State of the Game - DQ Price
Comments
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skyraiserdm wrote: »nearly 4 month gone... still no solution... come on and unpin the thread
b:bye
Last I remember they were talking about what they wanted to do to compensate for this since this version does not have any/as many gold farmers as china does. 4 Months of debate and we get no word of how it is going, I haven't been around all 4 months but I take a guess that they haven't even hinted that their still talking about it right?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
skyraiserdm wrote: »Non-Venomancer needs repair ~50.000 / hour and also the incoming is less because they need breaks for meditation or potions
Yes, this is true. I only did this test to bring some real numbers into the discussion. I have 2 characters: an average-geared veno and a very overpowered dd cleric. To conduct the test on the cleric would have been even more unfair, in my opinion.
As a side note, I didn't use any pots during this test. I was grinding at a medium speed in order to time my soul transfuse / meta boost / nature's grace, and thus maximizing efficiency in the (time+cost) vs. (earnings+repair) equation. I think my repairs for this hour were about 10k, maybe a little less.
I'd be curious to see others' results repeating this same experiment. Also intersting to note that with a 20% increase in (npc'd) dq items, I would have netted another 50k or so.
b:victory0 -
Allynna_ - Dreamweaver wrote: »Also, tbh recently the drop rates seem to be a lot lower for DQ items then when I started playing a few months ago . . .
This statement is correct to a certain extent, but the causality is misconstrued. Higher level mobs simply have a gradually lower & lower drop rate on DQ items. So if you remained the same level for months & months you would not have noticed any lower drop rate. The drop rates havent been changed since the inception of the game, its just the rate is lower as you level higher, thereby perceiving a game nerf.0 -
Darksylph - Heavens Tear wrote: »This statement is correct to a certain extent, but the causality is misconstrued. Higher level mobs simply have a gradually lower & lower drop rate on DQ items. So if you remained the same level for months & months you would not have noticed any lower drop rate. The drop rates havent been changed since the inception of the game, its just the rate is lower as you level higher, thereby perceiving a game nerf.
Who knows. Maybe dropping rate was nerfed but quietly is some of these endless patches. Because we never know what is in this small patches.I stopped to trust them looong time ago.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
50k/hr seems rather excessive. Repairing the entire TT90 armor set from zero durability is only about 100k, while the weapon is 60k. Ornaments are another ~100k. So if your repair costs are 50k/hr, it's basically impossible for you to play more than a few hours without having equipment break. Maybe if you're a 5 APS build that's the case. But most regular builds should be able to go a couple days between repairs. Definitely more than a full night's play without having equipment break.skyraiserdm wrote: »Non-Venomancer needs repair ~50.000 / hour and also the incoming is less because they need breaks for meditation or potions
Also, last time I tested this in my 80s (granted pre-DQ nerf) I could hit about 300k/hr in loot (if you aren't getting near that, you need to find a better spot or rethink how you're doing it - even my level 30 cleric could hit 200k/hr gross). If you figure after nerf and repairs this is down to 240k/hr, that's 4000 coin per minute. If you take a minute to sit to regen hp or mp, you're losing 4000 coin. You are almost always better off using regen powders and pots instead of "taking a break."
For mp in particular, herb yuanxiao only costs about 600 coin to make with current token prices and will fill about 50%-80% of most non-wiz caster MP bars. You shouldn't even be using the high level mp pots you get as loot. You should be selling them to NPCs and using the money to buy tokens to make yuanxiao (L90 mana pot sells to NPCs for 1280 coin and only gives you 2350 mp, more than enough to pay for 2x herb yaunxiao which will give you 10k mp).0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »Who knows. Maybe dropping rate was nerfed but quietly is some of these endless patches. Because we never know what is in this small patches.I stopped to trust them looong time ago.
I haven't moved area for a good few months now, having only made one level in that time. For consistent comparisons, doing one man army quests on my barb, the rate of DQ drops has dropped from 8-12 per one man army cycle down to between 5 and 7 DQ drops. With the odd HP/MP potion (roughly 5 or 6 per cycle) and an equipment drop (plus a lucky box if fortune is with me), I'd make a net gain after repairs of circa 10k now. Sometimes the gain is as low as 3k. It could be that the 1 level gained has made the difference but I have recently tackled lower level mobs and gained the same ratio of drops per kill quota.0 -
Roseary - Sanctuary wrote: »Last I remember they were talking about what they wanted to do to compensate for this since this version does not have any/as many gold farmers as china does. 4 Months of debate and we get no word of how it is going, I haven't been around all 4 months but I take a guess that they haven't even hinted that their still talking about it right?
