New classes overpowered

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  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Belgare - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yea, that's the truth. On my Seeker there is no damn way I can hold a kill if a mystic decides he or she will KS me as if I'm invisible.

    This was true of barbs vs venos, BM vs wiz as well lol
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  • Kokki - Harshlands
    Kokki - Harshlands Posts: 267 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    i agree that the 79 skills and demon/sage skills makes it a whole different ball game. I think the devs did a good job with these new classes, and making them a little more fun to play, i actually enjoyed the EG's quests, while i hated them on my psy who i quit at level 14.

    in squad PVE the EG's excel, the solo they are pretty balanced, my mystic has to mediate after 5-6 mobs for MP like the seeker needs to medidate for HP
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  • Longknife - Harshlands
    Longknife - Harshlands Posts: 4,843 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Nope.

    It's still sins.
    I know a BM with 26k physical defense on my server who was not happy to have died in under 3 seconds (while charmed) to a 5aps sin who was free to just occult ice and melee, and free to opt out of staying to fight should occult ice fail.

    Mystics and Seekers seem like VERY OP TW classes, but not so much like great 1v1 classes.
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  • LenieClarke - Heavens Tear
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,275 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Bentus - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Khewy = ranged physical attack type boss (i.e. archer type boss) = -50% dmg at melee range

    wait, archer mobs suffer the melee damage nerfing too? i guess i never really tried that out, i just always assumed that was a players-only problem. thought it WOULD explain why my glacial walker came so much nearer to killing khewy than my eldergoth did...
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  • Sevryn - Lost City
    Sevryn - Lost City Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    FuzzyWuzz wrote: »
    Thus far the new earthguard do look promising, however, Fuzzy wonders if we should save the "OP new class" discussion until after their skill tree is actually complete? b:surrender

    Finally, someone who stopped to think some common sense b:chuckleb:thanks
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  • Dimitrik - Dreamweaver
    Dimitrik - Dreamweaver Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Anyone else completely sick of these threads? This is like gradeschool levels of maturity. Remember when a new kid hits the school? They get a lot of attention, and all the popular kids go, "Hmph! He/she's not so cool!"

    Srsly.

    As for overpowered'ness, Fuzzy's right. The skill trees aren't even done. But since you feel the need to jump the gun and throw the dreaded "OP" label on it already, let's take a look at it.

    What is a Seeker? Frankly, for all intents and purposes, it looks kind'a like a watered down sword Blademaster with a slight twist. Sword Blademasters are honestly better at tanking, because they have access to two stuns, two ranged attacks, a potent party-wide buff, self-healing, and debuffing. Heck, I'm probably even forgetting a benefit or two. (EDIT: I totally was forgetting the three AoE's, including one of the stuns. Knew I'd remember. :D)

    A Seeker has some debuffs, a 30% chance to have a chance (not a typo) to inflict greater damage, and... that's where the comparison ends. The better tank is a Blademaster, hands down. DDing isn't even in the question, since if you want to DD as a Blademaster, most everyone will scream for fists/claws. However, Seekers are a heavy armor class with access to magic attacks. This means they can kill other heavy armor classes (you know, the ones deficient in magic defense?) with relative finesse.

    THAT is their strength. Bringing physical defense with both physical and magic offense. That said, the mirage celestone thing you pointed out is a flaw in the class, not a merit. Casting a fifteen minute buff (I believe it is) is not worth 10 grand to me.

    Now, does that seem overpowered to you?

    As for Mystics... can I just ask you why you're not whining over Venomancers? I mean, really. They have a lot in common. Except Venomancers are still more overpowered than Mystics in their pet variety, self-sufficiency, and practical invulnerability to melee classes.

    Now look, you made me write a novel just to point out how stupid this is. Hope you're proud.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Seeker tanking delta at 85? BS.

    Lol! With a Sin's bloodpaint, it was a breaze. We even lost aura quests early on. Carry on though. b:chuckle
    Dimitrik wrote:
    Sword Blademasters are honestly better at tanking, because they have access to two stuns, two ranged attacks, a potent party-wide buff, self-healing, and debuffing.

