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OneHottShot - Heavens Tear · May 2010

Rumble - Harshlands wrote: »

This is just one of many cases where the GMs and devs have absolutely no concept of the gaming community, how it works, how people play, etc. They are completely out of touch and the only thing they understand is Anniversary/Coral/Tiger/Whatever Packs.

So how long is this list. I don't know. Let me start it off:

1) This new daily quest - No one in their right mind would pay that much in game coin for that little experience and spirit. Anyone who actually played the game would know this. Hence my assertion they are completely out of touch. In principal it is an interesting idea for a coin sink, but poorly executed. Also the community is in an uproar of how easy it is to level as it is and how bored people are with doing only Dailies. So they introduce another daily. Well played. How about making higher level quests give more appropriate exp, spirit and rewards instead. That way people will actually quest at higher levels.

2) Chest of Coins rewards for FC. I mean how lame is that? I'm sure the Devs can look at records and tables to see how many people in the history of the game have ever bought or used a hammer to open one of these. Instead they keep a worthless item implemented where they could easily swap it out for a more meaningful reward or change the chest to make it more like a cube chest or lower the price of hammers.

3) Some of the exchanges for Tokens of Best Luck are ridiculous. Given that 2 of them equals 10 million coin you would think they could do the math to see what some of the rewards should cost in terms of tokens needed.

4) One GM asked about meaningful gifts as part of events and suggested Hay as a good idea. Hay? I won't name the GM because perhaps it was an honest mistake, but talk about out of touch with player wants/needs.

5) Reducing the number of mirages for decomp of gears? Making some 3 stars produce zero? They claim its because of issues on other versions of PW but lets be honest here. Its so they can introduce packs that have mirages so we need them.

6) Every skill or piece of gear (weapon or armor) that is absolutely useless for the class it's designed for. I.e. magic rings with accuracy. Has anyone ever played the game that designs it.

7) The new refine transfer stones that require well more stones then it's worth to just start from scratch. The only use they have is in Nirvana so why make them anything but.

8) The cost of wines to buy directly. Not even close to the cost of wines in game. anyone that played would know this.

9) <Insert your fail event/implementation/change here>

It just goes to show that the people who implement changes have no idea about the game itself and the community and seem not to care. They just want to push their sales out. Now don't get me wrong (Don't you EVER get me wrong!!!!!!!!) I understand they need to make money and I can appreciate that. In fact I want them to be profitable so they can continue developing he game and adding to it. However they would get more money if they listened to the player base and truly understood what was going on and made meaningful and desired changes. (i.e. fix old bugs). A happy customer (player base) is a paying customer (player base) is the mantra of most service industries. At least the successful ones.

Cheers

Your list isn't near long enough, but thats a very good start. I'm still waiting a year later for barrage of arrows to work right, as well as many other things in the game.

Its sad that after an overwhelming response on a thread that frankie closed about the DQ drops they went ahead and did it. Maybe they had to but...

We all begged them NOT to make the "compensation" 2x. They don't listen. They lose players for it. Maybe they aren't concerned because for each 1 of us who quits another joins.

The sad thing is.. I've been playing this game since Dec. 2008 and I know how great it used to be. People who joined a year later have no idea what awesomeness this game used to entail. No idea what it was like to have 89k gold and the Daevas being the coolest sword you could buy in game. I'm out there loving the new stuff too but they have beat the game down and made it a junkpile of unforetold greed.

I miss the old PWI .. may she rest in pieces because peace just isn't happening. I never though this game would come to this... but much like the real world, its gone to **** all in the sake and name of the enemy.... PROGRESS>

Alumin - Sanctuary · May 2010

ouch, that sucks big time, first lowering the DQ drop prices, & a new daily not worth the coins, pwi is starting to suck big time. at least finish the game than ruin it. jeez..

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear · May 2010

Nahktuul - Archosaur wrote: »

I dont do mini-bosses for income. I do them to insure my faction's future. Something you wouldnt know much about. Right?

Why dont you charge up some coin from your daddie's mastercard and try the daily out for me, Ascii? Let me know what you get.

