To all you APS users

ink333

So if supposedly the devs finally nerfed APS to 3.33 how many of you would ragequit?

B_K - Sanctuary

got 2 aps chars, but nope. played the game before ppl knew about aps will play after its gone if that ever happens

Quilue - Sanctuary

Farming takes too much work. I probably get more coin cat shopping and running events than farming.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

I'd stop taking arcanes to nirvana and fill their spots with people who have 3.33 aps.

Knownase - Heavens Tear

If it was nerfed............ uh.....still farm Nirv without a cleric and only with BP. :]

NeroKylar - Sanctuary

ink333 wrote: »

So if supposedly the devs finally nerfed APS to 3.33 how many of you would ragequit?

I'd resort to my veno XD

Kinjeto - Raging Tide

I'll be interested to see if they actually do.

Theres many components to the 5 APS thing:

- Theres armour
- Theres jewellery
- Theres the demon spark
and the final one is:
- The Jones blessing
(Which was broken recently -- and quite humourous it was as well..)

It also doesn't concern me either cause you can change back and forth at level 100 anyway. Using the Celestial Schism mold. It is probably just the spell casters who're complaining. Just like the same people who go "I'm bored"

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

A lot of arcanes would suffer most likely.

A lot of people don't realize how much help arcanes get from people with 4/5 aps.

I personally helped at least 10 arcanes finish their 99 key quest sunday.

Ankiel - Raging Tide

no doubt they will do it as soon as my sin hits demon spark...

(so you guys have some time )

vristion

Its not "5aps" in general hurting the game. Its when a class -coughsinscough- can force people to sit there and tank it is where its broken..

BMs 5aps hurt? Yea if you stand there and let them go all 5aps on ya, even so, most classes have skills to outstand their hits.... Barb 5aps? no problem run like hell...Sins? pushing the goto-town button is only option.

LadyLavinia - Lost City

Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »

A lot of arcanes would suffer most likely.

A lot of people don't realize how much help arcanes get from people with 4/5 aps.

I personally helped at least 10 arcanes finish their 99 key quest sunday.

Sounds good in the first view but In the second its really bad for me!
You HELPED arcane classes to finish the quest?
I would rather say they havent got ANY OTHER CHANCE THAN TAKING A 5.0aps freak with them O.o

Its every time the same (my opinions):
Arcane QQ about 5.0 cause they are useless --> TRUE
Barbs QQ cause they cant run NV without 3.33+ aps --> TRUE
AND NOW THE BEST!!!
5.0 QQ CAUSE THEY CANT FIND A BARB HOW CAN TANK GV OR 3-3!!!
I've often seen that in the world chat that ppl cant find a "normal" barb for their BH or Gv xDD

TheDan - Sanctuary

LadyLavinia - Lost City wrote: »

Sounds good in the first view but In the second its really bad for me!
You HELPED arcane classes to finish the quest?
I would rather say they havent got ANY OTHER CHANCE THAN TAKING A 5.0aps freak with them O.o

Its every time the same (my opinions):
Arcane QQ about 5.0 cause they are useless --> TRUE
Barbs QQ cause they cant run NV without 3.33+ aps --> TRUE
AND NOW THE BEST!!!
5.0 QQ CAUSE THEY CANT FIND A BARB HOW CAN TANK GV OR 3-3!!!
I've often seen that in the world chat that ppl cant find a "normal" barb for their BH or Gv xDD

Your argument is pretty invalid when it comes to people needing "normal" barbs for 3-3 or GV. I do most my full GVs at spawn point with no barb since barbs are pretty extinct. Barb buffs are nice, but not required. No one does GV anymore because FCC is way more EXP. Nowadays people can DD (BP) tank bosses so the barb really can never hold aggro.