I'll agree, 4 months + and they didn't do anything. I quess every 1 month write a GM '' we working on it ''. I'll have check they new game '' Heroes of Three Kingdoms '', and belive it or not, you can read in forum the same things as here. '' How to make ingame coins , and terrible drop rates''. The game should be actaully funny, but needless to say that almost noone playing it. As far i have read this, i didnt download the game because i know how ridiculous money sink have get PWI and they new product(s) dosn't look nothing better as PWI.0 -
Svarius - Heavens Tear wrote: »Oh stuff it, tweakz. In the ~2 years I've been playing I have never seen above 1k coin from a mob, and I pick up every damn thing that drops, even ammunition for christsakes.
You're level 24 dummy.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
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Darksylph - Heavens Tear wrote: »This statement is correct to a certain extent, but the causality is misconstrued. Higher level mobs simply have a gradually lower & lower drop rate on DQ items. So if you remained the same level for months & months you would not have noticed any lower drop rate. The drop rates havent been changed since the inception of the game, its just the rate is lower as you level higher, thereby perceiving a game nerf.
I do realize that at higher levels drops do seem to decrease in value, but I sometimes go and play alts, and then the next day play one of my higher level characters. Leveling my 2x-3x chars I seem to get less DQ items in drops, then when I leveled my 1st 2 chars 3-4 months ago. I'd say on 6x mobs (with 6x char) I'm getting almost as many DQ items drops than on 2x mobs (with 2x char).
Or maybe the 20% decrease it item value has really impacted the grinding profit at lower levels. . .0 -
-beating a dead horse-
So, how about that DQ price compensation, heh b:bye0 -
Mraochan - Lost City wrote: »-beating a dead horse-
So, how about that DQ price compensation, heh b:bye
*2 years later*
frankieraye: It's still being worked on.0 -
Did yopu really expected something better from a company such as PWI????
5 months later and nothing is done yet.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks Brit for the sig b:laugh0 -
They're too busy thinking of stuff to put in the boutique for sales every week. From the look of on going sales, they're going to be throwing in the kitchen sink pretty soon as well. +12 kitchen sink - improved drainage, never clogs, guaranteed 2 sockets to drain water faster. +10000 - 20000 physical damage if thrown at your enemy. +100% reduced damage if worn as a helmet.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6J9LLe2Jlg<- One of my best loved piece of trance track0 -
Blancheneige - Heavens Tear wrote: »Did yopu really expected something better from a company such as PWI????
5 months later and nothing is done yet.
You've been here from the start Blanche (going by your forum join date)...
Remember the first year when it really felt like the game was growing and improving? More people starting to play all the time, few people leaving, most improvements were positive... The first Jolly event was awesome. The fastest way to level was zhenning with training scrolls. The drama and complaints in the forums were minimal because people were actually playing the game more. The additions to the cash shop were fair and decent, and spread out over a reasonable period of time. I could go on and on for hours.
They stick us with this price drop in dq items as a result of the farming problems in CN... where they're allowed to multi-client... no wonder they have a problem. They also have offline gold trading and no rules against selling your char or items for real money. It might as well be a different game entirely. Then they change the UI that nobody was complaining about in the first place, nerf TW and nearly all the end-game goals... It's all been said before.
I honestly wonder how they conclude these changes are for the better. I know they must rationalize it somehow... I have a scientific mind, I want facts and numbers. Cold hard facts are the only thing I care about when it comes to solving problems because they're the only thing that matter. Is it just to make money off the new people that don't know any better? Speculation is great, but only goes so far before some facts are needed.
Here in the forums we have some intelligent people who care. They count ToBL's over a period of time and try to speculate on how much coin they interject into the economy. They grind for an hour to find the actual ratio of drops. They even offer to fix the buggy code! They come here complaining, but caring, and trying to help. If they didn't care they'd just quit and walk away.
