Are Barbs still needed and respected?

Holdonimor - Harshlands
Holdonimor - Harshlands Posts: 2 Arc User
edited February 2012 in Barbarian
im starting to see less barbs,
Post edited by Holdonimor - Harshlands on
«13

Comments

  • StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear
    StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Nope.
    People are selfish, use them for their own needs up until they get to where they want.
    Sins rely on them, up until nirvana, then no body wants them.
    Clerics as well, but they have more of a fighting chance to get into squads like nirvana.

    Its understandable why barbs are a dying race, people need to get their own gear and such, so they make other classes to get to their goal, most obvious one is a sin.

    <100 Barb
    <100 Sin
  • XylolyX - Heavens Tear
    XylolyX - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,097 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Depends if you're a good barb or not. The people i squad with would rather take a good non-aps barb into Nirvy than a fail-5.0 Sin. Goes faster too.

    But overall, barbs are usually put away after 100 and taken out for TW or buffs.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Lvl10XBarb
    Lvl10XArcher
    lvl10XAssassin
  • Nine_Lives - Raging Tide
    Nine_Lives - Raging Tide Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    XylolyX - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Depends if you're a good barb or not. The people i squad with would rather take a good non-aps barb into Nirvy than a fail-5.0 Sin. Goes faster too.

    But overall, barbs are usually put away after 100 and taken out for TW or buffs.

    speaking of TW, if you want to get into a good tw fac, easiest way to get in is to be a barb.

    All the major TW facs in my server lowered their requirements for recruitment for barbs. They have some sort of monthly allowance so somehow your needs are being helped. A BM friend geared his barb with his old TT90 HA armor and TT 90 gold axes with decent refines and got the kitty in when his BM main gets thumbs down despite wearing the exact same thingb:shocked

    Though seekers are slowly budging in, barbs are still badly needed in delta.

    A lot of friends have delayed their cultis because of no good kitties around, despite having seekers and some op psys bragging they can tank delta.

    Hopefully the game does release a new instance though that will make barbs needed again
  • _Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear
    _Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear Posts: 562 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Barbs are still respected barbs are still needed, imagine tw or delta without barbs, realistically only aps barbs are needed or a sage barb for buffing outside of tw or delta.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    _Mg_Zr - level 100 sage Barb / level 101 demon r9 aps barb on Harshlands
    Mg_Zr - level 100 demon Psychic
    _mg_zr_ - level 100 demon Blademaster
    |\/|erlin_ 7x Wizard
    Makaveli_ - 8x Harshlands sin
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    People are selfish, use them for their own needs up until they get to where they want.

    I agree with this, but that's the same for any class. There is such an overwhelming number of sins that trying to find a BH on a sin is sometimes rough because every squad already has one, where finding a BH/FCC/zhen party on a barb is easy almost everytime. Even 100+ they are useful in Delta and metal, and most other BHs if for nothing more than a buff ****. Barbs get their pick of squads levels 1-99 then QQ when they can't find a squad 100+.

    They're always useful in TW. But only once well geared.

    They're one of the best pk classes. But only once well geared.

    Really, they're only mostly excluded from farming instances. Why bring a tank that doesn't DD when you can bring a DD that can out tank a barb?

    I think the real issue is barbs that specialize too much one way or the other. The pure vit "I R tank" barbs that are great for TW really aren't useful in pve because they can't hold aggro from a sin sneezing. Then some barbs focus on DD too early and don't have the hp to tank and end up just as useless in PvE.

    Barbs are actually super useful in squads because they DD on par with BMs, they get easier hp/defense than BMs, and they provide buffs and debuffs for the entire party. Good barbs never have a problem finding squads.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • HadesHound - Raging Tide
    HadesHound - Raging Tide Posts: 357 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    With my Barb, I am goin with a mix of STR and VIT. That way, I wont be the best at either, but I will still be able to do both.

    Case in point. Earlier today, I watched someone who was goin around trying to trick low level players into going into PK mode, just so she could PK them. She challenged me.

    I accepted.

    Her: "Hey, turn off protected!"
    Me: "No." BAM! BAM!

    VICTORY!

    Me: You glad I stayed in normal mode?

    Yet, when my two best friends in the game need help in an instance, they immediately yell for me to come do the whole thing for them lol.

