DW - Hypothetical cross server TW

Algiz - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Kalopsia - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I think Andres's list is pretty spot on, nice to see KAN made this list, coming from another seeker id say he's one of the top skilled in server.

Other considerations: (not sure of all the factions or name spellings)

Archer: Vaud (shattered)
Cleric:Tegge (shattered), NigXiang (tempest)
barb: fenrir wolf (dynasty)
Psy:drakoveuz (?), temptation (dynasty) PsyckoPsy (blacklist)
Sin: Naberis (?)
Mystic: Algiz (dynasty)
BM: Bubba_Z (equinox), BAMBAM (blacklist)
wiz Deathproof (tempest)
Veno:davalentine(?), kattywompus (tempest)

ty for the mention Kalo

and you too SonH

but yeah, it's looking like the core of every list is tending the same way, and i see nothing but epic players so far. Would be interesting to see how we fit all these pieces together and who we'd squad with who.

We should petition our gm's to pass something like this on to the devs, it'd be epic to see something like this happen once a month.

Andres - Dreamweaver wrote: »

The real issue is, who do you have leading us? So many different leading styles for wars, some of us are very agressive in their pushes. Others are very conservative. Pick up 80? ezpz... What style would suit us best is what's hard to tell.

we could do that by having our tw leaders conferring as super squad leaders

example, say we have dyna, tempest, eq, and relic ( just four factions off the top of my head, no slight meant by order, no mentions, etc) Maybe have the 4 leaders responsible for tw in each case talk out some possible plans before hand, then once we're in the fight, have maybe all the Generals in room with the squad leaders, but phantomed (assuming the use of vent of course) together in a room so they can kinda figure out which way to go. Ideally if we had enough of each faction we could do something like dyna holds left, tempest holds right, relic holds mid, and eq holds the base and between the 4 generals they swap and shift based on the flow of the battle.

Or we could even do something like this

Say Wacky is more defensive than someone like Plague, and lets say Plague is more offensive and aggressive (again, examples and not exactly realities per se)

so maybe one general that plays more defensively be charged with defense of vital points on lane and base, and the more aggressive be in charge of moving cata's and attack squads.

Aeliah - Dreamweaver · February 2014

I'd say that would create major problems, Algiz. It would be a lot easier to have the TW leader change from one TW to the next. Or, the 4 leaders could vote for 1 leader from amongst the 4, using whatever criteria they want. The point is, debating a course of action is improper for TW, where snap decisions are necessary. It doesn't matter if the 'best' decision is arrived at---if the decision takes too long coming, the opportunity is lost anyways. In others, a 'good' decision executed swiftly is almost always better than the 'perfect' decision which takes too long in the coming, at least as far as TW goes.

Also SonH list looks good.

Algiz - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Aeliah - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I'd say that would create major problems, Algiz. It would be a lot easier to have the TW leader change from one TW to the next. Or, the 4 leaders could vote for 1 leader from amongst the 4, using whatever criteria they want. The point is, debating a course of action is improper for TW, where snap decisions are necessary. It doesn't matter if the 'best' decision is arrived at---if the decision takes too long coming, the opportunity is lost anyways. In others, a 'good' decision executed swiftly is almost always better than the 'perfect' decision which takes too long in the coming, at least as far as TW goes.

Also SonH list looks good.

who said they'd be debating? thats why i added the second bit about potentially having the main points like att and def set to specific leaders. Over the course of the tw they could jointly decide its time to full push to optimize on a full faction roll. I've been squad lead and helped lead my fair share of tws you know xD

lets be honest, people will be much more comfortable taking the lead from people they do it with on the intraserver tw's anyway.

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Aeliah - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Look Tempt, its like this. As DarkSkiesx hinted at, there are a lot of really experienced, really well geared psychics.

If you were a veno, or a wizard, or an assassin, and possessed similar gear and experience in that class as you do on your psychic, you'd automatically be on the list. But for psychics, I believe you still have some catching up to do.

That being said, its not like I check people's gear and playstyle everyday. There are people on each list that I"m not too familiar with. If you can demonstrate that you think you belong, in terms of gear, experience, or other factors, well then, this is the place to say why!

Also, I'll nitpick your list a bit later when I have more time Dark.

