Was told that a veno is redundant, and now was informed that sins are the new barbs

angellicdeity

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »

1) R9 bows aren't very common and 2) the purge on a bow is pretty unreliable, seeing how it's a weapon proc. You cannot trigger it at will.

1) I think Sanctuary has rank 9 players mostly of other classes. Come on lost city and most of the rank 9's will be sins/archers/wizards.

2) I wouldn't say its unreliable. If you ever faced a rank 9 archer in game, if you survive more than 2-3 shots the 4-6th one usually is a nice spirit black hole proc. While they cant use it at will, its pretty reliable seeing as if they cant kill something in 2-3 shots a debuff might actually help.

Longknife - Harshlands

CaitlinDan - Heavens Tear wrote: »

First off, I have to make it clear, I'm not really good at MMORPGs in general, but I do enjoy playing PW and I would like to know that I'm playing something that is wanted in parties in the future and so on.

I started with a cleric, then rolled a veno and played both. Then someone informed me that Venos are completely outclassed by Mystics and that I should simply delete my veno because it is a complete waste of time, which was really sad because I loved playing it.

Mystics do outclass venos in everything....except for what you want.

Venos still have better debuffs, so it's actually quite common for there to be a squad of full sins/BMs doing a nirvana run + a lone veno that's there to amp damage/purge a certain boss. Mystic can't do that.

Cadeal - Dreamweaver

CaitlinDan - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Thank you for cheering me up on that point. (:

However, what about those claims that barbs are extinct/redundant and that sins are going to be the new tanks because of Blood Paint and demon spark? I love my noobie barb, does that mean I should stop?

About your barb:

No you shouldn't stop. They're not a redundant class, and get the exact same benefits from Blood paint and demon spark as a sin does. There's a good collection of end game barbs still scratching out a living in Nirvana, and moreso that can easily take down a sin.

Play whichever class you want to;

endlessseek wrote: »

Look i warned and made alot of post on this forums... BM and Sins are the best class.. But BM is the best deal for this game. Go 5 aps BM its cheapest and best 5aps DD. And most wanted in squads. And you can solo things with BM.

Endless... stop... just stop. You still have no idea what you're talking about.

DaKillanator - Raging Tide

Alright look OP, the simple fact of the matter is that sins are the best class for PvE and PvP. They will outshine everyone in almost everything, period.

Now that we have that out of the way...

You should play whichever class(es) are most enjoyable to you. End of story. Because you have to remember that this is a game, and if you ever find that your not enjoying yourself, then you have no reason to play it.

That said, I've personally rolled a sin, and allow me to tell you it's the most boring class in the world. Sins are basically the Easy mode for PWI. The reason that everybody doesn't have a sin is the same reason we don't all play Easy mode on our video games; it's not a challenge.


Now let me tell you what you can do that not every sin can do:

As a veno you can solo with a herc, which is multiple times cheaper than aps. You still have an excellent soloing class. You might be 3 times as slow as a sin in completing a TT, but then you payed about one eighth of what they payed for 5aps.

And your barb is still a good tanking class endgame. And barbs are very much wanted before endgame for things like FC. As a barb you would never be bored, you're always going to be needed somewhere.

You also might consider a psy, wizzy, or archer. All 3 of those classes outdo sins in Mass PvP like TW. I don't know how much you're interested in PvP, but if you are, and you don't just want to pick off people one at a time, those three classes I named could be good choices for you.

TigerLily - Lost City

Firefeng - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Any squad that would take a 3.33 aps DD (like my Sin...) over a Veno who can Amp Damage,Rainbow, Purge and Demon Ironwood are dumb. You don't invite a veno to Nirvana for pets...

Of course you dont invite venos for the pet or their normal attacks, you do it for the debuffs. If you have sage/demon amp and can use it on majority of bosses in NV its definitely way better than a 3.33 DD i agree, but in most runs you cant.

On many bosses, specially the annoying ones, venos only contribution would be landing a 100% armor break, if sage, using ironwood scarab for 40% break and buffing reflect.

You dont really need purge in NV, only boss that needs to be debuffed normally dies before he even gets a chance to buff himself. Or he does it once at most.

