Its getting Out of Hand

Dark_SageS - Heavens Tear

The gold price are getting way to much expensive almost to 2mill, Why ? after Years seeing price jumping from 100k to 2mill? C'Mon dont you think its a to much?

Asgardeus - Sanctuary

Gold prices are controlled by players.
As long as people buy at that price, they stay high.

So nope, obviously it's not too much.

StormHydra - Sanctuary

Asgardeus - Sanctuary wrote: »

Gold prices are controlled by players.

And players buying and selling is heavily influenced by PWE.


EDIT:

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Asgardeus - Sanctuary wrote: »

Gold prices are controlled by players.

KrittyCat wrote: »

Does PWE hold a proverbial gun to players' heads to make them buy? No? Then it's the same as any capitalist economy.

This is not really true. The majority of the current gold price is determined by the company and not any player market.

Consider the anni pack: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/20191
Perfect -Token of Luck - 15 (97%)
Perfect -Token of Best Luck (1.715%)

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Just these two alone contribute:
15*10k*.97 + 5,000k*.01715 = 231k
231k to the value of the pack in total absence of any player market

The anniversary pack when bought in bulk costs 22 silver. Even factoring in the 2% AH fee.

231K / .22 / 1.02 = 1029 k

Just looking at the tokens from the Anniversary Pack and totally ignoring any player market and totally ignoring every other item in the Anniversary Pack gold would be pegged at 1.029M.

The tokens are contributing the majority influence on the price of gold, not the players. The player market is a minority influence.

krittycat

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

And players buying and selling is heavily influenced by PWE.

Does PWE hold a proverbial gun to players' heads to make them buy? No? Then it's the same as any capitalist economy.

Anyway, this topic has been discussed over and over again, with no conclusion made other than the fact that players control the economy, and choose to sell gold at high prices to make money for themselves.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

And players buying and selling is heavily influenced by PWE.

How do you figure exactly? The price of everything in the game except those items with explicitly pre-set Prices (i.e. DQ Items, Mirage Celestones, Etc...) is determined entirely by the Player Base. Perfect World Entertainment and by proxy Wanmei have next to no direct influence over the prices of items in this game.

Other than perhaps I suppose setting the minimum price at which certain items such as those I mentioned above can be sold to other players at.

Nubispotze - Heavens Tear

KrittyCat wrote: »

Does PWE hold a proverbial gun to players' heads to make them buy? No? Then it's the same as any capitalist economy.

Anyway, this topic has been discussed over and over again, with no conclusion made other than the fact that players control the economy, and choose to sell gold at high prices to make money for themselves.

TBH, GMs in game buy gold that is selling with IN GAME COIN, to raise the gold price and to keep it high.


didnt you know this Kritty, i have an unsaid GM speaking about this in SS on my old Hard Drive maybe i should dig it up just to shut these " all knowing" mods up. like seriously you mods need to just mod and not try and post normaly because you might know how to follow forum rules but know nothing of the game that you mod for >=)



waiting for post to get deleted by unsaid modsb:victory

Asgardeus - Sanctuary

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

And players buying and selling is heavily influenced by PWE.

Yes, PWE tempts palyers to buy gold, ofc. But that's what any company does.

I just laugh if I hear people cry that you got to charge so much to be good. Noones forcing them. They do it willingly. lol

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

Nubispotze - Heavens Tear wrote: »

TBH, GMs in game buy gold that is selling with IN GAME COIN, to raise the gold price and to keep it high.


didnt you know this Kritty, i have an unsaid GM speaking about this in SS on my old Hard Drive maybe i should dig it up just to shut these " all knowing" mods up. like seriously you mods need to just mod and not try and post normaly because you might know how to follow forum rules but know nothing of the game that you mod for >=)



waiting for post to get deleted by unsaid modsb:victory

Pics or it didn't happen b:angry

Honestly, unless you can back up your statement with proof (which ironically due to the no naming and shaming rule I don't believe you can), then I don't think you can actually claim the above statement.