Cheers,

Aeliah

- my gear is way better then gear of some psys you mention:)
- I'm playing pwi for 5 years, first as bm, then psy since they came out
- Im doing tw for 4 years (every single weekend) in every major faction on this server - Calamity, EQ, Dyna
- 2 from those 4 years i have been SL/officer

enough?

just because some people prefer to fly under the radar and don't care much for pk doesn't mean they dunno other stuff, and trust me tw is my favorite part of this game, so i know who is good in which position, who has what gear, what gear has people in other factions and so on.

Reason why I don't consider your list very accurate is because you not SL and you don't know how people doing in tw squads. Also you see only one perception of tw and that is your squad + some people you know form pk or you friends. Don't get me wrong I have very much respect for you as cleric and specially respect your pk skills but as far as is knowing peoples gear and what they can do in squads you don't know much (othervise you wouldnt exclude for example nig who has 4-5 years of experiance in doing tw).

so now lets get down to the bussines...

I'm not making list because i know you will all looking for people with best gear on server (so i think this thread should be named "who are best geared 80 on DW":)). I cant agree with that list because gear is just one aspect of tw. All this would be ok if we doing some kind of PK tournament against other servers... but we talking about tw.

In tw most important is experience, and ability to work in team and for benefits of the team which basically means leave your ego outside of the instance. I had honor to be in squad with or lead people who are doing crazy good stuff in tw... like one veno who is my favorite veno just cause can do stuff that 3 venous in squad usually doing, but unfortunately don't have gear that will ever measure to your standards. Then there is cleric who is far most best buffing cleric you can ask for, but again gear will never put him anywhere near any list. In the same time time I saw so so so many OP geared people who are so fail in tw that was even embracing to watch (hell look just at Fly) and I can name so many people form "tw list" some of you made. The worst thing is that you know they sux, but they or your friends/faction members/has op gear so they have to be put on list. I'm 100% sure that if some of you want to be 100% honest with list of people who seriously deserve to be in that kind of tw...those lists would look completely different.

If OP gear wins tw we all know how this tw season would look like. But thx to the people who dint sparck pk targets just so they can see their damage in damage log and actually do stuff for other people in squads by sometimes sacrifice themselves, tws are won.

While at the beginning of the thread i was seriously hopping for some interesting discussions and sugestions...like I sad before I see where this is going... and its going to ...." list your 80 best geared people in your faction...and then compare their gear with other factions and pull 80 of them who has best of the best...then put list of them on the forum... so not only our server can see who are big shots here but other serves to" (dmn some of you guys really like to see your names around).

Cheers

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Excellent posts guys. Cheers Andres, Kalo & Son for your input. We're making really good progress, and thanks again everyone for keeping posts objective and on topic.

Now that I think we have provided ample opportunity for everyone to nominate candidates, we should move on to the next steps.

1. Squad builds and placement - fine tune our squads and place the players
2. Leadership - every squad needs a squad leader and we need to agree on a TW commander(s)
3. Discussions on server specifc strategies/attack vs defence tweaks - this will ultimately depend on whether the other servers can get to the same position we will hopefully be in, with this thread, so we can assess what they are bringing to the table and what our best options to counter are. Strategy is always based on what your opponent does, you can only really plan your opening moves like Chess.

1. So to start off with Squad builds. We have seen a variety of propositions thus far. I will list these by proposer below.

Aeliah:
8 squads
Cata 1 & 2 :- 2 clerics, 1 mystic, 2 barbs, 1 bm, 1 archer, 1 seeker, 2 veno/assassin
Squad A-F :- 2 clerics, 1 mystic, 1 barb, 1 bm, 1 veno, 2 magic DDs, 1 archer, 1 archer/seeker

Nigelus:
8 squads
Cata 1 - 1 barb, 2 clerics, 2 bm, 1 mystic, 1 psy, 1 archer, 1 seeker, 1 veno (10)
Cata 2 - 2 barbs, 2 clerics, 2 bm, 1 mystic, 1 psy, 1 archer, 1 veno (10)
Cata 3 - 1 barb, 2 clerics, 1 bm, 2 archers, 1 psy, 1 wiz, 1 seeker (10)

Def 1 - 1 barb, 1 cleric, 2 bm, 2 psy, 2 wiz, 1 archer, 1 veno (10)
Def 2 - 1 barb, 1 cleric, 1 bm, 1 mystic, 1 psy, 1 wiz, 3 sin, 1 veno (10)
Def 3 - 1 barb, 1 cleric, 1 bm, 1 mystic, 1 psy, 2 wiz, 1 archer, 1 sin, 1 veno (10)

Flank 1 - 1 barb, 1 cleric, 1 bm, 1 mystic, 4 archer, 1 seeker, 1 veno (10)
Flank 2 - 1 barb, 2 cleric (1 UVD?), 1 bm, 1 psy, 1 wiz, 1 veno, 1 seeker, 1 sin 1 archer (10)

Scout: 1 seeker (some shifting required this is 81)

Andres
10 archers
13 clerics
7 venos
10 barbs
6 wizards
8 psychics
5 sins
7 mystics
6 seekers
8 bms

If this or a similar make up is selected we can build squads.