If your fraction is surviving off mini-bosses' drops... then your fraction is already doomed.

drjiggle · May 2010

OneHottShot - Heavens Tear wrote: »

We all begged them NOT to make the "compensation" 2x. They don't listen. They lose players for it. Maybe they aren't concerned because for each 1 of us who quits another joins.

I don't think anyone has claimed that the 2x experience is meant to be the compensation for the DQ price drop. My impression was that whatever that turns out to be, we won't be seeing it for a while until they implement it. Also, I would expect that whatever it is needs to be a permanent change in order to be any kind of legitimate compensation.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

If your fraction is surviving off mini-bosses' drops... then your fraction is already doomed.

My fraction is 22 7ths.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · May 2010

It is likely this quest is designed for the Chinese PW economy. As I understand it, due to so many farming bots there is so much coin that gold there costs like 1.4m each.

KrittyCat - Dreamweaver · May 2010

So they **** us up even more because of the Chinese version? I say that PWI needs to negotiate seperate development rights and tailor the game more to the needs of us here in the U.S. That is (quite possibly) the 3rd thing in the last few patches that is meant to balance the Chinese game and ends up **** us up here...lovely... -_-

NightRage - Raging Tide · May 2010

1.45 mil spent on the ****.

1 hour spent grinding for Compund Venom and Mystical Orbs and talking to NPCs.

Return: 145K EXP
Super-Duper Mystery Box: Fantasy Fruit. 5K EXP. (90+ Box)
Normal Mystery Box: Gave me nothing.

This is so garbage it was almost funny.

WTS> My Services to PWE. They could use somebody that actually knows the game.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · May 2010

KrittyCat - Dreamweaver wrote: »

So they **** us up even more because of the Chinese version? I say that PWI needs to negotiate seperate development rights and tailor the game more to the needs of us here in the U.S. That is (quite possibly) the 3rd thing in the last few patches that is meant to balance the Chinese game and ends up **** us up here...lovely... -_-

I'm just guessing the crazy stupid Chinese PW economy is to blame but it does seem to make sense.

Pervera - Lost City · May 2010

KrittyCat - Dreamweaver wrote: »

So they **** us up even more because of the Chinese version? I say that PWI needs to negotiate seperate development rights and tailor the game more to the needs of us here in the U.S. That is (quite possibly) the 3rd thing in the last few patches that is meant to balance the Chinese game and ends up **** us up here...lovely... -_-

It sounds quite funny cause any developer thats actually aware of what he's doing will have drop/pricing list in an separate config file thats easy to modify without ****** with code. IMHO an average GM have to know how to mod this so for me thats a greed covered by bunch of lies.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary · May 2010

Anyone else thought that this is the compensation?

Yindra - Sanctuary · May 2010

BladedZero - Sanctuary wrote: »

it's the developers fault, not the license holders

Sorry, but THAT is an extremely popular, but equally STUPID excuse.

License holders pay money for their licenses, and this isn't an off-the-shelf product that's licensed to millions of customers for a few bucks a piece.

Which means they either get an incredibly cheap license, or they are bound to have a phone number they can call --- with someone at the other end who actually listens and is open to discussion.

After all, licenses are just like other products --- if you don't like them you cancel them. So it's not like the development company can do anything they want, if they want to keep their licencees around.

Since PWI is still up and running, there's two options: either PWI has talked with the chinese guys, and they agreed on what has been done. Or they didn't talk because they liked it anyway.

It's also a favorite excuse for not fixing bugs. "It's not our fault! The developers have to fix this, and they are in a different company!". Yeah sure. Call them. Kick their lazy butts. YOU are paying them. Consider paying less. Did you really sign a contract that lets the other party do as they please?

Point is, cash shop sales don't hurt PWI. Not fixing bugs doesn't hurt them. "The developers" are just a convenient way to tell their customers (i.e. us) to shut tf up.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary · May 2010

Yindra - Sanctuary wrote: »

It's also a favorite excuse for not fixing bugs. "It's not our fault! The developers have to fix this, and they are in a different company!". Yeah sure. Call them. Kick their lazy butts. YOU are paying them. Consider paying less. Did you really sign a contract that lets the other party do as they please?

