O.o at this cleric in bh fire

Futurelord - Dreamweaver

hugoredbone wrote: »

Well since healing and DD spells for a cleric are both based on the same stats a "DD" cleric would also be able to heal unless they didn't invest any points in healing spells, which is utter fail.

A cleric's for healing/purifying period, there's no reason for a cleric to DD unless there are more than 1 cleric or the group is doing so well that you can afford to DD on the side.

There's not a single class in the game that can't out dps clerics with exception of maybe tank barbs.

In terms of spell speed<--, wouldn't the cleric win over venos as well, possibly wizards? (Mention a veno with nix/herc and i will bring out my cleric with +10 weapon(same money spent))

To say clerics are at the very bottom of the bottom in damage is a little much.

Less talky about the APS classes, APS were not always around ya know. (And hope to be nerfed.)

We arnt the best DD capable class true, but we are good enough to deserve a little more respect then this. (Anyone who show disrespect to another class should not play this game(Reputation effects game environment))

Prepare for Karma to bite you in the rear next TW/PK.
You can laugh at the damage we do on mobs and bosses but you cant laugh when we still do enough to lay you down to sleep, somewhere where your soul will weep.

Edit: Healing/purify only? we can keep the boss defences down by 50%+ and let others do 20% more damage during the entire fight as well. (Full support genie lol, thats funny) And i personally can survive being the only one alive during a boss fight (some/like everyone) long enough to revive everyone/buff/heal. Sometimes the ability to keep ourselves alive to keep DDing by healing exceed the fact that we have low damage.

Edit 2: I type too much...

Edit 3: We are talking self buffed right? Wouldnt the magic attack buff on clerics make up for the extra damage bonus wiz skills give? That seems kinda balanced, good job devs! (we can still aoe SPAM! physical damage hehe)

Edit 4: Telling someone to reroll is like telling a person with a pet they love so much to get a new one cause the current one is not capable of looking at a ball without eating it. They love said pet and cant be replaced. Stop being rude.

Baalbak - Dreamweaver

Jellytoast - Sanctuary wrote: »

Meh, I hit upwards of 24k on any mob, regardless of it's element. (well except the ? ones of course) Wood mobs are quite a lot more than that... I say for a cleric meant to be a healer that's pretty good. I've one shot my barb husband who has 17k hp in human. People really underestimate clerics, and I know other classes do more, but it's still pretty damn good.

sparked or unsparked? debuffed or not? what skill(s)?

I've personally yet to see a cleric one shot a Skull Hunter in OHT (unless it was weak/sacrifical) and they have about 34k HP. OTOH i can hit non sparked crits with demon onslaught for about 22k - 24k. Demon sparked, thats a one shot on those OHT mobsb:chuckle

anywho on topic... there's been a lot of clerics I've squaded with as of late that gripe about compensation for this and that, nevermind the fact that they are there getting done something that they need. or the ever so common cleric that says "im never doing nirvana again without a 5.0 squad because i died too many times" (ffs stay out of the fire ya nab)

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Baalbak - Dreamweaver wrote: »

anywho on topic... there's been a lot of clerics I've squaded with as of late that gripe about compensation for this and that, nevermind the fact that they are there getting done something that they need. or the ever so common cleric that says "im never doing nirvana again without a 5.0 squad because i died too many times" (ffs stay out of the fire ya nab)

Funny how many "Cleric LF fast Nirvana" WCs you see and when you inv one, he has full TT90 armor +3 with flawless and TT99 gold wep +5... The thing is, if they get the job done, why would you even ask for more when that's the main point? Well, unless you want level 11 res.

DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »

Being fail long enough for me to get off a BIDS b:pleased

It was a Levi Tw so...yah...

2vs2 in PK, teams were BM + BM vs. BM + wiz. One of the BMs used p. marrow. He wasn't in the squad with the wiz. I think we all know what happened. b:cute

Xoria - Sanctuary

Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »

yeah, you're wearing a t-shirt with an S on chest? There are 1% exception from rule. Do I want to risk if you get an itch and your timings are messed up ? no. So yeah, go do your stuff with 4k HP and blade of red dust. I'm gonna search/get a R8 6k HP cleric that I can rely on even if he falls asleep on his keyboard.



yeah, that awesome cleric si gonna DD and debuff for more than a 4-5 aps Sin/BM/Archer/Barb. kewl, than we're all nabs.

Lol, my point was don't lump everyone together in the same category. You won't know who can do what until you give them a chance. I've had a ton of people say 'you can't do ____ with that equipment or that HP.' I just ask them give me a chance and I will provide an awesome cleric in my stead if I really can't handle it.

As it stands, I have never been booted from a squad for not being able to do __ instance. Why? In truth, PWI is easy enough to play with even sub- par equipment (IE: NPC armor) at the level you can do ___. The difference is the amount of work needed to balance out your weakness so you're not useless.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Baalbak - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I've personally yet to see a cleric one shot a Skull Hunter in OHT (unless it was weak/sacrifical) and they have about 34k HP.

