cleric build

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

But looking good is just as important as playing well. b:victory

You are one of the rare cleric on HL doing both really good. b:chuckle

Dawnx_ - Harshlands

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

You are one of the rare cleric on HL doing both really good. b:chuckle

What about me? b:shutup

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

Dawnx_ - Harshlands wrote: »

What about me? b:shutup

you are a pretty panda? b:chuckle ♥

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

tweakz wrote: »

Yet we can't take a statement like this credibly. Most of us have been in those squads where Cleric is in BB, squad is in BB, and yet toons still die. Anyone making statements like this are clearly ignorant.

*YAWN* Yeah because weapon/gear has nothing to do with it. Just because you don't seem to get that it's largely about gear choices let me show you a vit cleric build who built around the fact that they had vit and went for channeling.magic attack to make up for the fact that they lacked offense. And a pure cleric who built for defense because they were focused more on making up for that lack of defense.

See this pure cleric? http://pwcalc.com/4a67368ba7027b20 Chan=21 They have more defense than the vit cleric because that is what they built themselves around.

See this vit cleric? http://pwcalc.com/65d1a64d2d805cc2 chan=36 They have more attack and channeling than the pure cleric because that is what they built themselves around.

In the case of these two builds I personally like the first build better but this isn't about that. If these two were both sitting in BB in RB, you'd get better heals from the vit cleric. The pure cleric would be better able to take any damage thrown at it. It's not about whether or not you put in a few points in vit, its' about your gear and weapon choices. And these are both builds found on google though I tweaked a couple of things on them cuz i felt like it.

tweakz

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

*YAWN* Yeah because weapon/gear has nothing to do with it. Just because you don't seem to get that it's largely about gear choices let me show you a vit cleric build who built around the fact that they had vit and went for channeling.magic attack to make up for the fact that they lacked offense. And a pure cleric who built for defense because they were focused more on making up for that lack of defense.

See this pure cleric? http://pwcalc.com/4a67368ba7027b20 Chan=21 They have more defense than the vit cleric because that is what they built themselves around.

See this vit cleric? http://pwcalc.com/65d1a64d2d805cc2 chan=36 They have more attack and channeling than the pure cleric because that is what they built themselves around.

In the case of these two builds I personally like the first build better but this isn't about that. If these two were both sitting in BB in RB, you'd get better heals from the vit cleric. The pure cleric would be better able to take any damage thrown at it. It's not about whether or not you put in a few points in vit, its' about your gear and weapon choices. And these are both builds found on google though I tweaked a couple of things on them cuz i felt like it.

1) I don't see any great casters using might rings.
2) Anyone going for vit isn't likely to use +10 rings, and cloud stir?
3) +6 vs +7
4) Sage Vanguard Spirit on vit build isn't going to apply to a Cleric in BB and is not installed on pure
5) Most budget casters use a +mag/+vit tome
6) Most vit builds stat way more vit than that

Did I miss anything?

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

tweakz wrote: »

1) I don't see any great casters using might rings.
2) Anyone going for vit isn't likely to use +10 rings, and cloud stir?
3) +6 vs +7
4) Sage Vanguard Spirit on vit build isn't going to apply to a Cleric in BB and is not installed on pure
5) Most budget casters use a +mag/+vit tome
6) Most vit builds stat way more vit than that
Did I miss anything?

1)I see plenty use that particular might ring and that is another forum posters actual build. I tweaked it to +10 a couple of things that she hadn't refined to +10 yet.

2)I have vit and will also be using cloud stir when I decide to go back to playing my cleric. I will also +10 my equips. The reason you don't see a lot is because a lot of people would rather have the firepower when they hit that refine and restat. It doesn't mean vit builds don't get that gear, its just that many of them shed their vit once they have it. Because they equip their cleric like it was pure anyway.

3)It isn't just because of +6 vs +7, I can swap the belt around to what the person originally had and +10 both of those weapons and the vit build will still have more magic attack. Like I said I made a tweak and that was one of them based off something I could see myself going for.

Vit build at +10 with two sapphires, swapped the belt back to what the original poster had. I personally believed that they shouldn't have used that particular belt so I swapped it out. I noticed they were going for the channeling so I swapped the boots as well. I personally like my version of their build better.
http://pwcalc.com/cc3130e2d84f37c0

Pure build at +10 with two sapphires
http://pwcalc.com/a776464f4389674b

So once again the vit build had more healing power. Which once again goes to show that your gear is what is important and not whether or not you put in a few points of vit. And the +6 vs +7 was to show you that if you stat vit you need higher refines on your weapon than a pure build to make up for it but since that point seems to lost on you. There they are both even refines. Didn't change the fact that a vit cleric who gears up offensively is just as capable of surpassing a pure cleric who geared up defensively in magic attack. Just as a pure build can have more defense than a vit build if they choose to gear up defensively.