EDIT: I will also go on record as stating that the Moderators are also players of the game in question. It is the G.M.'s specifically who are simply paid employee's of the company and who do not really understand the game as it is understood by the players.

_Skai_ - Raging Tide

I remember back in the day when people were QQing like crazy because of the overly expensive 400k gold.

frankieraye

Nubispotze - Heavens Tear wrote: »

TBH, GMs in game buy gold that is selling with IN GAME COIN, to raise the gold price and to keep it high.


didnt you know this Kritty, i have an unsaid GM speaking about this in SS on my old Hard Drive maybe i should dig it up just to shut these " all knowing" mods up. like seriously you mods need to just mod and not try and post normaly because you might know how to follow forum rules but know nothing of the game that you mod for >=)



waiting for post to get deleted by unsaid modsb:victory

Hey Nub, please send pm me this screen shot you're referring to.

And just to make it clear, our GM's do not buy and sell gold via the auctioneer.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

frankieraye wrote: »

Hey Nub, please send pm me this screen shot you're referring to.

And just to make it clear, our GM's do not buy and sell gold via the auctioneer.

Or at least not while they are on the clock b:victory

krittycat

TolanSky - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Or at least not while they are on the clock b:victory

Even then, it's only via user accounts, which have no more special privileges than any other players. A GM account cannot be used to buy or sell gold.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

KrittyCat wrote: »

Even then, it's only via user accounts, which have no more special privileges than any other players. A GM account cannot be used to buy or sell gold.

Well it is good to know then, that the GM accounts do have some limitations on them.

krittycat

TolanSky - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Well it is good to know then, that the GM accounts do have some limitations on them.

That's the same with any commercial online game. It reduces accusations of GM favoritism and corruption, for the most part.

Asgardeus - Sanctuary

Hmm more in depth, I understand why gold prices are high.

I used to buy some zen myself. Maybe 10$ a month, not like the crazy spenders, of which the servers surely got enough. It was entertainment money for me, like a cinema visit or a good book. When I happened to sell that gold I ofc waited for the highest offer. My money, I want the most coins for it. And if people are willing to pay that price, fine with me.

However, I stopped charging a few month ago, with the VAT tax change. I simply don't agree with the fact that I should get less zen for my rl money.

Seeing it from a f2p player perpective now, yes, it is hard to live with those gold prices. But then again, most of the things from cs you can get cheaper off players. Or you need to merchant/be smart with your money. You can still get by as f2p.


I don't think the company is to blame. People who accept those high prices are. ^.~

Fintan - Lost City

It's not like gold went from a few hundred K to 2M overnight. As the playerbase can afford more, the price goes up. Normal inflation, there.

Also, there's just over 50 units of gold for sale on LC at this moment. That's an absurdly small number, historically. That indicates that either there's a coordinated effort to constrain supply (sorry, the playerbase isn't coordinated at all b:surrender), or that people aren't buying zen with cash (and invoking supply and demand economics).

If we really were upset with the state of affairs, we'd all stop buying and the number of gold for sale in the AH would be near zero, on all servers. That would increase the buy price with coin, yes. But it'd also get the point across, via their P&L, that the playerbase really doesn't like their current approach to the game.

But since it seems much of the playerbase really doesn't care and they just want to complain, it's kind of irrelevant. b:shocked

lordmarik25

if gold price is high people will buy up more gold hence PWI stacks** paper to the ceiling but I buy gold whatever price is at, I don't believe a GM would buy gold...or maybe I don't want to beleive...

LosTEscape - Lost City

Even in a private server its forbidden for a GM to do anything in the game (like for example buy or sell gold) except "unstuck" ppl, spawn event mobs and such. They can get fired if they do otherwise.
Speaking about gold prices, its like IRL the "sugar" prices in Kwik-E-Mart went up but so did your salary.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

lordmarik25 wrote: »

if gold price is high people will buy up more gold hence PWI stacks** paper to the ceiling but I buy gold whatever price is at, I don't believe a GM would buy gold...or maybe I don't want to beleive...