I'm sure there are different builds/compositions, feel free to suggest these and highlight and strengths/weaknesses with these, (one example could be hey we don't have that many well geared bm's etc). I think there are the simple logical builds as Aeliah and Andres suggested, then there are the more strategy specific builds like Nige suggested. Finding a healthy balance between the two would be ideal, and obviously this would depend also on the final selection of candidates. Here is where incorporating aspects such as who works well with who will give us that synergy benefit so we can hit the ground running if we were to field this TW team.

2. Leadership, I'm leaning towards one TW commander per TW, on a rotation, splitting attack and defence can leave you splitting your TW into two fights rather than one flowing battle with role switching based on current positions and enemy movements. That is opinion so open to debate, may be subject to the final selection also.

Well done so far guys. Dreamweaver ftw.

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver wrote: »

- my gear is way better then gear of some psys you mention:)
- I'm playing pwi for 5 years, first as bm, then psy since they came out
- Im doing tw for 4 years (every single weekend) in every major faction on this server - Calamity, EQ, Dyna
- 2 from those 4 years i have been SL/officer

enough?

just because some people prefer to fly under the radar and don't care much for pk doesn't mean they dunno other stuff, and trust me tw is my favorite part of this game, so i know who is good in which position, who has what gear, what gear has people in other factions and so on.

Hi Tempt. Apologies I didn't pick this up earlier, you have been nominated already, just because Aeliah didn't include you on his list doesn't mean you are automatically excluded from this hypothetical wargames. I don't see value in people having to justify themselves, as I'm sure there are plenty of people that will vouch for you. This is to prevent unnecessary derailments/conflicts. When we get to squad placements it may very well emerge that you perform better with a certain set of people based on your experience and this could outweigh any gear disadvantages.

_dblazen_ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I could imagine a few people who would be good for the lists other than the "known" ones from the "big" factions, i'm sure you people can come up with that too since there are some people running around that are either in smaller factions or are even factionless, sure that wouldn't make up 80 people, but it adds to the list.

Hello, although you have a fair point, I think the odd few 'exceptions' have already been mentioned. The problem with including people that aren't or haven't been in top end TW factions is they will lack the experience of working together in a TW setting, which is vastly different from PvP/PK/NW/PvE etc. This puts them at a disadvantage and the squad at a disadvantage so wouldn't be worth the risk in my opinion. If you have any in mind that do have experience however that haven't been mentioned please do so.

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Hi Tempt. Apologies I didn't pick this up earlier, you have been nominated already, just because Aeliah didn't include you on his list doesn't mean you are automatically excluded from this hypothetical wargames. I don't see value in people having to justify themselves, as I'm sure there are plenty of people that will vouch for you. This is to prevent unnecessary derailments/conflicts. When we get to squad placements it may very well emerge that you perform better with a certain set of people based on your experience and this could outweigh any gear disadvantages.

oh thx for including me Dark I feel so special and honored now (insert sarcasm).

Wasn't justifying myself, was stating facts related to this:

Originally Posted by Aeliah - Dreamweaver View Post

Look Tempt, its like this. As DarkSkiesx hinted at, there are a lot of really experienced, really well geared psychics.
If you can demonstrate that you think you belong, in terms of gear, experience, or other factors, well then, this is the place to say why!

Those facts are not stated cause I have urge for recognition (no one is bigger critic of me then myselfe). It is just example how people are wrong and misinformed about others.

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver wrote: »

oh thx for including me Dark I feel so special and honored now (insert sarcasm).

Don't thank me I didn't nominate you. There is no need to be sarcastic or annoyed about it either. I want this to be a serious debate. Please join in.

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Those facts are not stated cause I have urge for recognition (no one is bigger critic of me then myselfe). It is just example how people are wrong and misinformed about others.

This is a fact of life, you can't expect people to be fully informed about everyone in their faction let alone everyone on the server. As you rightly pointed out Aeliah is not an officer, doesn't make squads, doesn't lead squads, doesn't coordinate TWs. So it is not surprising they aren't fully aware of the capabilities of everything Dynasty has to offer. This doesn't mean they aren't entitled to an opinion, and doesn't mean you aren't either.

