Just to understand the numbers correctly: This is damage to hull against shielded targets that do not use Hazard Emitters, right?
And did you test THY?
That't right... I won't be providing PvP test numbers cause frankly they are not possible to control... and unlike you I see no point in 1 on 1 numbers.
I will tell you that in PvP... the UN buffed plasma torps provide higher dps... mainly because the burn proc is 100% on unbuffed plasma torps... and I wait until I know my target has no hazards... and in many cases I can get there teammates to blow there hazards, and switch to a clean target that can't stop the burn proc. It is not hard to rack up 4-8 procs on one target ... for a 400-1000 burn dmg a tick.
If you are suggesting that Hazards makes them suck for PvP... frankly that just isn't the case. They counter the DOT yes... but Polarized hull Negates all kinetic... Brace For impact Negates all dmg... and frankly hazards negates most of the dmg of the other types as well.
For PvP right now Plasma > all others. Even after the phasic buff... I doubt highly they will out perform plasma either.
One additional question: Did you measure Rapid Reload Transphasic Torps, too?
No I used regular crithx3 phasics... because frankly they do higher dps.
They spit just as fast with 3 doffs so there really is little reason to use the lower dmg rapid fire.
I could run those tests for you if you really want... I can already tell you where they will rank dmg wise... below Plasma Quantums and Photons... I can say that because even the 12 second recharge chronitons match photon dps with doffs... so really I don't see the possibly 1-2 extra torps a min that you may get due to the 12% chance of not procing a 1 per second fire rate, really making a major impact to performance.
I will probaly re run my tests after the phasic buff... but I understand they are also reducing the base dmg numbers... something tells me they will likely be close to the photon / chron numbers.
That't right... I won't be providing PvP test numbers cause frankly they are not possible to control... and unlike you I see no point in 1 on 1 numbers.
I will tell you that in PvP... the UN buffed plasma torps provide higher dps... mainly because the burn proc is 100% on unbuffed plasma torps... and I wait until I know my target has no hazards... and in many cases I can get there teammates to blow there hazards, and switch to a clean target that can't stop the burn proc. It is not hard to rack up 4-8 procs on one target ... for a 400-1000 burn dmg a tick.
If you are suggesting that Hazards makes them suck for PvP... frankly that just isn't the case. They counter the DOT yes... but Polarized hull Negates all kinetic... Brace For impact Negates all dmg... and frankly hazards negates most of the dmg of the other types as well.
For PvP right now Plasma > all others. Even after the phasic buff... I doubt highly they will out perform plasma either.
Hmm... Chrono Mines in the back Plasma Torps in the front, of a Sci Ship causing Tractor Slows and the burn might make people think they ran into an invisible Warp pee.
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this: American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Hmm... Chrono Mines in the back Plasma Torps in the front, of a Sci Ship causing Tractor Slows and the burn might make people think they ran into an invisible Warp pee.
I can assure you and Husanak alike that at least one sci build I post in my sci thread will have 3 plas torps upfront with double spreads and doffs.
Interesting. I will have to do some tests about that.
I would suggests you post this in a new thread, too.
Probaly won't start a new thread over it... I run all sorts of tests. I keep log files for most of the odd things I try. I don't often go into numbers for a few reasons. They do change situation to situation and they are open to interpretation believe it or not.) I wouldn't say everyone should run plasma... cause ya its not for everyone... plasma CAN be a great pvp weapon if you use it properly or it can be a complete waste if you don't. Quantums are mostly > then all others 9 times out of 10... but I wouldn't say only run quantums. Phasics honestly the only way I have gotten them to do anything worth while is in an EXTREMLY dedicated build. (Torp brel with cloak bonus and KGH Kinetic bonus... even then if a target has a bunch of armour its pointless. and the 40% buff won't change that, I don't think)
Photons are interesting they are almost = to quantums for burst potential but they fly allot slower... which can be a good thing if you are timing burst... Builds that use Beam Overload AND a torp... I have found photon > as it is easier to time a bunch of burst on a facing. You can even use evasive with a Photon HY 2 and 3... and they will land at the same time... Rapid Fire 3 + 2 photon tubes with Photon HY 3 + HY 2 + Evasive... followed by a BOL 3 in the face at like 1k out... is by far the highest burst move I have been able to pull of in this game.
