do ONE thing
intrepid? ablative armour , defiant ? cloaks , armitage ? torp spam etc etc etc
if said console upgraded next weapon attack to fire at all targets like the armitage spam for say , 15 secs or so , kind of like a super fire at will , maybe that could work
but giving it a console with the ability to fire all torpedos on a 180 arc , AND some upgraded phaser stuff with no kind of cooldown ? thats going into balance issues , this thing can have whatever boff stations it needs , two Lt Tacs you could get away with
as for the other c-store ships , the only ones that overdo it are the flagships , and thats because they are special
Rear Admiral , Engineering Division
U.S.S. Sheffield N.C.C. 92016
Yes...it does give you a great tactical punch but very weak tanking abilities compared to what it had before. The reason this boff layout is bad is because to restore some semblance of tanking you are forced to use the Universal Lt for ENG, that would mean absolutely no Sci boff abilities. With no Sci Boff abilities, you have no way to clear some debuffs the enemy throws you way such as subnucleonic beam (with Sci Team). If you choose to use the universal Lt for Science instead then you are left with only Com ENG and ENS ENG. So you can't chain Emergency Power to Shields and Emergency power to Weapons, which is important in my build to have a balanced attack and defense.
I don't think we need both a LtCom TAC and Lt TAC. It is a bit of an overkill on the offensive. A cruiser is nothing if it can't tank well. It's like a cruiser trying to be like an escort minus the manueverability and speed. It'll be a sitting duck despite its tactical abilities. Like I said in previous post, it's like a sumo wrestler trying to fight like a ninja.
Your right, I just rechecked the ships and they all have one console each. So the only things I can see which would go for the refit and retrofit are these:-
1) 180 degree Quantum torpedo launcher that can possibly fire both High yield and Torpedo spread.
2) Improved stats e.g. turn rate from 7 to 8, etc
3) Boff stations layout bump up that tac stations and possibly remove the ensign tac to balance it out or also possible have the suggested boff layout which is heavy on tac which I suggest to the devs many times, give the players a chance to try the new boff layout, a trial time, so we can see if we like or not. If we don't like it go back to the other boff layout.
4) I plus many other players would like to see skin tight shields if it is possible on here.
5) Nemesis costume hopefully and the a 2409/25th century costume for the ship plus all the fixes to the ship which have not been sorted out on the original sovereign in game e.g. nacelles to low to see from front view.
This is all I can think off at this time unless the new sovereign gets something completely new console or ability.