4) Which is why if you look at the calc I did not apply the the 6 second buff.Would you like to go back to that calc and see the +6 second buff? Then click buffs and check the checkbox.

5) I know plenty of vit clerics who don't use that tome

6) No, a lot of vit clerics cap vit at 50 and if you comb through these threads you will see many people say to cap vit at 50 or so.


Nice found two more posters who prove my point about equips. One of these is a vit build who cares about her equipment and the other is a pure build who thinks being pure and refining is enough. Which of these two would you rather have healing you in an instance with aoe?

http://pwcalc.com/4d88d6d27c99be00
http://pwcalc.com/0dd3b31878e3d368

I'd take the 800 less magic attack cleric who can actually live long enough to heal then that pure squishy fellow. The reason you run into people whose bb isn't enough has nothing to do with the vit they stated and everything to do with their equips/refines/shards. It's just as easy for someone to be a pure build with **** for gear who dies constantly as it is to be a vit cleric that doesn't heal enough. At least you're getting some kind of healing from that vit cleric who lives though. A dead cleric heals no one.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

For tome that depend, more and more i see people using a vit one or magic one, i personally have 2, +20 magic one and +20vit (3% physical resistance), depending on the situation i'll switch.

SxeChik - Archosaur

tweakz wrote: »

Yet we can't take a statement like this credibly. Most of us have been in those squads where Cleric is in BB, squad is in BB, and yet toons still die. Anyone making statements like this are clearly ignorant.

Im just telling what is true for me, believe or not your choice Just don't assume all vit build clerics are bad, that's truly ignorant FYI

tweakz

SxeChik - Archosaur wrote: »

Im just telling what is true for me, believe or not your choice Just don't assume all vit build clerics are bad, that's truly ignorant FYI

Oh, I see a part LA wiz on HT that I wouldn't hesitate to squad with, but that doesn't mean the build is the best choice. I can agree that there are vit build clerics that can out perform non vit builds. However; the encouraging of others to follow the wrong path is wrong. If you have an alt with super duper LA equips; fine account share them with your mage. But don't go around telling people that vit build is as good as pure mag, or tweak some stats on pwi calc to make it look like that's the case. In almost every case where my wiz has struggled in RB; it's been a vit build cleric in BB. Not saying none of them are capable; just pointing out that the build is not wise.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

tweakz wrote: »

Oh, I see a part LA wiz on HT that I wouldn't hesitate to squad with, but that doesn't mean the build is the best choice. I can agree that there are vit build clerics that can out perform non vit builds. However; the encouraging of others to follow the wrong path is wrong. If you have an alt with super duper LA equips; fine account share them with your mage. But don't go around telling people that vit build is as good as pure mag, or tweak some stats on pwi calc to make it look like that's the case. In almost every case where my wiz has struggled in RB; it's been a vit build cleric in BB. Not saying none of them are capable; just pointing out that the build is not wise.

And if you posted it like that instead of going vit build is fail fail fail and calling everyone who rolls one a mooch bag and quoting successful vit builds and claiming they are full of it, maybe people wouldn't have a problem with that opinion. It's fair enough to say, I wouldn't recommend it because of x,y,z. It's another thing when someone else tells their success to call it nonsense as though it's somehow impossible to be a good vit build cleric. And adding vit is nowhere near as experimental as Light Armor. Again, it's the mindset behind the reason many people go vit (i'm just gonna not bother with gear cuz i have vit!) instead of the build itself.

Kinda like all those moron aps sins who can't survive anything but are 5aps which is all they care about. Then expect the squad the squad to hold the boss 3+ times because they are constantly dying. I don't mind once because we all make mistakes. And even twice if you were dumb and didn't pot before potting in because we've all rushed and gotten ourselves killed doing something stupid. But there are sins that constantly die and drag out the fight for a very long time because they don't know what they are doing. Not just a bit less skilled at the class than others (which I don't mind so much) but a huge burden on their squad. They bother me as much as the next person but that's because they are morons who don't know their class and won't have at least enough gear to survive. Not because the typical sin build is so terrible its beyond repair. Obviously plenty of people have success with it. And plenty of vit cleric have great success with their clerics.

And again vit build is the wrong build is your personal opinion. There is a ton of easily obtained gear out there that makes vit more than viable. But if you're going to go vit do it because it fits your playstyle. Not because you don't want to refine or shard your weapon and armor.

tweakz

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

And again vit build is the wrong build is your personal opinion. There is a ton of easily obtained gear out there that makes vit more than viable. But if you're going to go vit do it because it fits your playstyle. Not because you don't want to refine or shard your weapon and armor.