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver wrote: »

- Im doing tw for 4 years (every single weekend) in every major faction on this server - Calamity, EQ, Dyna
- 2 from those 4 years i have been SL/officer
...
and trust me tw is my favorite part of this game, so i know who is good in which position, who has what gear, what gear has people in other factions and so on.

Then contribute, we could use your knowledge, and your experience, don't sit on the fence, join in. This isn't to make you feel special or honoured, we're having a discussion, I would prefer constructive improvements and tweaks, rather than poo poo'ing the process and calling other's efforts/opinions wrong or misinformed.

Andres - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Honestly, I picked my 8 psychics based on all that was quoted.
Gear, TW Awareness, PK Awareness.. It's the same breakdown I used for every class. It's the main reason why I sat myself down.

My squad setup is as it follows, no mental breakdown as to why. The way I'm used to run TW, I have enough confidence in the DDs I'm leading to leave Cata squads as pure support squads. I really can't go into much without having a whole new argument which most of you probably don't care to listen anyway b:laugh
11 squads.

2x CT squads (14 people):
2 barbs, 2 clerics, BM, Mystic, Psy

4x CS squads: (40) (Split into 2 Frontline squads, 2 actual CS squads)
Barb, Cleric, BM, Mystic (Or Sin), Psy, Wiz, Seeker, Veno, 2 Archers.

2x "backline" CS squads (20):
Barb, 2 Clerics, BM, Mystic, Psy, Wiz, Seeker, Veno, Archer

1 Utility squad (6):
3 Sins, Cleric, Veno, Mystic.

What's pretty interesting, is that SonH's "main 80" is broken down as:
30 Dynasty members
27 Relic members
18 Tempest members
5 From other factions (2 Skunkyard, 2 BootyCamp, 1 Kindrid)

Seems like "OPness" is mainly well distributed, and clearly TW at the local level is very much left to good tactics and numbers. b:shocked

Dragslave - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Just to add... Temptation is a great psychic, great Squad leader, she actually leads what i think is one of the most hard squads to coordinate...

Aeliah might not know this since he's not in that squad... but is true that i might have not listed some people like Dallen (awesome veno) Tveskoeg (great psy) and more, since they might not have that great gear, or still working on it, but they excell at their class, but sadly, nowadays, if gear gap is big no skill can make up for it... if i were full +12 jades... idk how many people can take down a wizard unless purge is involved... b:laugh

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Dragslave - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Just to add... Temptation is a great psychic, great Squad leader, she actually leads what i think is one of the most hard squads to coordinate...

Aeliah might not know this since he's not in that squad... but is true that i might have not listed some people like Dallen (awesome veno) Tveskoeg (great psy) and more, since they might not have that great gear, or still working on it, but they excell at their class, but sadly, nowadays, if gear gap is big no skill can make up for it... if i were full +12 jades... idk how many people can take down a wizard unless purge is involved... b:laugh

Thx Drags:)

I was thinking about dallen, but I prefer not to mention names because of so many other people who are "not known" like him and can eat half of those listed people for the breakfast. But like I sad, this just showing that people don't know much of this topic even they think they do.

I'm don't want to make any kind of list Dark cause people who would be on my list are people most of you never heard off. They prefer to fly under radar, and they don't spend fortune on wc so they are not known.

Power creep in this game is already insane and people already feel less worthy because they cant keep up with cash players. Making lists like this just make them feel even worst. Luckily tw is one segment of the game where fat wallet doesn't count much, and it allows those people to win people they cant take down in v1v. Thats one thing i love about tw:) - Outplay, outsmart,outwit.

And I agree with you Drags that skills cant make up for gear gap, but like one smart person told me once (you will know who), people who already have end game gear are reached the end and can only sit on it now... while others slowly, but surely catching them up.

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Temptatio/V - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Thx Drags:)

I was thinking about dallen, but I prefer not to mention names because of so many other people who are "not known" like him and can eat half of those listed people for the breakfast. But like I sad, this just showing that people don't know much of this topic even they think they do.

I'm don't want to make any kind of list Dark cause people who would be on my list are people most of you never heard off. They prefer to fly under radar, and they don't spend fortune on wc so they are not known.

Power creep in this game is already insane and people already feel less worthy because they cant keep up with cash players. Making lists like this just make them feel even worst. Luckily tw is one segment of the game where fat wallet doesn't count much, and it allows those people to win people they cant take down in v1v. Thats one thing i love about tw:) - Outplay, outsmart,outwit.

