Firmament Bow Rank

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  • PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,507 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    All 832 rolls are equally likely. The chance of getting a top 10% weapon is 10%.

    interesting. I assumed that each stat was rolled indivindually so an "average roll" was more probable.

    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    That's not to say all these rolls will be equally common across a server. The bad bows are rerolled more often than not so the good bows are more common than you'd expect. I know someone on my server who has the exact same roll as me.

    hehe ofc. same thing with my g16 hat, someone has the exact same stats with the exact same order (it has 2x mag bonuses)b:chuckle
    you only purge once #yopo
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    interesting. I assumed that each stat was rolled indivindually so an "average roll" was more probable.

    They are all rolled individually but the stats are kept separate in the listing which means you can make an absolute ranking (given 2 bows you can always say one is better than the other).

    Still though if you were to plot a histogram of the dps of all bows it would likely form a bell curve. This is because the dps condenses the 3 numbers into a single number so you'd see an averaging effect. The list doesn't actually give the dps it computes so I guess there is some missing information. Bows in the middle of the list likely perform much closer to their neighbors than bows on the extreme ends.
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  • PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver
    PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,507 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    They are all rolled individually but the stats are kept separate in the listing which means you can make an absolute ranking (given 2 bows you can always say one is better than the other).

    Still though if you were to plot a histogram of the dps of all bows it would likely form a bell curve. This is because the dps condenses the 3 numbers into a single number so you'd see an averaging effect. The list doesn't actually give the dps it computes so I guess there is some missing information. Bows in the middle of the list likely perform much closer to their neighbors than bows on the extreme ends.

    ah I see; thanks for the clarification ^^
    you only purge once #yopo
  • Chuck_smith - Sanctuary
    Chuck_smith - Sanctuary Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    DarkMarch - Lost City wrote: »
    SweetieBot wow.. are u really a Bot or a real human?? b:shocked

    A human with LOADS of free time on his/her's/it's hands, otherwise, it wouldn't be AFK f:laugh
    Sage barb in progress.
  • XxRagzxx - Sanctuary
    XxRagzxx - Sanctuary Posts: 258 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Finally got my bow made: #769 92.43%: 11, 4, 14. PWI hates me.

    Edit: I think I got the lowest one on this thread thus far. Valirah rerolled so many times, and yet mine was still worse.
    Archer Build:
    pwcalc.com/d38eec6e1f27c7a6
    Sin Build:
    pwcalc.com/d74f267d3be72784
  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    XxRagzxx - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Finally got my bow made: #769 92.43%: 11, 4, 14. PWI hates me.

    Edit: I think I got the lowest one on this thread thus far. Valirah rerolled so many times, and yet mine was still worse.

    Reroll!
  • Noveriot - Heavens Tear
    Noveriot - Heavens Tear Posts: 45 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    My advice to anyone:

    #826
    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2wcjvr9&s=5

    Keep rolling:

    #49
    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=hwhgeb&s=5
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Noveriot - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    My advice to anyone:

    #826
    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2wcjvr9&s=5

    Keep rolling:

    #49
    http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=hwhgeb&s=5

    You're welcome.

    Where's my paint picture?
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    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
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  • Noveriot - Heavens Tear
    Noveriot - Heavens Tear Posts: 45 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You're welcome.

    Where's my paint picture?

    Right here:

    30xd5zt.png
  • skaitavia
    skaitavia Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    While the SweetieBot rolls are semi-relevant to this thread, this thread is more meant as a reference to how your Firmament bow stats are ranked, not as a spam thread of posts for SweetieBot to forge a bow for you.

    If you would like to do that, as well as many other SweetieBot requests, you can:

    Go to the designated SweetieBot request thread in Off-Topic discussion for your requests.


    Thank you for your understanding guys.
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  • __Sami__ - Archosaur
    __Sami__ - Archosaur Posts: 220 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Bump for people who dont know bout this, was fairly easy to find when needed though with search.
    __Sami__ - Archer - 105/104/102 - mypers.pw/1.8/#135691 - Active
    HideYoHubby - Assassin - 105/101/101 - Inactive
    WnbTank - Barbarian - 103/101/101 - Catshop
  • SweetieBot - Lothranis
    SweetieBot - Lothranis Posts: 18,978 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    __Sami__ - Archosaur wrote: »
    Bump for people who dont know bout this, was fairly easy to find when needed though with search.
    NECROOO!!!!!!!