    What do stuns, ranged attacks, buffs and debuffs have to do with tanking? There's only obscure bosses like Harpy Wraith that could make a difference. Other than that, it's about the ability to keep aggro these days, and I saw a Lv. 85 Seeker with a mere +2 weapon with aggro over a Lv.100 BM in Delta. The only way I would have kept aggro from him is if I were to drop my pdef and HP significantly.
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  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Post proof then.
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  • flamingahole
    flamingahole Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    safyres wrote: »
    Does anyone else who is NOT currently playing a seeker/mystic (and therefore enjoying the awesome overpoweredness) think these classes are WAY too powerful? AND I've been seeing complaints about needing mirage celestones, etc for a COUPLE of their skills/spells....because they're not stupidly powerful enough already? Let's make it better?
    Anyone else think a nerf HAS to be incoming? Share your thoughts!

    I have a question for you, have you played either of the new classes? Perhaps you should reserve judgment on how OP they are for when two things happen:

    1- All their skills come out.
    2- You actually play one to a level worth mentioning.

    Until both are met, any input you may have on either class will be rendered invalid. Have a nice day. b:bye
    You have three chances to guess the reason for the post above.
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    You're all a bunch of idiots.

    There's no real way to tell if they're overpowered or not until someone hits 10x, gets their endgame gear and starts refining.

    The seeker has a moving zhen and can steal an enemies positive buffs. Sounds like the class has potential. Talk about not needing to be buffed for PK if you can just find someone's buffs to steal.

    So, the moral of the story is... wait for someone to get a +10 (or better) nirvana or rank 9 weapon with end game armor and refines with most of their lvl 11 skills before saying something is OP or not. Everyone knows end-game balance is the only thing that really matters.

    b:bye
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  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    You're all a bunch of idiots.

    The most idiotic part of your post.
    There's no real way to tell if they're overpowered or not until someone hits 10x, gets their endgame gear and starts refining.

    If they're OP at 85 compared to other classes at 100+; then who's the idiot?
    The seeker has a moving zhen and can steal an enemies positive buffs. Sounds like the class has potential. Talk about not needing to be buffed for PK if you can just find someone's buffs to steal.

    So, the moral of the story is... wait for someone to get a +10 (or better) nirvana or rank 9 weapon with end game armor and refines with most of their lvl 11 skills before saying something is OP or not. Everyone knows end-game balance is the only thing that really matters.

    b:bye

    -Should have stuck with just this.
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  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    tweakz wrote: »
    The most idiotic part of your post.



    If they're OP at 85 compared to other classes at 100+; then who's the idiot?



    -Should have stuck with just this.

    You are a moron. Everyone here knows it. You're like yulk but different.

    /thread
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  • Mendy__ - Sanctuary
    Mendy__ - Sanctuary Posts: 149 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    ... can steal an enemies positive buffs. Sounds like the class has potential. Talk about not needing to be buffed for PK if you can just find someone's buffs to steal.

    :O what is this skill?

    or did you mean...

    Quid Pro Quo Level 10
    Range 20 meters
    Mana 300
    Channel 0.5 seconds
    Cast 0.7 seconds
    Cooldown 60 seconds
    Weapon Blade or Sword

    Requisite Cultivation Transcendent

    Transfers up to 10 of your debuffs to the target and
    silences your target for 1 seconds.

    ps. ilu and miss you <3 hehe
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Mendy__ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    :O what is this skill?

    or did you mean...

    Quid Pro Quo Level 10
    Range 20 meters
    Mana 300
    Channel 0.5 seconds
    Cast 0.7 seconds
    Cooldown 60 seconds
    Weapon Blade or Sword

    Requisite Cultivation Transcendent

    Transfers up to 10 of your debuffs to the target and
    silences your target for 1 seconds.

    ps. ilu and miss you <3 hehe

    Oh, I dunno, cheze was talking about it in guild chat, I wasn't paying too much attention either. lol I think it's one of the lvl 11 skills he was talking about. He does tend to know what he's talking about so I didn't question him on it.

    I love you too... and I miss you more <333

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  • Mendy__ - Sanctuary
    Mendy__ - Sanctuary Posts: 149 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    Oh, I dunno, cheze was talking about it in guild chat, I wasn't paying too much attention either. lol I think it's one of the lvl 11 skills he was talking about. He does tend to know what he's talking about so I didn't question him on it.

