Do mystics have a lack of skill on your server?

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

well, gale force is cool and stuff but it's sad when the mobs are nice and round, bm hf'ed, sin subsead, you tripple sparked> CE > channeling an ulti.

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

I died a little inside when a Cleric spams CHB at that boss, just like when they insist to keep putting BB up for it even though the boss keeps interrupting/sealing.

I don't get the point of saying that you shouldn't set up BB if a boss interrupts. *if* BB is the best way, a decent cleric should be able put 3 BBs in a row (depending on whether it's worth a chi pot (but they are like 40k anyway)). and when finally the boss interrupts and cleric can't put up BB, they can just go to plan B and do w/e is the next best way. The only way this won't be better is if the plan B requires excessive amounts of chi when BB drops.

DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Man so much sin hate, pull the stick out ur ***.b:angry My sage sin, w/o chill in aps gear does 65k crits on average in delta per aoe. So when you say we can't aoe for ****, i think you need to get your facts straight. I'm not even gonna talk about how much damage i do with chill and r9 armors (dont have the wep yet). But its in the 150k crit per aoe, and my crit rate is normally about 74% after powerdash.b:chuckle

you know what they say, when you can't have somehting you persuade yourself to see it as useless :b

Desdi - Sanctuary · August 2013

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I don't get the point of saying that you shouldn't set up BB if a boss interrupts. *if* BB is the best way, a decent cleric should be able put 3 BBs in a row (depending on whether it's worth a chi pot (but they are like 40k anyway)). and when finally the boss interrupts and cleric can't put up BB, they can just go to plan B and do w/e is the next best way. The only way this won't be better is if the plan B requires excessive amounts of chi when BB drops.

Genesiac Blink: Vile has no AOE thus the Cleric only needs to focus on the person who is tanking. The boss also seals/interrupts every 15 or so seconds after its first AOE purge.
The tank benefits more from constant IH plus the Cleric can re-buff the tank with Vanguard Spirit (Sage one has a nice Pdef bonus too or Demon SoR).

Most Clerics I've seen are desperate to keep BB up and when it's on down or on cooldown they spam CHB. I do tell them they should just IH and rebuff the tank but they sometimes don't listen. Some of them even try to squad rebuff which is pointless since the boss has a constant AOE purge >.<

viikatemies92 · August 2013

I appreciate IH a lot more on Genesiac Blink Vile than BB as a tank.

And yup my mystic soloheals many times in FC 80+ and mostly people complain about lack of buffs and seekers say they dont handle pull without BB.. lol

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

Genesiac Blink: Vile has no AOE thus the Cleric only needs to focus on the person who is tanking. The boss also seals/interrupts every 15 or so seconds after its first AOE purge.
The tank benefits more from constant IH plus the Cleric can re-buff the tank with Vanguard Spirit (Sage one has a nice Pdef bonus too or Demon SoR).

Most Clerics I've seen are desperate to keep BB up and when it's on down or on cooldown they spam CHB. I do tell them they should just IH and rebuff the tank but they sometimes don't listen. Some of them even try to squad rebuff which is pointless since the boss has a constant AOE purge >.<

I'm not really arguing about the usefulness of BB in blink but for the validity of the argument "boss X interrupts so I won't BB"; I'm saying that whether you set up BB or not should be based on whether it's the best thing to do and deal with potential interruptions as plan B.

well at least you haven't met a cleric that aoe buffs after ressing ONE dead guy. good thing we were in sot so I could crystal spam and bubble of life xD

SpiritDivine - Sanctuary · August 2013

After playing mystic for a few years now i must say that the list in the first post is kinda stupid. Lots of things on that list comes from someone with very little experience with mystics i think. For example why would you put out a healing herb when you need to heal everyone in squad with other heals anyway to prevent charm tick? Lots of newbs ask for healing herb at stupid places. I would say that rather then mystics being worse then other races it is most likely that other races have less understanding on how to play mystic well.

I think there are three schools of mystics. Those who used to be clerics, those who used to be venos and those who used to be wizard or psychic. Often it is not until later in the game that a mystic can be good at all three roles.