In a full 5.0 party i would definitely use the last spot for a skilled veno with sage/demon amp/Demon Nova over a 3.33 DD, even if several bosses aren't affected by Amp its mostly worth it. But majority of people running NV would (out of habit or beliefs) grab any aps DD over a veno. Thats just how it looks.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary

angellicdeity wrote: »

1) I think Sanctuary has rank 9 players mostly of other classes. Come on lost city and most of the rank 9's will be sins/archers/wizards.

2) I wouldn't say its unreliable. If you ever faced a rank 9 archer in game, if you survive more than 2-3 shots the 4-6th one usually is a nice spirit black hole proc. While they cant use it at will, its pretty reliable seeing as if they cant kill something in 2-3 shots a debuff might actually help.

Sanct does have a ton of R9. I suspect that Sanct has the most CSers of all servers...

And... Spirit Blackhole might Proc more often than HS, but it's not a 50% proc. A Veno with purge will trigger a purge at will, vs a weapons proc, which due to the FANTASTIC RNG (note the sarcasm) might proc twice in a row, or take 2-3 minutes to proc.

Azura - Lost City

TigerLily - Lost City wrote: »

Of course you dont invite venos for the pet or their normal attacks, you do it for the debuffs. If you have sage/demon amp and can use it on majority of bosses in NV its definitely way better than a 3.33 DD i agree, but in most runs you cant.

On many bosses, specially the annoying ones, venos only contribution would be landing a 100% armor break, if sage, using ironwood scarab for 40% break and buffing reflect.

You dont really need purge in NV, only boss that needs to be debuffed normally dies before he even gets a chance to buff himself. Or he does it once at most.

In a full 5.0 party i would definitely use the last spot for a skilled veno with sage/demon amp/Demon Nova over a 3.33 DD, even if several bosses aren't affected by Amp its mostly worth it. But majority of people running NV would (out of habit or beliefs) grab any aps DD over a veno. Thats just how it looks.

Don't forget about genie skills. A veno can contribute by using tangling mire while the others use frenzy. Also, in most squads I go many ppl only use genie only for holy path, so in those I contribute more than normal b:surrender

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

Don't forget about genie skills. A veno can contribute by using tangling mire while the others use frenzy. Also, in most squads I go many ppl only use genie for holy path, so in those I contribute more than normal b:surrender

If I holy path to a boss or something, by the time I get there, my genie is back to full energy again. High magic build ftw.

Meanwhile, someone not using holy path often times cannot even get to the boss/mobs until they're halfway dead, unless I wait for them.

FoxRunning - Heavens Tear

i have to adimit that i was very disheartened last night, when out in the Harshlands with my son and his baby cleric (trying to level him a little faster), i saw a Mystic with a Craglord, gathering up Nevistocks and killing them with a few whams. while there i was, having to do one at a time, with my lv82 Crystaline. i have a mystic, though she is just a baby, but im impressed with the pet,(though i wish to God they had picked something not so bloody butt ugly!!!!b:shocked)

if what i saw, with that Mystic and her pet is typical, venos are toast....b:cry

MAClNTOSH - Dreamweaver

The way I see it is to put the classes in tiers like a fighting game.

Sins are the god tier. They do the most DPS in PvE, and for PvP, they have the most options at any one given point, and can't really ever be put in a situation they can't escape from, while constantly pressuring their opponent.

Yet, just like in a fighting game, people play characters that are NOT god tier. Why? Because they want to, and they like how the character feels. Granted yes, you will see many more of the god tier characters running about generally dominating everyone/everything. But there are plenty of people who play the lesser characters and can do just as good if not better.

Baalbak - Dreamweaver

every class has its distinct role, something it does better than any other class. figure out what you want your role to be - and pick your class based on that. I would have to say though that unless you are interested in TW specifically where venos and barbs have a distinct role - a sin is a good choice for PvE specific gameplay. I enjoy how quickly my sin kills - i hate how squishy it is. (but i still solod all three fb19 caves without a charm at level 36 with a bit of kiting on the boss).