Game out of balance, agree or disagree?

We have 2 problems here.
My 2 personal problems with PWI at the moment are that I feel I will never have a max star chart (This is still kinda new, so maybe there will be more ways to farm the items) and I feel I will never, EVER have a RB2 Nuema Portal set. Does it bother me? Kind of, I'd like to have the best of the best. Does it really matter? Not so much, I still find the game enjoyable even in PvP.

About the promos, yes, this game is getting more and more money driven BUT spend rewards are open to everyone, even with gold at cap price and a line for it you can still buy and prepare in advance for these events.

Charge rewards isn't that unbalanced to be honest, I mean, this one for example gives 1 Deity stone for over 200 gold you charge, that's 200 dollars to get a free deity stone, I don't believe CSers will stack on them (Let's be real, there's not many people spending thosands on this game in one go). Also, last time they had drakeflames the price of those stones dropped to the ridiculous price of 40M or 10 gold/dollars, so, we all profit from this in a way.

I also don't agree with your statement about the people that don't pay can't keep up because, talking from personal experience, I have charged 20 dollars on this game when I joined the RT server back then to give me a boost and since then never cashed another cent. All I got I farmed and merchanted, got my r9, an A card set, everything +10 at the moment and have enough for my Emperor tome. One thing you have to understand though, this is just like real life economy, money makes money if you have the know how and by saying this in most cases (like mine) the rich get richer, the poor get poorer. Of course not everyone knows how to farm and how to merchant and to be honest, I am thankful for that, otherwise we would all be trying to get the moves on each other

TL, DR I don't agree with certain points but yes, I feel the game is a bit more cash oriented nowadays.

kuthond wrote: »

3 pieces of R8 recast, G16 double int dagger +11

If you hadn't wasted millions on rerolling r8r for int and +11ing a g16 Nirv dag, you'd probably have r9.​​

What I think is really important nowadays, even more than gear is the whole primal passives skill sets + a good card set leveled.
Also the spirit is something to take into account in pvp.

I can tell by personal experience that me being full rrr9+10, weapon +11, with an A set and all the primal passives maxed, I still find myself against enemies that I hit for 800 to 2000 damage at much while they hit me for 5000 to 15000, considering that as an arcane class I have arround 17 k unbuffed and 20 k buffed thats 3 or 2 shots, while they can just stand there without even a charm tick Of course those players usually are End game or almost end game. But still I think is kind of stupid that some people on this game can have almost ''GOD MODE''

Dont get me wrong on this last statement, I am not saying that an end game should not be OP, it is obvious that the model of progress that this game has is ''pay to win'' or at least ''work hard to win'' and there is nothing wrong with that.

But what I am trying to say is that an end game player should be able to beat easily on 1 on 1 a no end game player, heck he should be able to beat easily maybe 2 or 3 averages. But when you see an end game player tanking 20 or 30 rrr9 that are not end game. or when you see an end game sin killing 2 rrr9 squads like nothing or an end game psy/veno/cleric running around like an idiot with 30 people chasing him/her and those 30 not being able to kill it, well for me that is totally out of balance.

Also seeing the opinion about gear levels and aps in this case to be more specific makes me reaffirm even more what I previously said about primals, cards, etc.
While I agree that the whole aps concept is outdated on pvp and 99% of aps players are a 1 shot against r9. A player with highly refined aps gear and all the primal pasives at max + a very good card set can kill the average rrr9 arcane without much trouble, this proves the importance of cards, spirit and passives. This is something that I saw more than once on Cross server Nation Wars: Aps Blademaster with warsoul droping rrr9 +10 clerics, venos and other arcanes. Only thing is that he needed to have his target fully controlled.

But of course as was stated before on this same thread with the amount of money and time that an aps player put in to his toon, that person can probably get full rrr9 end game, which it is more efficient and powerful for PVP.

kuthond wrote: »

Well you are saying I am 3-4 gear levels behind but that is not true at all. Pretty much all gear is grade 16, only my wrists and necklace are 15.
...

See this is where part of the problem is. It's all G16. All G16 is not equal though. I had G16 before I went to R9. It was a huge difference.

Pretty much, you've got to pretend gear goes like this....

• G12.0 ~ R8 (Yes, it's 12, I double-checked.)
• G15.0 ~ R8r
• G16.0 ~ Nirvana
• G16.4 ~ R9
• G16.6 ~ R9r
• G16.8 ~ R9rr

I could go even deeper comparing adds and actual stats, but that shouldn't be necessary. You could also look at it this way.

