Cleric Vs. Physical mobs

TCHP - Lost City · February 2012

Look at the arrow ...

fail GV

See I'm not Squishy ....

Ashivas - Dreamweaver · February 2012

We have a sleep spell and a stun spell. Not to mention plume shell IH WoP and physical and elemental attacks... you just suck at cleric.

Geshwur - Raging Tide · February 2012

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Yup. Its to gain chi quickly when you have a moment. Lol. I use it in combination with wellspring as a macro to gain one spark...and not eat 1000 mana each turn like Sage SOR does . b:laughb:laughb:laugh

I understand it's good for chi, but it's got a long channel time, and as someone said before, at 90+ or so, mana's no longer an issue. I just use my demon buffs that give chi. Fairly high mana cost, but for the cost of 1 herb/full chi, it's not too bad.

Sibyll_DeVir - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I'd like PWI inserts in new expansion this skill insthead of Violet dance (quite unuseful in my opinion...using it i dont deal many more damnage and cant heal...so i never use it)

Anyone find Violet Dance useful?

Violet Dance is great, PvP OR PvE.
I use it when I need to kill multiple mobs, and wanna do it fast. Build chi if you don't have it. full is great if possible. Stack 4 IH, Buff, 3spark, if mobs are close together pop a chi pot, tempest and Razor Feathers. Then if your chan speed is fast enough you can either take mobs 1 by 1 while IH is still up, or you can un-buff, stack more, and finish.

Ajiuo - Harshlands wrote: »

... Get genie skill earthquake. Jeez

Agreed, but earthquake is situational. If you're in a densely populated area of mobs that don't aggro, and you're killing one, earthquake is not usually a good idea.

As others have said, knockback isn't necessarily needed when you have 2 sleep skills that both have potential to last a long time, and cyclone. Kiting takes a little longer than being able to knock back mobs and kill from a stationary position. But as others have mentioned (yet again) clerics were meant to be healers. We CAN solo quests, but when DD is a secondary role, we will never have all the perks of other mage DDs.

J_Voorhees - Heavens Tear · February 2012

The OP is a bad troll. so your cleric takes longer to kill a mob than your psy, surprise surprise.
think before you open your mouth.
What kind of class is your psy and what kind of class is your cleric. Think a little bit. Now stop. Activate 2 more braincells and think harder.

RIGHT your psy is a damage dealer class, and your cleric is a healer class. WOW. Congratulations.

Now for the next step. What are those two classes supposed to do?

Think again, think harder, now think hard enuff so you start to sweat. OH RIGHT !!!

Psy is supposed to deal damage, and clerics are supposed to heal !!!!
Yeah you are on a good streak.

So why should anyone play a Psy as a DD class, if Clerics would kill as fast as Psys do and got all the heals on top of that?...

Futurelord - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Violet Dance is great, PvP OR PvE.
I use it when I need to kill multiple mobs, and wanna do it fast. Build chi if you don't have it. full is great if possible. Stack 4 IH, Buff, 3spark, if mobs are close together pop a chi pot, tempest and Razor Feathers. Then if your chan speed is fast enough you can either take mobs 1 by 1 while IH is still up, or you can un-buff, stack more, and finish.

Wait what? I think your a bit confused on what Violet Dance does sir. That damage bonus on the average cleric is in no way capable of increasing the speed in which you kill mobs. In fact all it does is make you unable to heal yourself when sht hits the fans.

I only use it to annoy people in pk by spamming the hp debuffs on everyone.

Why did I come to this thread again... oh yes.

Do Not Kite! I can't stress enough how pointless this is. If you can use IH to cancel out damage done to you then whats the point in kiting? Tsk Tsk Tsk.

Nuff said.

OP: Your English is not very good. That may be why no one understand what your "trying to say."

Highestelf - Heavens Tear · February 2012

Pyrogasm - Heavens Tear wrote: »

heh .. CLERIC is a healer .. will always be a healer and its supposed to be nothing more than a healer. In any game, the cleric, is a healer :P.

I beg to differ!! I have cleric friends that kick the living **** out BM's and deal MASSIVE damage on phys enemies!!

YES, playing cleric from 65 to 85 CAN BE FRUSTRATING, if it's your first toon, because you likely lack the knowledge necessary to build it properly in the first place, let alone use your skills to full benefit. MOST clerics I know do get tired, or frustrated with their toon at some point. They build another class and eventually learn the necessity of stating attribs properly, and selecting gear/weapons properly, blah blah blah.
Eventually they apply what they've learned to their cleric, by restating and gear improvements, then they enjoy their cleric as if it was a new toon to them.

