undine overrated

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

UIquiorra_ - Lost City wrote: »

Here's where the math doesn't add up...
You beat him 3 out of 4 times but died to 2 purges... Wouldn't that mean that you only beat him twice? Check you're math dude.

See the more detailed account of our 6 encounters. the first 4 were pretty much understood to be 1 vs 1, even though he just jumped me each time (no "ready, set, go!" **** like I see so many annoying people do).

The 4th 1 vs 1 he won with a purge. Then, we were done and talking and he just started attacking and purged and killed me.

math is fine (which for me is uncanny), you just didn't get to the part where there were really 6 fights, not just 4.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote:

I am sorry, but that is exactly what you did last night. And what Dai Viper has been begging to do.

I have been begging u? lol
I am not an Archer so I cant purge u. Thats why I will play my own buffs and you can get full buffs, is that fair enouf? if you dont think so, I can take off my cape too,and replace it with a lunar +2. its not a problemb:surrender

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

I have been begging u? lol
I am not an Archer so I cant purge u. Thats why I will play my own buffs and you can get full buffs, is that fair enouf? if you dont think so, I can take off my cape too,and replace it with a lunar +2. its not a problemb:surrender

keep begging

AgentPotato - Archosaur

I just took up BLOOD on his offer to undine damage test on me, and basically, if I'm reading my excel sheet right (=\...)

It comes out to:

Undine adds ~15% damage
Cleric mag attack buff on wiz adds ~30% damage
Mag def buffs on archer gives ~60% reduction

Disclaimer: this was only 5-10 hits each sample, but as BLOOD said, the dmg range on mag swords isnt huge, plus we were lazy to keep taking samples. And, I left all my gear on so I had 59 defense levels. I cba to take off my gear and keep restarting a duel or rezzing.

I guess this all makes sense. Undine's description is just like every other skill, and the debuff is reduced by pvp dmg reduction of 75%. Cleric magic attack buff added ~30% damage... idk how to explain that one without more samples/thinking (cba), as the description says it adds 70% of base mag attack.

Apparently the cleric magic defense buff does add a straightup 60% damage reduction though, which makes sense since its only reducing damage, and not being reduced by pvp dmg reduction.

I'm sure these numbers are up somewhere else, but I'm just posting them because they're relevant to the flame war b:kiss

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Agent and I just tested it. In almost every case DP + Pyro does more damage than undine and divine pyro.

Again, I am not saying to not use undine, just that the 1.5 seconds it takes can be better used sometimes on pyrogram (or glacial snare then gush) and the damage is pretty equal but slightly in favor of not using undine.

If you can get 3 or 4 skill out, you are probably better of with undine. and if you can undine before sleep and without ticking their charm before and ultimate, of course do it.

But to undine before every attack, or even most attacks, it not necessary. at least for sage b:victory

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

keep begging

Lol. Ok, nvm then. That's all I can say. See u in tw then

HardToThink - Lost City

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

keep begging

Don't assume everyone forgot about you crying to him for a 1vs1 with hh90 gear(What's with your obsession with tt90 anyways) before he even said anything. He offered to give you full buffs and to not use some of his gear. You begged him for a 1vs1 and when he said okay you said LOLNVM STOP BEGGING LOL, so its obvious you're just a troll or you know you cant kill dai 1vs1.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

Don't assume everyone forgot about you crying to him for a 1vs1 with hh90 gear(What's with your obsession with tt90 anyways) before he even said anything. He offered to give you full buffs and to not use some of his gear. You begged him for a 1vs1 and when he said okay you said LOLNVM STOP BEGGING LOL, so its obvious you're just a troll or you know you cant kill dai 1vs1.

Thank you for your support lol

Evanera - Heavens Tear

Yea I'll be honest here don't back down from a fight which is a lot easier to accomplish than what you offered, Blood.

Especially don't make yourself look **** by telling him he's begging after you did it worse than him.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

Don't assume everyone forgot about you crying to him for a 1vs1 with hh90 gear

Crying to him? I don't want to 1 vs 1 him AT ALL.

Go reread before you try to troll. Lying isn't trolling. Its just lying. Any child can do it.