It really depends on gear, you can't assume 5APS barbs cannot tank. There's plenty of 25-30K HP fist barbs out there with all +11 gear that tank better than "normal" vit barbs. Same goes for BMs, I see tons of 20K HP + BMs out there... build doesn't matter, it's a matter of like 100 stat points and difference of 2K HP. Last I checked there's hardly a noticeable difference between a 30K HP barb and 28K HP barb.

Tojop - Dreamweaver

Like most other sins, I'd switch to sage and be slightly less epic. Meh.

_Aubree__ - Dreamweaver

Sorry but helping arcanes do nirvana 99 keys? LOL well if they could get squads in the first place, they wouldn't need to do 99 key quests. IJS

Wunderkind - Dreamweaver

LadyLavinia - Lost City wrote: »

Sounds good in the first view but In the second its really bad for me!
You HELPED arcane classes to finish the quest?
I would rather say they havent got ANY OTHER CHANCE THAN TAKING A 5.0aps freak with them O.o

Its every time the same (my opinions):
Arcane QQ about 5.0 cause they are useless --> TRUE
Barbs QQ cause they cant run NV without 3.33+ aps --> TRUE
AND NOW THE BEST!!!
5.0 QQ CAUSE THEY CANT FIND A BARB HOW CAN TANK GV OR 3-3!!!
I've often seen that in the world chat that ppl cant find a "normal" barb for their BH or Gv xDD

Your point is invalid and it's what is wrong with this whole 5.0 situation. This weekends I did nearly 80 runs and no matter the squad makeup no run (even 99 key quests) took more then 8 minutes.

(3) 5.0s (2 sins +12 and 1 +11 BM) as a core of our group + any 3 random resulted in no difference for times. There is a point where Nirvana can't get any faster per run. This has a lot to do with skill cooldown for the vast majority of it. Barbs having a pure strength genie for tangling mire and devour easily make sup for a 5.0. This is also true for a good veno that knows when to amp. We were taking wizzards, venos, clerics, and with our core + whoever it just doesn't matter on the times per run. Most of the time it took longer to resquad and get back to Nirvana then to do the run.

I honestly feel that if you guys got your way and it was nerfed to 3.33 that 99.99% of squads that have APS WOULD shun ALL the arcanes out COMPLETELY because then it would actually start effecting the times per run dramatically. With that being the case I think all the arcanes would be much worse off then they are now.

As I have been saying this whole time, the problem has never been with 5.0 it's been with people thinking you need 5/6 5.0s in a squad to be the fastest. I'll take a competent squad of 2/3 5.0s + good support cleric/wiz/psy/veno over another 3 5.0s that are clueless about glacial spike and HF any day.

On a side note, they didn't say they were going to nerf 5.0, they said they were going to make it less useful. That means people will still be 5.0, it just wont play into the new instances (I presume).

TheDan - Sanctuary

_Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Sorry but helping arcanes do nirvana 99 keys? LOL well if they could get squads in the first place, they wouldn't need to do 99 key quests. IJS

If I had Nirvana squads, I'd refuse them anyways. Nirvana is a slow *** way of making money. TT and Lunar is where all the money is at. Nirvana has the mats that can be liquidated the easiest, but in terms of money in the long run, it sucks.

I save my 99 keys on purpose because it's not worth doing a 15 minute run and getting a 300K split on 1x, when I can invest 30 minutes and get a 2-3M split from TT/Lunar. b:bye

Kokki - Harshlands

rainbow squad in nirvana with runs under 10 mins all day long during 2x drops

you know that replacing a 5.0 bm with a rank 8 or better wizard speeds up the run right? if not go check out what a wizard can do in a squad to amp the damage. and btw the first 3 secs of a boss i was putting out 350K+ damage with a HF. so beat that 5.0 aps 4K crits users.

we had a "normal barb"
we had a 5.0 sin ( just happened to be available at that point )
we had a rank 8 veno
we had a rank 8 archer with BV ( bloodvow )
we had a rank 8 cleric
we had me, rank 9 wizard

i should have fraps'ed it, so that the all 5.0 APS classes would drop their jaws in awe, on how fast this runs goes.

