Hellfire Abomination...and the painful new SOT.

GlenRoss - Archosaur · July 2013

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Obviously all the players claiming that they did things the hard way are just talking out of their *****.

Yeah you know who I'm talking about.

I don't know who or what you mean. The hard way? As in just kill it, with no special tactics? Yeah I (with a group of course) have done that a few times. Am I missing your meaning?

Bearing in mind that I'm not taking melee hits, hence not taking as much abuse as the big uglies :-) but our group as a whole fared well.

Grindata_ - Heavens Tear · July 2013

for new abba and sot even my barb has a hard time tanking last boss and my barb is almost full s3 with 27k pdef and 9k mag def buffed 19k hp even through invoke and solid shield it burns through charm like crazy and results in death multiple times and my barb barb is 101.

Psytrac - Dreamweaver · July 2013

HideYoHubby - Archosaur wrote: »

Granted it cant crit either by my understanding, though it seems to buff itself at times. Either way, that sort of damage range is absurd for lvl 99s to take.

actually, I'm goin to correct you on that, monster CAN crit.

and yes, it is completely absurd

HideYoHubby - Archosaur · July 2013

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

actually, I'm goin to correct you on that, monster CAN crit.

and yes, it is completely absurd

I knew drummer could crit but I always thought it more of a glitch than anything as I havent seen such things happening too often. I guess the crit rate is something stupid low, I gots to go trough that data again trying to locate it.

Asishi - Archosaur · July 2013

Grindata_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

for new abba and sot even my barb has a hard time tanking last boss and my barb is almost full s3 with 27k pdef and 9k mag def buffed 19k hp even through invoke and solid shield it burns through charm like crazy and results in death multiple times and my barb barb is 101.

I'll assume for SoT you're speaking of Queen of Agony, Xipher. She and Borobudur Dungeon Lord are intended to be rough, and are -only- needed for TMs and weeklies. There's absolutely no reason they should be easy, they're intended to be a challenge.

Honestly, next to Queen of Agony, Xipher and Trap Master Fierce, new Hellfire is a bit of a pansy.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear · July 2013

Grindata_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

for new abba and sot even my barb has a hard time tanking last boss and my barb is almost full s3 with 27k pdef and 9k mag def buffed 19k hp even through invoke and solid shield it burns through charm like crazy and results in death multiple times and my barb barb is 101.

For you to be almost full g16... you probably isn't a fist barb. And with 19k hp buffed... it means your refines SUCK. There are arcane out there with more hp... not to mention the hundreds of light armor classes.

soleida · July 2013

First I like to started to mension: PPl who think gear or own the best off the best doesn't make you a better player.

For the idiot who stats a veno without a herc or nix is a fail..........get your fact straight! Every pet level for the started is a good tank like the nix/herc. A veno is not sending your pet in and attack. With the new update things have being change too: the evoluted pet has its defence, attack and hp based on the owners gear. Before this update ppl use to point out: Veno's are outdated. Is this update on the veno's side the best thing ever happend to them................its still full of bugs and another reason to get R9 +12.

For SOT and Abba its a bad thing they change it so much! Its not only the TT99 culti but also a part off the OHT culti which is needed for the level 100 culti. At level 99 most off us are working on their endgame gear. But do we need to spent a fortune in real money to do a culti? As for take some endgame players for backup wont be a bad idea.........accept for the fact some ppl are to high on their horses and ask for gear and weapon, bm a link! For some classes its even hard to find a squad. And no its not like you get a squads fast. Every bh I have to ask over and over if ppl take veno............when my cleric is always needed even more then 1 time. (wonder why I quit helping out on the cleric)

For the gear its hard these days to get a squad even for your oht culti. Lets stand the fact we need to farm for our mats. TT became a Stand alone instance for the Sin,bm and seeker. Veno's who have a hell off a gear might be able to do some bosses.........but not me! So ppl need to farm coins .......which are done by BH at level 100 for the cards. Its kind off a circle we need to do bh's to get money and we need good gear to be able to them.

Doing NW is another way to get money: cannies and raps. Sadly pwi still don't keep up to the promisses to make it more accesseble to ppl. European players have to get up at 4-5 in the morning to do this. Some Eastern USA players have the problem the timing is late too. Hell its weekend right? Sadly some ppl need to work in Real life.