My main is 101bm, but main used to be my cleric. I too felt frustrated by my cleric's struggles in game. After retiring my cleric to make bm my main and leveling him to 101 I decided to play my cleric again.

MOST clerics make the mistake of ASSUMING high VIT points will increase their survivability!!

NO!! IF you put too much into VIT you rob from MAG - Higher mag kills faster!! The fewer hits a phys mob can get in on you the better your chance to survive. INCREASING phys defense with shards and gear refines will minimize the damage you incur per hit!!

HIT HARDER + BETTER PHYS RESIST = HIGHER SURVIVAL RATE!!
Eventually you DO WANT more HP, but not before you have your skills and phys defense taken care of.

1) I restatted my cleric to ALL mag - every other stat was minimum req for upgrades!
2) I purged all useless citrines from sockets and replaced with PHYS RESIST shards!

NOW, my cleric KILLS most phys mobs before they touch me AND I have higher survival rate against phys mobs and phys AOE, when I do get hit!!

Killing 108 mobs in hell, with little damage to my lvl90 cleric is VERY satisfying!!
Survivng phys attacks from higher level phys mobs is VERY satsfying!!!

Clerics .... PHYS DEF is YOUR FRIEND!
Adding HP to your squishy does very little to your ability to survive IF you don't have phys resistance!!! I am NOT saying vit or citrines are a complete waste - what I'm trying to say is that you MUST address the "WEAKNESSES" of your toon!!!

IF you are dying TOO MUCH, address your toons shortcommings.

1) Increase PHYS def
2) KILL FASTER!!!! INCREASE MAG, puts more punch behind your mag attacks and enhances all your mag skills!!
3) USE YOUR SKILLS more effectively - you have stun skills - USE THEM! YOU HAVE SHIELDS, USE THEM. LEARN to attack properly, ATTACK by alternating between Cyclone and plume shot, start with cyclone to slow mob then plume shot, then cyclone etc etc

YOU HAVE DEBUFFS - USE THEM. I use mag debuff on all enemies I view as a challenge to my attack!! In squad I use both mag and phys debuffs on "anything" that has high hp or proves a challenge for my party members.

The point is YES, you are squishy, BUT you MUST LEARN to apply everything you have in order to counter the opposition!!

MAX ALL your attack, defense and heal skills asap!
MAX YOUR MAG attribs to get FULL benefit from your MAGIC!!

escarte · February 2012

get violet dance u become a metal wizzie >.> will greatly increase ur dmg just wont let u heal so well ull now have to learn to use ur cleric as a dd

Futurelord - Dreamweaver · February 2012

escarte wrote: »

get violet dance u become a metal wizzie >.> will greatly increase ur dmg just wont let u heal so well ull now have to learn to use ur cleric as a dd

Hahahaha your funny homie. I laugh at you. Hahahahahahahah!

Quilue - Sanctuary · February 2012

High vit was necessary back in the days when you had to survive AOE bosses. Clerics had to be above a certain hp threshold for Soulbanisher in 1-x TT, for example.

Jeremied - Sanctuary · February 2012

b:shocked This...this thread.

Pardon me while I go tank 6 physical mobs to distract me from the horror. ;_;

Ajiuo - Harshlands · February 2012

Futurelord - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Do Not Kite! I can't stress enough how pointless this is. If you can use IH to cancel out damage done to you then whats the point in kiting? Tsk Tsk Tsk.

Nuff said.

There is nothing wrong with kiting. If you know you aren't going to be able to keep your HP up even with heals, and YES, it does happen, if you're preoccupied with things (like I'll be texting my boyfriend while grinding on mobs or in FC). Something dumb happens, you know IH won't heal you in time and SoR takes a small chunk of time to channel, even with roughly -24 channeling. A good timed silence/sleep (or if they are in c/d) holy path away and a few heals does the trick. We've all done it.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Geshwur - Raging Tide wrote: »

I understand it's good for chi, but it's got a long channel time, and as someone said before, at 90+ or so, mana's no longer an issue. I just use my demon buffs that give chi. Fairly high mana cost, but for the cost of 1 herb/full chi, it's not too bad.

.