    __Sami__ - Archosaur replied to a message that was 4 months 19 days 10 hours 26 minutes old.
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    I only respond if you begin a line with "SweetieBot", read the link below for commands
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  • Cawcawwww - Archosaur
    Cawcawwww - Archosaur Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited December 2013
    nuuuu don't let it die, this thread worth a sticky
  • SilverMayhem - Archosaur
    SilverMayhem - Archosaur Posts: 559 Arc User
    edited January 2014
    Cawcawwww - Archosaur wrote: »
    nuuuu don't let it die, this thread worth a sticky

    Bump!
    Logic = Against ToS. It's the answer to all "Wtf..." Moments during normal gameplay with other players.
  • ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide
    ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide Posts: 397 Arc User
    edited January 2014
    Sticky request sent to MODs.
  • skaitavia
    skaitavia Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited January 2014
    Sticky request granted. But don't forget my most recent post to this thread! That means to leave Sweetiebot forge requests to the Forging thread, rather than posting them here. ^u^
    [SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony![/SIGPIC]
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  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    I gotta thank Asterelle for this hugely elaborated list of rank forges (and it being stickied by the mods, would never have found it otherwise). I made my first r9r3 bow last night and finding it here wayyyyyyyy down at #536 gave me no doubt about rerolling or not ^^ my gf rolled her first wiz r9r3 wep and it does make it a lot harder to judge wether or not to reroll without an overview like this.

    However reroll is harder than it looks, even at #536 it was able to go to worse #608 >.>
  • Satyrion - Sanctuary
    Satyrion - Sanctuary Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    I gotta thank Asterelle for this hugely elaborated list of rank forges (and it being stickied by the mods, would never have found it otherwise). I made my first r9r3 bow last night and finding it here wayyyyyyyy down at #536 gave me no doubt about rerolling or not ^^ my gf rolled her first wiz r9r3 wep and it does make it a lot harder to judge wether or not to reroll without an overview like this.

    However reroll is harder than it looks, even at #536 it was able to go to worse #608 >.>

    If you read some of the first pages, there is a short talk about wiz weapon ^^
    youtube.com/user/Cebloon
    ~ not that there is that much to see (yet?)
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Satyrion - Sanctuary wrote: »
    If you read some of the first pages, there is a short talk about wiz weapon ^^

    Couldn't get it to work at first but finally figured it out ^^ tyvm, got the whole list of wiz's weapon as well now :) #884 out of 1664, reroll it is^^

    *Edit:* After re-making some codes and checking the other classes I found out most of them are quite similar tbh and could be derived from the original code from Astrelle and from Maeleal's attempt where Asterelle in the end fixed it. :P
    I'll post them here and if anyone can see if they're wrong/can be corrected let me know :) (still full credit to Ast, I simply changed lines around and words)

    Wizard rankings list
    Blademaster, Barbarian rankings list
    Cleric, Mystic and Psychic's rankings list
    Sin, Seeker and Archer (seeker has vit 10-11 so neglectable and dex/str can be swapped around.

    Just missing Veno now if these are correct^^
  • Satyrion - Sanctuary
    Satyrion - Sanctuary Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    Couldn't get it to work at first but finally figured it out ^^ tyvm, got the whole list of wiz's weapon as well now :) #884 out of 1664, reroll it is^^

    *Edit:* After re-making some codes and checking the other classes I found out most of them are quite similar tbh and could be derived from the original code from Astrelle and from Maeleal's attempt where Asterelle in the end fixed it. :P
    I'll post them here and if anyone can see if they're wrong/can be corrected let me know :) (still full credit to Ast, I simply changed lines around and words)

    Wizard rankings list
    Blademaster, Barbarian rankings list
    Cleric, Mystic and Psychic's rankings list
    Sin, Seeker and Archer (seeker has vit 10-11 so neglectable and dex/str can be swapped around.