As for Teamwork and squads:

PPL tent to do more powerlevel, gear up and expect they know how to play the class. Depenting on high level well geared players is not always a deal. Some even ask for gear and weapon link. But more I have the idea: its a instance for 99 culti............should we be able to do it with a TT99 gear squad? Do we need to spent more real life money to be able to do our culti? And yes i have to say players are jerks if its gets done to teamplay. They tent to rush off leave the squad behind and expect you as slow cleric to keep them alive as well. Some even rush off when the squad is not even in the instance. Hell they can do it alone.........That's is what they understand by teamplay! Sadly I see a game who was attent to be a team effort turn into a single mode. Some older players even expect you to know every instance.

As for the bosses: if the sot boss hits like 4 k more ..........I'm still 1 hit like most mag. classes. If if you have the top off some gear the fact is some classes have lesser hp then phy. class.

Ps who those who wants to QQ on my english: I'm sorry for my Dyslexia.

Grindata_ - Heavens Tear · July 2013

my barbs refines r the average +5 cause im not a hardcore cashshopper to get all gear +10/12 i cashshop here and there but not enough to have josd or vit stones in every piece of gear.

Quilue - Sanctuary · July 2013

HideYoHubby - Archosaur wrote: »

Interesting, damage was basically doubled and damage range is fairly small now. Hellfire currently hits bout as hard as pure dex sin with N3+11 dags, discounting attack levels. And unlike those daggers, Hellfire doesnt have damage reduction of PvP. Granted it cant crit either by my understanding, though it seems to buff itself at times. Either way, that sort of damage range is absurd for lvl 99s to take.

But Hellfire is probably not hitting as fast as a pure dex sin. Just think of it as a sin on permanent zerk crit. Absurd on a robe or LA, but probably not on a lv99 barb with support. It's really the other stuff Hellfire does that causes the most problems.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · July 2013

if you want to play challenge mde and do your 99 culti at 99 with a 99 squad: gear up.

otherwise, do what everyone else did and do it with help. tabs are supposed to be an incentive for higher level players to help you in your culti; that's how it's supposed to be.

oh, and stop being a hypocrite and do full delta to finish your OHT culti with a 95 squad; if you do that I doubt that that squad will have problems with hellfire. cheers.

Sanna - Morai · July 2013

I think it is stupid how the developers in China decide to make things over complex with new instances. Look at AeU and the new SoT and Aba. I guess casual gaming is a thing of the past in pwi.

Untamed_pain - Archosaur · July 2013

Aeu isn't hard. i like Aeu.

Aba and Sot. Isn't that bad either. If you got the right squad who's knows what they are doing shouldn't be a prob getting it done. Now of course my veno and cleric are celestial. But i do have a 98 seeker. I haven't decided when ill do her 99 culti when she is 99 lol and yeah she has skill books.

Jadsia - Lost City · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

I think it is stupid how the developers in China decide to make things over complex with new instances. Look at AeU and the new SoT and Aba. I guess casual gaming is a thing of the past in pwi.

Oh puhleeeeeeeeze. If you want an easy instance to feel OP in then go back to FB 19. A game is supposed to have some element of challenge to it.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

I think it is stupid how the developers in China decide to make things over complex with new instances. Look at AeU and the new SoT and Aba. I guess casual gaming is a thing of the past in pwi.

god forbid that something requires two braincells and the ability to do more than macro-afk killing a boss.

Sanna - Morai · July 2013

The difficulty is not in playing. It is in figuring out how to do the dungeon.

Before when you had no idea how to do a dungeon you could look at the map and do it. You could figure it out on your own.

Now you need to teleport here or stand there at the correct times. You need to read a guide on what to do before you play. I think that is stupid. It is not harder just stupid. Good luck sending a group of overpowered players into abaddon to try and kill the BH boss without any info on the dungeon beforehand. I dont see how they would be able to do it.
That is a change in game play.

For me personally that is a big step away from how PWI used to be and how it was developed. For me it is a step towards the worse.

You can make the game harder if you want. But the way they are developing dungeons lately i dont find much fun and doesnt fit into PWI. It might work in another game but not here.
To me it shows the current developers in china are very disconnected with the game.

I hope i made it clear it is not about gear or difficulty of the dungeon.

Xainou - Sanctuary · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

Good luck sending a group of overpowered players into abaddon to try and kill the BH boss without any info on the dungeon beforehand. I dont see how they would be able to do it.

Man, I wonder how people like my squad even figured out that dungeon then...

