Aba and SOT? Cash shop only??
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Warsong is open at all times of the day. You can do it whenever.
The alternative to doing Seat/Aba for incomparables is doing Morai dailies for exclusives. Sure, they're lesser shards, but still good.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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I
Subtraction.
/blatant sig copy is blatant
105/105/105 obtained! b:cute0 -
Warsong can be done any time of the day, so is hardly the same as NW. Just find some friends which will do it when you're able to play.
Exclusive shards can be gotten from the Morai orders and are nearly as good as the weekly Incomparables. They're more expensive, but also can be acquired quicker (1 every 3 days as opposed to 2 every 3 weeks)[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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ok ok i read it wrong.... read warsoul......0 -
Cristalwhite - Harshlands wrote: »read the complains or dont.
but dont complain about comlains f:meh
Or better yet. I'll do as I please.
I post as I play: within the rules as they are, without expectation that everybody should be affected so that I can have everything the way I want it. Without QQing that an adventure game has adventure. Without expectation that the game revolves around me and if I can't cut it, then it should be made easier to let me win.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Cristalwhite - Harshlands wrote: »thats what i do. but feeling that i lose somthing that way
well, you cant have everythingNW: cheap raps/cannise <- 2 am for me, i need my sleep
you don't have to do it; catshop prices for raps/cannies dropped dramatically.you only purge once #yopo0 -
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »well, you cant have everything
you don't have to do it; catshop prices for raps/cannies dropped dramatically.
And Nirvana is still available for use.b:laugh0 -
Funny how I can 2 man both of those instances? totally takes a full squad of 10, yepThe people and friends we have lost, or the dreams that have faded...never forget them! ~~ Summoner Yuna, FFX
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Apostasy - Raging Tide wrote: »Once one hits 95, you can go to morai to get the quested gears. Those gears give +Slaying and +Warding levels which are equivalent to +Attack and +Defense levels, but only in PvE. Although they are not the best gears, they are a good start to building toward the higher "easily cs accessible" gears. As one hits end game around 100 and higher, the building of gears is the equivalent of building levels prior to that. So it is a matter of building to that point and learning tricks to building materials to the ends you want to accomplish. Such does take time.
Otherwise yes, the pay to win aspect of this game is disgusting. However, at the same time, there is no reason to not pay around $10-30 per month (10-30 gold) to play as well. The pay to play subscription games cost that much. I do not see why people would expect to play a game entirely for free when that is considered.
Well, as you already know, a subscription provides you access to EVERYTHING that game has to offer - not just everything you are getting for free anyway. b:chuckle
MoraI gears are not cheap. 7 million each piece, 17 million for the weapon last I checked, not to mention you sacrifice your ability to TW, NW, duel or anything PvP related to use those gears (this could even include most Events - not sure). I can however see their value to a farmer. What is someone supposed to do when they get mind-warped from constantly farming? AFK in RoR for very little XP? f:confused
I dont think anyone has a problem paying a subscription rate for access to EVERYTHING. But, its a mute point either way, when everything - even updates that recycle low-level content for higher geared players, while chasing any potential new players off - are obviously aimed at 'Pay To Win' peeps, and those 'Big Money' players only. It is what it is. b:surrender
Surely, if management doesnt care, why should anyone? At this point, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that Qingzi has been recycled to make R999 content, so no more BH29 for j00, lil nubcakes! *giggles and shrugs*0 -
so anyway "Aba and SOT? Cash shop only??" no learn to play and get decent squad seems gist of it, and if u cant be arsed gogo wallet0
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or anyway - can always just not do it too, not until you too get the "Easy Mode" gears for it. Seems strange to see OP players also complaining...
Idk about anyone else, but Id be a bit perturbed if I paid all that money for "Easy Mode" gears and still had trouble doing it. *shrugs*0 -
I find it odd to get "perturbed" about the game being the game. On my way to EARNING my "easy gear" there were a number of instances and challenges I found myself unable to do at the current level and gear. Rather than whine that PWI should bring the challenge down to my level, I worked my level, skills and gear up until I was up to the task. Problem solved ...... without requiring PWI to make a global change that affects everyone.
btw, that's not to thump my chest about it. That's nominal logic and effort, available to everyone.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
I haven't read through all this, but did anyone under 103 call me a whiner and wimp for wanting an fb/bh 99 dungeon be doable by people that level?
Heh. The chrono quest sends you in there at 90..
Just a question: Did anyone actually read my post?