You failed to show it in your pwicalc example yet you're clinging to it.

I see plenty use that particular might ring

Plenty isn't most, and there are plenty of fail choices made by the general player base.

I have vit and will also be using cloud stir when I decide to go back to playing my cleric.

Most people I believe would restat before getting cloud stir for obvious reasons. You're letting us know that you're playing a vit cleric. I've played a vit cleric; it sucked. Reset was the best thing for it.

It isn't just because of +6 vs +7, I can swap the belt around to what the person originally had and +10 both of those weapons and the vit build will still have more magic attack. Like I said I made a tweak and that was one of them based off something I could see myself going for.

You tinkered with multiple things. -I didn't just point out one. I could likewise point out that a single refine would make an equal impact on HP.

I know plenty of vit clerics who don't use that tome

Majority vs plenty.. -puhlease.

I'd take the 800 less magic attack cleric who can actually live long enough to heal then that pure squishy fellow.

I'd take neither, and stop downplaying pure's matk. Fail is fail; they can't survive: fail; they can't heal sufficiently: fail. Defending vit build is just an excuse for being a mooch.

SxeChik - Archosaur

@tweakz: well, you said vit-build is not wise, not as "good" as pure build... what about people that go pure build and have no money to refine or add good shards? b:bye

tweakz

SxeChik - Archosaur wrote: »

@tweakz: well, you said vit-build is not wise, not as "good" as pure build... what about people that go pure build and have no money to refine or add good shards? b:bye

You're talking about a day's worth of income difference to me. You're talking about a build that takes longer to earn the same amount. You're talking about a build that people use to exploit others for Nirvana and BH, etc. LA at least have the excuse of account sharing. Vit builds don't have an excuse.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

tweakz wrote: »

You failed to show it in your pwicalc example yet you're clinging to it.

Really, the vit build I posted had 17k magic attack damage and had more magic attack than the pure build.

tweakz wrote: »

Plenty isn't most, and there are plenty of fail choices made by the general player base.

Again, it was someone else's exact gear.

tweakz wrote: »

Most people I believe would restat before getting cloud stir for obvious reasons. You're letting us know that you're playing a vit cleric. I've played a vit cleric; it sucked. Reset was the best thing for it.

I have a cloud stir ring already. And the rep for rank 8. And a glorious robe: torment. And the kind of vit cleric that would use the gear I showed is the kind that is happy with their vit and has no intention to restat. You seem to be under the bizarre impression that nobody will actually gear up a vit cleric. If you like your vit and want to keep your vit, you wouldn't be buying a restat note. You'd be buying better equips.

tweakz wrote: »

You tinkered with multiple things. -I didn't just point out one. I could likewise point out that a single refine would make an equal impact on HP.

Even both of those clerics had been +12, the vit cleric would still have more attack than that particular pure cleric's build. So they would heal more. Your complaint was that they couldn't heal you enough and the calc proved you wrong. If for some reason you can't be healed by someone with 17k magic attack, then that is your fail. Also, that light armor cleric you know proves you wrong every single day. It's not the builds its the players behind them. I don't get what so hard to understand about that.

tweakz wrote: »

Majority vs plenty.. -puhlease.

TBH the majority of clerics pure or vit can properly heal a party. If everyone failed every instance so much, nobody would get anything done. Of the fails the majority have been people who don't know things like what heal aggro is or when to use what heal. I've also noticed that the squads that disband don't tend to be the ones you have to pot, it's the ones where everyone is dying multiple times because the cleric can't stay alive.

tweakz wrote: »

I'd take neither, and stop downplaying pure's matk. Fail is fail; they can't survive: fail; they can't heal sufficiently: fail. Defending vit build is just an excuse for being a mooch.

The question was if you had to take one of these, which one would you take. The reason you trying to get out of picking one is because the answer is obviously the vit cleric since that particular pure cleric can't even survive many aoes. The other has the defense but you might have to pot to make up for their smaller heals.

SxeChik - Archosaur

tweakz wrote: »

You're talking about a day's worth of income difference to me. You're talking about a build that takes longer to earn the same amount. You're talking about a build that people use to exploit others for Nirvana and BH, etc. LA at least have the excuse of account sharing. Vit builds don't have an excuse.

Um... you should just answer my question, "What about people who go pure build without money to refine or add good shards?" instead of saying nonsense.

You can as well just say you don't have an answer. Applying your idea/build which you assume that is good on other people is really a shouldn't-do thing b:bye

tweakz

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Really, the vit build I posted had 17k magic attack damage and had more magic attack than the pure build.

