Interrupt Channelling in PK/Duels not effective as in PVE

GohRaL - Sanctuary

Hi there, if your thinking this thread is about the CC glitch, your in the wrong thread.


My thought was about those skills that can interrupt an enemie's skill channelling such as:

-Alacrity (Barb)
-Shadowless Kick (BM)
-Kinfe Throw (Sin)
-Earthquake (Genie)

and so on...


What i was wondering is, how come that when we use it on mobs/bosses and we succed to interrupt the channeling the enemy lose the magic attack and it goes on CD (usually 10sec) but when we use it against another character it will just stop it but not put it on CD ?


When the skill is interrupted for a player, we are able to cast it right away, as if nothing happened. The log say "Interrupted" but then we can cast it a second later.

What i think would be much more interesting is to make it so when a player skills is interrupted it will conusme the MP and the eventual CHI as usual, but also put the skill on CD so the interruption has a meaning...

I dont get whats the point of interrupting a skill if the player can cast it right away.



How is working atm:

Barb VS BM

-The BM is about to cast Roar of the Pride (b:angry), the Barb is able enough to cast Alacrity in time and he cancels it.
-The BM loose his cast, but is able to use it in a matter of a split second later.
-Barb get stunned b:cry


How should work imo:

Barb VS BM

-The BM is about to cast Roar of the Pride (b:angry), the Barb is able enough to cast Alacrity in time and he cancels it.
-The BM loose his cast
-???
-Porfit



This is unfair to me. Why, if we have the capacity to interrupt skills that are a pain in the back, cant we fully enojy the situation ?


This change will get a big change in PK imo, and also make it more enjoyable. Now that there's 1-shot fest it might also get the non r9 classes with a few experience in fights stand a chance on other r9 opponents

What do you think ?

truekossy

No... just... no.

Assuming this isn't a troll, think about it for a second. Bosses don't have cooldown times. They have patterns and will cast magic once every X seconds. If you go run up to a pure caster mob and cancel the channel, all that happens is it starts over again immediately afterwards.

Same thing applies to players. Plus, if you interrupt them, it's possible to throw off a combo or save yourself for long enough to do something else to survive if they try again immediately afterwards.

Kagizyu - Heavens Tear

I think its a cool idea, but if you face an all magic mob... it still reuses the skill. And if you fight a mag/phy at a range. When you interrupt its at face of the person. So you get hit with the physical damage the mob was originally "macroing" too

GohRaL - Sanctuary

I was thinking of this to be used against players.

If you face a magic mob, he will just continue to cast magic as before. The interrupted attack will vanish, but then he will continue to attack you with magic attack.
Skip the CD part on mobs, because is not the right way of express it, pattern is better.

This change wouldnt affect in any way the combat agaisnt mobs/boss, cuz they follows pattern as you said.

If the attack is canceled on melee range, he will continue with phy attack
If the attack is canceled on long range, he will continue with magic attack




@truekossy: have you ever been able to cancel a roar of the pride ? short channel, long stun. i think is the fastest stun in game compared to the high rate of succes it has.

If you do manage to cancel it you will have maybe a second before he can cast it again, and as i said before is a very fast channel. Almost no time to be able to conuter it unless you land a stun or whatever.

What im wondering here is to have the full effect on a proper interruption, which would be to have the skill interrupted being put on cooldown

Kagizyu - Heavens Tear

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

I was thinking of this to be used against players.

If you face a magic mob, he will just continue to cast magic as before. The interrupted attack will vanish, but then he will continue to attack you with magic attack.
Skip the CD part on mobs, because is not the right way of express it, pattern is better.

This change wouldnt affect in any way the combat agaisnt mobs/boss, cuz they follows pattern as you said.

If the attack is canceled on melee range, he will continue with phy attack
If the attack is canceled on long range, he will continue with magic attack




@truekossy: have you ever been able to cancel a roar of the pride ? short channel, long stun. i think is the fastest stun in game compared to the high rate of succes it has.

If you do manage to cancel it you will have maybe a second before he can cast it again, and as i said before is a very fast channel. Almost no time to be able to conuter it unless you land a stun or whatever.

What im wondering here is to have the full effect on a proper interruption, which would be to have the skill interrupted being put on cooldown

Yeah I see what you mean, and psys and wizzies can stun faster in tandem with tide/sutra ijs. .1 stun sucks.

BerserkBeast - Sanctuary

I agree with the OP channeling interruption(C.I.),sucks in PvP compared to PvE.

In PvE we face dumb bosses that repeat the same pattern over and over again,so C.I. works"As it should".