    I think that, instead of specializing, being well rounded is better.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    It's not the years that matter, it's the milage that has true meaning. Do not spend your life trying to walk a mile in someone else's shoes. Walk the best path you can, and enjoy that journey.
    And ladies... Save a cowboy, ride a brony!
  • StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear
    StarStrukkk - Heavens Tear Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Yah, I love my barbie!
    The only way he could get into nirvs was through friends, randoms on world chat always do 5 man squads or less <_<
    Hence I made the sin to get my barbs gear lol
    I agree that its hard for a lot of classes to get into squads.
    Venos for the most part, always see them in the center looking for squads for an hour-or two.
  • thumbs
    thumbs Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

    Really, they're only mostly excluded from farming instances. Why bring a tank that doesn't DD when you can bring a DD that can out tank a barb?

    Barb doesn't = tank.

    Veno can be good dd, but most often they're not. They're often asked along for their debuffs regardless of survivability or dps. Barbs have a better pdef debuff, have an awesome patk buff, and with the HP buff increase the survivability of the squad which either keeps them alive and DD'ing or allows others to shift more into DD than tank survivability. Barb's Armageddon, hp per vit, and native speed is unmatched. Demon Barbs can increase crit rate on all party members. If a barb isn't wanted; it's probably because they're abilities aren't being exploited.

    I think the real issue is barbs that specialize too much one way or the other. The pure vit "I R tank" barbs that are great for TW really aren't useful in pve because they can't hold aggro from a sin sneezing.

    There isn't any reason to hold aggro from them. (Refer to Barb doesn't = tank). When not spamming Flesh Ream; they can spam Devour.
    Then some barbs focus on DD too early and don't have the hp to tank and end up just as useless in PvE.

    They still have useful skills like Frighten, Alacrity, Devour, Aggro reset, and buffs which is better than the assassins who can steal aggro but can't handle it any better.
  • _Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear
    _Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear Posts: 562 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I agree with this, but that's the same for any class. There is such an overwhelming number of sins that trying to find a BH on a sin is sometimes rough because every squad already has one, where finding a BH/FCC/zhen party on a barb is easy almost everytime. Even 100+ they are useful in Delta and metal, and most other BHs if for nothing more than a buff ****. Barbs get their pick of squads levels 1-99 then QQ when they can't find a squad 100+.

    They're always useful in TW. But only once well geared.

    They're one of the best pk classes. But only once well geared.

    Really, they're only mostly excluded from farming instances. Why bring a tank that doesn't DD when you can bring a DD that can out tank a barb?

    I think the real issue is barbs that specialize too much one way or the other. The pure vit "I R tank" barbs that are great for TW really aren't useful in pve because they can't hold aggro from a sin sneezing. Then some barbs focus on DD too early and don't have the hp to tank and end up just as useless in PvE.

    Barbs are actually super useful in squads because they DD on par with BMs, they get easier hp/defense than BMs, and they provide buffs and debuffs for the entire party. Good barbs never have a problem finding squads.
    As true as it can get i suppose
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    _Mg_Zr - level 100 sage Barb / level 101 demon r9 aps barb on Harshlands
    Mg_Zr - level 100 demon Psychic
    _mg_zr_ - level 100 demon Blademaster
    |\/|erlin_ 7x Wizard
    Makaveli_ - 8x Harshlands sin
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    _Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    As true as it can get i suppose

    Wait for it...wait for it... thumbs is busy making it untrue by sprinkling magical troll dust on it and taking as many things out of context as possible and finding irrelevant points to "fluff" his post. b:victory
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Vindis - Dreamweaver
    Vindis - Dreamweaver Posts: 614 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Barbs are alright. I only really see Sins/BMs complain if a barb is there that we could've used another DD. Clerics/Wizzy/Psys without high refines love the hp buff. And devour/SotT really does increase squad dps. Admittedly, Nirvy is easily doable with one high aps toon with BP and it doesn't really matter what the others in squad are. If you're a barb and you aren't wanted in squads you are doing something wrong.


    On my server, they are in high demand for nearly all instances (Delta comes to mind) and any squad with 2+ casters will be happy about it. As a pure bow archer, I quite enjoy not having to tank everything in Warsong when I aoe if there are no casters present.