Fryvorg - Sanctuary · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

Now you need to teleport here or stand there at the correct times. You need to read a guide on what to do before you play.

Didn't you notice the pop up quests, blinking yellow text and NPCs that give you any information you need? b:bye

Jadsia - Lost City · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

The difficulty is not in playing. It is in figuring out how to do the dungeon.

Now you need to teleport here or stand there at the correct times. You need to read a guide on what to do before you play. I think that is stupid. It is not harder just stupid. Good luck sending a group of overpowered players into abaddon to try and kill the BH boss without any info on the dungeon beforehand. I dont see how they would be able to do it.

Are you trying to troll me?

Definition of - game /gām/ Noun

A form of play or sport, esp. a competitive one played according to rules and decided by skill, strength, or luck.

Adjective

1.Eager and willing to do something new or challenging: "they were game for anything".

From the very definition of 'game' we see that it inherently involves overcoming challenges using skills, strength, and/or luck. Whenever any of these elements become irrelevant the function of the game ceases to exist and it becomes nothing more than a rudimentary routine of actions.

As someone else pointed out, with your reasoning I am perplexed that anyone is able to complete SoT and Aba out at all but we do. Why is that? Maybe we apply our character's and our own skills and our strengths and with a little luck we succeed. Hmmm. Maybe you can take some anti-QQ pills and try it out.

soleida · July 2013

I have to agree on the bad job pwi does if it gets down to what china does. A new update in china means the same update in USA as well. PWI do not think about the action they take on updating the game form China. Instead off making the game more fun for all, they mess up the game more with every update.

Compare to the beginning: there are a lot off instance left to died! There where you needed a squad overpower classes can handle it alone. The instance who provide the mats for gear are dead. Why do a nirvana if NW is a easy way. The new veno instance to level up your pet ............yeah, another great idea, who doesn't work without PK mode. To bad too the defence hp and attack is bound to the players gear! More coins need to be spent to have a better gear.

I get ppl QQ about the new abba and Sot .........do ppl with T90/99 need to buy the skill books in AH? And lets face the fact high level ppl don't like to take a new player to a instance. Some classes dont even are wanted in some instance. Like most ppl which the time for nw sucks need to buy their raps from cat-shops.

I don't want to QQ but seems PWI is focus only on more money than a way to keep new players. Lets face it : if pwi means buy tons of gold form real money would you play?

Desdi - Sanctuary · July 2013

Fryvorg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Didn't you notice the pop up quests, blinking yellow text and NPCs that give you any information you need? b:bye

^ this O.o the game already provides you with most of the information you need. If not all, then at least the most important ones but the majority of people never bother to actually read...

I did full Abaddon and Seat of Torment the very first day they came out with a squad. We didn't read anything, there were no guides out there yet, very few people had run it (or nobody at all as we went in right after servers were up) and we still did it. It's not that hard in my opinion, just needs a little more thinking and paying attention to what you're doing.

Psytrac - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Jadsia - Lost City wrote: »

A game is supposed to have some element of challenge to it.

ok, challenge. do it in tt90 gear? do it in +2? better yet.. make 1m before level 90, while being actively in combat and not just sitting behind.

Oh right.. 12k attacks with 3k hp aren't fun, having 1 coin per drop, well.. that's not fun either.

Challenge is fun, but this isn't challenge.

challenge
n.
1.
a. A call to engage in a contest, fight, or competition: a challenge to a duel.
b. An act or statement of defiance; a call to confrontation: a challenge to the government's authority.
2. A demand for explanation or justification; a calling into question: a challenge to a theory.
3. A sentry's call to an unknown party for proper identification.
4. A test of one's abilities or resources in a demanding but stimulating undertaking: a career that offers a challenge.

Xainou - Sanctuary · July 2013

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ok, challenge. do it in tt90 gear? do it in +2? better yet.. make 1m before level 90, while being actively in combat and not just sitting behind.

Are you even playing the game...?

Brillance - Raging Tide · July 2013

There are peeps on my server that still do their BHs in Blues, Purples, or a mix with a couple greens. They will probably struggle with both the BH and their culti now.

They are good players usually, and probably spend more time on and in the game than most bother too, from what Ive noticed.

One could say, if they wanted to be so cold, "to heck with them. Who cares? Non-factors!"

Another, who's server isnt exactly bursting at the seams with an active population might get a little caring about the situation. *shrugs*

ovenusarmanio · July 2013

Sanna - Morai wrote: »

The difficulty is not in playing. It is in figuring out how to do the dungeon.