And I agree with you Drags that skills cant make up for gear gap, but like one smart person told me once (you will know who), people who already have end game gear are reached the end and can only sit on it now... while others slowly, but surely catching them up.

So once again you are not understanding what this thread is about, and making assumptions related to epeen/bragging/troll threads.

I'll reiterate once more the purpose of this thread but I'm feeling like this is falling on deaf ears, and you have already made up your mind.

This thread is for when/if we on PWI get Cross Server TW with other servers, we know what 80 we want to put in that will give Dreamweaver the best chance to win. This isn't a competition between us. I don't care whether I have heard of these people or not, whether they spend hours on wc or not, whether they have insane cash shopped gear or not. What I care about is whether they have the skill and experience in TW to outperform (or 'eat them for breakfast' as you put it) the current nominations. We all know gear isn't everything, especially for support classes like veno's (dallen) but for DD like an archer you would want a r9rr bow over a g15 one, this is just common sense. If the g15 bow person is now feeling upset he wasn't picked, well, how do the 20 people that are ready for TW but don't get picked as the 80 to field vs Relic feel? They will be like go Dyna go do it for us, same as how I would feel about the 80 we pick for Dreamweaver.

You've made clear your intention as to not help or contribute to this process, even after my repeated attempts to get your input, for your own reasons, and you are still discrediting the opinions that people have put forward, saying 'they don't know what they are talking about' even after it has been made clear this is a collaborative discussion which you are unwilling to add your voice/opinion to, which is all that I have asked for, opinions.

SakuLv - Dreamweaver · February 2014

Hmm if there would be such a server TW. I think most fairest way to choose top 80 would be like umm..
Idk Hitting 1 npc mob. Those 80 who hit highest dmg are able to go and defend DW ;D

If ppl would love this kinda event, there would be tons of unknown ppl whos names arent on list now ;D

Not sure how team work would work out. Probably top 80 winners could have 30 mins to prepare. Maybe get on 1 vent xD or something, squad up and stuff ;D

DionDagger - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Glad to see I made it on here somewhere o.o.

Zsw - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Andres - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Zsw was definitively up there in the list but he now just trolls us in spirit.

GG what

Zheii - Archosaur · March 2014

Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »

GG what

"The Ghost of Zsw" ...Somehow it seems fitting.

Heartz - Dreamweaver · March 2014

SakuLv - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Hmm if there would be such a server TW. I think most fairest way to choose top 80 would be like umm..
Idk Hitting 1 npc mob. Those 80 who hit highest dmg are able to go and defend DW ;D

If ppl would love this kinda event, there would be tons of unknown ppl whos names arent on list now ;D

Not sure how team work would work out. Probably top 80 winners could have 30 mins to prepare. Maybe get on 1 vent xD or something, squad up and stuff ;D

sure, if you want our server to lose.

SakuLv - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Heartz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

sure, if you want our server to lose.

Im just saying it would be more fair.
Or like 8-10 top ppl from each class
And its not about losing or wining ;D it would be about having fun! f:fan

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · March 2014

SakuLv - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Im just saying it would be more fair.
Or like 8-10 top ppl from each class
And its not about losing or wining ;D it would be about having fun! f:fan

While defense are sometimes ignored by certain skills, I think many people realize just how crucial it is to survive, and have reasonable defenses/hp. I don't think anyone in the right mind would want someone in this hypothetical tw, with my gear, regardless of their skill/how hard they hit. They would NOT be able to take very many hits at all, they would be fodder at best, sure the few times that they can hit, might help a little, but overall I believe many prefer it if people survive, and stick in the battle longer to actually help 'control' the situation. I.E stuns, slow, etc. A dead person isn't going to help regardless of how effective their attack is.

In other words, focus too much on one side of that... atk/def side of mass pvp, and the other will be highly lacking. Still, a person who has epic defenses is likely going to be of a hell of a lot more help than someone who is capable of dishing out damage but not able to take any. (A lot of people focus more on weapons/attack than they do defense. Someone who is one shot-table is going to be dead a lot, and ergo of little to no use to anyone.)

I do agree it should be about having fun, but if one person is dragging down the team, and potentially causing them to loose badly, it gets hard to not be depressed/annoyed that they made it over someone else they feel is far and away far better than the one(s) who did make it. :$ (Ergo... the opposite of fun.)