You got it a bit wrong. PWE is not paying PW Beijing anything. The mother company in China hired the GMs, management people, everything. If this game was licensed, then the PWE would be paying something for the license. No license, no payment.

Think it like this: one dude starts a company. He hires me. Then I come to his office saying that he's doing it all wrong and I want changes. It just doesn't work.

SerenityMare - Dreamweaver · May 2010

Players: we want another event!

Devs: Ok! Here is another daily! b:victory

*facepalm*

Ephemerai - Sanctuary · May 2010

two entirely separate 'games' with two entirely different economies [pw-china and pwi] should NOT be subject to the same "economy-fixing" patches, especially if the coin changes involved are based on fixed numbers and not percentages.

pwe needs a feedback/test team consisting of people who actually spend a fair amount of time playing the game so that useless items in new patches can be spotted and tweaked if at all possible prior to release.

Cyrl - Raging Tide · May 2010

Ephemerai - Sanctuary wrote: »

pwe needs a feedback/test team consisting of people who actually spend a fair amount of time playing the game so that useless items in new patches can be spotted and tweaked if at all possible prior to release.

But but but....that would be logical. And everyone knows PWE doesn't do logic...

Michael_Dark - Lost City · May 2010

Almost ALL of you are freaking idiots.

THIS IS THE COIN SINK EVERYONE HAD BEEN ASKING FOR.

QQmoar

This is proof that no matter what PWI does, they'll get people whining and complaining... omg it's too expensive, omg it's too cheap, omg it's too much, omg it's too little... etc...

Shut up already. If you can't afford it, don't do it, it's that simple.

I can't believe how OBVIOUS this is. It's also made a number of DQ items SELLABLE... hint, it's opened a new market for merchanting. Duh. Idiots.

Pepper - Lost City · May 2010

ChaoticEnvy - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Ermm

Tiger Badge Repeatable Quest

Level Requirements: Level 20 - 100

Is that right (not ingame atm) If 101+ kinda get screwed .. again lol

I would say "kinda got saved.. again lol"
The only thing i got screwed since BH npc popped up first time is them taking out socket stones ( didnt get a chance of doing BH for exp b:cute) , but they gave us Nirvana and 100+ BH is pretty easy. All i can say to this is you wanna save money and get exp?
G o G r i n d
Does anyone here know what "grind" means? b:shutup

oh btw, whoever said
Server: "we want new daily"
GM: "here you go"

That made me NOT to be sorry for reading forum this time
+1 seriously

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide · May 2010

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

Almost ALL of you are freaking idiots.

THIS IS THE COIN SINK EVERYONE HAD BEEN ASKING FOR.

QQmoar

This is proof that no matter what PWI does, they'll get people whining and complaining... omg it's too expensive, omg it's too cheap, omg it's too much, omg it's too little... etc...

Shut up already. If you can't afford it, don't do it, it's that simple.

I can't believe how OBVIOUS this is. It's also made a number of DQ items SELLABLE... hint, it's opened a new market for merchanting. Duh. Idiots.

You tell 'em Mikey b:laugh .

Lesthar - Heavens Tear · May 2010

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

Almost ALL of you are freaking idiots.

THIS IS THE COIN SINK EVERYONE HAD BEEN ASKING FOR.

QQmoar

This is proof that no matter what PWI does, they'll get people whining and complaining... omg it's too expensive, omg it's too cheap, omg it's too much, omg it's too little... etc...

Shut up already. If you can't afford it, don't do it, it's that simple.

I can't believe how OBVIOUS this is. It's also made a number of DQ items SELLABLE... hint, it's opened a new market for merchanting. Duh. Idiots.

'Everyone had been asking for?' ('By popular demand'?)
Objection! This statement is clearly faulty your Honor! (guess the reference). For there was no agreement on my side.

But more seriously, it is a modified coin sink indeed, but it acts at the source, and is not helping the newbies, nor the non-cash users.

By the way, I would not buy DQs. I sell them or grind for them, but buying them... Ew.
Besides, who does actually go for Dragon Quests now? Two of the better prizes are now in the boutique. Right?

