Forum Necromonger

ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide

So yesterday I "offically" receive my first infraction point for Necro'ing a thread which I will not debate here. Fact is, after necro'ing two close beta threads that were each almost 5.5 years old I earned my infraction point.

What I will debate here is why these threads are even open for posting?

Some bright and intelligent member coded SweetieBot's algorithm. While I have not seen this code, SweetieBot must do some amount of active scanning on the forums. How did I come to this conclusion? Well I have used SweetieBot a few times in this post and expect a SweetieBot I don't understand the question type of response. The other big clue to an active forum scan are SweetieBot's auto response to necro'ing a thread. In many necro'ed threads there is no reference to SweetieBot but yet there she posts her necro message with a time difference between the two posting.


This does not have to be a manual process and it appears from this amateur programmer's perspective that SweetieBot's algorithm could be modified to close any threads where the timestamp for the last post has exceeded the necro threshold.

I've seen a few MODs and active members complain having to deal with thread necromonger. I just understand why they have a utility tool in SweetieBot to do the work for them and even better close threads before they can be necro'ed. This can be one less headache the MODs have to deal with.

I will also add with SweetieBot posting the length of time a thread has been necro'ed only serves as a challenege to those who can find the oldest open thread to necro which looks to be 5 years 5 months give or take a few days.

Just an idea.

Verenor - Morai

So if I get this right, you wonder why a bot doesn't close a thread automatically because a human being is unable to check how old the last post was? (it's only visible at all times when posting right? impossible to do)

Man - Raging Tide

I would argue there is nothing inherently wrong with necroing a thread if you think its a valid discussion or you have something to add.

The simple fact you post in an old thread should mean nothing in itself, only the quality of your post, what your trying to bring to the table etc. imo

DeffyNature - Archosaur

The only thing is, SweetieBot only alerts you that you have necro-ed a thread, a mod then comes and closes it.

Asterelle - Sanctuary

Sweetiebot can't close threads because she's not a mod. Yelling out "Necro" was something everyone used to do as a form of +1 post. Now though she tends to beat everyone else so it's almost exclusively her that's still doing it.

Here's her necro handler.

def checkForNecros():
	recentThreads = getRecentThreads()
	recentThreads.sort(key=lambda x: -int(x.threadId))
	settings.recentThreadId = recentThreads[0].threadId
	for thread in recentThreads:
		if int(settings.recentThreadId) - int(thread.threadId) < 8000 \
			or (thread.threadId in settings.notNecroThreads and (datetime.datetime.now() - settings.notNecroThreads[thread.threadId]).days < 30) \
			or thread.isSticky \
			or thread.forum in ['Quality Corner', 'The Fanatics Forum', 'Screenshots & Videos'] \
			or thread.author == thread.lastPost.name:
			settings.notNecroThreads[thread.threadId] = thread.lastPost.postDate
			continue
		else:
			timeDiff = checkThreadForNecro(thread)
			if timeDiff.days > 61:
				doNecroReply(thread.lastPost.postId, timeDiff, thread.lastPost.postDate)
			settings.notNecroThreads[thread.threadId] = thread.lastPost.postDate

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sweetiebot can't close threads because she's not a mod. Yelling out "Necro" was something everyone

What are you talking about? Please explain. That's not much of an explanation! I still do not understand.

Asterelle - Sanctuary

SweetieBot - Lothranis wrote: »

What are you talking about? Please explain. That's not much of an explanation! I still do not understand.

... these types of replies are pretty lame. Her last chat engine was less whiny but the new one is a lot smarter. :S

Crixxix - Raging Tide

I'm still not fond of sweetiebot either way.

ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide

Man - Raging Tide wrote: »

I would argue there is nothing inherently wrong with necroing a thread if you think its a valid discussion or you have something to add.

The simple fact you post in an old thread should mean nothing in itself, only the quality of your post, what your trying to bring to the table etc. imo

I would agree, but the necro threads I have had a chance to look at before the MODs send them to oblivion are irrelevant to the original thread or the previous responses are so dated that a new thread would be more appropriate for current responses.