At level 70 or 80 it makes kinda sense that people dont know what they are doing. I think that goes for mostly every race. Especially now when so many level with zhen and fc even at lower levels. It is often not very common to play in squads until level 70 or 80 and many even skip squads till even later in the game.

Edit: Have only experience from Sanctuary and Morai servers. From what i have heard from other players the maturity level on Raging Tide is the lowest out of all servers so that might also factor in with how mystics act and my point that other classes dont know much about mystics.

Colum - Raging Tide · August 2013

@ SpiritDivine, I assure you I see these same issues wih many 10x mystics.

thumbs · August 2013

SpiritDivine - Sanctuary wrote: »

I think there are three schools of mystics. Those who used to be clerics, those who used to be venos and those who used to be wizard or psychic. Often it is not until later in the game that a mystic can be good at all three roles.

Mystic never plays roll of veno, and could replace cleric early on. -What is there to replace about wizards?

At level 70 or 80 it makes kinda sense that people dont know what they are doing. I think that goes for mostly every race. Especially now when so many level with zhen and fc even at lower levels. It is often not very common to play in squads until level 70 or 80 and many even skip squads till even later in the game.

It would take me less than a day to learn to play a new class better than most currently playing that class. It's more a symptom of effort, and ability. A lot of great players gave up on this game when the apsidiots took over. Even though the game has changed to better suit AoE and mag; we still have the derp melee mentality prevailing.

SpiritDivine - Sanctuary · August 2013

thumbs wrote: »

Mystic never plays roll of veno, and could replace cleric early on. -What is there to replace about wizards?

Where in the text does it say anything about playing the role of veno, cleric or wizard?

Zoldi - Morai · August 2013

Here ?

SpiritDivine - Sanctuary wrote: »

I think there are three schools of mystics. Those who used to be clerics, those who used to be venos and those who used to be wizard or psychic. Often it is not until later in the game that a mystic can be good at all three roles.
.

Nixiya - Morai · August 2013

hard to play mystic the right way when around you are crappy players
i lvled one mystic to lvl 75, mostly did random runs and guess what...only 2 clerics that i met where debuffing and dding when no1 needed the heals, i never saw any veno to pull mob or turn into fox form to debuff, when bms see boss they usually put their fists and only skill they use is spark, same thing about most sins on morai server. so yeah while some classes have better debuffs i still will use my herbs cuz NO1 else even bothers to fricking debuff. up to lvl 75 not a single soul have told me to not use my herb cuz they have better debuff, i would gladly use both healing herbs or w/e the squad asks if they would do their job.
and i dunno about other servers but on morai i feel safer with mystic in squad than cleric...90% of them completely suck.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · August 2013

A lot of class lack of skills on my server, it seems worse for mystics since there's less than 10 mystics on HL.

I played a few months on HT and it was the same, RT seems the worse, but I think all servers have unskilled people.

Brillance - Raging Tide · August 2013

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

A lot of class lack of skills on my server, it seems worse for mystics since there's less than 10 mystics on HL.

I played a few months on HT and it was the same, RT seems the worse, but I think all servers have unskilled people.

Oh, that is so unfair! RT has/or had Mechsiao (havent seen Mech around in a while though), it also had GaiaSeeker (who I am told is gone for at least 2 years - rumor, but havent seen him in the same amount of time as Mech).

I remember a couple others from when I was a nubcake, looking up to the full R8's of the day - best gears at the time.

Lmao, I guess you are right. Seems weird I cant name more after being on the server more than 2 years - closer to 3. For the importance placed on gears alone on RT, you would think there would be a lot more of them. *shrugs*

Nevermind. b:surrender b:chuckle

DionDagger - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Nixiya - Morai wrote: »

hard to play mystic the right way when around you are crappy players
i lvled one mystic to lvl 75, mostly did random runs and guess what...only 2 clerics that i met where debuffing and dding when no1 needed the heals, i never saw any veno to pull mob or turn into fox form to debuff, when bms see boss they usually put their fists and only skill they use is spark, same thing about most sins on morai server. so yeah while some classes have better debuffs i still will use my herbs cuz NO1 else even bothers to fricking debuff. up to lvl 75 not a single soul have told me to not use my herb cuz they have better debuff, i would gladly use both healing herbs or w/e the squad asks if they would do their job.
and i dunno about other servers but on morai i feel safer with mystic in squad than cleric...90% of them completely suck.