Aesthor - Heavens Tear

ink333 wrote: »

So if supposedly the devs finally nerfed APS to 3.33 how many of you would ragequit?

I'm an archer. I got 5aps because bows fell behind in dps after 5 aps was available. If it goes away I don't see any problems with going back to my bow.


Plus nowadays I've only been logging on to TW and it's not like 5 aps is doing me much good there so I can honestly say I don't care if 5 aps goes away.

TheDan - Sanctuary

Kokki - Harshlands wrote: »

rainbow squad in nirvana with runs under 10 mins all day long during 2x drops

you know that replacing a 5.0 bm with a rank 8 or better wizard speeds up the run right? if not go check out what a wizard can do in a squad to amp the damage. and btw the first 3 secs of a boss i was putting out 350K+ damage with a HF. so beat that 5.0 aps 4K crits users.

we had a "normal barb"
we had a 5.0 sin ( just happened to be available at that point )
we had a rank 8 veno
we had a rank 8 archer with BV ( bloodvow )
we had a rank 8 cleric
we had me, rank 9 wizard

i should have fraps'ed it, so that the all 5.0 APS classes would drop their jaws in awe, on how fast this runs goes.

Where's the HF coming from if there's no BM? BV =/= HF. My G15 +10 fists will hit the first boss for 84K @ 5aps with HF, amp, subsea, tangling mire, and devour.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

_Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Sorry but helping arcanes do nirvana 99 keys? LOL well if they could get squads in the first place, they wouldn't need to do 99 key quests. IJS

They can get squads, they just don't try.


Over the weekend I ask in guild chat if anyone wanted to go run a nirvana, of all the people who replied, ONE was a mage.


Most of them don't get runs because instead of actively trying to get runs, they just sit around and QQ about 5 aps.


This is in a guild where 70+ ppl were online and 95% of the members are 100+.




And I see you suffer from the delusion that the people who only run with 5 aps would go with arcanes if 5 aps was nerfed, they won't.


Nirvana LF a DD, must have at least +10 rank 8 bow
Nirvana LF a DD, must have at least +10 weapon
Nirvana LF a DD, must have 3.33 aps
Nirvana LF a DD, no mages



And yea, lol @ 350k damage with HF, my guild has a sin that hits 200k crits at 4 aps with HF, Amp subsea and tangling mire.

Sthenith - Dreamweaver

I'm a long way from 5 aps, so i really can't comment on that, but if they somehow nerf the aps they can only do it in a couple of ways :

1. limit the aps = capping it at lower

2. remove -int gear.

3. making some instances harder for the aps users.

If 1. then it won't change much really, even a 3.33 is imo pretty awesome from my point of view ,
If 2. then there wil lbe an uproar like you've never seen before : removing -int means less value = losing heaps of cash,
if 3. then i don't really care because there will be other ways to farm certain instances.

I still don't understand why people get so hyped up over "faster" runs. Like it really matters if you do an instance in 10 minutes or 15. It's not like gaming for 5 minutes more makes a lot of difference.

When you see people WCing for squad/forming, you realize it takes a long time (usually) to even form a squad. Then the run is done in 8 minutes. then you WC again for half an hr before you get another sq going...etc etc. (talking genrally here, not only nirvy)

I'd love to go on nirvy runs to get my nirvana daggers, but i'm not since i'm not "5 aps" like so many morons in WC ask. So, do i buy the raptures then from those that do ? Hell no. I'll go with rank daggers and tell em to shove those raptures where the sun don't shine if i can't farm them myself at some point.

The only reason 5 aps is so "hyped" is because some idiots love wasting time on Wcing and hate spending time really "playing" the game and run an instance in less then 8 minutes.
I prefer running instances with peeps that have fun and "explore" different things then running an instance in record time and be bored waiting for a squad the next half hr.

