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Does PWE/Cryptic Value its Customers?
logicalspock
Member Posts: 836 Arc User
I have been losing my enthusiasm for this game and as of December and have been content to play it without spending any money.
When Cryptic introduced the c-store only VA ships, they made sure that they were still balanced with the RA ships. I own every single one of the endgame federation ships that existed as of the F2P launch. Some of these endgame ships cost $25 now and when you buy an endgame ship and are told a few weeks later that you have to pay another $5 for each of your characters to upgrade it to a better ship (which presumably is not even reclaimable and will thus may require the further purchase of a ship slot) I feel like Cryptic is saying, "we really do not value the money you give us."
Cryptic needs to understand that they are not selling the latest and greatest model of a vacuum cleaner or home banking app. The fleet Galaxy-R is only better than the c-store Galaxy-R because it exists within the artificial universe that Cryptic programmers have engineered. It does not have any new visuals, it does not prepare your taxes better, and it certainly does not vacuum better.
Cryptic used to make money by creating something new: a brand new ship or a new uniform. Now they make money by devaluing the old ships that we spent good money on.
If Cryptic routinely rebalanced endgame ships to ensure that they were all about equally powerful, I would feel as if Cryptic was actually valuing the money I was spending. If Cryptic actually were selling new content in the c-store, like expansion packs or bridge packs, I would feel as if Cryptic was actually valuing the money I was spending.
The last six months have really makes me feel that Cryptic does not value me as a customer, not a feeling that makes me inclined to spend my money.
When Cryptic introduced the c-store only VA ships, they made sure that they were still balanced with the RA ships. I own every single one of the endgame federation ships that existed as of the F2P launch. Some of these endgame ships cost $25 now and when you buy an endgame ship and are told a few weeks later that you have to pay another $5 for each of your characters to upgrade it to a better ship (which presumably is not even reclaimable and will thus may require the further purchase of a ship slot) I feel like Cryptic is saying, "we really do not value the money you give us."
Cryptic needs to understand that they are not selling the latest and greatest model of a vacuum cleaner or home banking app. The fleet Galaxy-R is only better than the c-store Galaxy-R because it exists within the artificial universe that Cryptic programmers have engineered. It does not have any new visuals, it does not prepare your taxes better, and it certainly does not vacuum better.
Cryptic used to make money by creating something new: a brand new ship or a new uniform. Now they make money by devaluing the old ships that we spent good money on.
If Cryptic routinely rebalanced endgame ships to ensure that they were all about equally powerful, I would feel as if Cryptic was actually valuing the money I was spending. If Cryptic actually were selling new content in the c-store, like expansion packs or bridge packs, I would feel as if Cryptic was actually valuing the money I was spending.
The last six months have really makes me feel that Cryptic does not value me as a customer, not a feeling that makes me inclined to spend my money.
Post edited by logicalspock on
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PWE does not. And Cryptic must do whatever they say in the end.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I just learned that in order to get a fleet version of my ship, which by all means is a minor upgrade, id have to spend a full 2000 zen to get it, not to mention the star-base upgrades and the fleet credits required.
I have to spend 20$ for an extra console and a mild shield/hull upgrade, really?
Not only this, but they rolled out a REALLY broken update, they didn't even adjust the prices on the dilithium exchange for the zen conversion, and then they had the audacity to go ahead and 'nerf' one of the biggest dilithium generators in the game (the contraband turn-in doff mission) just to put the icing on top.
The update had me really excited when it was in tribble, it truly looked like a well oiled and working update that was polished, and then they push it out onto the holodeck with some quick "**** we need more money" updates and end up breaking everything.
The fact that they time-gated the tholian event to only give you fleet marks during certain times that isn't even marked on the calender is just another piece of the wonderful cake, after specifically saying that they werent going to time-gate them.
You might as well time-gate it now, one of the main reasons why the tholian event was USEFUL was because he gave you fleet marks for your missions, so I guess their strategy is now 'make the event open but basically useless until certain times.'
Bonus times are nice, but usefulness times aren't, the tholian missions give you nothing but anti-tholian equipment, so going down there is literally pointless unless you're prepping to run the missions like some sort of STF god, which again is pointless because the equipment down there is trash anywhere BUT on that planet.
Do they value the individual customer, recognizing intelligence, loyalty and their wish to support the game?
No... They don't.
Just as a small example, they openly disregard feedback (Seriously... it's been 4 days since the test weekend ended... There is no way they could have killed the bugs).
The whole "PWE is making them do it" argument dosen't work either, because you can usually tell when someone is fighting the incoming changes, and I have to say that I sense no form of remorse or sadness, when certain prominent dev's write on twitter or here on the forums.