    Random question: Does devour stack with cleric's phys def debuff? If no, which is the superior debuff? /curiosity.
    Ring Engraving/Amulet Carving Guide - pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1174451

    Retired from PWI.

    b:bye
  • Brickee - Heavens Tear
    Brickee - Heavens Tear Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    *rant alert*

    PVE:

    As a barb, you're done tanking at about 90-95ish.

    Even with clawbarian, other classes hold aggro better. In a squad past 90, you're good for buffs and devour. Bout it.

    I would go on instances, and Id be asked specifically to keep up devour and DD, and not touch any other aggro skills. And by god, they were right, it was a faster run and easier on the cleric in terms of who to heal. Not that I could keep aggro from 95+ 3.33-5APS chars consistently.

    I love my 21khp Demon Barb. I stopped playing him because my BM keeps aggro just as well, and does more damage, making the run more efficient.

    The fastest FCs I've done is with BMs and a Seeker, sometimes a Sin if there aren't enough BMs around. We crack out a 90+ Barb, Cleric, Mystic, and Sin for buffs, leave em outside, and go to town. Pre-95 as a three man team we finished the place in like 30 minutes, buffs expired right as we were doing heads. No one died, no one charm ticked, and I noticed little to no difference in how fast we cleared the place vs a full group.

    APS made barbs obsolete, BP made clerics/mystics obsolete, vortex made needing BB for big pulls obsolete, and sins are like a BM without HF. Every day I play I see a naked barb with names like "HPATKBuff" or "BufferBarb" 90+ in a city or outside of FC/TT/Etc.

    Eventually, PWI may give us an aggro increase so we can tank again and be more useful than buffers. But until then, I only crack out the Barb for crazy stuff like trying/succeeding to aoe pull Eden.

    Needed? Rarely.
    Respected? Only in those rare instances.
    Fun? Absolutely.
    Better tank than an APS BM with good refines and shards? Hell no.

    If they fixed the Barb aggro issue vs the 5APS characters (hell, give us claws as a kitty form weapon and claw mastery skill), I'd play my barb again. I love tanking.

    PVP:

    If you enjoy the charm-**** gank fest bore that is TW, or like egotistical phallic whip fests that is PVP, Barbs rock.

    I enjoy the skill selection I have with my BM for it better, but I've had a blast doing some pvp on my Barb.

    I get a lot of "Whoa, 21khp, I have to duel you!" and I stand up and arma the Sin. Few times I let my hp go down to about 3-4k, get em hoping, and hit ToP. Using roar is funny too.

    Also:

    "I only really see Sins/BMs complain if a barb is there that we could've used another DD. "

    I actually see the opposite when my BM is brought into a group, that they would have preferred a Barb. But its mostly a same-class envy issue.

    I do get hounded to run FF or TT more on my Barb when I log on for dailies than my BM though, but I think that is due to class saturation.

    Honestly, if you throw a rock in any zone, you hit about 12 Sins and 7 BMs. Venos and Barbs are a rare nearly extinct sighting, and should be put in zoos so people can get a refresher and remember what they look like.

    Archers and Psys are like that rare classic car you see on the road every now and then, but usually its because of some convention or event they're having.

    I haven't grouped with or seen a Wizzie outside of PVP/TW in the last 2 months, let alone under level 100. I'm not even sure they're selectable as a new character class when you start up PWI anymore.

    I actually need to ask some fac mates what Clerics and Mystics do to level past 92/95 as they are no longer needed in FC. Oracles? Exp Cards? Wishful thinking?
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Vindis - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Random question: Does devour stack with cleric's phys def debuff? If no, which is the superior debuff? /curiosity.

    Veno Myriad Rainbow = 100%
    Veno Demon Ironwood = 100%
    Veno SageIronwood = 40%
    Veno lvl 10 Ironwood = 30%
    Barb Devour = 50%
    BM Glacial Spike=50%
    Barb Sage Penetrate Armor = 45%
    Barb Demon/lvl 10 Pentrate Armor = 35%
    Cleric Sage/Demon Dimensional Seal = 40%
    Cleric lvl 10 Dimensional Seal = 30%
    Pet Pierce = 20% (If curious)

    I believe all of them overwrite each other, none of them stack. They can be stacked with physical debuffs like Tangling Mire, though.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Brickee - Heavens Tear
    Brickee - Heavens Tear Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Sakubatou is correct, they don't stack and will overwrite each other with the newest one cast. Coordinate with your group if you plan to be the devour-bot.