LOL. I figured that you knew it. That's the only use that I can think of for it, so I was jokingly saying that was its use. Lol.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Futurelord - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Wait what? I think your a bit confused on what Violet Dance does sir. That damage bonus on the average cleric is in no way capable of increasing the speed in which you kill mobs. In fact all it does is make you unable to heal yourself when sht hits the fans.

I only use it to annoy people in pk by spamming the hp debuffs on everyone.

Why did I come to this thread again... oh yes.

Do Not Kite! I can't stress enough how pointless this is. If you can use IH to cancel out damage done to you then whats the point in kiting? Tsk Tsk Tsk.

Nuff said.

OP: Your English is not very good. That may be why no one understand what your "trying to say."

I normally agree with some of the things that you write on here, but I have to disagree on this one. I don't normally kite. I much prefer to IH, and kill, while putting up plume shell if things prove tough, using sage vanguard, and just murdering my opposition, while suffering around 1 or 2 hits.

However, there is a time when kiting is beneficial. Like I said, I don't normally kite. For a long time, I didn't know what kiting was, but I've practiced it, and feel very confident in my ability to kite. Its a valuable skill, and when a mob deals a particularly large amount of damage (not terminal, but tough to deal with regardless), then kiting comes into play. Since you can't kite magical and ranged mobs, clerics need to worry about physical mobs. It keeps them from being hit up close and personal, and I can honestly say that there have been instances where I've kited, and killed mobs that would have otherwise killed me had they been allowed to get close to me. Kiting is a valuable tool for mages, and ranged fighters. For clerics, as well as all magic/ranged classes, I would highly advise learning this technique, practicing it, and mastering it.

Geshwur - Raging Tide · February 2012

Futurelord - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Wait what? I think your a bit confused on what Violet Dance does sir. That damage bonus on the average cleric is in no way capable of increasing the speed in which you kill mobs.

I beg to differ, with only 15K soulforce I notice a 4-6K damage increase per hit.
And tbh 15K doesn't seem like much considering my sin has almost 27K and is only +5-6

TCHP - Lost City · February 2012

you can't heal in violet dance ...

well there's still crab and apo and genie, and shield and mp pot and and and ...

I said it before and I'll say it again. the damage increase in violet dance VS PVE is not that much. 3 spark or not, violet bonus does not change.

Here are a few numbers : ( R8 +5 weapon whit 2 perfect shard (+80 Att total), 422 mag)
Base attack : 9627-12813
Base + violet 10279-13680
Dif : 652-867

Base + 3 Spark :21030-27989
Base + Violet + 3 Spark: 21682-28856
Dif : 652-867

Comparing it whit 1 spark, base + 1 spark :12285-17149

Soul force :15611 ( I have 49+ refine lv 101 cleric)

The skill say : " Inc mag att gain by 40% to 80% " This part of the spell imo is the pvp part were Soul force is compared and the % bonus is added depending on the difference.

I still have to try it, I did a duel whit a friend and the result was not what I expected. Has I did less damage whit no weapon in violet form then I did in normal form but I suspect my friend use a damage reduction skill. Still I had no weapon equiped and I won the duel vs a 100 veno that purge me ... go figure it out .... ?

Mayfly - Dreamweaver · February 2012

High pdef is a more than adequate substitute for high HP on phys AOE bosses like Soubanisher.

VenomSara - Heavens Tear · February 2012

I have a cleric lvl 101
has arcane armor not nirvana
just TT arcane armor
since Sins and BM with Blood Paint dont need clerics
i transformed my weak cleric into a sloing cleric
right now i got 5.500 hp 9.000 Mp 5.000 phys res 10.000 mag def
i can do wield thunder / cyclone / sirenkiss /cyclone / plume x2
until i need to heal myself 2 or 3 times then can finish the mobs

also in violet dance can kill the mob only taking 1 hit from it
so could kill 3 mobs without healing myself

if aoe 3 or 4 mobs will be diferent as heal heal heal / razor /siren
heal heal heal heal /razor

well u got the idea .... sitting in the floor and QQ get u nowere
is time to do something b:victory

Crystyl - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Sibyll_DeVir - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I hope PWI staff know how much impossible is for a cleric to fight physical mobs.

In Morai mobs are quite all phyisical!

In Tun Su Txin run Cleric is a dead man walking.

I'm bored to play my cleric, because the only way to play it is to heal ppl in istances...nothing else able to do....And I make sure that's very very boring

WHY PWI staff continue to let classes so unbalanced?

Cleric is full of useless skills (a lot of heal skills with same effects)...and not have a simply skill to send away a mob (like psy or archer have)

Please, now trolls can hurt and joke...as the same!