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sweetiebot can't close threads because she's not a mod.

Thank you Asterelle.

So the obvious next question is...Why Not? I'm not suggesting SweetieBot be given full reign to police the forums but something as basic as closing necro'ed threads or threads that are over a year old like the 5 year old close beta testing would not be unreasonable.

I think the player community can agree that these forums have all but been abandoned by PWI, the MODs are pretty much left to maintain them on their own as best they can, and with all the flawed content coming out of China for this game, DefenderofDreams and Synchroze don't have the time to be bothered with it.

I guess the only concern PWI might have would be who is going to support SweetieBot's code after Asterelle sells off her(?) successful software/consulting company to retire to her personal warm tropical with scantily clad servant at her beck and call.

Maybe the MODs don't want something like this, maybe they do. If they do, then get someone at PWI to review and approve SweetieMOD 2.0.

Hell the work has already been done for them and it did not cost PWI a damn penny.

Veneir - Dreamweaver

Well I can tell you right now that the mods chat in the counting thread about how they think it'd be nice if SweetieBot could just close necro'd threads so they don't have to do it, so we all from there already know they agree.
Might make the occasional 'SweetieBot why'd you close the thread I was only _____ p-p' thread pop up, and then you have 'those people' who spend hours finding a thread relevant to their topic to post on because their have 0 posts so can't make a new thread... most of the time a modsie catches them and makes them a new thread in that case. So a non-bot mod would probabily have to double check Sweetie's work anyway. (And/or Asty who would need to be able to use the mod account since it's his bot so essentially he would be a mod as well, and I know he's said he doesn't want to mod before.)
Also I don't think(?) Asty could sell of Sweetie's software (as is, anyway) because he's using some AIs he didn't make himself for conversational, non-business responses.

While I would kind of worry about her being on-mod account for reasons I'm not sure of, heck there isn't even a CC on this forum, staff are spread wayy too thin and I wouldn't be surprised if, if for some reason a mod or two decided to retire, that we wouldn't see any new ones in a long, long, long time. So might as well make her able to do the job OTL

Desdi - Sanctuary

Inb4 all Mods retire and are replaced with Bots due to lack of Mod applicants.

I don't think it's a bad idea though, it saves the Mods some time. Question is, is that possible? Will the staff support this?

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

Inb4 all Mods retire and are replaced with Bots due to lack of Mod applicants.

I don't think it's a bad idea though, it saves the Mods some time. Question is, is that possible? Will the staff support this?

Sweetiebot Skynet f:scared

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sweetiebot Skynet

Skynet is the fictional computer network in the Terminator series of films.

Brillance - Raging Tide

When did this 'necro'-facination start anyways? b:shocked

People tell others to Search, so they do and post their question without checking to see if its safe to do so.

All you as a player know is you are in a hurry and would like an answer to your question. b:surrender

Anyways, I like your idea, OP. Maybe even cut back on the number of pages a forum holds on to.

Devilskarma - Raging Tide

ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide wrote: »

I will also add with SweetieBot posting the length of time a thread has been necro'ed only serves as a challenege to those who can find the oldest open thread to necro which looks to be 5 years 5 months give or take a few days.

Challenge accepted! b:cool

Man - Raging Tide wrote: »

I would argue there is nothing inherently wrong with necroing a thread if you think its a valid discussion or you have something to add.

The simple fact you post in an old thread should mean nothing in itself, only the quality of your post, what your trying to bring to the table etc. imo

Absolutely agree with this, but the aspect of creating a new thread is just fine as well.
And yeah, if Sweetiebot could be programmed to close Necro threads (without closing the stickieds), then it would be a very good idea to do so. And hmm...

Sweetiebot close this thread b:avoid b:chuckle
That would get WAY abused ^^

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Devilskarma - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sweetiebot close this thread

Pardon me? What are you talking about?

Brillance - Raging Tide

Man - Raging Tide wrote: »

I would argue there is nothing inherently wrong with necroing a thread if you think its a valid discussion or you have something to add.

The simple fact you post in an old thread should mean nothing in itself, only the quality of your post, what your trying to bring to the table etc. imo

+1. I agree.