That might say something about dreamweaver clerics... personally, I have seen a cleric aggro some, holy path, aggro some others, and then tempest and they all fall down.

Ahira - Lost City

Why waste all that mana DD'ing? Just heal and save your pots guys. -__-'

Xoria - Sanctuary

Ahira - Lost City wrote: »

Why waste all that mana DD'ing? Just heal and save your pots guys. -__-'

Lol, how true. Not like a cleric gets ridiculous damage compared to others (psychic and wizard to be exact) with the same equips.

Futurelord - Dreamweaver

Ahira - Lost City wrote: »

Why waste all that mana DD'ing? Just heal and save your pots guys. -__-'

Xoria - Sanctuary wrote: »

Lol, how true. Not like a cleric gets ridiculous damage compared to others (psychic and wizard to be exact) with the same equips.

Excuse me, but my Demon IH spam is 400 mana a pop.

Gwendolynne - Heavens Tear

DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »

why do clerics persist on saying that they can hold a candle to any other class in DD? I'll say they can out damage an equal geared non -interval barb, and that's about it.

The cleric in beginning of thread that says he can hit 20-30k normal hit makes me laugh. I hit about 18k on average as a wiz; you know, the dph class? He's either got insanely high refines on his tt90 wep (lol) or he's plain lying, and that's all there is to it. Nothing makes his cleric so special that it can hit that high without refines- and that's mathematically proven if you even look at the skill damage calculations.

Oh and I'd like to know how he hit 114k without spark, genie skill, amp, hf, etc.

Because I've only hit 220k, and that was an undined extreme poisoned heaven flamed double sparked bids crit (and yes it was on an equal level mob).

and my best on another player is only 42k, which is on a phys marrowed blademaster with a BIDS and basically every other damage multiplier I stated earlier (level of bm was unknown, but this was in a TW against a 80+ TW fac).

I've hit 114k Crit nonsparked on my cleric... but I am levle 101 with Rank8 +6

Before that though I had the TT99 Pataka and I could hit pretty hard sparked I think my best was 105k sparked non-crit with Heaven's Flame. He may be lying but it is totally possible to hit big numbers as a cleric. Just becuase they arent' doing "as much" doesn't make them unviable as DDs.

However, my standpoint is the same on the matter. A cleric is a SUPPORT ONLY class. Support by healing, Support by being able to multitask. Support by knowing when to debuff (don't use your phys def debuff when there is a barb using devour, pay attention to the debuff icons on a boss), support knowing when its okay to throw in some damage spells in between your healing. Help your team, don't hinder them, and certainly don't simply NOT heal them because you only want to DD. Be a cleric in all its glory.

Baalbak - Dreamweaver

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

That might say something about dreamweaver clerics... personally, I have seen a cleric aggro some, holy path, aggro some others, and then tempest and they all fall down.

sure they can do that, most don't though. i suppose being on a PvE server has gotten them used to just healing and not really doing much in the way of attacking, especially AoEing stuff. Most clerics I see still just do cyclone -> plume -> cyclone etc..

meanwhile I run into a group of mobs and ToP -> demon onslaught -> armageddonb:chuckle

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I just had a fist BM tell me to stop attacking in BH29 after I stole aggro from him. O.O he was same level as me I believe too. Luckily I've been soloing BH29 of late and don't need anyone else even if it takes a bit, so I just kept attacking and finished off the boss anyway. So since I know it probably doesn't count because he probably don't have 5aps yet and I am vit build so it definitely wasn't cuz i have mad skillz or anything like that, but still it happened. So never say never. b:laugh b:pleased

Fist BMs in the level 7x range is just pure ****. More often then not, I would rather a spot in the squad to stay empty then take ANY pre 89/90 fist (only) BMs. So basically you are saying that you can out damage a piece of rock... well mobile rock.

But congrad... you have out damaged a rock. Now maybe its time to move on to something with at least half a brain.

Allynna_ - Dreamweaver

Generally Clerics do less damage by Wizzards, just look at the skills. Plume Shot is about the same to Pyrogram, but takes .2 seconds more to cast, and doesn't benifit from Elemetal Mastery.
Wield Thunder when maxed does about 300 more static damage, but 100% less weapon damage than Sanstorm. If by level 80 you Weapon + Rings + Saphires in Weapon are less than 300, your doing something wrong. BIDS is about the same as Tempest, but with 100% more Weapon damage.

When in a squad, a pure magic Cleric buffed will do a bit less than an equivlent Wizard, and has less elemental Flexibility. Not to mention a lot of clerics stat Vit, but most Wizards don't.

I'm not saying that clerics suck at DPS, but of the DD classes they are the weakest. If your a cleric you heal fist Metal Mage second.

sig1043a

It never fails, no matter what mmorpg you play, you always get "battle clerics." And as usual, it is extraordinarily rare for a "battle cleric" to actually hold a candle to a regular DPS class. Ironically if a player is good at being a "battle cleric", they probably would be phenomenal playing a traditional DPS class.