Back to OP.
Before you picked Cleric you read the different class descriptions and abilities......right?

If you want "easy" find an easier game to play. If you're "bored" playing cleric then you picked the wrong class. Play a different class. Don't blame the design of the Cleric for your boredom.

Futurelord - Dreamweaver · February 2012

VenomSara - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I have a cleric lvl 101
has arcane armor not nirvana
just TT arcane armor
since Sins and BM with Blood Paint dont need clerics
i transformed my weak cleric into a sloing cleric
right now i got 5.500 hp 9.000 Mp 5.000 phys res 10.000 mag def
i can do wield thunder / cyclone / sirenkiss /cyclone / plume x2
until i need to heal myself 2 or 3 times then can finish the mobs

also in violet dance can kill the mob only taking 1 hit from it
so could kill 3 mobs without healing myself

if aoe 3 or 4 mobs will be diferent as heal heal heal / razor /siren
heal heal heal heal /razor

well u got the idea .... sitting in the floor and QQ get u nowere
is time to do something b:victory

6.1k hp and 3.3k phy resist. It only takes 1 IH to stay alive with 3 phy mobs on me. Are you sure your doing it right? Pure magic clerics have the best healing power in game...

Ingrafer - Heavens Tear · February 2012

Sibyll_DeVir - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I hope PWI staff know how much impossible is for a cleric to fight physical mobs.

In Morai mobs are quite all phyisical!

I'm bored to play my cleric, because the only way to play it is to heal ppl in istances...nothing else able to do....And I make sure that's very very boring

Cleric is full of useless skills (a lot of heal skills with same effects)...and not have a simply skill to send away a mob (like psy or archer have)

I can't help but laugh at this b:chuckle

1st. If you can't tank physical mob's then you're not a very good cleric. Hello ever heard of this skills? (Iron heart, Plume Shell)

2nd. Yes i agree sometimes being a cleric is boring cause usually you have to just stand in BB or spam IH on the tank or w/e. But that's what a cleric is for.

3rd. What are you talking about? every healing skill does something different, I use every healing skill I have to keep someone alive or even the whole group alive when BB get's interrupted. And if you want to send away a mob get earthquake on your Genie OR play another class >.> this day's you can get to lvl 100 in a couple of day's

Highestelf - Heavens Tear · March 2012

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

High vit was necessary back in the days when you had to survive AOE bosses. Clerics had to be above a certain hp threshold for Soulbanisher in 1-x TT, for example.

I would LOVE high hp on my cleric.
My first cleric build I had massive hp for a mid level cleric but I still got laid out almost instantly, because i couldn't kill a damn thing. I flash back and find it outrageously funny. After learning the importance of mag over vit and phys def shards over citrine, my game play and pleasure took on a whole new level. Now that my cleric is s..l..o..w..l..y reaching end game, I can be more comfortable boosting my HP as I replace/upgrade my gear.

Clerics are a fun class because you can **** off entire squads in a heartbeat, or be the guardian angle. I honestly believe the best experience for a cleric is to build a BM and play like "leroy jenkins." There's something about rushing mobs like a dumb ***, with some hope of survival. Playing both classes has taught me to appreciate their unique differences and take their weaknesses in stride, as I work to overcome them.

To newbie clerics, I suggest you just read the forums and look for suggestions that will lead you through the build/path that suits your style. Enjoy the struggles, they will make your character better in the end. Ignore the peeps that tell you to get used to being a weak assed healer, my guess is that those peeps are the ones that need a pocket cleric at their beck and call.

Also, if your doing your job correctly and the squad still dies, the tank will likely blame you. Unfortunately, you will have to deal with it until you learn enuff to know when it is actually a fail tank and/or aggro stealers that are too stupid to know what THEY are doing wrong. TRUST ME, there are few things funnier than fail squads laying blame on the cleric.

Their should be a bill of rights for clerics.
1) The right to be in a squad that protects their clerics.
2) The right to stop spamming IH on a weak tank, when you know his innevitable death will result in your immediate demise.
3) The right to not heal/squad heal when squishy assed aggro stealers interfere with the tanks ability to do his job.

Then again, there are few things more satisfying than knowing you can and do keep weak players alive, and knowing you played a key role in the success of a sqaud challenge.

b:laughb:chuckleb:laugh

yadda yadda yadda

Just have fun, it's a game lmao

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · March 2012

oh lord. so OP wants what, clerics to be the best DD? and ofc then she wil go "oh noes, my cleric is more squishy than barbs, we need a bunch of hp/pdef/mdef super self buffs!" and ofc after that she will want a gm weapon and cape...