I am assuming that KrittyCat is correct and that it is not within the powers granted to the GM accounts to be able to access the Gold Purchasing section of the Auction House even if they wanted to from work. That said, I am also going to go out on a limb and assume that it is really bad business for any company to artificially influence the economy of items sold to and from other players. I get this assumption based on my previous history with another gaming company that has historically tried to artificially influence this market by instituting artificial banned and restricted lists for items within their own game, as well as instituting various rarity levels for items within their own game, thereby artificially raising or decreasing the value of items within said game in such a way as to potentially hurt the sales of that game.

PWI has neither a strict definition of rarity levels for items. While various items have different chances of dropping either from mobs, or from token packs, they are in a strict sense no more rare or less rare than any other item in the game by the simple fact that these items can be infinitely farmed for or purchased on an infinite level. There is no restriction to the number of copies of any given item a person can have. Even Items such as Rank Gear can be possessed by a single character in duplicate!

Further as of the moment there is not one single item in the game, that has previously been released which is now banned from use by the players (at least not that I am aware of). Sure there may be limited release items, but there are no banned items that I can think of.

This means that the prices are almost entirely determined by US the players. Not by Perfect World Entertainment or Wanmei.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

KrittyCat wrote: »

Even then, it's only via user accounts, which have no more special privileges than any other players. A GM account cannot be used to buy or sell gold.

GM account spawns cash shop item
GM account trades items to player account
player account sells items
player buys gold with profits

your scenario does not paint a pretty picture, you should probably verify your information before you disseminate it from a position of perceived authority. it makes the company look bad.

or maybe...

KrittyCat wrote:

Stop posting threads just to see your text on a page.

Kthnx.

Zarni - Dreamweaver

It's been explained before.

Simple version:

When the game started, gold was 100k because no one had much coin, and there wasn't much of any use in the boutique.

When packs came out, gold went to 400k, to match the perceived value of the packs. On the average, packs will return around 400k coin from the best luck tokens (mostly) and combined totals of regular tokens and high value rare items.

2+ years later, packs are still valued around 400k. They now cost much less to buy in bulk with gold. When they cost 1 gold each, gold was 400k coin. When they cost 20 silver each gold is around 2 million coin.

Almost nothing else seems to be a factor in gold:coin ratio. Occasionally rank sales have had a temporary influence on prices, but that stabilized back in line with the pack:gold:coin equation after the first wave of people got their rank gear.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary

The GM's raise the price of gold just because they HATE YOU. They have to use a convoluted, stupid method of doing so, for no profit to themselves, or the company, espeically since the massive sale of items at a discount (sale) in the Boutique isn't going to do anything.

Sounds like good, solid logic to me.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

GM account spawns cash shop item
GM account trades items to player account
player account sells items
player buys gold with profits

your scenario does not paint a pretty picture, you should probably verify your information before you disseminate it from a position of perceived authority. it makes the company look bad.

or maybe...

this is of course assuming that the GM Accounts have the ability to spawn items without getting authorizations from an executive of the company.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

TolanSky - Heavens Tear wrote: »

this is of course assuming that the GM Accounts have the ability to spawn items without getting authorizations from an executive of the company.

yeah, im sure there is a board of directors meeting every time someone accidentally NPCs something.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

Asgardeus - Sanctuary wrote: »

Gold prices are controlled by players.

KrittyCat wrote: »

Does PWE hold a proverbial gun to players' heads to make them buy? No? Then it's the same as any capitalist economy.

This is not really true. The majority of the current gold price is determined by the company and not any player market.

Consider the anni pack: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/20191
Perfect -Token of Luck - 15 (97%)
Perfect -Token of Best Luck (1.715%)

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Just these two alone contribute:
15*10k*.97 + 5,000k*.01715 = 231k
231k to the value of the pack in total absence of any player market

The anniversary pack when bought in bulk costs 22 silver. Even factoring in the 2% AH fee.

231K / .22 / 1.02 = 1029 k

Just looking at the tokens from the Anniversary Pack and totally ignoring any player market and totally ignoring every other item in the Anniversary Pack gold would be pegged at 1.029M.