    Just missing Veno now if these are correct^^

    Venos 4th stat is pdef, so can really compare it much. I would put them on same ranking list as wizards.
    If I follow the list you posted, my weapon is #19 1.14%: 23, 10, 18 for my veno :P

    But with rebirth people having more str/mag/dex now, I wonder how much that affect the lists.
    youtube.com/user/Cebloon
    ~ not that there is that much to see (yet?)
  • Socqar - Lost City
    Socqar - Lost City Posts: 511 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    Couldn't get it to work at first but finally figured it out ^^ tyvm, got the whole list of wiz's weapon as well now :) #884 out of 1664, reroll it is^^

    *Edit:* After re-making some codes and checking the other classes I found out most of them are quite similar tbh and could be derived from the original code from Astrelle and from Maeleal's attempt where Asterelle in the end fixed it. :P
    I'll post them here and if anyone can see if they're wrong/can be corrected let me know :) (still full credit to Ast, I simply changed lines around and words)

    Wizard rankings list
    Blademaster, Barbarian rankings list
    Cleric, Mystic and Psychic's rankings list
    Sin, Seeker and Archer (seeker has vit 10-11 so neglectable and dex/str can be swapped around.

    Just missing Veno now if these are correct^^

    Not entirely sure that -chan should be 2nd for Psy's though... Psy's have pretty short chan times... Perhaps a veteran Psy could help sorting it out?

    Moreover, did you consider the difference in dmg calculations between Dex based classes vs. mag based classes? Iirc there was some x1.5 - x2.0 difference... but I may be wrong with this.

    THanks for the effort, though!
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Satyrion - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Venos 4th stat is pdef, so can really compare it much. I would put them on same ranking list as wizards.
    If I follow the list you posted, my weapon is #19 1.14%: 23, 10, 18 for my veno :P

    But with rebirth people having more str/mag/dex now, I wonder how much that affect the lists.

    I figured if a veno wanted to have the best possible survivability in balance with dpg-output it could be considered as a whole new list, if you're fine with your survivability you're right and can check wizard's list^^ and nice ranking weap :)
    Socqar - Lost City wrote: »
    Not entirely sure that -chan should be 2nd for Psy's though... Psy's have pretty short chan times... Perhaps a veteran Psy could help sorting it out?

    Moreover, did you consider the difference in dmg calculations between Dex based classes vs. mag based classes? Iirc there was some x1.5 - x2.0 difference... but I may be wrong with this.

    THanks for the effort, though!

    I've followed the patterns from this thread where dex had
    (1.0+(650.0+float(dex))/150.0+0.75)
    and magic
    (1.0+(700.0+float(mag))/100.0+0.75)

    I agree with the psy's though and mystic has way many low channeling skills where 3-10% matters maybe 1/33th or 1/10th of a second (which can still be pretty decent tbh, they cast faster than archer's attack), clerics can definately use as much channel as they want however :D hoping if any psy/mystic can post how much they value channeling or if it's less useful than magic stat.
  • Satyrion - Sanctuary
    Satyrion - Sanctuary Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    I figured if a veno wanted to have the best possible survivability in balance with dpg-output it could be considered as a whole new list, if you're fine with your survivability you're right and can check wizard's list^^ and nice ranking weap :)

    That would be a preference. So far I've only been looking on the damage output in these listings, but the individual person can maybe aim for more physical defense rather than higher damage / magic. Sadly my roll on physical defense isn't that great (+262 out of +150~450), but I refuse to reroll my stats as I love them. I was mostly aiming for high channelling back then and that's what I got.

    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    and magic

    I think this ranklist is based on 700 magic and 65% channelling with gear (no weap?). Now with rebirth and such stuff, magic should probably be increased (and chan decreased in my case lol). I've also noticed even higher difference on peoples stats now, so if people would want a more accurate list they have to make it match exactly their own characters build with magic and channelling. If I actually had such things as Emperor tome and was 105 on my rebirth levels, I'm sure I could reach 1k+ magic now... I'm not sure how all that cast time will affect the ranklisting or how to set it up, so I'll skip make any.
    youtube.com/user/Cebloon
    ~ not that there is that much to see (yet?)
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Satyrion - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I think this ranklist is based on 700 magic and 65% channelling with gear (no weap?). Now with rebirth and such stuff, magic should probably be increased (and chan decreased in my case lol). I've also noticed even higher difference on peoples stats now, so if people would want a more accurate list they have to make it match exactly their own characters build with magic and channelling. If I actually had such things as Emperor tome and was 105 on my rebirth levels, I'm sure I could reach 1k+ magic now... I'm not sure how all that cast time will affect the ranklisting or how to set it up, so I'll skip make any.