And yet how may flaws did I find in it?

Again, it was someone else's exact gear.

Want me to post someone elses fail gear?

I have a cloud stir ring already. And the kind of vit cleric that would use the gear I showed is the kind that is happy with their vit and has no intention to restat. You seem to be under the bizarre impression that nobody will actually gear up a vit cleric. And congratulations on not being able to **** it on a non standard build.

You could at least at this point indicate that you're sharing equips with an HA rather than making as if you're build is wise for those who don't have an HA.

I proved that you failed on 6 points. Stop acting as if you're still right pos troll.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

tweakz wrote: »

And yet how may flaws did I find in it?

Let's see your so called flaw was that one weapon was +6 and the other was +7. Which isn't a flaw. You said that sage vanguard's seal 10% 100 second buff was activated. It wasn't. You said that most budget casters don't use that gear, which also isn't a flaw in the gear. You said that most have way more vit than that. But I know for a fact that most people in these cleric forums who are vit clerics recommend a vit cap at 50. So nope, no flaws there. You could say well if they used this option or this option it would be less expensive or give them more defense. But the point wasn't perfect cleric gear, it was to show a viable build that people can actually get in-game where vit wouldn't be a hinderance. And it did exactly that.

tweakz wrote: »

Want me to post someone elses fail gear?

What was fail about 16963 magic attack, 10khp, and 8k defense with no other classes buffs? And you feel like the whole thing is ruined because you don't like that they used a sign of frost:chaos for the ring. Who cares if they went with a different ring than what you would use. You don't know anything about that person. You don't know if they pvp or tw. I'm sure they had their reasons to stat for defense.

tweakz wrote: »

You could at least at this point indicate that you're sharing equips with an HA rather than making as if you're build is wise for those who don't have an HA.

I'm not sharing equips with a HA and have never claimed to be a hard armor toon. My highest hard armor toon is like level 40. Once again you make assertions based on stereotypes. Oh you have a cloud stir, then you must automatically have a HA toon. Oh you have vit, you must automatically have bad gear. please. And that vit build wasn't mine.

tweakz wrote: »

I proved that you failed on 6 points. Stop acting as if you're still right pos troll.

You resorted to lame stereotypes, you proved nothing. They don't have to use lame refines, they don't have to use lame tomes. Vit doesn't mean you automatically have to do anything.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Why are you even arguing with tweakz/thumbs. lol We know by now that he's nothing but a clueless troll.


Anyway... Having both, a vit base cleric and a pure magic one, I can only say both work. Sure, I have seen both kinds of fail from others but in the end it all comes down to your skill. Know when to use your defenses, know which heal to throw on who at which time. A build alone doesn't make an awesome cleric at all.

Yulk_owns - Lost City

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Why are you even arguing with tweakz/thumbs. lol We know by now that he's nothing but a clueless troll.


Anyway... Having both, a vit base cleric and a pure magic one, I can only say both work. Sure, I have seen both kinds of fail from others but in the end it all comes down to your skill. Know when to use your defenses, know which heal to throw on who at which time. A build alone doesn't make an awesome cleric at all.

I agree with tweakz/thumbs about VIT clerics, vit clerics do heal less, and I honestly think vit would not be viable on a cleric at all. Even LA/AA MAG (before 100) is a better choice than VIT. You are gimping your magic damage as well while burning more MP.

VIT for squads by keeping yourself alive, okay, but that only works for easy mode instances / areas in open world. Clerics are meant to spam plume shell to keep themselves alive, HP would never matter if your physical defenses are low (magic defense are always high for robes). AA also gives the least HP. I think even HA clerics get more HP / damage (though not smart to do), so you're actually wasting points on vitality. I have some friends who actually regret putting VIT points on their cleric because they take longer to kill and burns more MP in the long run (plume shell will drain fastest with this build and this skill is needed for clerics, that also means VIT clerics would have less of a chance surviving than pure magic would).

Pure magic fits best for squads and very good to solo because of their magic power again, you need to guard your HP. Adding more via VIT to think you'll stay alive longer is actually futile. Get HP/physical defense from gear or just avoid getting hit (which is more important)

LA/AA is best for soloing because they are better suited for DDing. You may have the same base damage as a VIT, but then again, they could just have more MAG in and basically do more damage than VIT while having less damage taken from physical attacks and magic attacks whenever you swap.