Evanera - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Yea I'll be honest here don't back down from a fight which is a lot easier to accomplish than what you offered, Blood.

Especially don't make yourself look **** by telling him he's begging after you did it worse than him.

You both need to go reread. I don't want to 1 vs 1 him. I want to ignore him, but he won't get off my jock - like beating a wizard he calls fail will prove something. Again, he can't have it both ways. Just because you two couldn't help but try to rise to the challenge posed by some nobody rank 9 on your server, doesn't mean I have the same ego problems you do.

I also said here before, if he wants me to say he would beat me 1 vs 1 with his gear, I am happy to concede that. Again, for me its not a matter of ego, or giving a ** what he, your or anyone else thinks. I could totally care less. That kind of thinking is what kept him in cat shop for two years. I'll take my 2 years of fun, thank you very much.

Honestly, add two to the list of people trying to 1 up me in a competition I am not even joining in. You all must feel threatened. What? Upset noone looks to your snarky replies for guideance and instead follow the advice that I, a pve wizard, dare to post on these forums?

Get used to it. I may take breaks of a week or more, I am old. But I ain't going anywhere.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

Crying to him? I don't want to 1 vs 1 him AT ALL.

Go reread before you try to troll. Lying isn't trolling. Its just lying. Any child can do it.



You both need to go reread. I don't want to 1 vs 1 him. I want to ignore him, but he won't get off my jock - like beating a wizard he calls fail will prove something. Again, he can't have it both ways.

ID or Ad which 1 r u gonna use?

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

ID or Ad which 1 r u gonna use?

is this supposed to mean something? in english?

try again

HardToThink - Lost City

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

Crying to him? I don't want to 1 vs 1 him AT ALL.

Go reread before you try to troll. Lying isn't trolling. Its just lying. Any child can do it.



You both need to go reread. I don't want to 1 vs 1 him. I want to ignore him, but he won't get off my jock - like beating a wizard he calls fail will prove something. Again, he can't have it both ways. Just because you two couldn't help but try to rise to the challenge posed by some nobody rank 9 on your server, doesn't mean I have the same ego problems you do.

I also said here before, if he wants me to say he would beat me 1 vs 1 with his gear, I am happy to concede that. Again, for me its not a matter of ego, or giving a ** what he, your or anyone else thinks. I could totally care less. That kind of thinking is what kept him in cat shop for two years. I'll take my 2 years of fun, thank you very much.

Honestly, add two to the list of people trying to 1 up me in a competition I am not even joining in. You all must feel threatened. What? Upset noone looks to your snarky replies for guideance and instead follow the advice that I, a pve wizard, dare to post on these forums?

Get used to it. I may take breaks of a week or more, I am old. But I ain't going anywhere.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

I will 1 vs 1 you any day in TT90 gear +5. We shall see what your "skill" does then. Cmon, you will still have the advantage of attk and def levels from outgearing me - and playing a better 1 vs 1 class. Afraid to take me up on the challenge? Thought so.

Shame you STILL don't show your face at west gate unless you have help - and full buffs. If I had your gear I would be rocking west gate solo 24/7 - like I did for most of the history of our server, however distant it may now seem.

/5chars

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

is this supposed to mean something? in english?

try again

Ok. Let me tell u clearly
Ig: iron guard
Ad: absolute domain
Which one are gonna use after these posts?

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

Ok. Let me tell u clearly
Ig: iron guard
Ad: absolute domain
Which one are gonna use after these posts?

This still makes no sense.

You know apoth is not real. Its only make believe.

Evanera - Heavens Tear

LOLOL HTT beat me to it.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

This still makes no sense.

You know apoth is not real. Its only make believe.

ok if u still dont get it or pretend sob:laugh

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

quote missing the whole point

yes, if he insists, I am happy to do it where his gear won't give him an advantage. And if he is going to go on and on about me not accepting his challenge, I am happy to point out that he didn't accept mine, either.

But any fool (well, apparently not you, fool) can tell from my posts that I don't want to 1 vs 1 him at all. And I want him to just leave me alone because no matter how despirate he and everyone else is to measure themselves against me, I find him incredibly dull, feeble of mind, and not worth the effort.