• G12 ~ R8 (Yes, it's 12, I double-checked.)
• G15 ~ R8r
• G16 ~ Nirvana
• G17 ~ R9
• G18 ~ R9r
• G19 ~ R9rr

​​

so, if you could have R9 but dont want it ,why you complaining?

@kuthond

It is not uncommon for different gear with the same grade to have a difference in power. You can look at TT armor and find NPC armor of the same level range have the same grade. TT will generally be much better than NPC gear though. Grade is honestly a pretty poor indicator of a gear's actual power level and shouldn't be used as a main point of comparison.

kuthond wrote: »

And this is total rubbish ofcourse, like I said I dont wanna blindly do what literaly everyone does. Thats just total lame. I could have had R9 for a long time but its not what i want. But thats not the subject I want to discuss

Well, people follow similar gear paths because they are generally the best options. Those that want to do something different have to accept that their build and gear choices will be less effective. It's been like this since R9rr became farm-able through NW, and thus obtainable.

I'd love to go back in time when people could work with different builds and have multiple gear path options, and still be as effective, though usually in different ways. However, NW and R9rr have been around for a few years already so people shouldn't really be surprised. Besides, I've seen this happen to other MMOs too, where a certain gear path or build is generally the best option. It's not something unique to PWI.



In my opinion, I think the biggest problem is the overall economy and state of the game. Though I may be wrong, but it seems like it's harder to farm gear and stuff these days. People still had good chances of farming their R9rr and even reach "endgame" standards with +12 and JOSD over time. I farmed my gear, but when I did, the economy was better than it is now. Now I'm just lucky I've already had a certain level of gear, so it's not as hard to keep up to date.

The second problem is how random War Avatar cards and Star Chart are. I spent a lot of farmed money to get certain cards for one character, when the other one got them from just farming FSP every day plus promo/event/code packs. It makes it harder to make consistent upgrades to your character because you need luck. Even if you spend a lot of money (farmed or real) you might still not get what you want.​​

Gear definitely contributes, but it's also because people learn how to run each new instance in the most effective and efficient way.

When we first got AEU it was cool and challenging, people even believed only R9 players can run it. FSP was very challenging, but then people learnt the mechanics and it's no big deal anymore. The first time I did QSM, it looked pretty hard, but the next few times I went it seemed a lot easier. That's the nature of things.

​​

dingo488 said:

QM is still super hard!!! Only the coolest people can run it, dont listen to her

I doubt that any instance is/was too hard for any long-time player .

Some instances were and are just too repetitive and time consuming. And not worth the effort.
Farming a Forest's Wisdom in Unicorn Forest was once a waste of time.
Farming a WS weapon was a waste of coins before NW release.
Farming a Sky Cover with Public Quest was a waste of time.
And farming QM gear'n weapon is obviously not worth to do too.

My barb is full g16 +10, vit stones, 4 S cards and 2 A cards, Emperor Tome, all titles, vitae maxed at 8, hp at 56k buffed. People are shocked when I tell them I am not r9. People ask me, why don't you go r9, I tell them I don't have too, I want to show others in this game you don't have to be r9 to be successful. Problem is I have seen too many players who have bought their gears and become rrr9, become arrogant, but they also fail when they come to instances because they haven't learned how to play their toons. Most of my gears were farmed over 3 1/2 years. I was given my g16 axes but I +10 them. The problem is too many people want end game gears yesterday, they don't want to be patient. At this time, my barb is farming to make my mystic rrr9. It might take about 2 to 3 years but that is ok, I play this game for fun, to spend it with my friends and family. Honestly, if you have the most powerful toon in game, it really means nothing in real life. I have been married over 26 years and my real life wife plays and my son plays too. That means more to me than whether I have an OP toon in a virtual game. Everyone really has to sit back and ask themselves - why did you first start playing PWI and see if their attitude has changed. Maybe its time to go back to the beginning with your attitude. Maybe its time to drop the ego and actually have fun in game.

As a player that has farmed 3 out of 4 chars on the server I am currently playing on completely for free (cash-wise ofc cause nothing is free especially not time) I have to say that it has indeed gotten alot harder to get to r9. Through my means of farming I can easily get 500 Golds every months with approx 4 hours of gameplay everyday (including nonprofit dailies and such) and people often ask me how thats possible. well to put it straight, for a new player it is not. You need to already have decent chars to be able to decently farm ofc. That doesnt mean that its impossible. I watched alot of my friends farming their way to full r9rr, nw neck, rings, tome, full +10, aeu set and with vit stones (Barb and seeker in this example) and now they can pvp just fine with nearly anyone on the server. How? Well farming TT, doing as many events as possible, being there when you can get something for free (e.g. spend promos and such) and ofc always a bit of luck. Especially the low TTs that nowadays no one bothers to farm have been a goldmine for them, selling certain mats for 600k+ that drop like candy.