Same goes for Mystics and BM's, and just about any other class except maybe barbs and seekers, it's easy to get away with mistakes on a seeker, and it takes a dedicated player to play a barb (4-5 years experience there).

YulaBerry - Dreamweaver · August 2013

The general skill level of players have definitely decreased in the last few years, as it became easier and easier to rush level to 90+. Maybe it's because I used to run with some great groups and was spoiled by them, but coming back years later on a new character, I cannot seem to find people who know what they're doing, even when "high levels" help my mystic on lower level dungeons.

In our class defense though, mystics is an exceptionally difficult class to play, because there are so many different things we can do with our skills depending on the situation-- so to be a reasonably good mystic, you have to be really flexible in managing all your skills/pets/plants/lysing/leeching options. At the same time, we are a lot weaker in each individual category (aka healer, tank, dd) than the classes specifically designed for them. (Healer: no bb, purify. Tank: lack of inbuilt hp and aggro skills. dd: mana burn. Support: weaker debuffs, less reliable seals than specific class skills)

So in all, very very good mystics can do any given role to the extent of an average specialty player, so an average mystic seems exceptionally worse than an average normal player. And really, our role (it seems to me, so far) is to fill the gaps in teams where we can, and to be flexible. It's hard to shine in such a role- and most people only notice what a mystic is doing when the mystic isnt' doing it right. So, give us a break! If we are not exceptionally bad, we are probably pretty average as a teammate.

Jaiden_/ - Sanctuary38 · August 2013

YulaBerry - Dreamweaver wrote: »

It's hard to shine in such a role- and most people only notice what a mystic is doing when the mystic isnt' doing it right. So, give us a break! If we are not exceptionally bad, we are probably pretty average as a teammate.

Very true. That's why me personally when ever I get a compliment it means a lot. I know I was a key player instead of just a filler.

Artemiko - Raging Tide · September 2013

Lmao. The OP hasn't met me then b:chuckle

Let's be real, a Mystic is a very large back of tricks, you just have to know when to use them. I rarely squad with other mystic's, but when I do, they're irritatingly pathetic. I remember squading with a mystic for fc when I was 95, and the fool had none of his plants maxed. How the hell do you even find yourself comfortable joining a squad with your plants not decently leveled.

You will never catch me just spamming NV.

I always have a pet out, and the pet is going to actually fit the scenario

Everyone is going to have res buff, no matter how tedious and heart wrenching it is to see my mana drain so quickly.

All of my skills are maxed, so there is no WAY I'm going to have any power issues

AOE Bosses- If the cleric can't BB, you can summon the healing plants, so I do it, it helps, trust me.

As a healer class I watch HP bars, even if I'm only asked to just DD, you never know what's going to happen, and being alert is key.

Falling Petals- From most mystic's I've seen, they don't use it. They're idiots, seriously. That skill is a lifesaver and saves you from having to spam BitC all the damn time.

Mystic's need to also learn when the hell to use Gale Force. I can't stand melee class QQ about how the mobs run afterwards. Too many mystic's use it because it's an aoe and has low cost in chi. No no no! You're just going to make it way more tedious for everyone.

I'm done! That was a bit long, but I know for a fact I'm not lacking in skill, I didn't touch fc until I was 85, and I spent time doing squad instances and the like so I could get a feel of where I belong and what I have to do in most scenarios. But there are some completely stupid *** mystic's out here though. b:surrender b:shutup

Algiz - Dreamweaver · September 2013

its sad that i've seen sooooooo many terrible mystics out there. Mystic is one of my first classes ( actual first being a cleric on HL), but its easily one of my best. I can always tell when i join a squad when people have been exposed to failtastic mystics, because they're always shocked when i do things i "shouldn't" be able to do (solo wood pav in WS, solo water in ws, solo fc in under 40 minutes, et c)

Mystics are a situational class, and sadly, people have become so used to doing one thing and one thing only in a squad that they can't muster up the flexibility that the Mystic class requires.