    Also of note from the mystic forums/skills DB:

    Befuddling Creeper
    [snip]For comparison, other class pdef debuff %s are:

    Barb: 50% (Lv 10-11 devour), 30% (Lv10 Penetrate Armor); 35% (Lv 11 Penetrate Armor)

    Venomancer: 30% (Lv 10 ironwood scarab); 40% (Sage Ironwood Scarab); 0% (Demon Ironwood Scarab, though 20% chance of 100%), 36% (Lv 5 Penetrate Armor pet skill)

    Cleric: 36% (Lv 10 Dimensional Seal), 40% (Lv 11 Dimensional Seal)

    Blademaster: 50% (Lv 10-11 Glacial Spike)

    Summons a Befuddling Creeper, which may reduce Attack Rate and Casting
    Speed of nearby enemies by 40% and reduce Physical and Magic Defenses
    by 20% for 6 seconds.
    Befuddling Creeper's Lysing deals moderate damage and has a high chance
    to Slow, Weaken, Distract, and Stupefy enemies for 18 seconds.
  • CarefulIBite - Raging Tide
    CarefulIBite - Raging Tide Posts: 45 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    Holdonimor - Harshlands wrote: »
    im starting to see less barbs,

    Thats nothing new barbs are underplayed. I'm actually seeing more barbs now then i have before.
  • SirChad - Raging Tide
    SirChad - Raging Tide Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    Who cares if barbs are needed or not? They are fun to play. Being 5 aps is not so fun. Okay... for the first few minutes you are 5 aps.. you're like "whoa look at my char go! He's fast!"

    Later you get bored because how easy everything is. Want something fun and challenging or something easy and boring? That's up to you.

    Hey.. some people like having to do nothing other than click attack then going to grab a drink.

    PWE will continue to make new classes even more OP than the last. Until PWI dies. (Which isn't that far away)
    ~I only put one post on each thread. So you can rage at me but know.. i will never see it~
  • Ryuhei - Heavens Tear
    Ryuhei - Heavens Tear Posts: 41 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    All i'll say is that i think we can all agree the daily begging for buffs is annoying. b:laugh
  • CrusherJam - Dreamweaver
    CrusherJam - Dreamweaver Posts: 550 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    OMG you guys forget the best reason we are here

    Buffs? naw....

    Tanking ? Naw....

    Human Mount? DING DING DING.


    b:laugh

    I provide free rides from our factions AFK spot in arch to the Banker, Bounty Hunter and

    anything else you may need.

    For non Faction members i pretend I charge but usually don't for a round trip to your

    destination and back. Some times i claim i want Pesos or some fresh meat.

    The best thing about being a Barb-o-Mount is if we haul you around outside towards a

    destination and something stops us we can bite back :-)

    :Take that ground mounts:

    Sage Barb FTW.
    19k Hp and rising my goal is 20k unbuffed (would love 25k )
  • ZackMystic - Harshlands
    ZackMystic - Harshlands Posts: 325 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    CrusherJam - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    OMG you guys forget the best reason we are here

    Buffs? naw....

    Tanking ? Naw....

    Human Mount? DING DING DING.


    b:laugh

    I provide free rides from our factions AFK spot in arch to the Banker, Bounty Hunter and

    anything else you may need.

    For non Faction members i pretend I charge but usually don't for a round trip to your

    destination and back. Some times i claim i want Pesos or some fresh meat.

    The best thing about being a Barb-o-Mount is if we haul you around outside towards a

    destination and something stops us we can bite back :-)

    :Take that ground mounts:

    Sage Barb FTW.