Both of these builds guards your HP well, and of course regeneration aura. Adding more MP, Magic attack and both defenses are more important than HP which you can get from gear. You're supposed to guard your HP, if you're not doing that, you're doing something very wrong.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Yulk_owns - Lost City wrote: »

You may have the same base damage as a VIT, but then again, they could just have more MAG in and basically do more damage than VIT while having less damage taken from physical attacks and magic attacks whenever you swap.

Yea, I totally see that working, given vit base is around 50 or 60, and TT90 LA requires 96 dexterity alone. b:chuckle Go away Yulk, just go away.

tweakz

SxeChik - Archosaur wrote: »

@tweakz: well, you said vit-build is not wise, not as "good" as pure build... what about people that go pure build and have no money to refine or add good shards? b:bye

I've already addressed this many times, but maybe not clear enough for you. The poor will stay poor. Vit build is costly, and less productive. How you can't see why you're too poor is beyond me.

SxeChik - Archosaur

tweakz wrote: »

I've already addressed this many times, but maybe not clear enough for you. The poor will stay poor. Vit build is costly, and less productive. How you can't see why you're too poor is beyond me.

Awww, then you fail so bad dude b:chuckle Maybe just the rich can play ^^

you mean if people are poor, people still HAVE TO follow pure build even though they would die like 80,000 times in a run?

hahaha, +1 for Xainou. You are a troll, tweakz b:laugh

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

SxeChik - Archosaur wrote: »

awww, then you fail so bad dude b:chuckle

you mean if people are poor, people still HAVE TO follow pure build even though they would die like 80,000 times in a run?

hahaha, +1 for Xainou. You are a troll, tweakz b:laugh

According to you tweakz, I'm poor... I don't care what you think b:bye But even if poor or not, so what? The MAIN POINT IS TO KEEP YOUR SQUAD ALIVE. Why are you still saying pure build is better? b:bye Heal more but dies more too dude.

He's the kind of person that think money (visa/mastercard) make people better, but he don't know that all the money in the world don't make someone more skilled.

If someone fail, he gonna fail nvm the build, gears and stats, someone who is skilled will be able to do a better job with less.

I should link him a video of Mrs_Mav maybe he will understand that money don't make someone better. (well in a way i'm sure he gonna say Mrs_Mav is pro... so w/e XD)

SxeChik - Archosaur

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

He's the kind of person that think money (visa/mastercard) make people better, but he don't know that all the money in the world don't make someone more skilled.

+1

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

I should link him a video of Mrs_Mav maybe he will understand that money don't make someone better. (well in a way i'm sure he gonna say Mrs_Mav is pro... so w/e XD)

LMFAO, he might join Mrs_Mav in Silence-of-the-trolls team b:victory

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

sxechik - Archosaur wrote: »

lmfao, He Might Join Mrs_mav In Silence-of-the-trolls Team B:victory

^ Lol

Yulk_owns - Lost City

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yea, I totally see that working, given vit base is around 50 or 60, and TT90 LA requires 96 dexterity alone. b:chuckle Go away Yulk, just go away.

*Facepalm* And you can have base DEX around 50 to 60 given for more crit %. Maybe I should go away from incompetent gamers like you. Sheesh, I know tweakz is a fail but you're making yourself look even more foolish than him.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

Yulk_owns - Lost City wrote: »

*Facepalm* And you can have base DEX around 50 to 60 given for more crit %. Maybe I should go away from incompetent gamers like you. Sheesh, I know tweakz is a fail but you're making yourself look even more foolish than him.

Heals don't crit.

akosireann

Mrs_Mav is a vit cleric btw

tweakz

SxeChik - Archosaur wrote: »

Awww, then you fail so bad dude b:chuckle Maybe just the rich can play ^^

you mean if people are poor, people still HAVE TO follow pure build even though they would die like 80,000 times in a run?

hahaha, +1 for Xainou. You are a troll, tweakz b:laugh

If you're dying 80,000 times a run you are irresponsible. It's unethical to impose your fail on a squad. It's your responsibility to properly equip: not gimp your ability simply to survive something you aren't ready to pull your weight in.

My barb can't properly handle RB wave 3. Should I join wave 3 squads with it and hope there's some OP toons that can make up for the fail? -No. I don't f'k over other people and I don't expect it to be tolerated from others.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Yulk_owns - Lost City wrote: »

*Facepalm* And you can have base DEX around 50 to 60 given for more crit %. Maybe I should go away from incompetent gamers like you. Sheesh, I know tweakz is a fail but you're making yourself look even more foolish than him.

How are you having 60 base dex if you need 96 to wear this armor, which is undergeared for a good level 100 by the way? Also, you pretty much need the double amount of strength.
Tell me, how doesn't that gimp you magic into nothingless? lol

I like how you don't even argue, only insult me. Worthless troll. b:chuckle