I did expect a flame fest. I'm stupid, lazy, can't play, shouldn't play *Inset insult here* but so many people who couldn't have been such a high level when this was done slamming me. So awesome. Nice that you got the level appropriate dungeon for your culti. Goody for you.
If you had bothered to read it, you would have noticed that I didn't say those dungeons shouldn't have been created. I just said they should have been added rather than replacing what was perfect challenge for us before.0 -
Ellisandro - Archosaur wrote: »I haven't read through all this, but did anyone under 103 call me a whiner and wimp for wanting an fb/bh 99 dungeon be doable by people that level?
Heh. The chrono quest sends you in there at 90..
Just a question: Did anyone actually read my post?
I did expect a flame fest. I'm stupid, lazy, can't play, shouldn't play *Inset insult here* but so many people who couldn't have been such a high level when this was done slamming me. So awesome. Nice that you got the level appropriate dungeon for your culti. Goody for you.
If you had bothered to read it, you would have noticed that I didn't say those dungeons shouldn't have been created. I just said they should have been added rather than replacing what was perfect challenge for us before.
no, we called you a whiner and wimp for instead of trying to raise up to the challenge you came here to QQ when sot is a piece of cake even for 90s b:bye btw, I have news for you, you have to QQ about revamped warsong too since you get some quests at lvl80 there.you only purge once #yopo0 -
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »I have news for you, you have to QQ about revamped warsong too since you get some quests at lvl80 there.
^ this. Entry level doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do the instance in a squad full of that level. Delta is lvl85+, TT3-x is lvl88+, Warsong is lvl80+ etc. Do you actually see a full lvl85 squad running a full 3-x or a Warsong?
Fair or not, that's how it is
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Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »^ this. Entry level doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do the instance in a squad full of that level. Delta is lvl85+, TT3-x is lvl88+, Warsong is lvl80+ etc. Do you actually see a full lvl85 squad running a full 3-x or a Warsong?
Fair or not, that's how it is
when do you get the harpy wraith quest btw? should be around 97 since that's the level req for the weapons b:chuckleyou only purge once #yopo0 -
You can't complete the Harpy Wraith quest (the Harpy Wraith by Ancient Wall isn't the one required for the quest; the one you need isn't in game.)[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »^ this. Entry level doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do the instance in a squad full of that level. Delta is lvl85+, TT3-x is lvl88+, Warsong is lvl80+ etc. Do you actually see a full lvl85 squad running a full 3-x or a Warsong?
Fair or not, that's how it is
There is a difference between warsong and the other revamped dungeons, because the others are easily doable for lvl90+ squads needing there culti or whatever chrono before revamping. Revamping aba/SoT is totally unnecesary, make another EU III or something for the weekly lol0 -
Precisely. Unfortunately, in today's instant gratification generation, this is beyond their comprehension.GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »I find it odd to get "perturbed" about the game being the game. On my way to EARNING my "easy gear" there were a number of instances and challenges I found myself unable to do at the current level and gear. Rather than whine that PWI should bring the challenge down to my level, I worked my level, skills and gear up until I was up to the task. Problem solved ...... without requiring PWI to make a global change that affects everyone.
btw, that's not to thump my chest about it. That's nominal logic and effort, available to everyone.
Squad of 85-87 characters with average gear can absolutely do Delta. As long as you know how to work together and are familiar with the instance.Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »^ this. Entry level doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do the instance in a squad full of that level. Delta is lvl85+, TT3-x is lvl88+, Warsong is lvl80+ etc. Do you actually see a full lvl85 squad running a full 3-x or a Warsong?
Fair or not, that's how it is
You won't likely see a full squad doing Warsong or TT 3x, but they can still get most of the quests done by joining in with a squad who is able to. Teamwork FTW. Both of these can be done by a squad in the low 90's. It just takes work.
New Abba and SoT aren't any different. Get to know the instance and how it works, and it's actually not that hard.
So basically, most of the people that complain about xxx being to hard, are just too lazy/stupid to sit down and learn how the instance works, and how to best coordinate your team to accomplish it.
But what else do you expect when you can buy "Pro" in a cash shop.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Haila - Sanctuary wrote: »There is a difference between warsong and the other revamped dungeons, because the others are easily doable for lvl90+ squads needing there culti or whatever chrono before revamping. Revamping aba/SoT is totally unnecesary, make another EU III or something for the weekly lol
My point still stands, nobody is complaining for not being able to run full Warsong on their lvl80 toon.