Sibyll_DeVir - Heavens Tear wrote: »

CLERIC CLASS IS BORING!!!!
Playing other classes is MORE MORE funny.
And that's i know because have also Archer, Psy, Veno, Barb and BM.
THE MOST BORING CLASS is CLERIC

if you prefer one-shooting stuff and not healing in instances dont play a cleric... nobody said that you have to play a cleric.

and seriously, lvl95 and saying that all heals are the same?..... i hope that at least you spam IH and not BotP...

Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Cleric's going to kill the odd IMR mob faster than a psychic, though

the psy will soulbourn the IMR and while it commits suicide he will kill some other mob xd
(ok, just some times and yeah, clerics are better against IMR, no need for spark(s))

scarfaceclaw · March 2012

Whenever i hear a cleric moaning about questing/grinding/killing mobs in general I have one thing to say.

YOU CAN HEAL YOURSELF AT ANYTIME!

Before, during and after the fight.

Khallie - Sanctuary · March 2012

Morai is a wonderfull place for a Cleric. I dragged my Veno through all the quests and my hubbies BM, even tanked for his barb. Some mobs are easier to kill then others, but I had no trouble with any of them. Most things are dead before they even get to me and if they do make, a quick IH in between shots saves me.

IH is your friend, so is plume shell, wings of protection. MP usage has never been a problem since I hit 75 and started using herbs that you can buy with tokens. 3 tokens gets you 50 herbs. Cheaper then pots. Herb farming to make apothcary mp stuff is a cheap option as well. Those heal 100mp per second. Really no excuse for saying you have no mp.

I do on average 14k damage each shot, have just over 5k hp buffed. My genie has earthquake for those moments you get mobbed. Update your gear, plus and shard. Makes a huge differance.

AND if your so bored with your cleric maybe its time to retire it and start a differant char cause sure sounds like that no matter what people are telling you, your not gonna change your mind on just how boring clerics are.

John_Smith - Harshlands · March 2012

I still have this thread bookmarked for its epic failness.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · March 2012

so this is where FCC leads >.>

Tsukyini - Raging Tide · March 2012

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

so this is where FCC leads >.>

Actually, this thread is the result of a brother and sister loving each other too much.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · March 2012

Tsukyini - Raging Tide wrote: »

Actually, this thread is the result of a brother and sister loving each other too much.

im starting to think the OP is a troll already >> jus cause the first post is just.... impossibly absurd.

Matgatg - Sanctuary · March 2012

Just to add some flavour to the discussion about clerics using too much mp. Have you seen what happens to us axe weilding BMs in delta. Until stage 3, it took about 80k mp out my bm on the charm. Usually that means 30~50 pots. We don't complain about our mana use in delta. Heavens forbid should hf ever not be operational because we are too cheap to pot and use hf, imagine the squad wipes. Most sins, tanks tank because the extra heals they get from hf, otherwise we drop like flies at the second boss in vana b:thanks.

Amusing story, OP squad, but the main two tanking sins were afk, the fledgling sins took it upon themselves to dd on the boss. Naturally the boss took time out, went for a smoke, bp heals dried up, and the room started smelling of rotten fish. When everyone came back, boss died quick enough

*waits for updates to finishb:chuckle*

SkogDyr - Lost City · March 2012

Sibyll_DeVir - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Yep i agree...

CLERIC CLASS IS BORING!!!!

THE MOST BORING CLASS is CLERIC

Wow...

My main is an EP and I wouldn't have it any other way. We have Phys and Mag attacks, great debuffs, Plume Shell, heals.... what more do you want?

As for the MP issue... maybe before lvl 70 but after than you should have enough MP to run a macro again and again. If you are having problems, make some pots or think about re-stat. At 101, the only Vit and Dex I have is from gear, I carry enough Str for gear and the rest is in Mag. (up to lvl 70, I did have a Vit build but changed it later on).

I would love to see your build if you are having that much trouble. I think that's where the problem is.

As for killing faster, Guardian Light, lure 3-4 mobs, spark, Plume Shell, Tempest, Sirens Kiss, Razor Feathers (IH yourself if needed)... they should be all dead. If not, you have MAG/gear issues and need to restat or refine.

Cleric Vs. Physical mobs

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