    My goldfish accepts your challenge XD
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    78 Mystic ZackMystic
    95 BM ZackBlade
    Retired in March 2012, thx DarkNova for the fun.
    Exiirah made this purely awesome signature b:pleased Many thanks to her
  • CrusherJam - Dreamweaver
    CrusherJam - Dreamweaver Posts: 550 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    ZackMystic - Harshlands wrote: »
    My goldfish accepts your challenge XD

    +1 b:pleased
    19k Hp and rising my goal is 20k unbuffed (would love 25k )
  • Miugre - Heavens Tear
    Miugre - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,390 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    All I can say to this thread is... respect is relative. If you're an oldschool barb, don't try getting respect from the "omg nirv runs longer than 5 min = fail" crowd. Hang with people who actually appreciate a real tank, and you'll find your problem solved. :P

    BTW, I've also found that decreasing the number of sins in a given squad for, say, FF, tends to mellow them out a little bit. On my barb I've been putting together the squads lately, and when I recruit randoms, I have a hard-set rule of "no more than one sin per squad." Generally this results in the weeding-out of the impatient kiddies, because if one of them DOES get in the squad, they'll usually ragequit five minutes in when they realize it won't go half as fast as they'd like it to go. Well, either that, or they can stay and continue to complain loudly until I kick them (which, admittedly, can be very therapeutic). :P

    Either way, I wholeheartedly recommend this tactic.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Yes, I'm still a stubborn holdout in favor of the old game. Haters gonna hate. ;]

    Other Active Characters:
    LigerKing (Barb), Girasole (BM), Shamsheer (Sin), ArborSoul (Mystic).
  • Nine_Lives - Raging Tide
    Nine_Lives - Raging Tide Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    ZackMystic - Harshlands wrote: »
    My goldfish accepts your challenge XD

    b:shocked but, but...you cant embrace a goldfish!b:shocked

    And fur does keep you warm especially now that it is snowingb:cute
  • fuzzywuzz
    fuzzywuzz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    If you're an oldschool barb, don't try getting respect from the "omg nirv runs longer than 5 min = fail" crowd. Hang with people who actually appreciate a real tank, and you'll find your problem solved. :P

    The panda approves of this msg. b:cute
    Need to talk to Fuzzy?
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  • XylolyX - Heavens Tear
    XylolyX - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,097 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    Know what helps those runs stay short? Sage Devour....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Lvl10XBarb
    Lvl10XArcher
    lvl10XAssassin
  • Stressedout - Dreamweaver
    Stressedout - Dreamweaver Posts: 119 Arc User
    edited December 2011
    XylolyX - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Know what helps those runs stay short? Sage Devour....

    Know what makes it even better? Demon Devour b:laugh
    frankieraye

    Oh the snowmen are coming, don't you worry..
  • Lolgasmic - Raging Tide
    Lolgasmic - Raging Tide Posts: 1,315 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Ryuhei - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    All i'll say is that i think we can all agree the daily begging for buffs is annoying. b:laugh

    This.

    I don't even have Lvl11 buffs, yet I still get pestered for them to the point it pisses me off.b:angry
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Barbarian 103 - 101 - 101
    Started playing on March 2010
  • Must - Lost City
    Must - Lost City Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Got on game a week ago, with months of not being active and i can tell you that i find it harder to get bh squads on my sin wich is wayyy better than Must..
  • Hazarduz - Heavens Tear
    Hazarduz - Heavens Tear Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Heres something I actually saw a week or so ago in HT WC.......


    "LFM Abba, 2spots, got cleric, LF a tank and a barb" b:angry b:surrender b:cry
    Old school demon tank -> LESS PEW PEW, NO Q _Q

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Vindis - Dreamweaver
    Vindis - Dreamweaver Posts: 614 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    I had a BH59 earlier on my barb and the cleric kept healing the seeker. I was confused, so I asked why they weren't healing me more. I was told they had never squadded a barb before :x
    Ring Engraving/Amulet Carving Guide - pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1174451

    Retired from PWI.

    b:bye
  • Must - Lost City
    Must - Lost City Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited January 2012
    Vindis - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I had a BH59 earlier on my barb and the cleric kept healing the seeker. I was confused, so I asked why they weren't healing me more. I was told they had never squadded a barb before :x

    LOOOOOOL, i really dont mind if we see less and less barbs, why, well if there only few of us ppl will take me anywere cause im rare...

    Its true ppl always pming me to do full GVs , cause they cant get a barb.. lets see on 2x if i cant get vanna like crazy, since i have demon devour...

    All i can say is less barbs more profit for me....

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