The only reason I posted numbers here is cause you seem to not believe that other people really do test things... and aren't just pulling things out of there hind quarters. Believe it or not most of us have run tactical Vo'ques at some point (which is basicly although possibly a slighly better version of your cat box, I didn't buy a cat box no and I won't. I have the vo'que if I want to fly a carrier. The turn rate drives me nuts I only have fun with that ship when a group of my friends are flying em.). I appreciate that you want to test things for yourself, however frankly its insulting that you assume the rest of us don't. People like Webdeath / Fallout / Marvio and many of the others that have responded to you and tried to discuss the merits of your build really have tested most of the stuff you have tried at some point. Yes I will even admit I tested a torp carrier once... it was a bad idea you can't keep target reliably.
Honestly based on the playstyle you have been talking about... you should really try out a Recon Sci Ship. You can load 3 torps in the front and keep arc all day long... you will get more dmg. You can use the sci stuff in an offensive way. Bottom line you will tank about as well... and you will kill people much more often.
In any even Soph... I will apologize to you know for any harsh wording I sued early in this thread... it just seemed to me that by page 2 you where coming on a bit strong... anyway. I will believe at this point that you just want to become a better pilot and leave it at that. If you have any honest questions ask them. What ever you want to think about the STO PvP community in general... you should know that compared to most MMOs this is the most mature bunch of PvPers there is. lol (in most PvP MMOs you would have gotten a very nasty reverse care bare stare by now)
The breen bonus just isn't good enough to justify the defensive step down. It provides around the same bump you get from one Tactical Consul.
I don't know I would say wait to test phasics again after season 6 changes come in. Until them try what you are doing with plasma torps... its not expensive to switch over. I still say it would work better in a recon ship... still at least with plasma you are applying some good pressure dmg for the team. I know you are loving the FPB cause it puts your ship on the score board... really though it doesn't really kill anyone, unless someone really isn't paying attention and beam overloads you or something. I would suggest either TBR, Scramble, or if you are going to try to get it in arc VM. That way you can provide some CC. Or run 2 tractor beams... and load some tractor beam pets to just plain be annoying... and kill defense values for your teammates.
is this the reason im getting hit by harping torps?i figured it was a noob move but i see good players doing it at well. i thought maybe its for the lol but good players hit me when my he is on cool down and it takes about 1-2k damage off my hp
Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
I strongly suggest you make changes to your build your weapons do almost no dmg, your pets only annoy and are hardly a threat and your fbp while very strong is very easy to circumvent. heal wise you use heals that dont give strong resists or resists at all you should drop sci team or fbp and get a ph or a haz emitters drop rsp and put in a emergency power to shields and if you can get another epts so you can keep it up most of the time that alone would increase your tanking like 3x. as it is now your shields are easy to knock down and keep them down if i was running my old bo3 build your lack of sheild resists and heals would make it a sitting duck as it is now though, with my 4 dhc build all i have to do is time my tac buffs well against your few heals and fbp and i can win solo against you every time
(im sorry if this is harshly worded but i feel very strongly that you can make a much better build)
Account linking and forum "improvement" made me Derp ._.
1. Rapid Reload Transphasics and regular transphasics do not have different rates of fire when using purple projectile weapons doffs. One can as well us regular transphasics, and get some bonuses for them, such as [Acc].
2. Using more than two torpedo launchers per facing does not increase actual rate of fire of the torpedos, or at least not significantly.
Thats right the difference is not major... this is why I didn't test with rapid reload. They are nice if you don't run doffs but with doffs and more then one launcher there pointless.
Chances to proc a cool down reset with 2 launchers is 73%... chance with 3 is 86%. So yes the chance of neededing that third launcher is aprox 13%. So no you don't really need it to badly.
If you are trying to get some torp dmg... consider using 2 Plasma torps + one Harpeng. The torp cool downs will also effect the harpeng although you can only get one proc on the harpeng not multiples... still makes it an effective third torp.
If you ware going to stick with phasics... put a breen cluster torp in... the doff procs all effect its 45 second cool down... you should be able to get its recharge down to the 20-25 second range if you are spamming your other torps.