    I love you too... and I miss you more <333

    b:kiss

    b:chuckle he probably just didnt use the right words to describe it lol


    b:kiss
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    Oh, I dunno, cheze was talking about it in guild chat, I wasn't paying too much attention either. lol I think it's one of the lvl 11 skills he was talking about. He does tend to know what he's talking about so I didn't question him on it.

    I love you too... and I miss you more <333

    b:kiss

    So you're entering this thread not knowing what you're going on about yet criticizing others for the same thing at the same time?

    stpid trll
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  • LenieClarke - Heavens Tear
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,275 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    the "steal a positive buff" thing is supposedly something you get with level-11 quid pro quo, i forget if it was demon or sage. source of this is somebody (Mooy?) translating level-11 earthguard skill descriptions off the PW-CN forums, so take that for what it's worth.
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  • Mendy__ - Sanctuary
    Mendy__ - Sanctuary Posts: 149 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    tweakz wrote: »
    So you're entering this thread not knowing what you're going on about yet criticizing others for the same thing at the same time?

    stpid trll

    not having the correct information is different than having no information (at least in my opinion) - michael might have been misinformed on that skill BUT the points that he makes are still valid :/ meh.. just sayin
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    the "steal a positive buff" thing is supposedly something you get with level-11 quid pro quo, i forget if it was demon or sage. source of this is somebody (Mooy?) translating level-11 earthguard skill descriptions off the PW-CN forums, so take that for what it's worth.

    omg i hope so ><<<
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    tweakz wrote: »
    So you're entering this thread not knowing what you're going on about yet criticizing others for the same thing at the same time?

    stpid trll

    You're whining about 8x balance. 8x-9x takes what, a week, maybe two? Talk about pointless. You're crying about game balance in a temporary or passing phase. At the speed that PW allows you to level, 8x game balance is a non-factor. You sound like yulk complaining.

    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    the "steal a positive buff" thing is supposedly something you get with level-11 quid pro quo, i forget if it was demon or sage. source of this is somebody (Mooy?) translating level-11 earthguard skill descriptions off the PW-CN forums, so take that for what it's worth.

    I think it is sage... It was mentioned, I just didn't pay that close attention.
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  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    You're whining about 8x balance. 8x-9x takes what, a week, maybe two? Talk about pointless. You're crying about game balance in a temporary or passing phase.

    No crying here, but you are trolling as usual.
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  • Sthenith - Dreamweaver
    Sthenith - Dreamweaver Posts: 207 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I'm personally playing a sin (99) cleric (95), Psy (75), and a couple of other lower lvl classes like BM(s) and archer. Now i've started a seeker.

    Going with my experience of other classes, seekers are not over or underpowered at all. It all depends on your playstyle, your gear and your goals.

    While sins are/were considered to be OP, for various reasons like APS and BP , you could say the same about psy's with their high damages and their soul skills, much like veno's used to be with herc's and nix's.

    There are a LOT of mystics and seekers currently being played, but i wonder how many of those toons will actually end up being leveled to nearly endgame gear and lvl. Because it's only then you can say if a class is worth playing.

    I'm not talking about oracled or hypered toons but toons with ALL their skills & books available, and played by people who have "experience" on those toons and know what the hell they're doing.

    And by "experience" i mean doing BH's (a lot) doing TT's (a lot more) and getting into ANY instance besides FC more then 1x. Because how many seekers or mystics have done warsong ? How many Lunar ? How many did 20+ BH 51/59/69/79/89.....?

    It's only if you KNOW what your toon can do and how you need to handle all the diff mobs/bosses/...etc, that you can state if a toon is OP or not.

    And unless you're on a pvp server where you want to get to 100+ asap, the main part of the game is in the instances and quests.

    I have yet to squad with a seeker or mystic in an fc, so i really have no clue how well/bad they are in this instance. And i know i'd hate to go into a bh69 (freakin pole :s) without knowing what a seeker or mystic can bring to the table, esp when i'm on my cleric.

    Give it a few months and we'll see IF one of those classes is worth all the QQing.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I think Demon Quid Pro Quo is rumored to be able to steal positive buffs.