Is it possible to get to decent gears without a permanent cat shop? in my opinion no or rather said its extremely hard.

But is r9 the nonplus ultra? No its not. I have seen sooo many r9 people that just cashed their gears and thats that. No passives, no titles, no level, no nuema, no cards, nothing. If you have all passive stats maxed and a decent A-Card Set or even the free b-Set from the Archo event combined with avg G16 Gears with medium refines then you will be able to wipe the floor with just freshly cashed r9 +5-ish players. This is actually the sad truth and to this day I dont really know why most people keep ignoring all the passive stats you can get as they make a huge difference. All passive together are like another piece of maxed out gear and even more.

If you've played other MMOs especially Pay2Play ones then you might realize that it actually doesnt take that much more time to be competitive in PWI than in those MMOs. Why does PWI got the upper hand? Cause the pvp is still fun. PvE content is a joke yes. I admit that. But you would invest the time and effort to get max gears just to hit on mobs anyways?

As for PvP: People already know quite well that I think this game is nearly balanced. Just that you dont have a decent counter for paralyze and the behaviour of said effect itself is broken. Paralyze shouldnt be overwriteable. Thats the only thing that cant be outplayed/prevented in a fashion that doesnt leave nearly absolutely defenseless for the next 20 seconds

cyberomega45 said:

My barb is full g16 +10, vit stones, 4 S cards and 2 A cards, Emperor Tome, all titles, vitae maxed at 8, hp at 56k buffed. People are shocked when I tell them I am not r9. [...] Maybe its time to drop the ego and actually have fun in game.

It's not about the "ego". R9 is the cheapest part anyway. Decent sharding, ornaments, avatars, tome, refining (if you didn't get a bunch of 10* orbs for free years ago) cost way more (cheapest full R9 sale was ~350 dollars once, iirr).
And if you are a "vit barb" you will be never good in PVP (no zerk-crit, not much str). Your toon is "just" a damge taker, and not everyone wants to play a toon like this.

dave76netherlands said:

i'm one of the clerics who cant effort r9rrr.

So been playing g16 cleric with meridian, neuma, shifting sky lv 10, war cards 40/40 80/80 (no set sadly) etcetera done, and to 99% of endgame players i'm hitting them between 250-500 no crit damage lmao.

So PvP you need end game gear or your just OS toon food

Cleric has no chance to block any stun and most chars stun. So i look very pretty while getting OS during stun
It does not matter how many things pwi adds to make your chars better.. you still end up one shot as cleric.

R9 Barb 50 damage and OS with 14-21k hp
R9 Sin 200 damage and OS with 24-29k hp
R9 Seek 2500 crit damage and OS with 22-38k hp
R9 Veno 200 damage and OS with 14-21khp
R9 Dusk 250 damage and OS aroud 30k hp
R9 Cleric 2500-4k crit damage and OS with 14-20k hp
R9 Storm 2500 crit damage and can barely/not survive.
R9 Psy 50 damage and OS with 21-30k hp
R9 BM 150 damage and OS with 25k hp


Cleric is so out of balance in PvP that seal and sleep are only chance keep you alive while dogging all direct attacks.
Direct attack .. you end up dead 99.9%.

Clerics are under the strongest classes in this game. The Amount of control skills they have is abnormal. A great cleric can single-handedly decide the outcome of a group-PvP match if done right. Your gears are just underwhelming, thats all xDD

tetraem007 said:

cyberomega45 said:

My barb is full g16 +10, vit stones, 4 S cards and 2 A cards, Emperor Tome, all titles, vitae maxed at 8, hp at 56k buffed. People are shocked when I tell them I am not r9. [...] Maybe its time to drop the ego and actually have fun in game.

It's not about the "ego". R9 is the cheapest part anyway. Decent sharding, ornaments, avatars, tome, refining (if you didn't get a bunch of 10* orbs for free years ago) cost way more (cheapest full R9 sale was ~350 dollars once, iirr).
And if you are a "vit barb" you will be never good in PVP (no zerk-crit, not much str). Your toon is "just" a damge taker, and not everyone wants to play a toon like this.

Funny, being a "vit barb", people are surprised at how hard I hit. I do well in PvP despite no crit. When you say "you will be never good in PvP" kinda shows your ego.