In PvP its dumb(Especially if you got some lag),because the opponent can simply cast right away again.

In my opinion C.I. should be considered as some sort of Magic"Disturbance",that not only stop channeling,but Seal for a short period of time(1-2 secs preventing other magic attacks),the opponent(Note that there have to be a C.I. for the Seal to apply).

Off course a change like this would break PvP even more in favor to Sins(Less impact on other classes),that already eat mages alive(Well maybe not Psy),but the basic concept is right.

StormHydra - Sanctuary

This would nerf wizards even more.

ohwait who cares about them?

TheDan - Sanctuary

The main reason you can't really "interrupt" skills with much success is because interrupt skills have channeling times as well. Take your .6 second cast time of roar minus .2 second cast time of shadowless kick and you only have .4 seconds to react to it, minus ping differences.

Things like BIDS / Blade Tempest can be interrupted easily with Shadowless Kick, but in PvP people use silence to do the job, not canceling their cast.

Canceling cast just isn't as effective as silence, the only times I'll use Shadowless Kick is in TW on barbs that are trying to bind to cat scrolls. Otherwise Smack / other silence skills are better.

Skills are roar are better evaded by leaping out of it (if you're a BM / wiz), since it's "instant cast."

Joshcja - Sanctuary

TheDan - Sanctuary wrote: »

The main reason you can't really "interrupt" skills with much success is because interrupt skills have channeling times as well. Take your .6 second cast time of roar minus .2 second cast time of shadowless kick and you only have .4 seconds to react to it, minus ping differences.

Things like BIDS / Blade Tempest can be interrupted easily with Shadowless Kick, but in PvP people use silence to do the job, not canceling their cast.

Canceling cast just isn't as effective as silence, the only times I'll use Shadowless Kick is in TW on barbs that are trying to bind to cat scrolls. Otherwise Smack / other silence skills are better.

Skills are roar are better evaded by leaping out of it (if you're a BM / wiz), since it's "instant cast."

shadowless kicking a WoGing archer is hilarious though

GohRaL - Sanctuary

The fact is that i can (not easily) interrupt some skills, just need to know opponent and time his timing...

What im asking is to put skill on CD after it got interrupted

Joshcja - Sanctuary

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

The fact is that i can (not easily) interrupt some skills, just need to know opponent and time his timing...

What im asking is to put skill on CD after it got interrupted

Only If I get CCing back >_>

GohRaL - Sanctuary

Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »

Only If I get CCing back >_>

Sry, this is not a viable trade...


Ur asking for a glitch to be put back in use, while im asking to fullfill the effect of some skills



OFF: you did good not to join my vana runs today josh, even if it was fast. After 2 runs i left cuz they were scammers...3 cannies (opened by me and my guildie) in 2 runs, cmon.

TheDan - Sanctuary

Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »

shadowless kicking a WoGing archer is hilarious though

Or kicking a barb trying to invoke... lol. I put my shadowless kick hotkey next to my smack so when smack's in CD I'll kick instead.

Joshcja - Sanctuary

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sry, this is not a viable trade...


Ur asking for a glitch to be put back in use, while im asking to fullfill the effect of some skills



OFF: you did good not to join my vana runs today josh, even if it was fast. After 2 runs i left cuz they were scammers...3 cannies (opened by me and my guildie) in 2 runs, cmon.

Ikr? WC peoples suuuuuck on our server

Also my all time fav use of kick is to drop squad in tt and kick somone digging a chest and take that chit, used to do it to my farmign partner all the time

LilNai - Harshlands

**** no.

I have enough hassle trying to cast spells at times as it is (On Wizard) I really do not need to put anything upto 6 of them into cooldown without effect.

Thats not a joke btw, FoW going on CD without working would be a near death sentence in PvP, getting wallopped trying to cast WotP sucks **** as it is, since it tends to be alternating CD with Distance shrink.

megaseeker

there is sumthing named drake bash n will of the bodhisattvab:quiet

DaKillanator - Raging Tide

Nty. Your idea works in that one example, but if wasting a wizard's sparks in TW was as simple as interrupting his channeling, we'd lose a lot of effectiveness.

Besides, it's not like there's some huge issue about BMs being OP. Try using some of your creativity to think up a sin nerf.

Not like any of it would be implemented anyways though...

Fresh_Corpse - Sanctuary

DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »

Nty. Your idea works in that one example, but if wasting a wizard's sparks in TW was as simple as interrupting his channeling, we'd lose a lot of effectiveness.

Besides, it's not like there's some huge issue about BMs being OP. Try using some of your creativity to think up a sin nerf.

Not like any of it would be implemented anyways though...