Before when you had no idea how to do a dungeon you could look at the map and do it. You could figure it out on your own.

Now you need to teleport here or stand there at the correct times. You need to read a guide on what to do before you play. I think that is stupid. It is not harder just stupid. Good luck sending a group of overpowered players into abaddon to try and kill the BH boss without any info on the dungeon beforehand. I dont see how they would be able to do it.
That is a change in game play.

For me personally that is a big step away from how PWI used to be and how it was developed. For me it is a step towards the worse.

You can make the game harder if you want. But the way they are developing dungeons lately i dont find much fun and doesnt fit into PWI. It might work in another game but not here.
To me it shows the current developers in china are very disconnected with the game.

I hope i made it clear it is not about gear or difficulty of the dungeon.

How do you think people figured out what was 2-shotting the tank back when POLE was hard? Or how to coordinate Delta before spawn point was really a realistic option? How do you think NPCs were found before auto-path? Or how people handled cube when the explanations in the rooms themselves are lacking and it involves tricks that people might not actually think to do, like the listen rooms?

PWI has always had a learning curve with new content ideas, its just that for a long time now they didn't change things up that much. So the wisdom was passed on. And since most of the squad knew what to do, one person could just derp around looking at the map and not communicating with the squad and figure out what to do by winging it. But that doesn't work when you're not the only one new to the instance, and not one person knows what to do. And the content is fresh so there is no one to turn to ask. Now you are the early adopters.

There is a lot of people saying things like "old players are stuck in their ways," or "hyper babies aren't as bad as people say and are just as good at their class," etc. But when new content hits the floor....now all I see are complaints instead of competition for best guides. Requests for nerfs instead of requests to collaborate on tips and tricks. And people saying things like "well it's probably your gear," instead of asking what the person may have been doing wrong. As if an extra 1k hp (on top of their 5k hp) was going to matter in the OP's situation when he got hit for 15k. 6k or 5k, he'd of still been one shot with that type of damage. So clearly something else was going wrong, and it had nothing to do with gear. People used to know that.

You call it a departure, I call it a return to form. While I do think they shouldn't make it part of the 99 culti if the boss really is too hard for someone in decently refined and shareded tt90-99mix to do. Dunno yet, it's too early for me to really say based off forum posts and I haven't got the chance to experience for myself. Having no characters on HT with that level range. I could go back to DW and do it, but I don't really want to spoil the content. xD That doesn't mean I don't support these types of changes. There is no reason it shouldn't be a BH, or a weekly for 100+. I don't support the constant taking of content meant for sub-100 and handing it over to the 100+ because it discourages new players. But revamped content that forces people to learn to understand why they are clicking x skill, instead of mindless clicking it? Yes, please! Bosses that require teamwork and coordination? Yes, please! New and interesting challenges that require more time spent working together than before? Yes, please. So sick of the only solo mentality, this is an MMO ffs we need more content that forces people to work together.

Chuck_smith - Sanctuary · July 2013

You guys do realize that it's the gear that gives the solo mentality right? b:chuckle . Challenge doesn't change people to work together, it's just going to create noobs that will skip BH and just find another way to gain coin the lazy way.

Quilue - Sanctuary · July 2013

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ok, challenge. do it in tt90 gear? do it in +2? better yet.. make 1m before level 90, while being actively in combat and not just sitting behind.

Oh right.. 12k attacks with 3k hp aren't fun, having 1 coin per drop, well.. that's not fun either.

Challenge is fun, but this isn't challenge.

Gonna have to disagree with the 1m before Lv 90...all of my alts...5 of them, have managed a 3.0 flier around lv 60 by themselves, and that is at least 5m with the old class fliers.

1m before Lv 90 might be a challenge if you use hypers or something.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · July 2013

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ok, challenge. do it in tt90 gear? do it in +2? better yet.. make 1m before level 90, while being actively in combat and not just sitting behind.

Oh right.. 12k attacks with 3k hp aren't fun, having 1 coin per drop, well.. that's not fun either.

Challenge is fun, but this isn't challenge.

A year ago I made a char on a new server to see how PVE servers are, I had no friends and knew no one, I was like totally a new player, there was no dreamchaser packs, by lvl60 I had around 30m.