Honestly though, i find people qq'ing about my galeforce just pathetic. if i do it right i can aoe crit for 200-300k, compared to your aps spam of 100-200k in a minute if you're lucky (assuming average gear of course). OOOOOOOOOMMMMMGGGGG they run for 3 seconds! Boo-Hoo! A lot of times i find myself tanking better than whatever barb i happen to be with because people are desperate for the BKI more than they are for a tank, so once i get that aggro after the squad as wiped around me, why wouldn't i spam GF and use the seal as an aggro skill?

Algiz - Dreamweaver · September 2013

Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »

...Mobs sealing is one of the main reasons why Mystics should not use gale force...the more mobs run around the longer it takes to kill them.

Yea HF is 6 seconds. During which a half-*** competent squad should already have wiped the mobs with mire/subsea/HF/votex/arma

seriously, how does a 6-9 second 200% damage amp count as counter-productive? Oh wait your mystic gale force and waste all of the squad's debuffs lol? b:laugh

your ignorance is showing again Wally...........

tweakz · September 2013

Algiz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

A lot of times i find myself tanking better than whatever barb i happen to be with because people are desperate for the BKI more than they are for a tank, so once i get that aggro after the squad as wiped around me, why wouldn't i spam GF and use the seal as an aggro skill?

In RB: cleric tells wiz they should get Expel. I whisper to cleric that barb isn't using enough aggro skills; cleric replies: I know.

-wth: why do people put burden on wrong class? We don't need barbs; we have pills for BKI now. I have a barb on each alt I can bring in for squad buffs. Barbs are another one of those classes that is full of fail.

Colum - Raging Tide · September 2013

Each class can be full of fail.

Then again, I had a r9 mystic wit+1 refines in BH delta w3, said mystic did not AOE with summon or GF, all he did was spamming healing herb and sent chihyu to attack targets. We requested him to AOE, no reactions. Our seeker who was supposed to tank the mobs did not vortex, archer ended up getting aggro and he RQ afer w2 for charm ****. After that sins got aggro from mystic and seeker.

... Yeeeeah fun times.

Desdi - Sanctuary · September 2013

Well, in my opinion using or not using Gale Force depends on the squad. If said squad can't kill the waves/mobs/whatever fast enough, using GL and making monsters run away from the AOE range is not the best idea (particularly ranged monsters that don't run back in the AOE range) but when things are stunned or the waves drop pretty fast I'd rather see the Mystic using GL.
It can also save lives by making monsters run away sometimes, I use Parasitic Nova in the same way in Lunar when things go wrong.

Mystics just need to learn when it benefits the squad to use GL and when it doesn't.

Xainou - Sanctuary · September 2013

Agree with Desdi. Seals can be a big lifesaver if used correctly.

Especially if you're having trouble in delta, they can buy that second when the BMs stun is in cd. Or when my faction leader pulls a full path in lunar, it makes the impact less hard on him. Or simply in water pav in WS. **** them bubble mobs, seal first.

tweakz · September 2013

Sage GF is different: they don't run out of AoE's and they move slower so melee dd have more time to tab/attack.

CapnK - Sanctuary · September 2013

Because of the way the game handles movement and attacks Sage is just as bad as Demon/level 10. For a melee to attack, the enemy has to be standing completely still. If the melee starts his attack and the enemy moves the attack cancels and he has to chase it again. Even a small amount of movement is enough.

And all versions of Gale Force are bad in Lunar since all mobs there are immune to freeze and slow.

tweakz · September 2013

CapnK - Sanctuary wrote: »

Because of the way the game handles movement and attacks Sage is just as bad as Demon/level 10. For a melee to attack, the enemy has to be standing completely still. If the melee starts his attack and the enemy moves the attack cancels and he has to chase it again. Even a small amount of movement is enough.

And all versions of Gale Force are bad in Lunar since all mobs there are immune to freeze and slow.

I play barb, bm, sin, and mystic. Not all mobs move when GF is used. There is plenty of time to tab another mob with sage GF. With sage GF: mobs don't move out of AoE area. As barb, bm and sin: I encourage mystics to use GF if they have decent weapon / stats regardless of culti.

Artemiko - Raging Tide · September 2013

tweakz wrote: »

I play barb, bm, sin, and mystic. Not all mobs move when GF is used. There is plenty of time to tab another mob with sage GF. With sage GF: mobs don't move out of AoE area. As barb, bm and sin: I encourage mystics to use GF if they have decent weapon / stats regardless of culti.