Pepper - Lost City · May 2010

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

Almost ALL of you are freaking idiots.

QQmoar

This is proof that no matter what PWI does, they'll get people whining and complaining... omg it's too expensive, omg it's too cheap, omg it's too much, omg it's too little... etc...

Shut up already. If you can't afford it, don't do it, it's that simple.

I can't believe how OBVIOUS this is. It's also made a number of DQ items SELLABLE... hint, it's opened a new market for merchanting. Duh. Idiots.

Did you ever notice 99.9% of QQ comes from oracle babies? b:embarrass

MALSUMIS - Lost City · May 2010

Nahktuul - Archosaur wrote: »

what a joke. I need 285 Grey Tiger Badges at 5k a piece? For a daily?

*scratches that off the to-do list*

Easy just grind DQ to make the coin......... wait, no, they gimped that. Dq item that was 2,500 is now worth 2k. That will take to long. But lets check for a 3x.....

34 Tiger Badges
x 5k coin

170000 coin

hmmmm
average dq drop price at 3x=1500. 170000/1500=133.33 dq drops needed. +20% to adjust for the dq price drop= way to much grinding.

great idea PWI make it harder to make in game coin then give us a quest that costs 2 hours of grinding just to start it.

Searing - Dreamweaver · May 2010

By the way, I would not buy DQs. I sell them or grind for them, but buying them... Ew.
Besides, who does actually go for Dragon Quests now? Two of the better prizes are now in the boutique. Right?

I farmed a Secret of the Dark Spirit ring with Dragon Quest...whole damn thing almost (i cheated on the last 2 gold orders and bought them >.>) Not really because i need it, but because it's one of the few hard to get & very rare items ingame that can't be obtained via packs or regular dungeons (and you sure as hell won't see one in AH...not even sure if there's 10 of these rings total on my server).
Felt good once i got it and the Dragon Quest itself proved to be a relieve from the constant BH/WQ/FC routine...

Lesthar - Heavens Tear · May 2010

Searing - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I farmed a Secret of the Dark Spirit ring with Dragon Quest...whole damn thing almost (i cheated on the last 2 gold orders and bought them >.>) Not really because i need it, but because it's one of the few hard to get & very rare items ingame that can't be obtained via packs or regular dungeons (and you sure as hell won't see one in AH...not even sure if there's 10 of these rings total on my server).
Felt good once i got it and the Dragon Quest itself proved to be a relieve from the constant BH/WQ/FC routine...

Oh, you did it for achievement... Hard work... Worth a praise ^^
I just hope the ring was useful. (sarcastic mode off)

KrittyCat - Dreamweaver · May 2010

Pepper - Lost City wrote: »

All i can say to this is you wanna save money and get exp?
G o G r i n d
Does anyone here know what "grind" means? b:shutup

I am sorry to say it, but even when I was in my 50s, grinding didn't pay off. Tank barbs do lower damage than just about every class, so our fights last much, much longer. We take more damage, thus we end up screwed when our drops don't compensate our repairs...plus whatever pots we have to pay for somehow (because NO pots are free, unless they are from the apoth)...ah, the lovely life of a tank barbarian...I wouldn't trade it for the world! ^^

Michael_Dark - Lost City · May 2010

Lesthar - Heavens Tear wrote: »

'Everyone had been asking for?' ('By popular demand'?)
Objection! This statement is clearly faulty your Honor! (guess the reference). For there was no agreement on my side.

Ok everyone (who has some semblance of a clue how the economy actually works) has.

But more seriously, it is a modified coin sink indeed, but it acts at the source, and is not helping the newbies, nor the non-cash users.

It helps the newbies by allowing them to sell nerfed DQ prices for more than the coin value.

It helps out the nubs and non-cash shoppers by giving some of those people who have many millions of extra coin and by giving them a place they can dispose of the coin, which will have an effect of reducing inflation. That helps everyone.

By the way, I would not buy DQs. I sell them or grind for them, but buying them... Ew.
Besides, who does actually go for Dragon Quests now? Two of the better prizes are now in the boutique. Right?

Yes, perhaps you may not buy them, but you might just end up selling them instead?