Give me a squad where i'm laughing my *** off and have a good time over a record breaking 5 aps idiot squad anytime. Breaking records doesn't make friends, having fun does.

Kokki - Harshlands

TheDan - Sanctuary wrote: »

Where's the HF coming from if there's no BM? BV =/= HF. My G15 +10 fists will hit the first boss for 84K @ 5aps with HF, amp, subsea, tangling mire, and devour.

My bad, i meant Bloodvow not DG

Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »

They can get squads, they just don't try.


*Cut for random stuff*


And yea, lol @ 350k damage with HF, my guild has a sin that hits 200k crits at 4 aps with HF, Amp subsea and tangling mire.

considering that barrier thorns +12 with two garnet gems with for 30-50K crits in all amps, i wonder where that sin is pulling his damage from, prolly his ***. ( that specific sin was 5 aps +12 barrier thorns with two garnet gems and all 4 socket diamond of tiger geared ) even if you count another 30 attack levels and gods frenzy crits he won't be doing anything over 130K crits on all possible amps.

i do agree on 1 thing, arcanes don't get into squads because they don't try. i can get nirvana at any time i want, with full 4.0 APS+ squads....even clericless......

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

I still don't understand why people get so hyped up over "faster" runs. Like it really matters if you do an instance in 10 minutes or 15. It's not like gaming for 5 minutes more makes a lot of difference.

When you're running it hundreds of times then yes, it does make a big difference.

Nael - Dreamweaver

Sthenith - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I'm a long way from 5 aps, so i really can't comment on that, but if they somehow nerf the aps they can only do it in a couple of ways :

1. limit the aps = capping it at lower

2. remove -int gear.

3. making some instances harder for the aps users.

If 1. then it won't change much really, even a 3.33 is imo pretty awesome from my point of view ,
If 2. then there wil lbe an uproar like you've never seen before : removing -int means less value = losing heaps of cash,
if 3. then i don't really care because there will be other ways to farm certain instances.

I still don't understand why people get so hyped up over "faster" runs. Like it really matters if you do an instance in 10 minutes or 15. It's not like gaming for 5 minutes more makes a lot of difference.

When you see people WCing for squad/forming, you realize it takes a long time (usually) to even form a squad. Then the run is done in 8 minutes. then you WC again for half an hr before you get another sq going...etc etc. (talking genrally here, not only nirvy)

I'd love to go on nirvy runs to get my nirvana daggers, but i'm not since i'm not "5 aps" like so many morons in WC ask. So, do i buy the raptures then from those that do ? Hell no. I'll go with rank daggers and tell em to shove those raptures where the sun don't shine if i can't farm them myself at some point.

The only reason 5 aps is so "hyped" is because some idiots love wasting time on Wcing and hate spending time really "playing" the game and run an instance in less then 8 minutes.
I prefer running instances with peeps that have fun and "explore" different things then running an instance in record time and be bored waiting for a squad the next half hr.

Give me a squad where i'm laughing my *** off and have a good time over a record breaking 5 aps idiot squad anytime. Breaking records doesn't make friends, having fun does.

Who says you can't have fun AND have fast runs? Most squad that actually have fun usually run the instance multiple times anyway...unless they take 2 hours, in which case I'd imagine the members getting grumpy. Hell I formed a random WC squad and did about 15 Nirv runs, several minutes each with them and it was a blast because everyone had a sense of humor.

Doqui - Raging Tide

Kokki - Harshlands wrote: »

My bad, i meant Bloodvow not DG




considering that barrier thorns +12 with two garnet gems with for 30-50K crits in all amps, i wonder where that sin is pulling his damage from, prolly his ***. ( that specific sin was 5 aps +12 barrier thorns with two garnet gems and all 4 socket diamond of tiger geared ) even if you count another 30 attack levels and gods frenzy crits he won't be doing anything over 130K crits on all possible amps.

LAWL.... now scroll back and reread the post

done reading? oke so... why do you thing rawrgh said 4 aps and not 5?