I just find the "I can enter the instance therefore I should be able to run it" a moot argument since most instances are not run like that. Was it designed this way? Maybe or maybe not but that's how the game has been. It's not the level per se but the gear available.
For as long as I can remember it was usually the higher leveled, better geared people helping the lower level one that needed the FB, the cultivation, the chrono. I've always had to ask friends and/or faction to help me through my FBs then cultivation bosses and then chrono. This hasn't changed, unless people are that picky that they would refuse a lvl9x or two in their squad.
You can argue that when the game was released there weren't many high levels/good geared people that could help out so people needed to do things at-level but you know very well that's not the case anymore and it hasn't been so for years. You can find more active 100s than active lower levels.
Never said Abaddon and Seat of Torment should have been revamp'd like that but I'm just not going to support the argument I just mentioned. Though, I don't find it that particularly hard to finish the instance and I still have a Mystic that's going to need his SoT cultivation/chrono done in the near future (lvl92 atm) so this isn't me talking from the "oh I r OP so go gear up" point of view :PSylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »Precisely. Unfortunately, in today's instant gratification generation, this is beyond their comprehension.
Squad of 85-87 characters with average gear can absolutely do Delta. As long as you know how to work together and are familiar with the instance.
You won't likely see a full squad doing Warsong or TT 3x, but they can still get most of the quests done by joining in with a squad who is able to. Teamwork FTW. Both of these can be done by a squad in the low 90's. It just takes work.
New Abba and SoT aren't any different. Get to know the instance and how it works, and it's actually not that hard.
So basically, most of the people that complain about xxx being to hard, are just too lazy/stupid to sit down and learn how the instance works, and how to best coordinate your team to accomplish it.
But what else do you expect when you can buy "Pro" in a cash shop.
I actually didn't do delta until I hit lvl100 because for some reason people didn't want me in their squad prior that, the irony, but I can imagine it being do-able but...decent gear, good teamwork and knowing the instance are the key words yeah.[SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
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I watch as months go by and I see person after person holding up BH squads particularly in Abaddon. There are those that don't wait for mdef / hp buffs before running, those that waste time on the eye mobs, those that attack mobs near LRD, and those that 1-1 puppet boss with puppet nearby.
So when I see a qq thread about something new (happens with every change that promotes thought, intelligence, and skill): I just think of these people who refuse to learn, get hostile when confronted with facts, and qq because they couldn't buy their way through the game.
I haven't even bothered with 100+ skills on most of my toons. Why get hung up on some barely useful skills or fairy color; when you either aren't skilled or equipped well enough to use them?0 -
I watch as months go by and I see person after person holding up BH squads particularly in Abaddon. There are those that don't wait for mdef / hp buffs before running, those that waste time on the eye mobs, those that attack mobs near LRD, and those that 1-1 puppet boss with puppet nearby.
So when I see a qq thread about something new (happens with every change that promotes thought, intelligence, and skill): I just think of these people who refuse to learn, get hostile when confronted with facts, and qq because they couldn't buy their way through the game.
I haven't even bothered with 100+ skills on most of my toons. Why get hung up on some barely useful skills or fairy color; when you either aren't skilled or equipped well enough to use them?
Ouch. Brutal.
But true.
Goes back to the shop-worn argument about people who skip the lower levels. I'd wager that much of the QQing about too-hard instances comes from people who skipped over the part where you couldn't kill Krixxix at level, without a squad or got squad-wiped in Wraithgate because Pole was so OP, at the level in which you got the quest. At some point, you should not be able to buy the next level. We've read the narratives from dozens of people who say they've done it under normal conditions. Either they're all lying or it's a doable quest. If it's doable, then it's time to look inward to figure out why you can't get it done. Maybe it's time to go back and revisit a few of those hundreds of quests you skipped and learn what it was meant to teach.
And maybe it would be helpful to understand that quests are supposed to be challenges. If PW becomes a place where you can fill out a form and receive your EXP handout, there's no accomplishment; no reason to be here. The handouts already diminish the accomplishment of those who actually earned their way up. The fact that the battle-tested guys typically know how to work their way past the SoT and Aba challenges is all that's left to distinguish those players from the passengers.
Disclaimer: Not to paint with a brush-too-broad. I realize that everyone has their own, unique story. Not everyone who struggles is a PWI passenger. But there are a lot of them out there. They threaten to outnumber the players.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
I think the reason you don't see more people QQing about the other instances you get quests for at levels that seem impractical, like Warsong, Delta and TT 3-X is because few people quest, period.