And what responses do they get? As you pointed out, 5 months later and nothing. Or, we're being punished for what might happen based on a different version that might as well be a completely different game. It all seems very unfair. No cold hard facts, no real numbers, just vague responses about how it's still being worked on.
I did expect better. I was raised to believe that in a business, one unhappy customer does more harm than 1000 happy customers do good. In my experience I've seen this to be true. For the record, I've had plenty of positive business experience both as a manager and as a self-employed entrepreneur/owner where I grew and expanded businesses to be better and more profitable. It really just boggles the mind and defies any conventional logic that I'm familiar with.
TL;DR~ My morning rant, nothing new b:surrender0 -
Well.....we still got X-Mas coming. <_<
But in all seriousness, you guys can't even tell us possible ideas of what compensation might be?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
b:flowerHave a Techno Rave Flower!b:flower
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-Master of Coffee-0 -
Knownase - Heavens Tear wrote: »Well.....we still got X-Mas coming. <_<
But in all seriousness, you guys can't even tell us possible ideas of what compensation might be?
In case they already are implementing it, they won't tell us anything. If they manage to bring out some kind of compensation, I'm going to thank them. Either they: a) asked the patch team to code it, b) hired their own team for it or c) begged the dev's to make it.
I have a feeling our version will get DQ-type thing that will be worth something and will be dropped from all of the mobs that drop DQ.100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.0 -
this is getting annoying i make more $ during 20 min playing lvl 20-30 chars than i aoe grinding on my lvl 82 barb for an hour. the repair costs are killing me after the dq price drop.
i have to grind for 45 min to make about 70k and then about 45k goes to repairs.
on on ceratin mobs i even net a net LOSS while grinding becuase of repairs.
this is absurd.
ive had to start playing my alts just so i can afford to pay repairs and tele fee's on my main.
FC costs me about 70k each run. (35k with a non fail sqaud)
i cant even afford my skills let alone the items i need.Killing level 80's with a lvl 60 is a lot more fun than killing level 90's with a level 100.0 -
Furries - Dreamweaver wrote: »this is getting annoying i make more $ during 20 min playing lvl 20-30 chars than i aoe grinding on my lvl 82 barb for an hour. the repair costs are killing me after the dq price drop.
i have to grind for 45 min to make about 70k and then about 45k goes to repairs.
on on ceratin mobs i even net a net LOSS while grinding becuase of repairs.
this is absurd.
ive had to start playing my alts just so i can afford to pay repairs and tele fee's on my main.
FC costs me about 70k each run. (35k with a non fail sqaud)
i cant even afford my skills let alone the items i need.
I haven't had that problem grinding on my barb. He makes a decent amount of coins more than he spends.Main characters
Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
Sage Barbarian Malego - 910 -
Mraochan - Lost City wrote: »You've been here from the start Blanche (going by your forum join date)...
Remember the first year when it really felt like the game was growing and improving? More people starting to play all the time, few people leaving, most improvements were positive... The first Jolly event was awesome. The fastest way to level was zhenning with training scrolls. The drama and complaints in the forums were minimal because people were actually playing the game more. The additions to the cash shop were fair and decent, and spread out over a reasonable period of time. I could go on and on for hours.
They stick us with this price drop in dq items as a result of the farming problems in CN... where they're allowed to multi-client... no wonder they have a problem. They also have offline gold trading and no rules against selling your char or items for real money. It might as well be a different game entirely. Then they change the UI that nobody was complaining about in the first place, nerf TW and nearly all the end-game goals... It's all been said before.
I honestly wonder how they conclude these changes are for the better. I know they must rationalize it somehow... I have a scientific mind, I want facts and numbers. Cold hard facts are the only thing I care about when it comes to solving problems because they're the only thing that matter. Is it just to make money off the new people that don't know any better? Speculation is great, but only goes so far before some facts are needed.
Here in the forums we have some intelligent people who care. They count ToBL's over a period of time and try to speculate on how much coin they interject into the economy. They grind for an hour to find the actual ratio of drops. They even offer to fix the buggy code! They come here complaining, but caring, and trying to help. If they didn't care they'd just quit and walk away.
And what responses do they get? As you pointed out, 5 months later and nothing. Or, we're being punished for what might happen based on a different version that might as well be a completely different game. It all seems very unfair. No cold hard facts, no real numbers, just vague responses about how it's still being worked on.