The post that your quoting is from a proposed change that hasn't even been slated to make it into or even past Season 6. It belonged to a whole slew of changes to not just Transphasics, but to all mines in addition to the possibility of merging High Yield and Spread with Dispersal Patterns Alpha and Beta.
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this: American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
They will likely have to tune the breen cluster torp some then... if the mines do that sort of bleed... to be honest even now at 20% if you are running phasic tactical units... and you have tac buffs running... I have landed strings of 4-8k crits... with 80% bleed oh my.
As long as they don't forget about that item when they tune the initial dmg numbers.
So the pretty much the standard weapon loadout? I have found there is so many fun options with this sturdy ship.
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
Well, not really. You can always check out all cannons build, with one beam or one torpedo, or both. You can also play beam escort, no idea how it is viable now. With DOFFs there is actually much more overall variety than it's used to be.
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
They will likely have to tune the breen cluster torp some then... if the mines do that sort of bleed... to be honest even now at 20% if you are running phasic tactical units... and you have tac buffs running... I have landed strings of 4-8k crits... with 80% bleed oh my.
As long as they don't forget about that item when they tune the initial dmg numbers.
Oh do not worry about this btw. I was testing my "mine layer" escort during wekend, which can drop 28 transhphashic mines in one go. It's unreliable in combat, most mines are destroyed by random explosions. It's awesome only for strawman testings.
Sometimes it works nicely, sometimes all mines are lost before they hit anything.
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
Comments
And when you put Resists and heals into the equation the more damage = better.
T Torps nor photons, magically mitigate healing. They frankly just do one thing well, in this case sucking like a cheap thai lady boy.
That't right... I won't be providing PvP test numbers cause frankly they are not possible to control... and unlike you I see no point in 1 on 1 numbers.
I will tell you that in PvP... the UN buffed plasma torps provide higher dps... mainly because the burn proc is 100% on unbuffed plasma torps... and I wait until I know my target has no hazards... and in many cases I can get there teammates to blow there hazards, and switch to a clean target that can't stop the burn proc. It is not hard to rack up 4-8 procs on one target ... for a 400-1000 burn dmg a tick.
If you are suggesting that Hazards makes them suck for PvP... frankly that just isn't the case. They counter the DOT yes... but Polarized hull Negates all kinetic... Brace For impact Negates all dmg... and frankly hazards negates most of the dmg of the other types as well.
For PvP right now Plasma > all others. Even after the phasic buff... I doubt highly they will out perform plasma either.
No I used regular crithx3 phasics... because frankly they do higher dps.
They spit just as fast with 3 doffs so there really is little reason to use the lower dmg rapid fire.
I could run those tests for you if you really want... I can already tell you where they will rank dmg wise... below Plasma Quantums and Photons... I can say that because even the 12 second recharge chronitons match photon dps with doffs... so really I don't see the possibly 1-2 extra torps a min that you may get due to the 12% chance of not procing a 1 per second fire rate, really making a major impact to performance.
I will probaly re run my tests after the phasic buff... but I understand they are also reducing the base dmg numbers... something tells me they will likely be close to the photon / chron numbers.
Hmm... Chrono Mines in the back Plasma Torps in the front, of a Sci Ship causing Tractor Slows and the burn might make people think they ran into an invisible Warp pee.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
I can assure you and Husanak alike that at least one sci build I post in my sci thread will have 3 plas torps upfront with double spreads and doffs.
Probaly won't start a new thread over it... I run all sorts of tests. I keep log files for most of the odd things I try. I don't often go into numbers for a few reasons. They do change situation to situation and they are open to interpretation believe it or not.) I wouldn't say everyone should run plasma... cause ya its not for everyone... plasma CAN be a great pvp weapon if you use it properly or it can be a complete waste if you don't. Quantums are mostly > then all others 9 times out of 10... but I wouldn't say only run quantums. Phasics honestly the only way I have gotten them to do anything worth while is in an EXTREMLY dedicated build. (Torp brel with cloak bonus and KGH Kinetic bonus... even then if a target has a bunch of armour its pointless. and the 40% buff won't change that, I don't think)
Photons are interesting they are almost = to quantums for burst potential but they fly allot slower... which can be a good thing if you are timing burst... Builds that use Beam Overload AND a torp... I have found photon > as it is easier to time a bunch of burst on a facing. You can even use evasive with a Photon HY 2 and 3... and they will land at the same time... Rapid Fire 3 + 2 photon tubes with Photon HY 3 + HY 2 + Evasive... followed by a BOL 3 in the face at like 1k out... is by far the highest burst move I have been able to pull of in this game.