    Depending on how it is implemented it could be one of the most broken things in the game (at least for PVE).

    Just log on your wiz alt and steal Stone Barrier, then log on your Mystic and steal Verdant Shell, then log your sin and steal Chill of the Deep / stealth. Steal all the other epic long-lasting self buffs in the game and go solo Harpy.
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  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I'd like to see a seeker steal true form lol.
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  • Fleuri - Sanctuary
    Fleuri - Sanctuary Posts: 1,763 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Belgare - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yea, that's the truth. On my Seeker there is no damn way I can hold a kill if a mystic decides he or she will KS me as if I'm invisible.

    Once you have done half damage to your target, you cannot be KS'd.

    And if you cannot do half damage on a quest monster before the mystic launches an absorb soul, that would be because you are trying to KS the mystic. (If you have a halfway decent weapon, and leveled skills, you have a good chance of getting your target below half health in 1.2 seconds, though of course that's not the most efficient way of fighting.)
  • ElderSig - Dreamweaver
    ElderSig - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,247 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I think Demon Quid Pro Quo is rumored to be able to steal positive buffs.

    Depending on how it is implemented it could be one of the most broken things in the game (at least for PVE).

    Just log on your wiz alt and steal Stone Barrier, then log on your Mystic and steal Verdant Shell, then log your sin and steal Chill of the Deep / stealth. Steal all the other epic long-lasting self buffs in the game and go solo Harpy.

    I would imagine it would be unable to steal self-buffs, only squad buffs.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Escorian - Dreamweaver
    Escorian - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,802 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    tweakz wrote: »
    Lol! With a Sin's bloodpaint, it was a breaze. We even lost aura quests early on. Carry on though. b:chuckle



    What do stuns, ranged attacks, buffs and debuffs have to do with tanking? There's only obscure bosses like Harpy Wraith that could make a difference. Other than that, it's about the ability to keep aggro these days, and I saw a Lv. 85 Seeker with a mere +2 weapon with aggro over a Lv.100 BM in Delta. The only way I would have kept aggro from him is if I were to drop my pdef and HP significantly.

    lol this is pure bs here point blank a level 85 cant go into rb delta they can only get into delta.
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    ty Nowitsawn

    Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Escorian - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    lol this is pure bs here point blank a level 85 cant go into rb delta they can only get into delta.

    I'm not sure what you are trying to say but you can enter both gamma and delta at level 85.
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  • Haza - Heavens Tear
    Haza - Heavens Tear Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I'd like to see a seeker steal true form lol.

    That would be one seriously deformed animal..plus i doubt Devs would be asked to create a new design for that..
  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I think Demon Quid Pro Quo is rumored to be able to steal positive buffs.

    Depending on how it is implemented it could be one of the most broken things in the game (at least for PVE).

    Just log on your wiz alt and steal Stone Barrier, then log on your Mystic and steal Verdant Shell, then log your sin and steal Chill of the Deep / stealth. Steal all the other epic long-lasting self buffs in the game and go solo Harpy.

    Even if it was able to steal buffs, I don't think you could steal self-buffs like Stone Barrier and Chill of the Deep, but the normal squad buffs.

    Even so, it'd still be insane: You get some of their buffs while putting your debuffs on them. It'd be similar to Soul of Retaliation, just that you can transfer existing debuffs to a new target, not to mention getting their buffs as well.

    In terms of PvP, if you could actually "steal" buffs that you already have, it'd be like having an extremely broken purge at your disposal: Debuff the Seeker and you get the debuff AND get purged. And silenced.
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  • Escorian - Dreamweaver
    Escorian - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,802 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Even if it was able to steal buffs, I don't think you could steal self-buffs like Stone Barrier and Chill of the Deep, but the normal squad buffs.

    Even so, it'd still be insane: You get some of their buffs while putting your debuffs on them. It'd be similar to Soul of Retaliation, just that you can transfer existing debuffs to a new target, not to mention getting their buffs as well.

    In terms of PvP, if you could actually "steal" buffs that you already have, it'd be like having an extremely broken purge at your disposal: Debuff the Seeker and you get the debuff AND get purged. And silenced.

    yeah but the cooldown on it is extremely long. 168 seconds.
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    ty Nowitsawn

    Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.

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