Pepper - Lost City wrote: »

Did you ever notice 99.9% of QQ comes from oracle babies? b:embarrass

Yeah... it's also most of the new users who enjoy the changes that have mostly ruined the game as well. $:\$

MALSUMIS - Lost City · May 2010

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

It helps the newbies by allowing them to sell nerfed DQ prices for more than the coin value.

It helps out the nubs and non-cash shoppers by giving some of those people who have many millions of extra coin and by giving them a place they can dispose of the coin, which will have an effect of reducing inflation. That helps everyone.

Where did you study accounting at? Wassamatta U? After grinding on my lvl mobs for 1 hour I made less that 12k in DQ drops.

By reducing the drop rate of the DQ it will increase the demand for them. the higher the demand the higher the inflated price. So this should cause and increase in gold prices, increase the number of pissed players, reduce the number of players, reduce the number of people buying items, sellers will be stuck with items with no customers to buy so it should be about the same as 1928 in the United States.

Michael_Dark - Lost City · May 2010

MALSUMIS - Lost City wrote: »

Where did you study accounting at? Wassamatta U? After grinding on my lvl mobs for 1 hour I made less that 12k in DQ drops.

12k? I'm calling BS. Go grind foxies.

EDIT: I just killed 10 of them on my lvl 64 veno. The mobs were light green, meaning reduced drop rate, I got 6 Flexible Sinew (12k) a ring (3.6k) and a reinforced leather... (3k?). It took less than 5 minutes.

By reducing the drop rate of the DQ it will increase the demand for them. the higher the demand the higher the inflated price. So this should cause and increase in gold prices, increase the number of pissed players, reduce the number of players, reduce the number of people buying items, sellers will be stuck with items with no customers to buy so it should be about the same as 1928 in the United States.

Oh please... first, the drop rate of DQ wasn't nerfed, the NPC value was. And please explain how less DQ = higher gold prices. lol

SlayerMaster - Heavens Tear · May 2010

Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »

Almost ALL of you are freaking idiots.

THIS IS THE COIN SINK EVERYONE HAD BEEN ASKING FOR.

QQmoar

This is proof that no matter what PWI does, they'll get people whining and complaining... omg it's too expensive, omg it's too cheap, omg it's too much, omg it's too little... etc...

Shut up already. If you can't afford it, don't do it, it's that simple.

I can't believe how OBVIOUS this is. It's also made a number of DQ items SELLABLE... hint, it's opened a new market for merchanting. Duh. Idiots.

FINALLY! I never thought I would see a person post about this when I was looking through all of the posts on this. I agree this is the coin sink that we need in order to stabilize the market in the game.

IGasm - Sanctuary · May 2010

MALSUMIS - Lost City wrote: »

Where did you study accounting at? Wassamatta U? After grinding on my lvl mobs for 1 hour I made less that 12k in DQ drops.

By reducing the drop rate of the DQ it will increase the demand for them. the higher the demand the higher the inflated price. So this should cause and increase in gold prices, increase the number of pissed players, reduce the number of players, reduce the number of people buying items, sellers will be stuck with items with no customers to buy so it should be about the same as 1928 in the United States.

The irony is that you insult other people's economics when you don't understand the games economics.

DQ are perhaps the major form of injecting money directly into the game. It is not being passed around but literally created. This means that with lower sellback prices, less money is being directly injected into the game.

With all the costs staying the same (repairs, pots, etc.) the amount of money coming into the game narrows down, since it will be harder for people to continue paying these costs. Over time, an equilibrium will form which should reflect the amount of money coming into the game being equal to the amount going out.

Though it is unlikely to happen like this, it will get closer then it did before. This means less coins flow around the game, thus the average player is poorer forcing prices of practically everything to lower. This process does take time to come into affect though.

This daily is just another money sink like lower DQ prices except this daily will more than likely make the rich poorer (for a small benefit) and therefore create a better balance between players' individual economies.

And don't compare real life economics with game economics since games have virtual items that can appear (or make things disappear) magically to change and balance out the economy.

Mahn - Sanctuary · May 2010

+1 IGasm. Couldn't have said it beter.

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