NO one likes to loose badly, and while it often shouldn't be attributed to one person, the way you purpose people should get in, is bound to allow a lot of people to squeeze on in that shouldn't be there, let alone arguably 'deserve' to be there... and ultimately in my own honest opinion... it is really not a good way to go about it imho. Now, I am not saying their way is 100% flawless as there is a high possibility that someone is going to be missed that absolutely deserves to be there, but I do believe it is better than a simple test of power/ability to take damage. (Too many people focus on weapon instead of defense, not to mention its far more likely that a hell of a lot more casters/archers will make it in than barb/bm's, and even MANY sins. All of which have quite the role to play in tw/mass pvp.)

SakuLv - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »

(Too many people focus on weapon instead of defense, not to mention its far more likely that a hell of a lot more casters/archers will make it in than barb/bm's, and even MANY sins. All of which have quite the role to play in tw/mass pvp.)

Yah u got point ;O.
Hmm idk i was just saying 1 silly idea xD

but since we have 10 classes..so top 8 of each class could idk go to that TW
but meh its just silly idea ;O

Kinda in this point im glad we dont have this server TW.
But i guess its still fun to imagine and stuff ;D

SonH - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »

While defense are sometimes ignored by certain skills, I think many people realize just how crucial it is to survive, and have reasonable defenses/hp. I don't think anyone in the right mind would want someone in this hypothetical tw, with my gear, regardless of their skill/how hard they hit. They would NOT be able to take very many hits at all, they would be fodder at best, sure the few times that they can hit, might help a little, but overall I believe many prefer it if people survive, and stick in the battle longer to actually help 'control' the situation. I.E stuns, slow, etc. A dead person isn't going to help regardless of how effective their attack is.

In other words, focus too much on one side of that... atk/def side of mass pvp, and the other will be highly lacking. Still, a person who has epic defenses is likely going to be of a hell of a lot more help than someone who is capable of dishing out damage but not able to take any. (A lot of people focus more on weapons/attack than they do defense. Someone who is one shot-table is going to be dead a lot, and ergo of little to no use to anyone.)

I do agree it should be about having fun, but if one person is dragging down the team, and potentially causing them to loose badly, it gets hard to not be depressed/annoyed that they made it over someone else they feel is far and away far better than the one(s) who did make it. :$ (Ergo... the opposite of fun.)

NO one likes to loose badly, and while it often shouldn't be attributed to one person, the way you purpose people should get in, is bound to allow a lot of people to squeeze on in that shouldn't be there, let alone arguably 'deserve' to be there... and ultimately in my own honest opinion... it is really not a good way to go about it imho. Now, I am not saying their way is 100% flawless as there is a high possibility that someone is going to be missed that absolutely deserves to be there, but I do believe it is better than a simple test of power/ability to take damage. (Too many people focus on weapon instead of defense, not to mention its far more likely that a hell of a lot more casters/archers will make it in than barb/bm's, and even MANY sins. All of which have quite the role to play in tw/mass pvp.)

I am not quite sure where your generalization of people preferring to focus on the offensive rather than the defensive side come from. No one on that list is a 1 shot per-say to most people on this server; of course with seekers that might not hold true for some. And honestly, the point that you made in the 1st paragraph is common sense, which is why no one on the list is R9rr with 6k HP.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · March 2014

SonH - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I am not quite sure where your generalization of people preferring to focus on the offensive rather than the defensive side come from. No one on that list is a 1 shot per-say to most people on this server; of course with seekers that might not hold true for some. And honestly, the point that you made in the 1st paragraph is common sense, which is why no one on the list is R9rr with 6k HP.

That generalization came from seeing on NUMEROUS occasions where someone (mainly it is/was indeed sins/bms with an extraordinarily refined weapon, with **** armor/defenses... mainly being the keyword... and since my 'keywords' often get missed... I feel its necessary to point out there WAS (and I believe there still is) casters/archers that did the very same thing, and they to had **** refines on armor/necklace/belt/rings.) Now obviously there are several exceptions to that, even then (using it loosely as even now there are still quite a few people running around with +10 weapons and only +5ish gears) its not like there aren't people capable of out damaging some of those people on those lists, that are far squishier than those on that list.

For the record I didn't say all. Albeit I did say a lot. :$ Something that I did indeed leave out, which is indeed a mistake of mine, a hell of a lot of people have realize the error in their ways of focusing too much on weapon, and most have gotten to the point where they have corrected their error... to an extent, still there is quite a few people who have a badass weapon, with hardly anything going for their defensive side. (Again not all, just more than there should be.)