The only reason I posted numbers here is cause you seem to not believe that other people really do test things... and aren't just pulling things out of there hind quarters. Believe it or not most of us have run tactical Vo'ques at some point (which is basicly although possibly a slighly better version of your cat box, I didn't buy a cat box no and I won't. I have the vo'que if I want to fly a carrier. The turn rate drives me nuts I only have fun with that ship when a group of my friends are flying em.). I appreciate that you want to test things for yourself, however frankly its insulting that you assume the rest of us don't. People like Webdeath / Fallout / Marvio and many of the others that have responded to you and tried to discuss the merits of your build really have tested most of the stuff you have tried at some point. Yes I will even admit I tested a torp carrier once... it was a bad idea you can't keep target reliably.
Honestly based on the playstyle you have been talking about... you should really try out a Recon Sci Ship. You can load 3 torps in the front and keep arc all day long... you will get more dmg. You can use the sci stuff in an offensive way. Bottom line you will tank about as well... and you will kill people much more often.
In any even Soph... I will apologize to you know for any harsh wording I sued early in this thread... it just seemed to me that by page 2 you where coming on a bit strong... anyway. I will believe at this point that you just want to become a better pilot and leave it at that. If you have any honest questions ask them. What ever you want to think about the STO PvP community in general... you should know that compared to most MMOs this is the most mature bunch of PvPers there is. lol (in most PvP MMOs you would have gotten a very nasty reverse care bare stare by now)
I don't know I would say wait to test phasics again after season 6 changes come in. Until them try what you are doing with plasma torps... its not expensive to switch over. I still say it would work better in a recon ship... still at least with plasma you are applying some good pressure dmg for the team. I know you are loving the FPB cause it puts your ship on the score board... really though it doesn't really kill anyone, unless someone really isn't paying attention and beam overloads you or something. I would suggest either TBR, Scramble, or if you are going to try to get it in arc VM. That way you can provide some CC. Or run 2 tractor beams... and load some tractor beam pets to just plain be annoying... and kill defense values for your teammates.
is this the reason im getting hit by harping torps?i figured it was a noob move but i see good players doing it at well. i thought maybe its for the lol but good players hit me when my he is on cool down and it takes about 1-2k damage off my hp
(im sorry if this is harshly worded but i feel very strongly that you can make a much better build)
rofl.
i just spilled my coffee, dammit sophie!
this is SO "last week" of you sir!
,,,,,i need more coffee now....
Thats right the difference is not major... this is why I didn't test with rapid reload. They are nice if you don't run doffs but with doffs and more then one launcher there pointless.
Chances to proc a cool down reset with 2 launchers is 73%... chance with 3 is 86%. So yes the chance of neededing that third launcher is aprox 13%. So no you don't really need it to badly.
If you are trying to get some torp dmg... consider using 2 Plasma torps + one Harpeng. The torp cool downs will also effect the harpeng although you can only get one proc on the harpeng not multiples... still makes it an effective third torp.
If you ware going to stick with phasics... put a breen cluster torp in... the doff procs all effect its 45 second cool down... you should be able to get its recharge down to the 20-25 second range if you are spamming your other torps.
Vornek@oberlerchner123 - Join Date: July 2008
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Vornek@oberlerchner123 - Join Date: July 2008
As long as they don't forget about that item when they tune the initial dmg numbers.
Oh do not worry about this btw. I was testing my "mine layer" escort during wekend, which can drop 28 transhphashic mines in one go. It's unreliable in combat, most mines are destroyed by random explosions. It's awesome only for strawman testings.
Sometimes it works nicely, sometimes all mines are lost before they hit anything.