The tokens are contributing the majority influence on the price of gold, not the players. The player market is a minority influence.

Traz - Dreamweaver

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

This is not really true. The majority of the current gold price is determined by the company and not any player market.

Consider the anni pack: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/20191
Perfect -Token of Luck - 15 (97%)
Perfect -Token of Best Luck (1.715%)

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Just these two alone contribute:
15*10k*.97 + 5,000k*.01715 = 231k
231k to the value of the pack in total absence of any player market

The anniversary pack when bought in bulk costs 22 silver. Even factoring in the 2% AH fee.

231K / .22 / 1.02 = 1029 k

Just looking at the tokens from the Anniversary Pack and totally ignoring any player market and totally ignoring every other item in the Anniversary Pack gold would be pegged at 1.029M.

The tokens are contributing the majority influence on the price of gold, not the players. The player market is a minority influence.

+1 got to it before me

Devoted - Lost City

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

This is not really true. The majority of the current gold price is determined by the company and not any player market.

Consider the anni pack: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/20191
Perfect -Token of Luck - 15 (97%)
Perfect -Token of Best Luck (1.715%)

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Just these two alone contribute:
15*10k*.97 + 5,000k*.01715 = 231k
231k to the value of the pack in total absence of any player market

The anniversary pack when bought in bulk costs 22 silver. Even factoring in the 2% AH fee.

231K / .22 / 1.02 = 1029 k

Just looking at the tokens from the Anniversary Pack and totally ignoring any player market and totally ignoring every other item in the Anniversary Pack gold would be pegged at 1.029M.

The tokens are contributing the majority influence on the price of gold, not the players. The player market is a minority influence.

+1 I don't even have to post now. But I did.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

yeah, im sure there is a board of directors meeting every time someone accidentally NPCs something.

I didn't say the Board of Director's had to decide this type of thing. I said an Executive. I mean last I checked the Board of Directors had their offices in China. If we require a decision from people in China everytime something goes wrong in the North American and European Version of the Game, there would be a massive break down in the super structure of those versions of the game.

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Wait what? Last I checked the Tokens of Best Luck didn't sell to NPC's directly for much of anything at all (at best they sell for the same rate as the ordinary Tokens of Luck). It is only when you get TWO Tokens of Best Luck and convert them into a 10 Million Bank Note that you actually can consider the Tokens of Best Luck as actually being worth 5 mil a piece.

krisnda

TolanSky - Heavens Tear wrote: »

the Moderators are also players of the game in question.

Thanks. You do not know how many times people need to be corrected about this. b:surrender

Decus - Dreamweaver

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

This is not really true. The majority of the current gold price is determined by the company and not any player market.

Consider the anni pack: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/quest/20191
Perfect -Token of Luck - 15 (97%)
Perfect -Token of Best Luck (1.715%)

Those tokens of luck can be sold directly to an NPC for 10k each in coins and the Best Luck for 5m each.

Just these two alone contribute:
15*10k*.97 + 5,000k*.01715 = 231k
231k to the value of the pack in total absence of any player market

The anniversary pack when bought in bulk costs 22 silver. Even factoring in the 2% AH fee.

231K / .22 / 1.02 = 1029 k

Just looking at the tokens from the Anniversary Pack and totally ignoring any player market and totally ignoring every other item in the Anniversary Pack gold would be pegged at 1.029M.

The tokens are contributing the majority influence on the price of gold, not the players. The player market is a minority influence.

+ 3

Why people still dispute this is beyond me.

TolanSky - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Wait what? Last I checked the Tokens of Best Luck didn't sell to NPC's directly for much of anything at all (at best they sell for the same rate as the ordinary Tokens of Luck). It is only when you get TWO Tokens of Best Luck and convert them into a 10 Million Bank Note that you actually can consider the Tokens of Best Luck as actually being worth 5 mil a piece.

Your comment strikes me as odd given that you said exactly what Asterelle already said.

Mingkeey - Lost City

i cant wait till one gold is five mill each.hahahab:dirty maybe it will scare everyone off the game and play something elseb:dirty