Lower dagger base damage to fist base damage, remove GoF, stealth only functions in pve.

Tada! Will never be done but It would fix the damage issue and stealth issue while leaveign sins their core pvp abilities.

ElderSig - Dreamweaver

If you want something like this you better take away the % chance of all normal melee hits interrupting, because I think it's bullcrap that I can be interrupted with a normal attack but can't stop you from auto-attacking with a gush.

GohRaL - Sanctuary

DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »

Nty. Your idea works in that one example, but if wasting a wizard's sparks in TW was as simple as interrupting his channeling, we'd lose a lot of effectiveness.

3spark is instant cast, no channelling to interrupt, i fail to get your point here


If it is possible to cancel a 3spark cast (never ever heard of) then its my bad

ElderSig - Dreamweaver wrote: »

If you want something like this you better take away the % chance of all normal melee hits interrupting, because I think it's bullcrap that I can be interrupted with a normal attack but can't stop you from auto-attacking with a gush.

MAGIC NEVER MISS

Auto attack is not a skill.

Skills hits way harder.

I have yet to see someone 1-shot anyone with a normal attack.

There's sonething called kiting, and you mage should be able to use it (forget sins)

APS is broke, do i really need to say that ?



The chance of interrupt a skill with a normal attack are unknow to me, im only talking about C.I. skills (100% / very high 70%)

LilNai - Harshlands

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

3spark is instant cast, no channelling to interrupt, i fail to get your point here


If it is possible to cancel a 3spark cast (never ever heard of) then its my bad


Wizards rarely 3spark. We cast our Ultis, they take 2 chi and take upto 5 seconds (Usually around 3.5 in engame gear). We lose chi when we kite, our sleep takes chi.


Auto attack is not a skill.

Skills hits way harder.

I have yet to see someone 1-shot anyone with a normal attack.

There's sonething called kiting, and you mage should be able to use it (forget sins)

APS is broke, do i really need to say that ?

Its not APS, its autoattack at all. Every single hit has a chance to interrupt and even a measly 2aps makes it close to impossible to pull off anything outside of FoW.

GohRaL - Sanctuary

LilNai - Harshlands wrote: »

Its not APS, its autoattack at all. Every single hit has a chance to interrupt and even a measly 2aps makes it close to impossible to pull off anything outside of FoW.

I edited my previous post cuz i missed something...


You cant compare a FoW, 28meter range, with a RotP which has just 5meter range.

The channel is so fast that you are able to cancel it only if you cast the C.I. skill in the same moment of your opponent. That could happen only if you know your enemy enough and you have timed his stuns. And ofc if your in range.



For the ulti part. You have sutra, add there a chi pot + cloud eruption and you have 2 sure ultis in a row, with no channelling.


Again, if a mage stays in melee range in TW, unless he's been ganked, is doing it wrong.

Range + AOE nuke = TW owning and we all know that

LilNai - Harshlands

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

I edited my previous post cuz i missed something...


You cant compare a FoW, 28meter range, with a RotP which has just 5meter range.

The channel is so fast that you are able to cancel it only if you cast the C.I. skill in the same moment of your opponent. That could happen only if you know your enemy enough and you have timed his stuns. And ofc if your in range.



For the ulti part. You have sutra, add there a chi pot + cloud eruption and you have 2 sure ultis in a row, with no channelling.


Again, if a mage stays in melee range in TW, unless he's been ganked, is doing it wrong.

Range + AOE nuke = TW owning and we all know that

No, you missed it entirely.

Sutra has a cooldown, Pots have a cooldown, genies are put to better use.

A sutra combo is actually harder to pull of than youd think. Theres latency in the effect, if you use it and try to cast too soon, youl start channelling before sutra hits and that will waste half of your 6 seconds, you either finish the spell (Can waste sutra completely) or you cancel and recast the spell (With your ideals this would waste the spell, and basically waste Sutra again).

FoW is rarely used at a distance, you dont use it on something that isnt a threat, you use it on something in your face to give yourself a chance to gtfo.

If BIDS is cancelled, thats 2 sparks gone, for nothing, and its now on a 30 second cooldown. Sutra doesnt actually make all spells instant channel, it grants a bonus of something like =95% channel, they can, and will, be interrupted on occasion.

You are trying to cancel what is supposed to be a reliable stun and you can do so. It will not instantly be recast, there will be a gap, because nobody expects it to be cancelled. If you want the skill to go on cooldown, you need to cancel the cast. BMs can do it by leaping back at the right moment, Wizards can do it by Distance Shrinking at the right moment.