    With that being the case every person would have to edit the code to their own build, which is always subject to change when improving your gear :P as that also goes beyond my knowledge I'm going to stick with these "default" rankings, as the difference might be very slim and the end-result still similar, just changed around. Top 10% wep might be 12-13% like that but still pretty worthwhile to keep and not risk 87% on way worse.
  • Satyrion - Sanctuary
    Satyrion - Sanctuary Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    With that being the case every person would have to edit the code to their own build, which is always subject to change when improving your gear :P as that also goes beyond my knowledge I'm going to stick with these "default" rankings, as the difference might be very slim and the end-result still similar, just changed around. Top 10% wep might be 12-13% like that but still pretty worthwhile to keep and not risk 87% on way worse.

    or making a little fancy calculator :P
    choose class, insert magic, and insert channelling, click go! xD
    youtube.com/user/Cebloon
    ~ not that there is that much to see (yet?)
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Satyrion - Sanctuary wrote: »
    or making a little fancy calculator :P
    choose class, insert magic, and insert channelling, click go! xD

    no clue how to make a calculator like Asterelle's xP those codes were first time I worked with such a thing :x
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    finalised rerolling :D and I must say I was lucky ._. reroll history: #536 - #608 - #442 - #300 - #300 - #99 and keeping it f:grin onto wiz's rerolls who got worse today f:horror
  • Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver
    Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver Posts: 461 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    I agree with the psy's though and mystic has way many low channeling skills where 3-10% matters maybe 1/33th or 1/10th of a second (which can still be pretty decent tbh, they cast faster than archer's attack), clerics can definately use as much channel as they want however :D hoping if any psy/mystic can post how much they value channeling or if it's less useful than magic stat.

    Some very cool information in this thread. Going to give me an interesting read and something to think about when I have more time to actually sit down and mull through all of the pages. O:

    Just popping in to put in my two cents with the psy/mystic and -chan thing. Though I don't have a mystic, as a psy player for..well...since they came out, I would say that channeling is definitely not a huge concern of mine. Of course it's not like I avoid it like the plague, it IS nice to have, but I wouldn't go out of my way for it. I think I would rather have mag or crit even before channeling. Buuuuuut that's just me. :P
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  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited February 2014
    Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Some very cool information in this thread. Going to give me an interesting read and something to think about when I have more time to actually sit down and mull through all of the pages. O:

    Just popping in to put in my two cents with the psy/mystic and -chan thing. Though I don't have a mystic, as a psy player for..well...since they came out, I would say that channeling is definitely not a huge concern of mine. Of course it's not like I avoid it like the plague, it IS nice to have, but I wouldn't go out of my way for it. I think I would rather have mag or crit even before channeling. Buuuuuut that's just me. :P

    If that's the case I tried something, not sure if it's right, but in the code swap around the values for chan and mag and keep everything else the same:
    for attlev in range(10,26):
    for chan in range(8,21):
    for mag in range(3,11):
    for maxattack in range(8,19):
    instead of
    for attlev in range(10,26):
    for chan in range(3,11):
    for mag in range(8,21):
    for maxattack in range(8,19)
    Ignore the names of chan and mag as I haven't changed those in order to keep the adjustment as simple as can be. With the new code and the roll "25, 19, 6, 180" as example (high magic and low-ish chan) you will see it had a ranking of #2256 on the old list, but #178 on the new one, where we've given Magic a priority over Channel.
    Hope this helps out for the myst/psy's as it's not perfect but it can make do :)


    PS: does anyone know how to increase the max amount of #'s that code shows so bm/barb/cler/psy/myst can actually see the top 10%?
  • JePoY - Lost City
    JePoY - Lost City Posts: 63 Arc User
    edited June 2014
    after 5 Reroll i got my Bow # 43 b:victory
    No Pain, No Gain.

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