They are defending poor decisions, and they do it in a strong manner. Anyone would just have not commented if they were dissatisfied, but could'n tell.
Na... they are in on it... and they love it.
And it was already too easy to get dilithilum by using that mission, even if you weren't KDF. This change is making it more fair.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Everything the devs say represents PWE, as their paycheck states. This means they MUST sound like nothing's wrong, whatever their personal feelings are.
And openly disregard it? You forget they must think over feedback before choosing to implement it or not. We miss a lot of that thinking process, hence why it's not as simple as 'yes, we're gonna do it' or 'no, we're not'
And not commenting if dissatisfied? They're individuals, doing what they think is best, not what you/anyone else expect is right and what isn't. Their idea of expressing dissatisfaction is probably a lot different. And don't presume to know how their minds work based on the end results alone.
In other words, there's more middle ground to this than anyone seems to think.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Uh no, Zen is LESS VALUABLE then CP, that means that if I buy 80 CP and 80 Zen for the same dilithium value, im getting LESS with the Zen purchase, this applies with the market.
So 325 dilithium for 1 CP is a better value then 325 dilithium for 1 Zen
And what is having less dilithium generation have to do with fairness, who are you being fair too? PWE's pockets? The dilithium exchange is already hideously inflated, even without the Zen conversion making it worse.
If they were middle ground, they would act like it...
It's fairly obvious, to me at least, that they like what is going on. They tried to channel alot of things into the C-Store, dispite customer feedback, while working for Atari, and I am starting to think that it was actually Atari holding some of it back.
Now, every little thing that get's released somehow get a relation to the C-Store... And what could be better for their little pockets, than a overflow of naive people, with too much access to credit cards and no sense of how much they are spending?
This is a goldmine filled with slaves, who know no better life, to them.
The Conversion FAQ (https://support.perfectworld.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/4136) clearly states that 80 Cryptic Points = 100 Zen points. This means 1 Cryptic point = 1.25 Zen
So if 340 Dil got you 1 Cryptic point, 425 Dil would be needed to make it a 1:1 conversion... with the price staying 340 Dil as an example, you're making more Zen than normal.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
You think they like it, and that anything else is fairly impossible or wrong. That's not a good mindset, by possibly deluding yourself, along with possibly closing yourself off to the truth.
PWE probably acts a lot like you're saying. Cryptic though, does not, even if on the surface they do. That is my opinion, and has been, ever since Open Beta. Nothing has changed that.
And I've never spent a single C-Store/Zen point, so I know my way around the game, and it's money aspects. Not spending money allows plenty of time to understand how they work before losing money off them.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
This is the same company that started this game with a pay to play subscription and a cash store.
They may have to do what PWE tells them to, but PWE isn't telling them to do anything they didn't dream of from the moment they started this venture. They're no more innocent than PWE is, they're just a lot better at blowing smoke up our rear ends.
Both companies only really value our money.
Uh. They don't set the prices on the dilithium exchange for the ZEN conversion. They cancelled outstanding offers.
The reason it's going for 320 dilithium per ZEN is because that's the price players have set it at... and that's because, it would appear, that the market was oversaturated with dilithium speculators, devaluing dilithium, and people buying ZEN who aren't conscious of the value difference.
It isn't Cryptic's job to adjust that... although the market will start adjusting that once demand for dilithium goes up.
But I like Cryptic. You may find it hard to believe, but I do, and I support them with my gameplay. It may be because I've never spent anything on STO, and hence never enjoyed rare benefits or lost value on others, but I don't mind anything they've done.
It's been that way since Open Beta. And it hasn't changed.
It's PWE I don't support though.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Shame
As my above post will say though, I don't mind anything they've done. You may, and I can't change that.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
You keep refering to how others do not know how they think and act, but assume that you do yourself.
How interesting.
Cryptic is 100% a part of this... They defend every action done, and they seem very happy and excited about it.
A few month ago we told them very compassionately that we did not like cartoonish icons in the game... They slightly changed them, but not really.
Now... they DuOff UI is flooded with cartoonish icons.
They do not give a F about us as consumers, as long as we are customers.
You assume they do it willingly... but there is relucantly as well, even if we don't see it. Shame you only assume it's willingly.
In my opinion, you're way past biased. I can't change that, but this is my opinion, and it can be wrong. I don't deny that. I stand by it though.
At the end of the day, you and others hate Cryptic for minor/major changes that you oppose, then hate their entire company JUST for those changes. My opinion, however, is it's much more complex than that, and thus I take a more complex approach to it.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
1. This could be another Year of Fail for Cryptic (though it's PWE's fault, not Cryptic's, but Cryptic ends up taking the blame for it)...