Those quests are non-essential. The only 2 chains truly essential to the storyline are Culti/Chrono, considering that they unlock maps and the ability to get certain skills.
Therefore, you would see more people looking to complete these quests at level, and similarly more complaints about it.
I feel the OP is right, if you haven't tried to do it at level, with similarly level appropriate gear (TT 99/Lunar 95 or lower), you can't judge people who have tried and do find it too difficult. Delta is definitely doable earlier than 100, and would actually make for a decent challenge if more people tried it sooner (since most 100+ don't find Delta very challenging, I would expect that this might increase in difficulty at some point too). If people ran it like it was designed (digging, using the eye etc) yes it takes longer, but it's more interesting. Warsong, I haven't heard of anyone at level trying it, but, before g16 very few people ever did Warsong beyond BHs anyway, so that's a poor comparison. Defending pavs might be too difficult, but clearing lanes and killing bosses might not be too bad though; I don't know what is actually required for the Warsong quest, but I don't think you need the final bosses for it anyway, so this could actually be doable with enough time and patience.
I feel like, while giving 100+ people a challenge that is good enough, they implemented it poorly, so that's worthy of criticism. I think if, for example, they revamped the other FB dungeons in a similar way for other level brackets, the people who need those for FB purposes would also start complaining, so it's not surprising to see this brought up repeatedly.
True it's not entirely the fault of the instance itself, like every single thing you do with a party, if people are incapable of teamwork, it's going to fail and feel more difficult than it actually is.
Unfortunately, this will not be changed or reversed, and I hazard a guess that in time it could only get -more- difficult, so, my advice to eeeeeveryone would be just wait til later to attempt it.0 -
Reliea - Sanctuary wrote: »I feel the OP is right, if you haven't tried to do it at level, with similarly level appropriate gear (TT 99/Lunar 95 or lower), you can't judge people who have tried and do find it too difficult.
semi-agree but when Hellfire hits my sin who has quite a few pieces of armor available on lvl99 for less than 300 I don't see any reason for a party that's in tt90s or morai g12 to be unable to do it.Reliea - Sanctuary wrote: »I feel like, while giving 100+ people a challenge that is good enough, they implemented it poorly, so that's worthy of criticism. I think if, for example, they revamped the other FB dungeons in a similar way for other level brackets, the people who need those for FB purposes would also start complaining, so it's not surprising to see this brought up repeatedly.
FBs were NOT meant to be done in their level range, at least not without a big investment in gear and good teamwork. that's why the tabs are there, to motivate people to help. and just as fb59 is not a cakewalk for people in their 70s, I don't see why 99 should be easy for 10x, let alone 9x.
The skills are lvl100 skills and cost quite a bit; I don't see how a poorly geared toon would afford them in the first place. While past maps do have some uses (i.e. grinding in VoS) they are largely obsolete; FC is better exp, jungle (cheap) belt is on par with past map belts and the best daily is in the first map.you only purge once #yopo0 -
To quote someone whom I admire and respect very much:
"We've read the narratives from dozens of people who say they've done it under normal conditions. Either they're all lying or it's a doable quest."
They did it with nominal squads with nominal equipment. Why then is there a problem?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »FBs were NOT meant to be done in their level range, at least not without a big investment in gear and good teamwork. that's why the tabs are there, to motivate people to help. and just as fb59 is not a cakewalk for people in their 70s, I don't see why 99 should be easy for 10x, let alone 9x.
The skills are lvl100 skills and cost quite a bit; I don't see how a poorly geared toon would afford them in the first place. While past maps do have some uses (i.e. grinding in VoS) they are largely obsolete; FC is better exp, jungle (cheap) belt is on par with past map belts and the best daily is in the first map.
I mostly disagree about FBs lower than 99 not being meant to be done at level. From my experience with just about every class, they didn't have any problem as long as they, yes, worked as a team.
But here I'm actually talking about if they went back to all the other FBs and increased the difficulty level to give the BH people a bigger challenge, like Aba/SoT was, not whether the current lower level FB people have problems with it at level now.
Perhaps teamwork is the answer after all... no range can do at-level FBs without teamwork.
The Skills and Map issue isn't about how expensive they are or how useful/obsolete they are, just a case of access to them. Price and usefulness isn't designated by the game itself, but opinion and market price.0
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