---
Lets, for a moment, just showcase what would happen for your ideals :

Wiz channels BIDS
Assassin Stuns, CDing BIDS, starts to kill, assuming he doesnt succeeed we continue
Wiz Shrinks and tries FoW
Sin Knife throws, FoW on cooldown, Jumps to the Wiz and tackling slashes before the wizard is out of range.
Wiz now has to AD / Expel or die. Uses Expel, survives and runs like hell. Gets a distance and sleeps the Sin. Runs some more hoping hes rescued, because he doesnt have anythign left until he can FoW again, which in all likely hood will be cancelled and the cycle begins again.

---

Thats not the best way to lay it out, im really not good at writing that sort of thing. To put it simply, all you would do is make Wizards, Clerics, Venomancers and Mystics worse off (Psychics have such little channel times theyre unlikely to get interrupted at the worst of times) and Assassins / Archers better off.

**** your ideal of cancelling Roar, just use an antistun pot and beat the **** out of the little punk.

GohRaL - Sanctuary

LilNai - Harshlands wrote: »

No, you missed it entirely.

Sutra has a cooldown, Pots have a cooldown, genies are put to better use.

What is best use of genie than killing ppl while in range ? The definition of glass cannon for mages is still there. If your the one of those that rather surive against 1 person than killing 10, im sry but TW is not for you

A sutra combo is actually harder to pull of than youd think. Theres latency in the effect, if you use it and try to cast too soon, youl start channelling before sutra hits and that will waste half of your 6 seconds, you either finish the spell (Can waste sutra completely) or you cancel and recast the spell (With your ideals this would waste the spell, and basically waste Sutra again).

Cancelling channelling (ESC) =/= Interrupt Channelling

Mastering your spell is your job, not mine. Since you wrote there's some weird circumstances it seems you know how to use it.

FoW is rarely used at a distance, you dont use it on something that isnt a threat, you use it on something in your face to give yourself a chance to gtfo.

Everything is a threath if we're accounting same gear in the 15m range. Dont tell me you check gear of the one that is charging at you ?

If he's close and your not stunned/sleeped you have shrink which has just 10sec CD or you can use HP. Anyway mages are good kiters except against sins

If BIDS is cancelled, thats 2 sparks gone, for nothing, and its now on a 30 second cooldown. Sutra doesnt actually make all spells instant channel, it grants a bonus of something like =95% channel, they can, and will, be interrupted on occasion.

Thats what im asking. An effective use of channel interrupting that leads to the skills being waisted

You are trying to cancel what is supposed to be a reliable stun and you can do so. It will not instantly be recast, there will be a gap, because nobody expects it to be cancelled. If you want the skill to go on cooldown, you need to cancel the cast. BMs can do it by leaping back at the right moment, Wizards can do it by Distance Shrinking at the right moment.

I dont know if cast cancelling is an intended feature. But thats not what im talking about

---
Lets, for a moment, just showcase what would happen for your ideals :

Wiz channels BIDS
Assassin Stuns, CDing BIDS, starts to kill, assuming he doesnt succeeed we continue
Wiz Shrinks and tries FoW
Sin Knife throws, FoW on cooldown, Jumps to the Wiz and tackling slashes before the wizard is out of range.
Wiz now has to AD / Expel or die. Uses Expel, survives and runs like hell. Gets a distance and sleeps the Sin. Runs some more hoping hes rescued, because he doesnt have anythign left until he can FoW again, which in all likely hood will be cancelled and the cycle begins again.

Why do you have to bring in sins ? I already wrote in another post. GL trying to kite a Sin, his tele stuns have longer range than your skills and with 2 sprints + HP is just non sense to kite him

---

Thats not the best way to lay it out, im really not good at writing that sort of thing. To put it simply, all you would do is make Wizards, Clerics, Venomancers and Mystics worse off (Psychics have such little channel times theyre unlikely to get interrupted at the worst of times) and Assassins / Archers better off.

Actually im just giving a suggestion for skilled player to have some more chances against facerolling r9 classes

**** your ideal of cancelling Roar, just use an antistun pot and beat the **** out of the little punk.

Answers in red

HardToThink - Lost City

Oh you adorable little pve'rs. Ask Blade_Aether for a lesson in interrupting b:heart

LilNai - Harshlands

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

Answers in red

God, go and play a ****ing Wizard. Your idea is stupid.

GohRaL - Sanctuary

@HardToThink: Im afraid that any answer from Blade_Aether in a barb matter is : Sage BO dont procs. b:bye

I told im well aware of how to cancel you little adorable pvper-im-better-than-you-cuz-im-LC

Im just asking what ppl would think of this change.