I don't play my char anymore on HT, but my cleric there is lvl82 and have around 10-15m money, a aquadash, a silverrain, a TT99 glaive, 3 pieces of TT90 (2 with 4 sockets and one +4),the demure set that I bought 10m back in time, a cape of elite leather shard in immac, butterfly wish wings, demon cleric skill books, rapt, a ton of herbs and mats, molds, shards and a lot more stuff, I bought that all by myself, I didn't c$ed, I played for maybe 1-2 months and no one gave me free stuff except a top and skirt (fash) from someone that left, but I didn't sold it, it's still sleeping in my bank. So I have probaly for more than 50m of stuff on a lvl82 cleric that I played max 2 months.

People lower than lvl 90 that never made over 1m are lazy, stupid or ignorant/new.

Lazy: teleport everywhere beside fly/mount/run, buy things at higher price than if they have made it themselves and stay in Arch all day long complaining and doing nothing.

Stupid: People that spend 50m and more on fash, pets, flyers, mounts, but have no gears, then after that you see them complain that gears are expensive and only c$er can have good gears.

Ignorant/New: People that never played games before and don't know how PWI work, so it's not really their fault, but they could come on forum ask advices and read guides. (Merch, etc...)

Jadsia - Lost City · July 2013

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ok, challenge. do it in tt90 gear? do it in +2? better yet.. make 1m before level 90, while being actively in combat and not just sitting behind.

Oh right.. 12k attacks with 3k hp aren't fun, having 1 coin per drop, well.. that's not fun either.

Challenge is fun, but this isn't challenge.

It's not a challenge for someone too lazy and has some sort of entitlement mentality. It's an impossibility for them because of their attitudes and self-imposed limitations. The only barrier between failure and success in a game like this lies within oneself.

I do not have to do SoT or Aba in tt90 gear that is +2. Why in the hell would I want to do that? I worked hard and farmed WS, HH, set up my catshop to go from r8 to full 3rd cast NV. I invested years into doing cultis to earn enough spirit and coin to buy every skill available for my veno. I'm currently farming to replace the cheap shards for better ones. My challenge was to upgrade my gear so I could go through these instances with better odds of success. What's the incentive of working hard to improve one's skills and gears and gameplay styles if the game did offer challenges that require them to overcome?

Making 1 mil before level 90 wasn't that difficult. In fact I farmed TT (HH for us on LC server) well over 1000 runs and worked a catshop for a year to earn the 200+ mil for my herc and my nix when I was level 74 - 3 and a half years ago.

If one is not willing to work on upgrading their skills, gear (including refines because +2 is stupid lazy) or learn how to make in game coin somehow with all the ways the game offers then they truly deserve to be left behind and weeded out of any type of advancement in the game. You can keep on making excuses with your pathetic demands that I should somehow roll myself back to substandard gear and style of gameplay in a weird attempt to draw some kind of empathy for the lazies who struggle due to their own choices out there but I won't. The fact that people like me worked hard to build our characters into something that can achieve the new SoT and Aba ought to be an incentive for others who haven't to do so themselves.

You can either level up your skills and gear, shadow someone who can escort you through the instances if your char is sub-par or not do the instances at all. People who prefer the latter are moochers and a burden to the rest of us so I'm glad they're being weeded out.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · July 2013

wow just wow. people find hard to figure out SoT? you getting ***** pop-ups to tell you what to do.... what can I say, those are not people that want to *play* a game, they want to *watch* a game while they change fashions and chit-chat. what's the point of getting new content if you are gonna afk-macro through it... let us squad wipe again and again and again, try different approaches and squad formations and finally finish it and get a nice reward.... that's a *game*

of course, that won't do well with the 3k hp cleric with the latest pure white fashion that qq's after the very first wipe...

Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ok, challenge...
make 1m before level 90
make 1m before level 90
make 1m before level 90

are you ****** serious? I really hope that you missed two zeros cause if you cant farm 1m before 90...

Psytrac - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Jadsia - Lost City wrote: »

Making 1 mil before level 90 wasn't that difficult. In fact I farmed TT (HH for us on LC server) well over 1000 runs and worked a catshop for a year to earn the 200+ mil for my herc and my nix when I was level 74 - 3 and a half years ago.

Yea.. 3 and a half years ago..

Try now.

And yes, I am actively playing the game. level 98 sin and 97 seeker.

I go to nation wars any time I am not passed out in bed, and I am 1-shot by everyone. but I still go

(and no, I do not count NW in that gather X money thing. I do do NW and earn money there, that is how I am making my money)

Hellfire Abomination...and the painful new SOT.

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