I get that some clerics get bored of healing, but really that is the price you pay for being a near indispensable class. Its no secret that just about any mmorpg you play, if you want an easy time finding a group you roll a cleric.

If you are not going to aid a group using your class's primary strengths, do everyone a favor and stick to soloing. That applies to any class.

MystiMonk - Sanctuary

sig1043a wrote: »

It never fails, no matter what mmorpg you play, you always get "battle clerics." And as usual, it is extraordinarily rare for a "battle cleric" to actually hold a candle to a regular DPS class. Ironically if a player is good at being a "battle cleric", they probably would be phenomenal playing a traditional DPS class.

I get that some clerics get bored of healing, but really that is the price you pay for being a near indispensable class. Its no secret that just about any mmorpg you play, if you want an easy time finding a group you roll a cleric.

If you are not going to aid a group using your class's primary strengths, do everyone a favor and stick to soloing. That applies to any class.

Then you can buy my res scroll for me if I go down which usually happens because you didn't clear a path got me.

mkat

dimented wrote: »

Well one said "there is 3 tanks, buy charm"

b:shocked I would hate to see a cleric say this in a nirvana squad.

DaKillanator - Raging Tide

Gwendolynne - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I've hit 114k Crit nonsparked on my cleric... but I am levle 101 with Rank8 +6

See now that's believable. A rank 8 +6 wep should be able to hit those kinds of numbers easily.
And I can also believe that you hit numbers near those with your tt99 Pataka if it was well refined (not to mention they have very large damage ranges).

But the cleric I was referring to is level 96. So he's either using a lunar wep or a tt90 wep, and either way he couldn't hit those numbers without high refines.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Fist BMs in the level 7x range is just pure ****. More often then not, I would rather a spot in the squad to stay empty then take ANY pre 89/90 fist (only) BMs. So basically you are saying that you can out damage a piece of rock... well mobile rock.

But congrad... you have out damaged a rock. Now maybe its time to move on to something with at least half a brain.

I even said it really doesn't count because his gear couldn't have been good, and that I myself am not this super epic character. My point is that someone said "DON'T ATTACK!" to a cleric. It's happened. And that goes right back to what other people have been saying, its not all class it about gears/skills as well.

For the record, and I said earlier, I do care about squad dynamics and mostly heal if I'm the only cleric in the squad. So I'm not saying that clerics shouldn't heal, I'm saying that you assuming a cleric is automatically going to be worse than everyone else is silly. Sometimes the BM is poorly geared, sometimes they don't know what they are doing, sometimes that cleric is above average because of high refines and can easily beat other classes with only average gear. You're assuming that you will always find two chars with exactly the same gear, but you won't. That's not real. There all kinds of types in the game and the best way to survive in a squad is through teamwork not classism.

oxytorch

dimented wrote: »

OK so I was in bh fire yesterday. Squad was: 2bms, 2 clerics, barb and veno. So I thought 2 clerics, this should be ok, but instead it was the worst bh fire I've ever been in. Instead of healing the cleric says "buy a charm"b:shocked I thought clerics liked to save peoples charms, has that changed as well with all the hyper noobs? Whats your input?

Hyper noobs are in prolific abundance , saturating every server with their frustrating incompetence . Just do what I do , use your blacklist b:pleased

Xoria - Sanctuary

Futurelord - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Excuse me, but my Demon IH spam is 400 mana a pop.

So is mine, so get demon celestial seal and save your MP charm ticks, apothecary and pots from being used. It's pretty easy to keep your squad alive and throw yourself MP regeneration buffs.

Or use the 100 MP/HP regeneration a second apothecary item. IH builds aggro, but no longer puts you into battle mode, so you don't get the 75% regeneration reduction- as long as you don't go in battle mode via another skill (like BB- it heals, but puts you into battle mode). Very few things actually require you to constantly spam IH to the extent that the regeneration is overcome.

Carebear_xD - Heavens Tear

I don't do anything but heal for even my wiz and psy. Unless for AOEs as a wizard.

I stand back and heal, less repair bills b:chuckle

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

Gosh you guys are acting like attack clerics are all like this

http://www.youtube.com/user/dorkly#p/u/0/DHpPKgi-niI

Longknife - Harshlands

dimented wrote: »

OK so I was in bh fire yesterday. Squad was: 2bms, 2 clerics, barb and veno. So I thought 2 clerics, this should be ok, but instead it was the worst bh fire I've ever been in. Instead of healing the cleric says "buy a charm"b:shocked I thought clerics liked to save peoples charms, has that changed as well with all the hyper noobs? Whats your input?

This is why you don't let PWI Sales Representatives heal your squad.

dimented

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Gosh you guys are acting like attack clerics are all like this

http://www.youtube.com/user/dorkly#p/u/0/DHpPKgi-niI

b:laughb:laugh rofl that was hilarious!