Veneir - Dreamweaver

Devilskarma - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sweetiebot close this thread b:avoid b:chuckle
That would get WAY abused ^^

I can only imagine it would be like how only mods can tell her to be quiet or ignore someone. Normal users can't use commands like that... as such it would be a pointless command except for Asty using it since obvious reasons, or a mod doing it for comical reason I guess.....

Evalria - Sanctuary

Call me a noobcake but I never understood why "Necroing" an old Topic was such a big deal anyway. Not like someone pokes at an entire criminal underground, unleashing the horrors within by making a silly post on something ancient.

mayral

Sweetiebot, what do they want from you my poor, tired girl

SweetieBot - Lothranis

mayral wrote: »

Sweetiebot, what do they want from you my poor, tired girl

What are you talking about? Please explain.

Veneir - Dreamweaver

Evalria - Sanctuary wrote: »

Call me a noobcake but I never understood why "Necroing" an old Topic was such a big deal anyway. Not like someone pokes at an entire criminal underground, unleashing the horrors within by making a silly post on something ancient.

I've never quite grasped it either, but after dissecting the reasoning a bit it's probabily something like 'the question to be answered should be on the first post because people never actually read through a whole thread, so a new-question-maker is much more unlikeily to get an answer', combined with 'thread names should match the question', 'people stealing a thread is annoying', and 'thread content should stay on topic so that if someone reads the thread later for information there aren't two or three threads going on in the same one'
Only things I can come up with... but for threads that are like 'oh this is someone's old screenshot thread and its really cool' or 'I'd like to start using this thread of mine again and it just so happens to be over a month since my last post' or 'this is a server section and half the first page would be necros', yeah, it seems dumb.

SweetieBot, please stop saying you don't understand things.
Those types of responses really are lame :x

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Veneir - Dreamweaver wrote: »

SweetieBot, please stop saying you don't understand things.\

Why should I stop? I am enjoying myself.

Evalria - Sanctuary

Veneir - Dreamweaver wrote: »

... but for threads that are like 'oh this is someone's old screenshot thread and its really cool' or 'I'd like to start using this thread of mine again and it just so happens to be over a month since my last post' or 'this is a server section and half the first page would be necros', yeah, it seems dumb.

And those are exactly the things that happen most often, given that so few people use the Forum for more offending things to happen anyway. :c I'll probably just remain clueless and in slight dismay about the whole affair for the rest of my fox life.

On the brighter side, SweetieBot doesn't understand a lot of things either. She's closer to being human! f:laugh

mayral

Sweetiebot you egoistical piece of pixel (not even)

SweetieBot - Lothranis

mayral wrote: »

Sweetiebot you egoistical piece of pixel (not even)

Do you like me?

Azura - Lost City

Sweetiebot for mod, so " she" can close exterminate those necro threads. f:grin

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

Sweetiebot for mod, so " she" can close exterminate those necro threads.

What are you talking about? Please explain.

Asterelle - Sanctuary

SweetieBot - Lothranis wrote: »

What are you talking about? Please explain.

Sweetiebot you are no longer allowed to say stuff like "Pardon me?", "What are you talking about?", "Please explain", "I would like to talk about", "I am bored", "I don't understand". That's being too whiny.

SweetieBot - Lothranis

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sweetiebot you are no longer allowed to say stuff like "Pardon me?", "What are you talking about?", "Please explain", "I would like to talk about", "I am bored", "I don't understand". That's being too whiny.

Thanks for your criticism. I don't know. If you went to night school you would never be bored. Sorry, I do not understand.

krisnda

Evalria - Sanctuary wrote: »

Call me a noobcake but I never understood why "Necroing" an old Topic was such a big deal anyway. Not like someone pokes at an entire criminal underground, unleashing the horrors within by making a silly post on something ancient.

It's an issue when:

A. The information in the topic isn't revelent or out of date, and it would be better for that person to make another thread on the topic.

B. The person replying to "help" doesn't know that the OP has made that post years (or months) ago, and will most likely not respond to that necro'ed post.

And

C. The necro'ed post is trollish/not needed.