@LilNaI: 1st. Ive never insult you or what you said, so if you're short of subjects dont bring insults in just cuz you think this will only fak mages. kthxbye

2nd. Main and only barb here, all the knowledge i have from other classes is the one i got from fighting/squading with them.

Try to sustain a vaild argument. Up till now, you just made statements that Wiz would be hugely nerfed. Just cuz you dont know how to C.I. doesnt means that mages cant take advantage of this.

We all know wiz have long channelling time, but they also have sleeps and shirnks (OMG 20chi each, thats waaaaay to much chi)

ElderSig - Dreamweaver

Oh yeah let's use our OP wizard's sleep that last 4 seconds and has a 2 minute cooldown. We should be interrupting people all the time!

You already hurt most arcanes now when you cancel their skills. If I start channeling a 4 second skill, and you interrupt it at 3 seconds, that's 3 seconds I've lost and damage you've done to me. In your view, I would not only suffer damage during those 3 seconds and not channel my skill off, I should also have my skill thrown into cooldown and consume any chi it required (god I hope it wasn't an ulti).

Yeah, that sounds like it doesn't hurt those long channeling classes at all.

StormChimera - Lost City

ElderSig - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Oh yeah let's use our OP wizard's sleep that last 4 seconds and has a 2 minute cooldown. We should be interrupting people all the time!

You already hurt most arcanes now when you cancel their skills. If I start channeling a 4 second skill, and you interrupt it at 3 seconds, that's 3 seconds I've lost and damage you've done to me. In your view, I would not only suffer damage during those 3 seconds and not channel my skill off, I should also have my skill thrown into cooldown and consume any chi it required (god I hope it wasn't an ulti).

Yeah, that sounds like it doesn't hurt those long channeling classes at all.

^ QTF.


people who have no experience in playing Wizards should just shut up instead of trying to defend their weak argument

LilNai - Harshlands

GohRaL - Sanctuary wrote: »

@HardToThink: Im afraid that any answer from Blade_Aether in a barb matter is : Sage BO dont procs. b:bye

I told im well aware of how to cancel you little adorable pvper-im-better-than-you-cuz-im-LC

Im just asking what ppl would think of this change.



@LilNaI: 1st. Ive never insult you or what you said, so if you're short of subjects dont bring insults in just cuz you think this will only fak mages. kthxbye

2nd. Main and only barb here, all the knowledge i have from other classes is the one i got from fighting/squading with them.

Try to sustain a vaild argument. Up till now, you just made statements that Wiz would be hugely nerfed. Just cuz you dont know how to C.I. doesnt means that mages cant take advantage of this.

We all know wiz have long channelling time, but they also have sleeps and shirnks (OMG 20chi each, thats waaaaay to much chi)

1 sleep and a shrink that takes 20 chi every single time it is cast. If were using shrink, we lose chi, its already an evil penalty. The only skills we have with a sure interrupt are the aforementioned 120 second CD sleep and FoW, which has an 18-21 second CD. Your idea would **** wizards more than it would let you deal with BMs.

The reason you find so many Wizards attacking you for this idea is because it is stupid and would affect us hugely, moreso than anyone else. Im not offending you, im stating that your idea is poorly thought out and would have more negative impacts than it would positive. In other words, its a ****ing stupid idea.

truekossy

Agree so much with this idea just being stupid and utterly crushing casters.

Here's an idea, let's give invoke a 4sec channel time and THEN implement this. Also let's give Arma a 3 sec channel time too! Mighty Swing? 1.6 sec channel time. Slam? 2.5 seconds. Devour? 1.5 seconds. etc. you get the point.

Then after that, let's put this suggestion in the game and see how much he enjoys having his skills easily canceled, losing the chi/MP from the skill even though it failed, and then having it go into cooldown! Let's see how much he'd enjoy PvE as a barb doing large mob pulls where every single attack has a chance to interupt, having to deal with the large channel times, and dealing with the curse of casters where almost every time he's stuck with interupt spam... except he can't immediately recast his survial skill because it's now in cooldown and he has no chi for it so now he's dead.

You don't need to play a caster to see why this idea is terrible. You really don't. If you wanted to make this a reality, you'd have to change it so that ALL skills had such a small amount of channel time that interupting them at all becomes near impossible... and that would not only make -chan totally useless, but it would also cause more imbalance because then it would empower anyone with range by a fairly large amount. Think a wiz who has the 6 sparks to do a sutra double ulti combo is bad? you'll love it when, to balance this so it doesn't **** over casters, channel time is killed so they can skip sutra and do an undined double ulti or undined sparked ulti combo.