I like you, can we be friends? b:cute

Countessia - Dreamweaver · September 2013

I hear what you are saying. The only thing that I would take exception to is the cancelling out debuffs with plants. It is hard to understand every single skill of every single class. These things come with time. Instead of raging on your mystic, perhaps say.."oh hey by the way, could you not use your creeper here? I have a stronger debuff." Communication is vital for the flow of any good group.
Mystics have a few pet peeves as well. I do not freak out every time a well meaning veno brambles me, although inside a bit of me is screaming...if you don't understand why, in pve mystics use a skill called lucky break which makes the next hit a guaranteed crit....however when we bounce happily in to aoe...bramble tics and steals the lucky break proc b:cry
Anyway...back to the matter at hand. The simple truth of the matter is the mystic is a complex class. It is neither as good a healer as a cleric, nor as good a dd as say a psychic or wizard. It takes a bit of time playing the class to get it down to a smooth flow( which is true of any class). Perhaps instead of hating on players, take the few seconds to make a friendly suggestion. I would warrant that 99% of the time it will be appreaciated and perhaps implemented in their gameplay. Win/Win situation

b:bye

Countessia - Dreamweaver · September 2013

Colum - Raging Tide wrote: »

Each class can be full of fail.

Then again, I had a r9 mystic wit+1 refines in BH delta w3, said mystic did not AOE with summon or GF, all he did was spamming healing herb and sent chihyu to attack targets. We requested him to AOE, no reactions. Our seeker who was supposed to tank the mobs did not vortex, archer ended up getting aggro and he RQ afer w2 for charm ****. After that sins got aggro from mystic and seeker.

... Yeeeeah fun times.

I am just going to point out that the harsh on refines is bogus. I have a full set of r9rr that is **** refined because the junk just refuses to get good rolls. It does not make me any less of a mystic that I have poor refines for the moment. Everything comes with time and frankly that stuff is expensive. How about take a little less time to check out people's gear and a little more time to use "constructive" criticism.

I would also like to point out that Dreamweaver has SEVERAL amazing mystics! In my guild alone we have a ton. Little less hating and a little more understanding and merriment perhaps. It is a game after all.

Zoldi - Morai · September 2013

Countessia - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I do not freak out every time a well meaning veno brambles me, although inside a bit of me is screaming...if you don't understand why, in pve mystics use a skill called lucky break which makes the next hit a guaranteed crit....however when we bounce happily in to aoe...bramble tics and steals the lucky break proc b:cry

When I was still doing Phoenix Valley, I tried once with veno bramble and I must confess it was a really bad idea because it made lucky break totally useless (plus the fact that it was very laggy b:surrender). But I still like having bramble in PVP b:thanks

By the way I'm not ok regarding the fact that Mystics would be not as good healer as Clerics and not as good DD as wizards or psychics. This is differrent but in some situations mystics can be better for both cases

Korpinsulka - Raging Tide · September 2013

Countessia - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I am just going to point out that the harsh on refines is bogus. I have a full set of r9rr that is **** refined because the junk just refuses to get good rolls. It does not make me any less of a mystic that I have poor refines for the moment. Everything comes with time and frankly that stuff is expensive. How about take a little less time to check out people's gear and a little more time to use "constructive" criticism.

I would also like to point out that Dreamweaver has SEVERAL amazing mystics! In my guild alone we have a ton. Little less hating and a little more understanding and merriment perhaps. It is a game after all.

IMHO if you can't even afford initial +3 - +5 refines, you should not get that expensive gear at all. Imagine what kind of refines you'd get on T3 with the same coin.
I wouldn't have checked the gears at all if the mystic would have done something more "constructive". Sending Chihyu to attack targets 1 by 1 and putting a healing herb down every now and then is not what I consider "constructive". At this point I check the gears, usually to find out if they're powerleveled/cashed toons.

Not to say that cashshopping makes player bad, it doesnt. Cash shopping AND powerleveling in a game you don't know and with little to no experience in MMOs and lack of common sense however... just no.

Do mystics have a lack of skill on your server?

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