I wasn't making a statement/belief about that list when I said what I said. I was merely trying to show sak her... mistake in her proposed design as respectfully as possible, without insulting her/giving her a one line sentence laughing in her face/at her intelligence subtly. (Yes I am/was bringing the list up a little in the fact that there are people who can potentially outdamage >some< of those on that list, but it is just to show that there are people who are capable of doing it, nothing more.)

"Common sense" That may be, but obviously not everyone understands it, as I have pointed out there are still several people running around with badass weapons that are capable of out damaging S O M E on these lists. (Again I am not saying all have someone that is capable of doing that, but the fact is some people will be able too)

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Aeliah - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Psychics: - 5 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
- MezK
- SkyIIa
- SpectreBR
- AznBloodV
- ApocaIypto

Yo, i did not play for like 4 months b:cute

Andres - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Ohsnap Apo is back, hide yo kids hide yo wives~~~

Aeliah - Dreamweaver · March 2014

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Yo, i did not play for like 4 months b:cute

If I were a psychic I may have even known that!

Fortunately I'm a cleric instead, so I'll depun you as fast as I can.

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Andres - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Ohsnap Apo is back, hide yo kids hide yo wives~~~

wowow who said im back

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · March 2015

Yes yes necro, but I think it would be interesting to compare MIAs/inactives 1 year on, coz I'm bored and this stuff always interested me.

Aeliah's list of Dynasty

Archers: - 10 candidates, 14 asked for
- iScarlet -inactive
- ATouchOfEvil -inactive
- ExMP -back
- Kenji_
- Ojimaru -inactive
- Raiyan -inactive
- xRedHoodx -inactive
- _Maximo_
- TripsOdom -inactive?
- RottenKitten

Clerics: - 7 candidates, 16 asked for
- Aeliah -inactive
- SonH -inactive
- Valentessa -inactive?
- Lechi
- Divine_Blade -inactive?
- FistToDeath -inactive
- Anarion

Venomancers: - 5 candidates, 8 asked for
- WackyTaffy
- Shuraka
- Raequel -inactive
- Merteuil -inactive?
- Anonome -basically inactive from a TW perspective

Barbarians: - 6 candidates, 10 asked for
- BigCojones -inactive?
- Kicksumbutt -inactive
- odinsghost
- slaughter
- DangerousDan -inactive?
- MelonHeads

Blademasters: - 4 candidates, 8 asked for
- EX_tacy -inactive?
- Aelicia
- RockStar_
- Jckstn -inactive?

Wizards: - 6 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
- Dragslave
- Drakira -inactive
- Smilsha
- sarisama
- Antics
- Belther

Psychics: - 5 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
- MezK
- SkyIIa -inactive?
- SpectreBR
- AznBloodV -inactive
- ApocaIypto -inactive

Assassins: - 5 candidates, 4 asked for
- ehop -inactive?
- Sword_Tammer -inactive?
- NoobzKiller -inactive?
- bigknockers -inactive?
- DionDagger

Mystics: - 6 candidates, 8 asked for
- Xaner
- Tato_ -isn't this dragslave
- Asthariel
- _Tara
- \Influence/
- Countessia -inactive?

Seekers: - 6 candidates, 8 asked for
- ShaShen -inactive?
- Nit -inactive?
- Iceblade
- K_Chonk -inactive?
- Bob_Boberts
- /Arnith\ -inactive?

Dark's list of Relic

Archers: - 13 candidates, 14 asked for
- Heartz
- RedMouse
- Andres -inactive
- G_Tar_God -inactive
- Vali_
- Peachies
- Kallypso -inactive
- $plinters
- xGalatea -inactive?
- CritSpree -inactive
- Caladiel -inactive?
- Sir_Rusty
- DarkSkiesx

Clerics: - 9 candidates, 16 asked for
- The_Cure_ -inactive
- Adibelle
- Racquel -inactive
- Yuunnie
- Kisma
- Gwendollyn
- Thrine -inactive
- Re_Animator -inactive?
- Temiko

Venomancers: - 2 candidates, 8 asked for
- LadyCatt
- Ivory -inactive

Barbarians: - 6 candidates, 10 asked for
- The_Plague -inactive
- Deadwake -inactive
- KaminariSama (Nanbuk)
- CHUM -inactive
- Beastly_Jay
- Jans