2. Without the Foundry, I think this game would have died at the end of 2011.
3. We can create more and better content than Cryptic can, Cryptic has very limited time and resources, so it would seem. They are either unwilling or unable to consistently deliver content, so it falls to us to do what they cannot or will not.
4. I've seen several very good examples of fun-to-play and re-play Foundry missions. There are still some missions which should be reviewed before being published (being totally sub-par, some are even test missions), but most missions are fun and very enjoyable. It is to be expected that some missions are not up to snuff, some people don't want to really contribute that much...;)
5. What we need, are series of missions that follow the same basic story plot, much like how Season 3 of Enterprise followed the same basic storyline. Some people have already started with this process, but it needs to be more common...Single missions are good, but several story-driven missions would be even better.
6. With the birth of ape-**** lockboxes and pay-for fleet ships which are not really any better than account-wide c-store ships I already own, and gated content, and so many other little tricks to steal real-life (TM) money, like making Dilithium purchasable instead of having every mission in the game give you set amounts of Dilithium that is given according to game difficulty settings (I always run Elite)....Well, the Foundry becomes more important with every single content-deprived c-store-gated addition to the game.
7. There was a promise from Dan during one of the recent Ask The Devs monthly questionnaire thingies, that "Soon" Foundry missions would give us rewards in-game, appropriate to our level and difficulty settings...I sincerely hope this comes before Season 7 does, because the Foundry is more important than gated content that will probably get tied into the C-Store with more lockboxes related to the content.
8. Season 7 is supposed to give us a lot of content...The problem is: Will it be gated again? Will it get tied up with the C-Store again (Like the Dominion FE was, especially with the lockboxes and Galor spam)? Will it have a gripping story? Or will it have a sub-par story? With the Foundry, we can make more and better content/missions than Cryptic seems capable of, because we have more time and more resources to throw at the effort...;)
Thanks for your time,
Kell out.
It's sad that you can't look up my history from the old forums anymore.
If you could, I would be able to show you that I used to support them with even more dedication than you are.
I base my opinions on actions... not a logo.
But when devs sit on twitter calling the players idiots for giving feedback about something they disapprove of, and alot more, yes... then my support will eventually reach an end.
I AM NOT A FAN OF PWE!!!!
MEMBER SINCE JANUARY 2010
But my mind works unusually. Actions that have turned your support in the other direction have had NO effect on me. My support of Cryptic hasn't changed at all since Open Beta. It may be because I haven't spent a dime on STO, and it may be other reasons.
I enjoy STO, and I like the devs on a personal level, based on what I've observed of them. The business level, my reaction to which is best described as 'meh', has no effect on either of those other levels for me.
So at the end of the day, I enjoy STO and support Cryptic, for the simple reasons I've mentioned. And It would take a major upheveal to upset that. It hasn't happened yet, so is not likely with the standard future changes.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Season 6 is one of the final nails in STO's coffin. STO will never see another dime of my money. Thankfully there is lots of other games out there with companies who actually put out real content updates, less glitchy patches and actually care about customer feedback. I'm still waiting to see them fix the spelling error "Disrupter" when you buy STF gear. One letter change to fix it. What about the "You have refined 0 dilithium" every time you change the zone? One line of code to fix that too.
if (refined_dilithium != 0) before printf.
But what do we get? More bugs, higher prices, no real content.
Which is probably PWE again... not that they care
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
That's 500 zen if you already own the base T5 C-Store ship, otherwise its 2000 zen. Per ship. Per character. That's 20 bucks for a single ship that my gut feeling says you won't be able to reclaim if you decommission it.
Are the account wide c-store (non-fleet) ships no longer available? What is to stop someone from buying the account wide version, then the per character fleet conversion thingie for the extra $5?
Nothing. they are still there. It is kind of clear now. all C-store ships have gone up in price 5 dollars. and non C-Store ships are now 20 dollars. I might do it for my carrier but I think I will stick with my normal ships for my other accounts.
Then you're essentially paying 25-30 for that one ship, since chances are I'm not going to be using the same ship on every character I have. This also doesn't work for the dilithium only ships, that's just a straight $20 no matter what.
Well it is a forced price increase to bolster their C-store sells. All ships ( except the T5 Connie ... no love for you guys at all. ) are now C-store ships and are at the same price as the old C-store ships. only difference is now you have to pay more to get the old C-store ships to get better. It is a well done price raise.
You are paying exactly what you would be paying for the c-store version now. You are only paying the $5 extra for the characters you want the fleet version on.
In short, you are essentially complaining about the cost of the existing c store ships, which didn't seem to be this level of issue til now. Before now, if you wanted a then 'top of the line' c-store ship on only one character, you didn't get a discount simply because you only wanted it for one character.
Matthew/Shiduri@zekesulastin
This is true.. I can see an issue in the case of such ships