I did expect better. I was raised to believe that in a business, one unhappy customer does more harm than 1000 happy customers do good. In my experience I've seen this to be true. For the record, I've had plenty of positive business experience both as a manager and as a self-employed entrepreneur/owner where I grew and expanded businesses to be better and more profitable. It really just boggles the mind and defies any conventional logic that I'm familiar with.
TL;DR~ My morning rant, nothing new b:surrender
welcome to communist china.....ijs0 -
Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »I haven't had that problem grinding on my barb. He makes a decent amount of coins more than he spends.
Yep, people like to blame game instead of their fail build.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
Ty for the update Frankie
IMO when something takes so long, has I remember reading that there was going to be some data compilation on this mod. I don't think the DEV can base new codding to prevent Farming gold just base on 1 month of data. It's been 4 month now and there probably looking at that data right now, and are trying to figure out how they can stop this money inflation.
I also bet they are comparing world wide data to see how this change affect each market. And to see if this mod will be enough to prevent the same thing to happen here in America.
The lack of information to this problem indicate 2 obvious answer. They are or are not doing something about it.
All we need to do is keep the pressure to make sure this does not goes in a crack. In a polite way pls ![SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
K so I came back to PWi for old good times and what do I see...Makes me wonder.b:dirty0
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Hey I remember you from cleric forums!0
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Furries - Dreamweaver wrote: »this is getting annoying i make more $ during 20 min playing lvl 20-30 chars than i aoe grinding on my lvl 82 barb for an hour. the repair costs are killing me after the dq price drop.
i have to grind for 45 min to make about 70k and then about 45k goes to repairs.
on on ceratin mobs i even net a net LOSS while grinding becuase of repairs.
this is absurd.
ive had to start playing my alts just so i can afford to pay repairs and tele fee's on my main.
FC costs me about 70k each run. (35k with a non fail sqaud)
i cant even afford my skills let alone the items i need.Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »I haven't had that problem grinding on my barb. He makes a decent amount of coins more than he spends.
Certain mobs definitely make a difference. I understand about how you say on some you could make a net loss, considering what I experienced the other day on my cleric. A quest for Nivastok Braves; 90+ mobs later, I had 20k in DQ items and 9k in miscellaneous to sell. Not a lot in coins either, as half of them dropped nothing. And 9k repairs. These mobs were 2 levels above me.
Understandable that it is going to be frustrating if you are quest grinding, and have no choice in the mob. But with regular grinding, sometimes what you have to do is search around and test some out. Despite being a level below me I had more luck with the Shieldbearer version when I did that quest (still a laughable amount of coinage but more luck). It seems that some just drop more than others.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Annalyse (veno) - Melosa (cleric) - Glynneth (archer) - Pickerel (sin)
Florafang (wiz) - RubixCube (barb) - Laravell (psy) - Diviah (Mystic)
Torchwood (BM) - Sataea (Seeker) - Wystera (Sin) - Allissere (SB)
Looking for a mature faction on HT? pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=7608420 -
Rillien - Heavens Tear wrote: »Hey I remember you from cleric forums!
b:avoid
It's not me xD
Any ways so I am guessing that AoE grinding will bring me like nothing?
I still remember that I used to get like ~125k-185k in dq per hour on my level.
Didn't try it now cause more likely is that I will die since it has been a while that I done it.
But just a question: Out of 20mobs whats the DQ drop rate now?
Silly aint Ib:surrenderb:dirty0 -
Nelae - Heavens Tear wrote: »b:avoid
It's not me xD
Any ways so I am guessing that AoE grinding will bring me like nothing?
I still remember that I used to get like ~125k-185k in dq per hour on my level.
Didn't try it now cause more likely is that I will die since it has been a while that I done it.
But just a question: Out of 20mobs whats the DQ drop rate now?
Silly aint Ib:surrender
I make around 250k per hour (minus repairs, 50k max) on Nightscream so I'd say a cleric would make more on poison mobs.100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.0 -
Still being worked on, thank you for all your patience
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Can we have some proof that this is being worked on?frankieraye wrote: »Still being worked on, thank you for all your patience
These messages looks more and more like PWI is only trying to calm down people while nothing is apparently being done about it...[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks Brit for the sig b:laugh0
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