Blademasters: - 7 candidates, 8 asked for
- Steel_Dragon -inactive
- slewdem
- X_Drac_X -inactive
- Archaius -inactive
- Tsukiyumi -inactive?
- A_Peenice -inactive
- _Achmed_ -inactive

Wizards: - 4 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
- Tche_BR -inactive
- Philco -inactive
- Cheryl_ -inactive
- Fireballer -inactive

Psychics: - 8 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
- Anjumara
- Evangile -inactive
- xCurse
- Presents
- Raffiel
- SuperLambo
- Tahimara -inactive
- FnBaronHero -inactive

Assassins: - 2 candidates, 4 asked for
-AlonaWorld
- llChaosll

Mystics: - 4 candidates, 8 asked for
- PG_Junior
- Cherriies
- Dulcesito -inactive
- Snoekjie -inactive

Seekers: - 8 candidates, 8 asked for
- Kalopsia
- ShadeWarden
- Breeezy
- Ebrithalia
- purpleseeker
- Cinnumon
- Tippers -inactive
- _Vig_ -inactive

DeathProof's list of Tempest

Archers: - 11 candidates, 14 asked for
TSTrike
__RYDIA__
The_Duke
Lidstrom
Esfandiyar -inactive
Senel
Meowmerz
ATouchOfEvil -inactive
Deadwieght
CheLo_ -inactive
Jinxers

Clerics: - 10 candidates, 16 asked for
Mufonette -inactive
KinderRosa -inactive
Restorz -inactive
Anmori
SMASHnHEAL -inactive
NingXiang -inactive
Mitachi -inactive
The__Sky -inactive
Velona
Solcitse -inactive

Venomancers: - 8 candidates, 8 asked for
Pepoash
Kattywompus -inactive
Draal -inactive
AiwenLyra
artymis -inactive
delishious
_Raszagal_ -inactive?
SkyStorm

Barbarians: - 4 candidates, 10 asked for
Morrier
N/\TT/\ -inactive atm
Prey
Scroggs -inactive

Blademasters: - 7 candidates, 8 asked for
RobMyth
Naturion -inactive
_Vengence_ -inactive
LordRomeo -inactive
Mufon -inactive
Siim -inactive
_LoneWolf -May he rest in peace

Wizards: - 5 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
Eziquil -inactive
Shadowfire
GimmeSnuSnu
DerpProof O: -inactive lel
ForceSpark -inactive

Psychics: - 5 candidates, 12 heavy magic dds asked for
The__Sun
The__Fish -inactive
GodlyMVP -inactive
_NoMorePain -inactive
BaesgVojc

Assassins: - 4 candidates, 4 asked for
kemushi
MrJohnDoe
the_pro
sean_

Mystics: - 5 candidates, 8 asked for
Damny
Ameyuri
KaIey
Asmu
Maradise

Seekers: - 4 candidates, 8 asked for
Tizanos -inactive
a_anita_a -inactive
__KAN__
DeadlySouls -inactive

So many inactives, so many people left. b:cry

If I put someone as inactive incorrectly please say so!

preybank · March 2015

All i got from this is :

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Yes yes necro, but I think it would be interesting to compare MIAs/inactives 1 year on, coz I'm bored and this stuff always interested me.

Blademasters: - 4 candidates, 8 asked for
- EX_tacy -inactive?
- Aelicia
- RockStar_
- Jckstn -inactive?

Blademasters: - 7 candidates, 8 asked for
- Steel_Dragon -inactive
- slewdem
- X_Drac_X -inactive
- Archaius -inactive
- Tsukiyumi -inactive?
- A_Peenice -inactive
- _Achmed_ -inactive

Blademasters: - 7 candidates, 8 asked for
RobMyth
Naturion -inactive
_Vengence_ -inactive
LordRomeo -inactive
Mufon -inactive
Siim -inactive
_LoneWolf -May he rest in peace

Dont you dare play a BM, or theres a 90% chance you become inactive within 1 year b:shocked

Demodude - Dreamweaver · March 2015

I say we clone Kalopsia 80 times and the rest of us take a nap

DionDagger - Dreamweaver · March 2015

Demodude - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I say we clone Kalopsia 80 times and the rest of us take a nap

Sounds like a plan.b:chuckleb:laugh

Slewdem - Dreamweaver · March 2015

DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Sounds like a plan.b:chuckleb:laugh

what about goonz who outgear kalo now.... or it turns into a class advantage over another now?

no more NP card gap now lmao lmao... when it ain't one thing it another llol

DW - Hypothetical cross server TW

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