...getting it now? b:bye

Rasis - Lost City

Nothing would happen. The game is boring anyway and I would just keep merchanting and be richer than you.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

30 - 50k crits with that? You high?


I crit 25k on a fully debuffed boss with my wimpy little +5 deicide with immaculate garnet.

Astraea - Raging Tide

Kokki - Harshlands wrote: »

My bad, i meant Bloodvow not DG




considering that barrier thorns +12 with two garnet gems with for 30-50K crits in all amps, i wonder where that sin is pulling his damage from, prolly his ***. ( that specific sin was 5 aps +12 barrier thorns with two garnet gems and all 4 socket diamond of tiger geared ) even if you count another 30 attack levels and gods frenzy crits he won't be doing anything over 130K crits on all possible amps.

i do agree on 1 thing, arcanes don't get into squads because they don't try. i can get nirvana at any time i want, with full 4.0 APS+ squads....even clericless......

im gonna guess that the sin rawrgh is talkin about is the 4aps +12 r9 sin in our fac

and eh, simple question: what do u think does more damage a G13 +12 nirv daggers at 5aps or G16 +12 rank 9 daggers at 4aps, both with jones blessings (min 30 att lv vs 60 att lv) doesnt rly take a genius to see that r9 zerk even at 4aps would make up for the damage done by having 4aps instead of 5 and uh yea, zerk dealing double damage

Tojop - Dreamweaver

Kokki - Harshlands wrote: »

rainbow squad in nirvana with runs under 10 mins all day long during 2x drops

you know that replacing a 5.0 bm with a rank 8 or better wizard speeds up the run right? if not go check out what a wizard can do in a squad to amp the damage. and btw the first 3 secs of a boss i was putting out 350K+ damage with a HF. so beat that 5.0 aps 4K crits users.

we had a "normal barb"
we had a 5.0 sin ( just happened to be available at that point )
we had a rank 8 veno
we had a rank 8 archer with BV ( bloodvow )
we had a rank 8 cleric
we had me, rank 9 wizard

i should have fraps'ed it, so that the all 5.0 APS classes would drop their jaws in awe, on how fast this runs goes.

My sin will easily do 700k+ during a single level 10 heaven's flame, no other debuffs except my frenzy and power dash. My daggers are +6. I have no problem bringing arcanes on nirv runs, but for the love of god don't start saying they will out DD a 5.0.

Obviously I would rather have a good veno than a bm who doesn't heaven's flame; that's not the point.

Xarathox - Dreamweaver

What I see happening if PW nerfed aps:

1. We've experienced DDoS attacks just a few days ago...Yeah, imagine that on a much larger scale. <.<

2. Or how about a mass exodus? All those you rely on to tank your BHs and ****? Gone. Better learn how to not be a squishy mage quick.

3. Charge per run. This I can see being the most probable. If you're a mage and not a cleric, bet on having to pay a fee just to even fill the spot.

Honestly, APS really isn't a mage's problem as to why they can't get nirvana runs. They're just lazy. Just grab a stack of tele's and go buck wild in WC. It really is that simple. Honest. I've seen it. o.o

SQUISHKASS - Sanctuary

Sorry but helping arcanes do nirvana 99 keys? LOL well if they could get squads in the first place, they wouldn't need to do 99 key quests. IJS

It's not that they can't get squads, it's just that most don't wana be bothered to go with other wizes & "normal" barbs for a 1h 99 run.

and btw the first 3 secs of a boss i was putting out 350K+ damage with a HF. so beat that 5.0 aps 4K crits users.
crits he won't be doing anything over 130K crits on all possible amps.

The 1st few seconds of boss under HF, I hit around 150k, I don't think that's with all the amps either.

But I do agree that non aps users can deal decent dmg & having a full aps squad in an instance like nirv isn't necesery; I rather have a veno or anyone else that can debuff decently...