HardToThink - Lost City

You contradict yourself so much I don't even have to argue you, you're doing it for me.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

yes, if he insists, I am happy to do it where his gear won't give him an advantage.

I have more advantages without full buffs and 1 piece of my gear? wowb:shocked

Evanera - Heavens Tear

Okay it's confirmed. Dai is a monster.

HardToThink - Lost City

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

I have more advantages without full buffs and 1 piece of my gear? wowb:shocked

You're just that pro =]

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

not because im pro,its all because he doesnt know how to play his classb:surrender

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

You contradict yourself so much I don't even have to argue you, you're doing it for me.

Its not a contradiction, its clear. Go reread it all. I am perfectly happy if I never see dai viper again. I have never "challenged" him, per se. I replied to his persistent challenges with a counter offer, if it meant that much to him.

If you can't get that, its because you, too, feel the need to try and diminish the greatness that is I. You, like all the others, have failed.

Evanera - Heavens Tear

Now now he can't be that bad. He is red name on a PvE server after all.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

look like you know him b:thanks

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Evanera - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Now now he can't be that bad. He is red name on a PvE server after all.

No, its not about whether I am bad or good, lol. I will never join in discussions about that.

But pointing out people saying I suck, then acting like I don't? That is fair game.

I comment about what people say, not who they are, or who they can beat, or what faction they are in, or what server they play on.

I deal with ideas, on their merits.

I will let others talk about how good I am or not. It seems an obsession for some. But not one of mine.

Unless, that is, they come after me. Then, of course, all is fair game.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

not because im pro,its all because he doesnt know how to play his classb:surrender

I don't know how to play my class? You think taking your weapon off impairs your skill so much, you don't know that your soul force comes from the refines of your other gear as well?

Don't even know that, and I am the one that doesn't know my class?

Or, wait a minute, did you think I was that dumb that I didn't know your class too? You thought you could trick me, you know, like when teddy acted like is arma wouldn't do as much damage without his +12 weapon? lol

Silly trolls, just because you gear up +12 on one character and that's all you know, doesn't mean that there aren't those of us that play all of the classes, and know far more than you. But then again, why would you? you didn't play for 2 years, you just sat in a cat shop, lol.

Ok, ok, i haven't played mystic yet . . . . you got me.

And read back - this very thread people were saying I was foolish for not using undine on agent - but not only were they wrong, which often comes from making conclusions on only 1 side of a story, but were mathematically proven wrong when agent and I tested it and I did more damage using something other than undine and just the debuff from sage pyrogram.

So are you as certain as they all were, before they were proven wrong, or are you less certain? Either way, you lose. Because I get to be me, and you unfortunately, have to remain you. And when your me, your always right. Because unlike you, when I don't know what I am talking about, I b:shutup

HardToThink - Lost City

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

No, its not about whether I am bad or good, lol. I will never join in discussions about that.

But pointing out people saying I suck, then acting like I don't? That is fair game.

I comment about what people say, not who they are, or who they can beat, or what faction they are in, or what server they play on.

I deal with ideas, on their merits.

I will let others talk about how good I am or not. It seems an obsession for some. But not one of mine.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

What? Upset noone looks to your snarky replies for guideance and instead follow the advice that I, a pve wizard, dare to post on these forums?

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

And I will point out again to yet another lost city wizard coming on here acting all big and bad:

Are you doing these on purpose?

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

I don't think I can explain it more clearly than I have. Go back and reread - this time with an open mind instead of trying to find some reason why I fail - when I didn't, in fact, fail.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

You both need to go reread.

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur wrote: »

Go reread it all.

Maybe you're right and the rest of everyone on the forums is wrong. Its not that you're puking contradictions and e-peen fights all over the forums. The entire community just has to reread the same thing again, for some revelation that wasn't there the first time.

But I'll leave you to your e-peen fight now. Its more fun just watching you say something, then something that's completely opposite, than it is to point it out to you. YULKMYSTIC

BLOODMYSTIC - Archosaur

I need to recognize sooner when I am dealing with the intellect of a 12 year old. None of that made any sense.

Go have some warm milk and go to bed.